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भास्कर्bhagawati
Speak
12:54, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
Malo Bula Trabeta thanks for your contributions, keep up the good work Vinaka
Here are a few good links for newcomers:
Vinaka vaka levu Trabeta and enjoy editing it help me when editing to keep in mind write like its an encyclopedia article, all the best
I have adjusted some and kept the additions around Ma'afu that User talk:Trabeta added, but we must be mindful that The Rasau and the Ravunisa are key also in Lomalomas history and while Ma'fu was a great man there are issues that he cut ties with tonga and also many Fijian chiefs did not fully accept him as a chief he was Tui Lau for a time but not head of Tovata, the head of the Tovata confederacy was always the Tui Cakau. Please lets keep the history in perspective, Lomaloma today has changed two titles have remained vacant for long periods that of the Turaga na Rasau and the Turaga na Ravunisa and that maybe has an effect in the power shift and disputes today but please do not doubt the Mana and history behind these titles and their relative influences on Lomalomas history and their past histories in Fiji.
I will be returning to My Village Lomaloma and visiting my uncles house in Lomaloma and visiting my Grandmothers house in Sawana soon enough User Trabeta and I would like to sit down in the spirit of peace and unity void of Ego around the Tanoa and have an educated discussion around our contributions, especially on Vanuabalavu, lomaloma and Sawana, I will will bring 1kg pounded Waka and I'll Lose the Yaqona, until then lets remain balanced and fair to our beloved Vanua and its varied histories and current predicaments. Vinaka Saka
Ma'afu when referenced should be addressed as Tui Lau as that was his title until he died in 1881. All history books that I have researched confirmed this to be the case and he did not abdicate his position but reverted his claims back to the Tui Nayau. He did not nominate the successor of Tui Nayau as he was supposed to - ref Mara, Pacific Way papers.
In my research - I will correct any errors that I see as incorrectly written about his ventures and existence in Fiji.
Whilst I agree the Rasau, Ravunisa, Tui Naturuku and other Tui's of villages do exist and what they mean culturally to their people - History remains that Ma'afu was the Tui Lau and Chiefdom of the Lau Confederacy as well as the Head of the Tovata.
History also point to the fact that Tovata did not exist until Ma'afu set it up - the government of North Eastern Fiji. Neither of the heads of Lau, Bua or Macuata were subservient to Tui Cakau at any time from the documents that I read - though at times he fought these provinces but I can not see any record where he was decisive - in fact most of his successes was using the support of the early Tongans and Cakobau. The records are correct that Ma'afu was installed as Head of the Tovata for life. There is a plaque at his home in Lotoa installed there by Ratu Mara to commemorate this fact. While Tui Cakau is the current head of the Tovata - this head is by selection - not hereditary ... though today people have incorrectly assumed that the Tui Cakau is the automatic head of the Tovata.
Whilst it is fair to say that there were chiefs in Fiji who were not supportive of Ma'afu - the fact remains that:
It should also be noted that there were alot of unpopular Chiefs in Fiji at the time - eg Cakobau was so unpopular that he was engaged in warfare all his life. The people of Rewa could not stand him and hence the battle of Kaba that brought the Rewans under his control only at the support of the Tongans.
These views are not driven by EGO, not so - they are driven by someone who wants history to be told as it was - not rewritten and swayed to favour one tribe against the other when clearly history and writings do not support it.
Trabeta ( talk) 08:33, 10 February 2013 (UTC)
Malo Bula Trabeta you may be interested in the articles Tui Lau and Tovata Confederacy as your knowledge around the subject is good and helpful. Malo User: Maikeli
I will quote the research work by AC Reid, born in Scotland in 1915 and served for 30 years in the South Pacific including 25 years in Fiji. He was the last European to hold the post of Secretary for Fijian Affairs. He also spent time in Tonga and retired and settled in NSW.
He wrote the only book that I can find in Library in Fiji and in Australian [ANU] that is most balanced in reporting in regards to the formation of the Tovata. His work that I have correlated with other journals confirm the following:
Tovata unlike the Burebasaga and Kubuna - was set up as a political association 'of the same party of the same side' and only formerlised into government post Colonial but has no real clout in Fijian cultural sense
It was formed out of coalition to tame/blunt Cakobau's expansionism which it did and historians wrote as one of the main reasons Cakobau who had claimed the Title of Tui Viti to give Fiji away to the British rather than be subservient to the Tovata Coalition led by their Head Ma'afu.
