Do you have sources to claim, that his EAR only was cut off? What I have heard as a kid and the source also claim that both his Ears and Nose were cut off... Please let me know if you have any reliable source..Thanks Fyodor7 ( talk) 09:00, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
- The well studied source on Tharakan is by M. O. Joseph, which is in the references in Tharakan's article. I don't have it with me here, so I can't quote chapter and verse, but I do remember reading about this point very well. One of his ears was cut off. Karnan ( talk) 01:09, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
- Reading the above question, I thought I shall write what I know about this subject.
P. Sankunni Menon in his book ‘’Thiruvithamcore Charitram’’ (History of Travancore, Malayalam, 1878. New edition 1988.) states that the people’s court passed the verdict on Matthoo Tharakan, and was whipped, ears cut off and put in prison at Trivandrum. (p.248). This was written by a high official of the Travancore government, about 70 years after the event.
M.O. Joseph, Nedukunnam, in his book ‘’Thachil Matthoo Tharakan,’’ (Malayalam, National Book Stall, Kottayam, 1947.revd.ed.1962) states that, Matthoo Tharakan was brought to Trivandrum from the north, put in fetters (p.314), whipped and cut off his two ears. (p.315). This was written after about 140 years after the event. Neduvelilmathew ( talk) 16:26, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
Fyodor (who I notice is now an outlaw) had asked me this long back. I do not have M. O. Joseph's book with me, so I could not verify. I suppose I was mistaken a bit in the details of my response. Since M. O. Joseph was privy to Thachil family archives, I consider his account reliable. I have Menon's book, but since he represents a state which has on the whole branded Tharakan as a traitor (contrary to the opinion of the then reigning Monarch), I am suspicious about his account (which may also not have been based on sufficient documents, since Velu Tampi burnt many of them in Trivandrum). Karnan ( talk) 15:42, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
I am willing to take you at your word. However, it will be nice if you could talk to the Sisters of the Destitute and get them to write about his family name on their web page. Otherwise, I think the name Palakkappillil would not find much credence. Since the canonisation process has begun, unless this is done now, lot of official documents will proliferate with the wrong name. Karnan ( talk) 21:09, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- I ve already sent an e mail to the SD sisters through their web site.. Im waiting for their reply. Nz now they have added the word Palakkappilil with his family though with lots of spelling mistake (payapilly palackapilly as given in their web site. [1] i ll surely send a detailed mail to them with facts n figures.
- In fact, for your information, till recently the SD sisters were of the opinion that the Congregation was founded by Fr. George Valliarampath. Took a lot of effort to correct them. Fr. Varghese Palakkappillil died just after 2 years of founding and then it was Valliarampath who carried out all the activities of SD.
- Nz thanks a lot for the support n concern.. A mammoth task ahead.. In wiki nz its better to give his original name rather than the popular name esp when there is a family named Payyapilly which has absolutely no connection with the Palakkappillil family.. In the very second sentence itself i ve specified that he is widely known as Varghese Payyappilly.. That ll do i guess.. Thanks User:Rahuljohnson4u ( talk) 07:43, 23 April 2010 (UTC)
- I see. Yes, perhaps they will need some time to make the corrections.
- I have known about the founder of the SD correctly from the beginning, but your are right in saying that many people have confused him with Mgr. Valliarumpath (who had an important role in their development, though none in the founding). That the SD themselves were party to this is news to me though. (When I visited their convents, I used to see pictures of both Fr. Palakkappillil and Mgr. Valliarumpath.) Once such impressions gain root it becomes very difficult to correct.
- It is always better to use his correct name. Yes, the name Payyappilly is shared by lots of families, and it is difficult to make out the actual family, so a mention of it as a popular misnomer suffices. I too did not know which family the late priest belonged to until you pointed it out. It seems the Ernakulam Archdiocese also has got the name wrong: [2] (From various stories, I know that they are even more resistant to any correction...)
