Hello, Bayshorebabydoll, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:
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Welcome to Wikipedia, Bayshore!
I understand you removed information from Bacliff, Texas that is unflattering towards Bacliff itself. In your edit summary you said that the source article was "an opinion piece and not based on fact". Unfortunately there is no evidence of either case. The article is not labeled as an "opinion" piece (yes, there are Wikipedia guidelines on how to handle "opinion" columns as newspapers) and it was published by a newspaper, so it is not treated as an opinion piece. The Houston Press did not make any retractions towards comments, and any internet discussion board comments do not count as reliable sources. Therefore I have restored the information removed in your edit. WhisperToMe ( talk) 22:36, 16 April 2013 (UTC)
~~~~
.
WhisperToMe (
talk) 21:57, 17 April 2013 (UTC)I also started this thread on the Houston Wikiproject Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Houston#User_removing_unflattering_information_from_Bacliff.2C_Texas and I started a discussion at the Good Article page at Wikipedia_talk:Good_articles#User_removing_content_and_disputing_source_in_article_marked_as_.22good_article.22. I also made a further post to the NPOV noticeboard and contacted three longtime Houston area editors ( User talk:RJN, User talk:Nsaum75, and User talk:Postoak) WhisperToMe ( talk) 21:59, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
Thank you for your reply. I'll take a look at it and post my reply on the Talk:Bacliff, Texas talk page, and I'll show you the specific section. From this point it will be best to keep it on the talk page. WhisperToMe ( talk) 02:19, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
Alright, I posted my reply at Talk:Bacliff,_Texas#Houston_Press_reply_.232 - I have a few questions, but I also have several things to clarify, especially regarding the verifiability policy ( WP:V) WhisperToMe ( talk) 02:47, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 12:52, 3 May 2013 (UTC)Yes, I am still here
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 02:10, 4 May 2013 (UTC)No, I didn't. It didn't seem to require one, but I did read it
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 12:42, 5 May 2013 (UTC)There's a big difference between the Houston Chronicle article on that event and the Houston Press article. The Houston Chronicle artcle reports about it without any of the author's bias that runs throughout the Houston Press article. I have no problem with factual information being included in the Wikipedia entry. It was based mostly on opinion and non factual information before which is not what something that strives to emulate an encyclopedia should be.
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 20:49, 5 May 2013 (UTC)That's a poor example. Lisa Falkenberg is an op ed reporter. Her opinions don't belong in Wikipedia articles either. None of the other nearby cities Wikipedia articles contain reporter's opinions, not even the Wikipedia article on Houston, so then why should Bacliff? Why is it so difficult to stick to the facts? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Neutral_point_of_view - the Houston Press article definitely does not follow this guideline.
98.198.217.61 ( talk) 00:26, 6 May 2013 (UTC)I do not believe that the other city pages "lack development". If that is the case, why has there been no major effort to fix them? Especially Houston, as it ranks much higher in importance than Bacliff. If you truly believe that the other city articles are incomplete, why are you focusing only on Bacliff? You've made no effort to edit any of the others, even Dickinson, which is in desperate need of citations. That one is my next project after I'm satisified with the Bacliff article. I'm puzzled that you are so insistent on attempting to keep information you yourself stated could be outdated. From my POV, it looks like you are attempting to control the Bacliff article, which goes against everything Wikipedia stands for.
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 01:29, 6 May 2013 (UTC)You may have been the primary contributor of the article, but I have every right to edit it. Expecting an article to stay static is not reasonable. There was no whitewashing intended by the removal of the information from the Houston Press. As it was before, the Houston Press information was given undue weight. There were few other sources and a lot of factual history and information were missing.
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 02:46, 6 May 2013 (UTC) An article about a town of 8,000 doesn't merit pages of quotes by reporters. It should be fairly short and concise, and contain only the most relevant information
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 04:14, 6 May 2013 (UTC)There are guidelines on article size. If it gets too big it becomes difficult to read, among other issues Wikipedia:Article_size
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 04:26, 6 May 2013 (UTC)This is not a high profile article
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 04:36, 6 May 2013 (UTC)So split the article, if you feel it warrants it. Also, I'd like to bring up this [[Wikipedia:NOT#Wikipedia_is_not_a_newspaper]. With all the direct quotes from reporters, the article begins to look like a newspaper report. This needs to be fixed.
The cloest thing to another in-depth source on Bacliff is a Houston Press article from 1997 that talks about rising property values in Bacliff and San Leon: http://www.houstonpress.com/1997-06-26/news/besieged-by-the-bay/2/ - No mention of gangs (the Houston Press article on the gangs in 2008 said that the Bacliff gang started out small) - It does talk about an economic decline in the shrimping industry WhisperToMe ( talk) 19:43, 12 May 2013 (UTC) Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 20:53, 13 May 2013 (UTC)Have you checked The Galveston County Daily News? The newspaper dates back to
1842. I have not made it to the library yet to review their archives but its on my list.
I could do a site search and see. It would be cool if the Galveston County Daily News had an in-depth article about Bacliff WhisperToMe ( talk) 00:11, 14 May 2013 (UTC)
Hello, Bayshorebabydoll, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:
Please remember to
sign your messages on
talk pages by typing four
tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out
Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{help me}}
before the question. Again, welcome!
