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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep.  JGHowes  talk 22:30, 24 September 2020 (UTC) reply

AdventHealth Ocala

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AdventHealth Ocala (  | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
(Find sources:  Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

This hospital doesn't seem notable. The article only cites a single primary source and I was unable to multiple in-depth reliable sources about it in a WP:BEFORE. There was hardly even anything trivial about it. So, this fails both WP:GNG and WP:GNG. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 13:39, 30 August 2020 (UTC) reply

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Florida-related deletion discussions. - hako9 ( talk) 00:42, 31 August 2020 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Geography-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple ( talk) 03:18, 1 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Health and fitness-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple ( talk) 03:18, 1 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Architecture-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple ( talk) 03:18, 1 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Organizations. Djflem ( talk) 09:04, 3 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 17:28, 6 September 2020 (UTC) reply
I'm not going to dignify the question with an answer, except to say if you have multiple in-depth reliable sources about the hospital under its old names feel free to provide them. That's what people usually do in AfDs instead of asking superfluous questions.
Sorry, I meant nothing bad by it. It's just when a hospital gets acquired by a network - the materials that made it notable or more verifiable were its origin history when it was perhaps more directly contributed with the community. I'm just speaking from personal experience from creating hospital articles. – The Grid ( talk) 23:59, 14 September 2020 (UTC) reply
No worries. I didn't think you did. I was just thinking you might have been able to find some sources have been sources I missed. I totally agree with you about it though. It seems like hospitals switch owners and names quit a lot. Which doesn't help with finding reliable sources about them. It seems like Google gives pretty different results for different people sometimes to. That doesn't help either. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 01:10, 15 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Adamant1 I just added some sources with what I've found so far. Removed the promo material as well. – The Grid ( talk) 15:01, 15 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Alright. Thanks. I guess we will see if they are up the standards of WP:NORG or not, but at least you added some. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 19:35, 15 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Eddie891 Talk Work 21:24, 15 September 2020 (UTC) reply
  • Keep Just adding vote after mutual discussion above with Adamant1. I think my edits to the page would be considered part of WP:HEY but I'm really neutral about the outcome here. – The Grid ( talk) 23:32, 19 September 2020 (UTC) reply
  • Keep My goodness, this hospital is nearly three times the average size of an American hospital, and it's a Level 2 trauma center – the only trauma center in a three-county area – but we're just going to say that it doesn't "seem" notable and try to delete the article? Because nobody ever writes anything about large hospitals? Or maybe the nom thinks that hospitals in general aren't notable, since he's been regularly nominating articles about hospitals for deletion (very few of which close with deletion)? Hint: When we're talking about a modern community hospital in the developed world, and you can't find multiple, in-depth sources for it, then problem is in your search methods, not with the notability of the hospital. And for reference, a Critical Access Hospital in the US is fewer than 25 beds, and those are notable, too. WhatamIdoing ( talk) 01:04, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
    • P.S. I just added three sources to the article, including information about the original building and where the money went when this city-owned hospital was leased to a private organizations. It wasn't hard. The only thing I did was look at the nearest daily newspaper and put the old name of the hospital into Google Books. I think it would be easy to do more if I wanted to spend any time on this. WhatamIdoing ( talk) 01:53, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
      • I mean, there is a basic premise underlining Wikipedia that people have to write about something for there to be an article about it. It is an encyclopedia after all. Not a business directory. Excuse me for not treating it like though. That aside, quite a lot of the articles I nominate get deleted and a lot of times when they don't its mostly because you, the ARS goons, and other people like you who think this is a phonebook and that there shouldn't be any inclusion criteria at all come along and steam role things by spouting nonsense and attacking nominators. Which isn't on me. Maybe I'd be more inclined to question my nomination record if they didn't involve so many utterly garbage keep rationales. I'm not really that about it though when most of the people who vote keep in the articles I nominate are doing so based on trash reasons like that I only nominated the article to target them because they edited it once 8 years ago. Considering things like that there's zero reason at this point that any of the people in your keep crowd should be taken seriously about anything. I don't see any of you criticizing your fellow keep voters who have legitimately less then less than stellar records either, nor do I because I think it's an extremely weak rhetorical method. That said though, I'd love to see you guys do it just for the sake of consistency. Get back to me when you've kicked everyone out of the Article Rescue Squad who has a less then 50% keep record (my delete record is way above that) or whatever. Then maybe I'll care about what you guys are saying. Until then though, I don't and I won't hold my breath about it. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 02:04, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
        • Sure: people have to write something about for there to be an article. But journalists actually do write about hospitals, so that's not a problem. If you think that I'm one of the "ARS goons", then I'll point out that I substantially strengthened NCORP a few years ago. All those complaints about the unreasonableness of AUD for small businesses and local non-profits are complaints about what I wrote. WhatamIdoing ( talk) 02:56, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
No, I don't think your one of the "ARS goons." Which is why I added there was the comma. I still think your a little more lose with the guidelines and quick to judge things then is helpful or productive sometimes though. That's all. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 10:02, 23 September 2020 (UTC) reply
    • P.S. BTW, I'd love to see the people, like Ritchie333 and others, who chided me for making things personal do the same thing to WhatamIdoing. Ten bucks says it never happens though. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 02:14, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Because I'm sick of having to repeat over and over to people like you and him that local newspaper articles about run of the mill crap like renovations or letters to the editor aren't usable sources for notability. It should be pretty obvious at this point that they aren't. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 03:07, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Except they are, and that's why these nominations usually close as keep. — Toughpigs ( talk) 03:10, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
No they aren't. You know what WP:NORG says about trivial coverage and it's completely ridiculous to claim a letter to the editor is a reliable source. No where does it say in any guideline that they are and there's rules about local sources. Including that using the same one a bunch of times like WhatamIdoing did here doesn't count as multiple sources. Anyway, most of "these" nominations don't get closed as keep. Just the ones you and the other people who seem to care less about the guidelines are involved in. Plenty of my nominations have resulted in delete though. It's just that you and the other inclusion at all cost people don't ever have any better arguments, let alone any guideline based ones, then to attack nominators. Even Catfurball who mainly edits Seventh-day Advantist articles and probably has a connection to them said this isn't notable enough to keep. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 03:20, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
Retrieved from " https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/AdventHealth_Ocala&oldid=980153406"
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep.  JGHowes  talk 22:30, 24 September 2020 (UTC) reply