Tui Bua and Tui Cakau Households have long association with the Tongans hence the coalition. Macuata was different and had a history of division but eventually came to the fold before Deed of Cession
The above are facts supported by referenced works by prominent historians who worked in the Native Land Commission. They are references that I quoted in the article of Enele Ma'afu
Whilst I learned most of these when I was a student at QVS [History teacher was Roqica] later in life I was most interested in the whole history of Fiji pre and post Colonial in particular the culture of cannibalism that was considered normal in Fiji not so long ago ...
Thank God for my ancestors and yours in bringing Christianity to Fiji ...
Trabeta ( talk) 14:01, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
Thanks, I was just trying it out. I didn't think I had saved the page. I was intending to put it back to how it was. Unfortunately I must have forgotten. It's just that having the photos all on the left seemed to make them flow down past the text too much on the right. Tukutukudina ( talk) 01:09, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
No problems - the re arrangement seemed to look better - but after all that hard work - someone has decided the photos are violation of copyright and have been removed. Ihave requested re installation as they are from my own photos or those that I have requested - but most if not all were those that I took from my camera whilst holidaying in the islands
Trabeta ( talk) 02:00, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
Trabeta I was trying to find the right licensing Tags for your photos but before I could they were deleted, try and upload them again and find the correct licensing permission, if you are having trouble let us know, maybe I could help.
Malo User:Maikeli
I understand the reasons and the details required on EXIF filess of the photos - I will access originals from my photo collection and repost them instead of ones sent to me on facebook.
This should not take too long - I had checked out the photos and have collated the originals that I took for posting
Many thanks Trabeta ( talk) 14:20, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
Basis of postings were disclosed. Photos from personal collection and from people who have authoriseduse were also removed.
I can now understand why so many articles do not have photos included.
Whilst lots of efforts have gone into preparing these articles - there are people who are more interested in removal and not understand reasons that were presented.
Will search the world to see who were the authors even some of them over 70 years old so readers can enjoy the article and contexed with photos
To all of you who have taken liberty to remove these items - thanks ...
Trabeta ( talk) 12:54, 5 March 2013 (UTC)
Bula Trabeta, hope all is well, just thought if you had the time if you could write on the Tui Lau title, the installation protocols and procedures for the Tui Lau, I notice alot of chiefly title articles have not got the installation process and folklore histories, I am trying to add them where I have information and knowledge around, if you could help also it would be good. Malo User:Maikeli
Please stop adding
unsourced content, as you did to
Enele Ma'afu. This contravenes Wikipedia's policy on
verifiability. If you continue to do so, you may be
blocked from editing Wikipedia.
Giant
Snowman
16:41, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
I have reverted the sections as the sources of comments are referenced after each paragraph. The Comments are based on research work from the main references ... You need to explain to me what is incorrect with the summary ... if I have done wrong - let me know - otherwise - I am very happy to quit editing this document - And over to you to edit and add value to the article
References include John Spurnway papers, AC Reid book on Tovata, History of Fiji and the facts that are sourced from his home with evidences after speaking to the elders that were of same origin ... Trabeta ( talk) 12:38, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
Hello, I'm
Widr. I wanted to let you know that I undid one or more of
your recent contributions to
Enele Ma'afu because it did not appear constructive. If you think I made a mistake, or if you have any questions, you can leave me a message on
my talk page.
Widr (
talk)
13:00, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
I have removed all information on these articles as they are no longer appropriate to be in this medium -they are my information and i should be the one that removes the lot -i leave for others to contribute where they can - my research will be published elsewhere Trabeta ( talk) 14:11, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current
Arbitration Committee election. The
Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia
arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose
site bans,
topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The
arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to
review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on
the voting page. For the Election committee,
MediaWiki message delivery (
talk)
16:57, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Hi, Welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Our
intro page contains a lot of helpful material for new users—please check it out! If you need help, visit
Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on
my talk page, or place {{helpme}}
on this page, followed by your question, and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions.