- Glad to see your reply. And thank you so much for offering your help. As you said the websites are resistant to any sort of correction. I think it will be very useful if you could also contact the administrators of the sites and request for the correction. It should me more effective than me repeatedly contacting them.
- I contacted one of the S.D. Convents nearby my home and they have agreed to change the name on their photo to 'Varghese Palakkappillil (Payyappilly)'. Moreover one of my aunts is a member of S.D. and I have asked her help too to sort out this confusion. As you told since the canonization process has begun there is a chance of official documents being proliferated with the wrong name.
- And I think it will be useful if I copy this conversation to the discussion page of 'Varghese Palakkappillil'. It will be useful for the people who view the page in future. Nz Thanks a lot for your support. I appreciate all your efforts to resolve this problem. Please do try your best. User:Rahuljohnson4u ( talk) 19:38, 05 April 2010 (UTC)
I recommend you Parla.cat. It's a good tool to learn catalan. Paucabot ( talk) 06:07, 8 May 2010 (UTC)
Best wishes on entering your 80th year. I did make some edits some time back on the late Mr. T. M. Varghese, Thandaneth. Karnan (talk) 14:13, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
- Thanks for watching me growing up and wishing me on entering anther New Year. Double thanks because I saw that letter on my 50th wedding Anniversary. I am also watching your edits for some time. Neduvelilmathew ( talk) 17:42, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
Repeating my wishes. Karnan ( talk) 09:51, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
- Hi Karnan,
- You have very good memory, added with much regard for others. Thanks. Neduvelilmathew ( talk) 10:18, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
Thank you, Sir. Much honoured. Karnan ( talk) 15:32, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
Hello Karnan, just some thoughts. Is it okay to call Krishna Menon a Bengali politician just because he contested an election from West Bengal? In this context, imagine adding the categories Andhra Pradesh politicians and Karnataka politicians in Indira Gandhi. Salih (talk) 16:30, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
- Hello Salih. Well, there was earlier a category in VKKM article saying he was a Maharashtra politician (I did not add that, it was someone else). So I added the category Bengali politician, and the more specific category Mumbai politician (removing the Maharashtra category). Both are there for the same kind of reason. I am not very keen on those categories, but either both must be removed, or both must stay. You can decide as you wish. I know that VKKM was particularly proud of his contesting from outside his home state, as a mark of his non-attachment to regional sentiments (and he was critical of Nehru contesting only from Allahabad, his home turf); VKKM finally contested his last election from Trivandrum when all options had run out (but again, he was reluctant to do so from Calicut). So perhaps he himself would have been happy to be included in those categories (not that this is very decisive, but just a remark). I don't know how Indira Gandhi viewed contesting outside Allahabad, but perhaps not so ascetically as VKKM. If Indira Gandhi is not included in those categories, and a regional tag on a politician is conferred by birth, yes, both those should be removed. Karnan ( talk) 22:45, 27 March 2011 (UTC)
This discussion is copied from Talk:V. K. Krishna Menon.
Hi, Karnan. You can communicate to me over Wikipedia talk page on the subject matter. I`d be more than happy to talk to you except personal data. With best wishes -- Kumaripriya ( talk) 04:00, 14 April 2011 (UTC)
No idea, Dear Karnan. To be frank with you, I don`t exactly remember about it. Leave it at it and let`s talk about Devasahayam Pillai now onwards. You have any more details with you about him? If so, why don`t you share through these pages? -- Kumaripriya ( talk) 15:54, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
Hi. noticed that you are a regular editor on the page. Have started a discussion with other editors in the Talk Page on some suggestions to improve the article. The discussion are located here [3], [4] . Appreciate if you could review and give your thoughts on this. Prodigyhk ( talk) 11:50, 19 August 2013 (UTC)
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Do you have sources to claim, that his EAR only was cut off? What I have heard as a kid and the source also claim that both his Ears and Nose were cut off... Please let me know if you have any reliable source..Thanks Fyodor7 ( talk) 09:00, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
- The well studied source on Tharakan is by M. O. Joseph, which is in the references in Tharakan's article. I don't have it with me here, so I can't quote chapter and verse, but I do remember reading about this point very well. One of his ears was cut off. Karnan ( talk) 01:09, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
- Reading the above question, I thought I shall write what I know about this subject.