AdventHealth Ocala

[Hide this box] New to Articles for deletion (AfD)? Read these primers!

AdventHealth Ocala (  | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
(Find sources:  Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

This hospital doesn't seem notable. The article only cites a single primary source and I was unable to multiple in-depth reliable sources about it in a WP:BEFORE. There was hardly even anything trivial about it. So, this fails both WP:GNG and WP:GNG. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 13:39, 30 August 2020 (UTC) reply

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Florida-related deletion discussions. - hako9 ( talk) 00:42, 31 August 2020 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Geography-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple ( talk) 03:18, 1 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Health and fitness-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple ( talk) 03:18, 1 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Architecture-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple ( talk) 03:18, 1 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Note: This discussion has been included in the Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Organizations. Djflem ( talk) 09:04, 3 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 17:28, 6 September 2020 (UTC) reply
I'm not going to dignify the question with an answer, except to say if you have multiple in-depth reliable sources about the hospital under its old names feel free to provide them. That's what people usually do in AfDs instead of asking superfluous questions.
Sorry, I meant nothing bad by it. It's just when a hospital gets acquired by a network - the materials that made it notable or more verifiable were its origin history when it was perhaps more directly contributed with the community. I'm just speaking from personal experience from creating hospital articles. – The Grid ( talk) 23:59, 14 September 2020 (UTC) reply
No worries. I didn't think you did. I was just thinking you might have been able to find some sources have been sources I missed. I totally agree with you about it though. It seems like hospitals switch owners and names quit a lot. Which doesn't help with finding reliable sources about them. It seems like Google gives pretty different results for different people sometimes to. That doesn't help either. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 01:10, 15 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Adamant1 I just added some sources with what I've found so far. Removed the promo material as well. – The Grid ( talk) 15:01, 15 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Alright. Thanks. I guess we will see if they are up the standards of WP:NORG or not, but at least you added some. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 19:35, 15 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Eddie891 Talk Work 21:24, 15 September 2020 (UTC) reply
  • Keep Just adding vote after mutual discussion above with Adamant1. I think my edits to the page would be considered part of WP:HEY but I'm really neutral about the outcome here. – The Grid ( talk) 23:32, 19 September 2020 (UTC) reply
  • Keep My goodness, this hospital is nearly three times the average size of an American hospital, and it's a Level 2 trauma center – the only trauma center in a three-county area – but we're just going to say that it doesn't "seem" notable and try to delete the article? Because nobody ever writes anything about large hospitals? Or maybe the nom thinks that hospitals in general aren't notable, since he's been regularly nominating articles about hospitals for deletion (very few of which close with deletion)? Hint: When we're talking about a modern community hospital in the developed world, and you can't find multiple, in-depth sources for it, then problem is in your search methods, not with the notability of the hospital. And for reference, a Critical Access Hospital in the US is fewer than 25 beds, and those are notable, too. WhatamIdoing ( talk) 01:04, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
    • P.S. I just added three sources to the article, including information about the original building and where the money went when this city-owned hospital was leased to a private organizations. It wasn't hard. The only thing I did was look at the nearest daily newspaper and put the old name of the hospital into Google Books. I think it would be easy to do more if I wanted to spend any time on this. WhatamIdoing ( talk) 01:53, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