भास्कर्bhagawati
Speak
12:54, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
Malo Bula Trabeta thanks for your contributions, keep up the good work Vinaka
Here are a few good links for newcomers:
Vinaka vaka levu Trabeta and enjoy editing it help me when editing to keep in mind write like its an encyclopedia article, all the best
I have adjusted some and kept the additions around Ma'afu that User talk:Trabeta added, but we must be mindful that The Rasau and the Ravunisa are key also in Lomalomas history and while Ma'fu was a great man there are issues that he cut ties with tonga and also many Fijian chiefs did not fully accept him as a chief he was Tui Lau for a time but not head of Tovata, the head of the Tovata confederacy was always the Tui Cakau. Please lets keep the history in perspective, Lomaloma today has changed two titles have remained vacant for long periods that of the Turaga na Rasau and the Turaga na Ravunisa and that maybe has an effect in the power shift and disputes today but please do not doubt the Mana and history behind these titles and their relative influences on Lomalomas history and their past histories in Fiji.
I will be returning to My Village Lomaloma and visiting my uncles house in Lomaloma and visiting my Grandmothers house in Sawana soon enough User Trabeta and I would like to sit down in the spirit of peace and unity void of Ego around the Tanoa and have an educated discussion around our contributions, especially on Vanuabalavu, lomaloma and Sawana, I will will bring 1kg pounded Waka and I'll Lose the Yaqona, until then lets remain balanced and fair to our beloved Vanua and its varied histories and current predicaments. Vinaka Saka
Ma'afu when referenced should be addressed as Tui Lau as that was his title until he died in 1881. All history books that I have researched confirmed this to be the case and he did not abdicate his position but reverted his claims back to the Tui Nayau. He did not nominate the successor of Tui Nayau as he was supposed to - ref Mara, Pacific Way papers.
In my research - I will correct any errors that I see as incorrectly written about his ventures and existence in Fiji.
Whilst I agree the Rasau, Ravunisa, Tui Naturuku and other Tui's of villages do exist and what they mean culturally to their people - History remains that Ma'afu was the Tui Lau and Chiefdom of the Lau Confederacy as well as the Head of the Tovata.
History also point to the fact that Tovata did not exist until Ma'afu set it up - the government of North Eastern Fiji. Neither of the heads of Lau, Bua or Macuata were subservient to Tui Cakau at any time from the documents that I read - though at times he fought these provinces but I can not see any record where he was decisive - in fact most of his successes was using the support of the early Tongans and Cakobau. The records are correct that Ma'afu was installed as Head of the Tovata for life. There is a plaque at his home in Lotoa installed there by Ratu Mara to commemorate this fact. While Tui Cakau is the current head of the Tovata - this head is by selection - not hereditary ... though today people have incorrectly assumed that the Tui Cakau is the automatic head of the Tovata.
Whilst it is fair to say that there were chiefs in Fiji who were not supportive of Ma'afu - the fact remains that:
It should also be noted that there were alot of unpopular Chiefs in Fiji at the time - eg Cakobau was so unpopular that he was engaged in warfare all his life. The people of Rewa could not stand him and hence the battle of Kaba that brought the Rewans under his control only at the support of the Tongans.
These views are not driven by EGO, not so - they are driven by someone who wants history to be told as it was - not rewritten and swayed to favour one tribe against the other when clearly history and writings do not support it.
Trabeta ( talk) 08:33, 10 February 2013 (UTC)
Malo Bula Trabeta you may be interested in the articles Tui Lau and Tovata Confederacy as your knowledge around the subject is good and helpful. Malo User: Maikeli
I will quote the research work by AC Reid, born in Scotland in 1915 and served for 30 years in the South Pacific including 25 years in Fiji. He was the last European to hold the post of Secretary for Fijian Affairs. He also spent time in Tonga and retired and settled in NSW.