P. Sankunni Menon in his book ‘’Thiruvithamcore Charitram’’ (History of Travancore, Malayalam, 1878. New edition 1988.) states that the people’s court passed the verdict on Matthoo Tharakan, and was whipped, ears cut off and put in prison at Trivandrum. (p.248). This was written by a high official of the Travancore government, about 70 years after the event.
M.O. Joseph, Nedukunnam, in his book ‘’Thachil Matthoo Tharakan,’’ (Malayalam, National Book Stall, Kottayam, 1947.revd.ed.1962) states that, Matthoo Tharakan was brought to Trivandrum from the north, put in fetters (p.314), whipped and cut off his two ears. (p.315). This was written after about 140 years after the event. Neduvelilmathew ( talk) 16:26, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
Fyodor (who I notice is now an outlaw) had asked me this long back. I do not have M. O. Joseph's book with me, so I could not verify. I suppose I was mistaken a bit in the details of my response. Since M. O. Joseph was privy to Thachil family archives, I consider his account reliable. I have Menon's book, but since he represents a state which has on the whole branded Tharakan as a traitor (contrary to the opinion of the then reigning Monarch), I am suspicious about his account (which may also not have been based on sufficient documents, since Velu Tampi burnt many of them in Trivandrum). Karnan ( talk) 15:42, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
I am willing to take you at your word. However, it will be nice if you could talk to the Sisters of the Destitute and get them to write about his family name on their web page. Otherwise, I think the name Palakkappillil would not find much credence. Since the canonisation process has begun, unless this is done now, lot of official documents will proliferate with the wrong name. Karnan ( talk) 21:09, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
- I ve already sent an e mail to the SD sisters through their web site.. Im waiting for their reply. Nz now they have added the word Palakkappilil with his family though with lots of spelling mistake (payapilly palackapilly as given in their web site. [1] i ll surely send a detailed mail to them with facts n figures.
- In fact, for your information, till recently the SD sisters were of the opinion that the Congregation was founded by Fr. George Valliarampath. Took a lot of effort to correct them. Fr. Varghese Palakkappillil died just after 2 years of founding and then it was Valliarampath who carried out all the activities of SD.
- Nz thanks a lot for the support n concern.. A mammoth task ahead.. In wiki nz its better to give his original name rather than the popular name esp when there is a family named Payyapilly which has absolutely no connection with the Palakkappillil family.. In the very second sentence itself i ve specified that he is widely known as Varghese Payyappilly.. That ll do i guess.. Thanks User:Rahuljohnson4u ( talk) 07:43, 23 April 2010 (UTC)
- I see. Yes, perhaps they will need some time to make the corrections.
- I have known about the founder of the SD correctly from the beginning, but your are right in saying that many people have confused him with Mgr. Valliarumpath (who had an important role in their development, though none in the founding). That the SD themselves were party to this is news to me though. (When I visited their convents, I used to see pictures of both Fr. Palakkappillil and Mgr. Valliarumpath.) Once such impressions gain root it becomes very difficult to correct.
- It is always better to use his correct name. Yes, the name Payyappilly is shared by lots of families, and it is difficult to make out the actual family, so a mention of it as a popular misnomer suffices. I too did not know which family the late priest belonged to until you pointed it out. It seems the Ernakulam Archdiocese also has got the name wrong: [2] (From various stories, I know that they are even more resistant to any correction...)
- Glad to see your reply. And thank you so much for offering your help. As you said the websites are resistant to any sort of correction. I think it will be very useful if you could also contact the administrators of the sites and request for the correction. It should me more effective than me repeatedly contacting them.