      • I mean, there is a basic premise underlining Wikipedia that people have to write about something for there to be an article about it. It is an encyclopedia after all. Not a business directory. Excuse me for not treating it like though. That aside, quite a lot of the articles I nominate get deleted and a lot of times when they don't its mostly because you, the ARS goons, and other people like you who think this is a phonebook and that there shouldn't be any inclusion criteria at all come along and steam role things by spouting nonsense and attacking nominators. Which isn't on me. Maybe I'd be more inclined to question my nomination record if they didn't involve so many utterly garbage keep rationales. I'm not really that about it though when most of the people who vote keep in the articles I nominate are doing so based on trash reasons like that I only nominated the article to target them because they edited it once 8 years ago. Considering things like that there's zero reason at this point that any of the people in your keep crowd should be taken seriously about anything. I don't see any of you criticizing your fellow keep voters who have legitimately less then less than stellar records either, nor do I because I think it's an extremely weak rhetorical method. That said though, I'd love to see you guys do it just for the sake of consistency. Get back to me when you've kicked everyone out of the Article Rescue Squad who has a less then 50% keep record (my delete record is way above that) or whatever. Then maybe I'll care about what you guys are saying. Until then though, I don't and I won't hold my breath about it. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 02:04, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
        • Sure: people have to write something about for there to be an article. But journalists actually do write about hospitals, so that's not a problem. If you think that I'm one of the "ARS goons", then I'll point out that I substantially strengthened NCORP a few years ago. All those complaints about the unreasonableness of AUD for small businesses and local non-profits are complaints about what I wrote. WhatamIdoing ( talk) 02:56, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
No, I don't think your one of the "ARS goons." Which is why I added there was the comma. I still think your a little more lose with the guidelines and quick to judge things then is helpful or productive sometimes though. That's all. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 10:02, 23 September 2020 (UTC) reply
    • P.S. BTW, I'd love to see the people, like Ritchie333 and others, who chided me for making things personal do the same thing to WhatamIdoing. Ten bucks says it never happens though. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 02:14, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Because I'm sick of having to repeat over and over to people like you and him that local newspaper articles about run of the mill crap like renovations or letters to the editor aren't usable sources for notability. It should be pretty obvious at this point that they aren't. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 03:07, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
Except they are, and that's why these nominations usually close as keep. — Toughpigs ( talk) 03:10, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
No they aren't. You know what WP:NORG says about trivial coverage and it's completely ridiculous to claim a letter to the editor is a reliable source. No where does it say in any guideline that they are and there's rules about local sources. Including that using the same one a bunch of times like WhatamIdoing did here doesn't count as multiple sources. Anyway, most of "these" nominations don't get closed as keep. Just the ones you and the other people who seem to care less about the guidelines are involved in. Plenty of my nominations have resulted in delete though. It's just that you and the other inclusion at all cost people don't ever have any better arguments, let alone any guideline based ones, then to attack nominators. Even Catfurball who mainly edits Seventh-day Advantist articles and probably has a connection to them said this isn't notable enough to keep. -- Adamant1 ( talk) 03:20, 21 September 2020 (UTC) reply
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
Retrieved from " https://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/AdventHealth_Ocala&oldid=980153406"

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