- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was no consensus. There is a clear absence of consensus to delete, and at least a theoretical potential to discover print sources, which, if they exist, would support clear notability for the topic. bd2412 T 14:24, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
1897 Indiana State Sycamores football team
- 1897 Indiana State Sycamores football team ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
There isn't enough information to justify having a stand-alone page on this season. "no records remain to record the scores or even the results" power~enwiki ( π, ν) 19:48, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 20:55, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 17:02, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
- Redirect to Indiana State Sycamores football unless someone can track down the results. WP:NSEASONS says that redirects are preferable to deletion for non-notable seasons. Smartyllama ( talk) 17:49, 20 October 2017 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 02:07, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 02:07, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. North America 1000 02:17, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Delete The existing content can be merged somewhere else but I don't think a redirect is a good idea. Not only is it a questionable search term, redirects are too often hijacked. Chris Troutman ( talk) 03:53, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 17:15, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Indiana-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 17:15, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Keep we typically keep season articles about college football programs. I would have no objection to merging into a decade or other grouping of several seasons if someone wants to do that.-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 21:35, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Close without action There is not a deletion problem here, there is an editing problem. Reasonable people have come up with the structure that is here, and added their WP:OR that more sources are not available. The editing needed to remove the WP:OR is obvious, and if there is a better organization available than one year per article, then re-organize it. Unscintillating ( talk) 01:55, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
- Keep - Articles on individual seasons of collegiate football teams are all notable: each game has been covered in the press of the participating universities and the home and away towns, insuring passage of the GNG, which calls for multiple instances of published coverage. Carrite ( talk) 11:07, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
- Comment - The nominator and at least one other person opines that "unless the results can be tracked down, the season is not notable. The problem is that neither the Terre Haute Star nor the Terre Haute Express are digitized as part of the Newspapers.com database at this time. This does not mean the papers were never produced or that they have not survived, only that they are not yet digitized for ease of access. Carrite ( talk) 11:13, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
- The Terre Haute Semi Weekly Express is available at newspaperarchive.com. Searching that paper for football, I find about 30 results. One referred to a game between the local high school and Rose Polytechnic teams. I don't see mention of Indiana State or Indiana Normal in any of the articles. I agree that their may be enough material to write an article about the team and I encourage anyone interested to check newspaperarchive and (if they have access) genealogybank, but I don't find anything. Smmurphy( Talk) 21:41, 25 October 2017 (UTC)
- Comment Sources: [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] WikiOriginal-9 ( talk) 18:26, 26 October 2017 (UTC)
- Comment. The lack of game results is certainly an obstacle to development of this article. However, unlike Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/1883 Carleton Knights football team (concerning a Division III program), this AfD concerns an NCAA Division I program. It is not unreasonable to believe that decent season articles can be built for most Division I programs. Further, Carrite's comments about the Terre Haute newspapers (and perhaps other non-digitized newspapers), as well as WikiOriginal-9's preliminary research uncovering an article reporting on the results of at least one of the 1897 games, suggests that editors should be allowed to continue developing this article. Also, and like Unscintillating noted above, a possible reorganization (perhaps a single article covering Indiana State football from 1896-1909) could be considered. Cbl62 ( talk) 14:54, 27 October 2017 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was no consensus. There is a clear absence of consensus to delete, and at least a theoretical potential to discover print sources, which, if they exist, would support clear notability for the topic. bd2412 T 14:24, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
1897 Indiana State Sycamores football team
- 1897 Indiana State Sycamores football team ( | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – ( View log · Stats)
- (Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)
There isn't enough information to justify having a stand-alone page on this season. "no records remain to record the scores or even the results" power~enwiki ( π, ν) 19:48, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions. CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 20:55, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 17:02, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
- Redirect to Indiana State Sycamores football unless someone can track down the results. WP:NSEASONS says that redirects are preferable to deletion for non-notable seasons. Smartyllama ( talk) 17:49, 20 October 2017 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 02:07, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America 1000 02:07, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. North America 1000 02:17, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Delete The existing content can be merged somewhere else but I don't think a redirect is a good idea. Not only is it a questionable search term, redirects are too often hijacked. Chris Troutman ( talk) 03:53, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 17:15, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the list of Indiana-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal ( talk) 17:15, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Keep we typically keep season articles about college football programs. I would have no objection to merging into a decade or other grouping of several seasons if someone wants to do that.-- Paul McDonald ( talk) 21:35, 23 October 2017 (UTC)
- Close without action There is not a deletion problem here, there is an editing problem. Reasonable people have come up with the structure that is here, and added their WP:OR that more sources are not available. The editing needed to remove the WP:OR is obvious, and if there is a better organization available than one year per article, then re-organize it. Unscintillating ( talk) 01:55, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
- Keep - Articles on individual seasons of collegiate football teams are all notable: each game has been covered in the press of the participating universities and the home and away towns, insuring passage of the GNG, which calls for multiple instances of published coverage. Carrite ( talk) 11:07, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
- Comment - The nominator and at least one other person opines that "unless the results can be tracked down, the season is not notable. The problem is that neither the Terre Haute Star nor the Terre Haute Express are digitized as part of the Newspapers.com database at this time. This does not mean the papers were never produced or that they have not survived, only that they are not yet digitized for ease of access. Carrite ( talk) 11:13, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
- The Terre Haute Semi Weekly Express is available at newspaperarchive.com. Searching that paper for football, I find about 30 results. One referred to a game between the local high school and Rose Polytechnic teams. I don't see mention of Indiana State or Indiana Normal in any of the articles. I agree that their may be enough material to write an article about the team and I encourage anyone interested to check newspaperarchive and (if they have access) genealogybank, but I don't find anything. Smmurphy( Talk) 21:41, 25 October 2017 (UTC)
- Comment Sources: [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] WikiOriginal-9 ( talk) 18:26, 26 October 2017 (UTC)
- Comment. The lack of game results is certainly an obstacle to development of this article. However, unlike Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/1883 Carleton Knights football team (concerning a Division III program), this AfD concerns an NCAA Division I program. It is not unreasonable to believe that decent season articles can be built for most Division I programs. Further, Carrite's comments about the Terre Haute newspapers (and perhaps other non-digitized newspapers), as well as WikiOriginal-9's preliminary research uncovering an article reporting on the results of at least one of the 1897 games, suggests that editors should be allowed to continue developing this article. Also, and like Unscintillating noted above, a possible reorganization (perhaps a single article covering Indiana State football from 1896-1909) could be considered. Cbl62 ( talk) 14:54, 27 October 2017 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.