Welcome to Wikipedia, Bayshore!
I understand you removed information from Bacliff, Texas that is unflattering towards Bacliff itself. In your edit summary you said that the source article was "an opinion piece and not based on fact". Unfortunately there is no evidence of either case. The article is not labeled as an "opinion" piece (yes, there are Wikipedia guidelines on how to handle "opinion" columns as newspapers) and it was published by a newspaper, so it is not treated as an opinion piece. The Houston Press did not make any retractions towards comments, and any internet discussion board comments do not count as reliable sources. Therefore I have restored the information removed in your edit. WhisperToMe ( talk) 22:36, 16 April 2013 (UTC)
~~~~
.
WhisperToMe (
talk) 21:57, 17 April 2013 (UTC)I also started this thread on the Houston Wikiproject Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Houston#User_removing_unflattering_information_from_Bacliff.2C_Texas and I started a discussion at the Good Article page at Wikipedia_talk:Good_articles#User_removing_content_and_disputing_source_in_article_marked_as_.22good_article.22. I also made a further post to the NPOV noticeboard and contacted three longtime Houston area editors ( User talk:RJN, User talk:Nsaum75, and User talk:Postoak) WhisperToMe ( talk) 21:59, 17 April 2013 (UTC)
Thank you for your reply. I'll take a look at it and post my reply on the Talk:Bacliff, Texas talk page, and I'll show you the specific section. From this point it will be best to keep it on the talk page. WhisperToMe ( talk) 02:19, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
Alright, I posted my reply at Talk:Bacliff,_Texas#Houston_Press_reply_.232 - I have a few questions, but I also have several things to clarify, especially regarding the verifiability policy ( WP:V) WhisperToMe ( talk) 02:47, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 12:52, 3 May 2013 (UTC)Yes, I am still here
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 02:10, 4 May 2013 (UTC)No, I didn't. It didn't seem to require one, but I did read it
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 12:42, 5 May 2013 (UTC)There's a big difference between the Houston Chronicle article on that event and the Houston Press article. The Houston Chronicle artcle reports about it without any of the author's bias that runs throughout the Houston Press article. I have no problem with factual information being included in the Wikipedia entry. It was based mostly on opinion and non factual information before which is not what something that strives to emulate an encyclopedia should be.
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 20:49, 5 May 2013 (UTC)That's a poor example. Lisa Falkenberg is an op ed reporter. Her opinions don't belong in Wikipedia articles either. None of the other nearby cities Wikipedia articles contain reporter's opinions, not even the Wikipedia article on Houston, so then why should Bacliff? Why is it so difficult to stick to the facts? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Neutral_point_of_view - the Houston Press article definitely does not follow this guideline.
98.198.217.61 ( talk) 00:26, 6 May 2013 (UTC)I do not believe that the other city pages "lack development". If that is the case, why has there been no major effort to fix them? Especially Houston, as it ranks much higher in importance than Bacliff. If you truly believe that the other city articles are incomplete, why are you focusing only on Bacliff? You've made no effort to edit any of the others, even Dickinson, which is in desperate need of citations. That one is my next project after I'm satisified with the Bacliff article. I'm puzzled that you are so insistent on attempting to keep information you yourself stated could be outdated. From my POV, it looks like you are attempting to control the Bacliff article, which goes against everything Wikipedia stands for.
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 01:29, 6 May 2013 (UTC)You may have been the primary contributor of the article, but I have every right to edit it. Expecting an article to stay static is not reasonable. There was no whitewashing intended by the removal of the information from the Houston Press. As it was before, the Houston Press information was given undue weight. There were few other sources and a lot of factual history and information were missing.
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 02:46, 6 May 2013 (UTC) An article about a town of 8,000 doesn't merit pages of quotes by reporters. It should be fairly short and concise, and contain only the most relevant information
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 04:14, 6 May 2013 (UTC)There are guidelines on article size. If it gets too big it becomes difficult to read, among other issues Wikipedia:Article_size
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 04:26, 6 May 2013 (UTC)This is not a high profile article
Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 04:36, 6 May 2013 (UTC)So split the article, if you feel it warrants it. Also, I'd like to bring up this [[Wikipedia:NOT#Wikipedia_is_not_a_newspaper]. With all the direct quotes from reporters, the article begins to look like a newspaper report. This needs to be fixed.
The cloest thing to another in-depth source on Bacliff is a Houston Press article from 1997 that talks about rising property values in Bacliff and San Leon: http://www.houstonpress.com/1997-06-26/news/besieged-by-the-bay/2/ - No mention of gangs (the Houston Press article on the gangs in 2008 said that the Bacliff gang started out small) - It does talk about an economic decline in the shrimping industry WhisperToMe ( talk) 19:43, 12 May 2013 (UTC) Bayshorebabydoll ( talk) 20:53, 13 May 2013 (UTC)Have you checked The Galveston County Daily News? The newspaper dates back to
1842. I have not made it to the library yet to review their archives but its on my list.
I could do a site search and see. It would be cool if the Galveston County Daily News had an in-depth article about Bacliff WhisperToMe ( talk) 00:11, 14 May 2013 (UTC)