He wrote the only book that I can find in Library in Fiji and in Australian [ANU] that is most balanced in reporting in regards to the formation of the Tovata. His work that I have correlated with other journals confirm the following:
Tovata unlike the Burebasaga and Kubuna - was set up as a political association 'of the same party of the same side' and only formerlised into government post Colonial but has no real clout in Fijian cultural sense
It was formed out of coalition to tame/blunt Cakobau's expansionism which it did and historians wrote as one of the main reasons Cakobau who had claimed the Title of Tui Viti to give Fiji away to the British rather than be subservient to the Tovata Coalition led by their Head Ma'afu.
Tui Bua and Tui Cakau Households have long association with the Tongans hence the coalition. Macuata was different and had a history of division but eventually came to the fold before Deed of Cession
The above are facts supported by referenced works by prominent historians who worked in the Native Land Commission. They are references that I quoted in the article of Enele Ma'afu
Whilst I learned most of these when I was a student at QVS [History teacher was Roqica] later in life I was most interested in the whole history of Fiji pre and post Colonial in particular the culture of cannibalism that was considered normal in Fiji not so long ago ...
Thank God for my ancestors and yours in bringing Christianity to Fiji ...
Trabeta ( talk) 14:01, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
Thanks, I was just trying it out. I didn't think I had saved the page. I was intending to put it back to how it was. Unfortunately I must have forgotten. It's just that having the photos all on the left seemed to make them flow down past the text too much on the right. Tukutukudina ( talk) 01:09, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
No problems - the re arrangement seemed to look better - but after all that hard work - someone has decided the photos are violation of copyright and have been removed. Ihave requested re installation as they are from my own photos or those that I have requested - but most if not all were those that I took from my camera whilst holidaying in the islands
Trabeta ( talk) 02:00, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
Trabeta I was trying to find the right licensing Tags for your photos but before I could they were deleted, try and upload them again and find the correct licensing permission, if you are having trouble let us know, maybe I could help.
Malo User:Maikeli
I understand the reasons and the details required on EXIF filess of the photos - I will access originals from my photo collection and repost them instead of ones sent to me on facebook.
This should not take too long - I had checked out the photos and have collated the originals that I took for posting
Many thanks Trabeta ( talk) 14:20, 2 March 2013 (UTC)
Basis of postings were disclosed. Photos from personal collection and from people who have authoriseduse were also removed.
I can now understand why so many articles do not have photos included.
Whilst lots of efforts have gone into preparing these articles - there are people who are more interested in removal and not understand reasons that were presented.
Will search the world to see who were the authors even some of them over 70 years old so readers can enjoy the article and contexed with photos
To all of you who have taken liberty to remove these items - thanks ...
Trabeta ( talk) 12:54, 5 March 2013 (UTC)
Bula Trabeta, hope all is well, just thought if you had the time if you could write on the Tui Lau title, the installation protocols and procedures for the Tui Lau, I notice alot of chiefly title articles have not got the installation process and folklore histories, I am trying to add them where I have information and knowledge around, if you could help also it would be good. Malo User:Maikeli
Please stop adding
unsourced content, as you did to
Enele Ma'afu. This contravenes Wikipedia's policy on
verifiability. If you continue to do so, you may be
blocked from editing Wikipedia.
Giant
Snowman
16:41, 19 June 2013 (UTC)
I have reverted the sections as the sources of comments are referenced after each paragraph. The Comments are based on research work from the main references ... You need to explain to me what is incorrect with the summary ... if I have done wrong - let me know - otherwise - I am very happy to quit editing this document - And over to you to edit and add value to the article
References include John Spurnway papers, AC Reid book on Tovata, History of Fiji and the facts that are sourced from his home with evidences after speaking to the elders that were of same origin ... Trabeta ( talk) 12:38, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
Hello, I'm
Widr. I wanted to let you know that I undid one or more of
your recent contributions to
Enele Ma'afu because it did not appear constructive. If you think I made a mistake, or if you have any questions, you can leave me a message on
my talk page.
Widr (
talk)
13:00, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
I have removed all information on these articles as they are no longer appropriate to be in this medium -they are my information and i should be the one that removes the lot -i leave for others to contribute where they can - my research will be published elsewhere Trabeta ( talk) 14:11, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current
Arbitration Committee election. The
Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia
arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose
site bans,
topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The
arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to
review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on
the voting page. For the Election committee,
MediaWiki message delivery (
talk)
16:57, 24 November 2015 (UTC)