- I contacted one of the S.D. Convents nearby my home and they have agreed to change the name on their photo to 'Varghese Palakkappillil (Payyappilly)'. Moreover one of my aunts is a member of S.D. and I have asked her help too to sort out this confusion. As you told since the canonization process has begun there is a chance of official documents being proliferated with the wrong name.
- And I think it will be useful if I copy this conversation to the discussion page of 'Varghese Palakkappillil'. It will be useful for the people who view the page in future. Nz Thanks a lot for your support. I appreciate all your efforts to resolve this problem. Please do try your best. User:Rahuljohnson4u ( talk) 19:38, 05 April 2010 (UTC)
I recommend you Parla.cat. It's a good tool to learn catalan. Paucabot ( talk) 06:07, 8 May 2010 (UTC)
Best wishes on entering your 80th year. I did make some edits some time back on the late Mr. T. M. Varghese, Thandaneth. Karnan (talk) 14:13, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
- Thanks for watching me growing up and wishing me on entering anther New Year. Double thanks because I saw that letter on my 50th wedding Anniversary. I am also watching your edits for some time. Neduvelilmathew ( talk) 17:42, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
Repeating my wishes. Karnan ( talk) 09:51, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
- Hi Karnan,
- You have very good memory, added with much regard for others. Thanks. Neduvelilmathew ( talk) 10:18, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
Thank you, Sir. Much honoured. Karnan ( talk) 15:32, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
Hello Karnan, just some thoughts. Is it okay to call Krishna Menon a Bengali politician just because he contested an election from West Bengal? In this context, imagine adding the categories Andhra Pradesh politicians and Karnataka politicians in Indira Gandhi. Salih (talk) 16:30, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
- Hello Salih. Well, there was earlier a category in VKKM article saying he was a Maharashtra politician (I did not add that, it was someone else). So I added the category Bengali politician, and the more specific category Mumbai politician (removing the Maharashtra category). Both are there for the same kind of reason. I am not very keen on those categories, but either both must be removed, or both must stay. You can decide as you wish. I know that VKKM was particularly proud of his contesting from outside his home state, as a mark of his non-attachment to regional sentiments (and he was critical of Nehru contesting only from Allahabad, his home turf); VKKM finally contested his last election from Trivandrum when all options had run out (but again, he was reluctant to do so from Calicut). So perhaps he himself would have been happy to be included in those categories (not that this is very decisive, but just a remark). I don't know how Indira Gandhi viewed contesting outside Allahabad, but perhaps not so ascetically as VKKM. If Indira Gandhi is not included in those categories, and a regional tag on a politician is conferred by birth, yes, both those should be removed. Karnan ( talk) 22:45, 27 March 2011 (UTC)
This discussion is copied from Talk:V. K. Krishna Menon.
Hi, Karnan. You can communicate to me over Wikipedia talk page on the subject matter. I`d be more than happy to talk to you except personal data. With best wishes -- Kumaripriya ( talk) 04:00, 14 April 2011 (UTC)
No idea, Dear Karnan. To be frank with you, I don`t exactly remember about it. Leave it at it and let`s talk about Devasahayam Pillai now onwards. You have any more details with you about him? If so, why don`t you share through these pages? -- Kumaripriya ( talk) 15:54, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
Hi. noticed that you are a regular editor on the page. Have started a discussion with other editors in the Talk Page on some suggestions to improve the article. The discussion are located here [3], [4] . Appreciate if you could review and give your thoughts on this. Prodigyhk ( talk) 11:50, 19 August 2013 (UTC)
Hello! Voting in the 2022 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23:59 (UTC) on Monday, 12 December 2022. All eligible users are allowed to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.
The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.
If you wish to participate in the 2022 election, please review
the candidates and submit your choices on the
voting page. If you no longer wish to receive these messages, you may add {{
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talk) 00:25, 29 November 2022 (UTC)