This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 5 | ← | Archive 10 | Archive 11 | Archive 12 | Archive 13 | Archive 14 | Archive 15 |
regards, Rich 02:26, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
Regarding your comment on User talk:Gerbrant/hidePane.js, did you mean to say that there should be some kind of description, or that it doesn't appear to work for you? B.t.w. I'm thinking of redesigning the script, such that the pop-up menu's will be located at the top. I'm not sure how to go about it yet, but ideally all the "interface" shouldn't take up more than one line or so. I think the article is what's important, all that clutter in the left pane may be useful sometimes, but when you're reading an article it just gets in the way. Shinobu 14:50, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi there, are you still interested in becoming an admin? I would be happy to nominate you if you were. Tim Vickers 21:42, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
Oxford American Dictionary albino |al?bi-no-| noun ( pl. -nos) a person or animal having a congenital absence of pigment in the skin and hair (which are white) and the eyes (which are typically pink). • informal an abnormally white animal or plant : [as modifier ] an albino tiger.
Is not "genetic disorder" or "medical condition"... IS A "NATURAL CONDITION"
race noun each of the major divisions of humankind, having distinct physical characteristics
You are very offensive, and ignorant...
You remember when the homosexuality was a "medical condition"?
Albinistic is very offensive, "person with albinism" is very offensive because you are considering like a disease "person with albinism" is like "person with AIDS"...
why the blondes, brown, homosexual... are "natural"... and the albinos a disorder, a "medical condition"?
"black people" have diseases that "white people" do not have or "Asian people" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.97.77.181 ( talk) 21:02, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
I asked at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style about this, but got no response. I am now spamming people whe participate in MOS with this request: would you look at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College football#NCAAFootballSingleGameHeader template usage and tell me what you think? - Peregrine Fisher 07:00, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
I have removed [1] an unsourced statement you added [2]:
"The UPA is in competition with the Billiard Congress of America and the International Pool Tour for US market dominance in cue sports."
I know nothing about the subject but there was a help desk complaint and then I didn't want to just tag it as unsourced. PrimeHunter 12:00, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi SMcCandlish. That large, annoying {{ NCAAFootballSingleGameHeader}} scoreboard posted at the top of the Chicken Soup Game article now at DRV brought me to this post of yours. Would you mind if I used your post as the reasoning behing my listing that template at TfD? (Or would you consider listing that template at TfD yourself). Thanks. -- Jreferee t/ c 15:12, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
Template:NCAAFootballSingleGameHeader has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. — Jreferee t/ c 06:30, 23 November 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for your answer on the manual of style discussion page. I threw up some other points. Could you respond to them if possible? Mrshaba ( talk) 07:31, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi again... I've been using your {{ rp}} template while developing my Solar energy glossary... So far so good... I think I need to add the Notes section back to get full use of your template's power but I'll get to that. I have another question you might be able to help with. Here's the situation. I want to define a field of text as a master "driver text". Then I want to have "passenger links" relate back to this original master field. This has to do with the popup idea I asked you about. When I scroll over a "passenger link" I want to see the popup text from the "driver" field. If the "driver" field is updated I want the "passenger link" popup reflect the changes. I understand this might be too complicated for WP but I'm asking for my own edification. Can HTML do this? I've asked the gurus at work and despite some honest work we haven't been able to get a Word document to accomplish this. Just asking... Thanks again for the template suggestion. Mrshaba ( talk) 18:25, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
Hey Stanton,
I see the issue of flagging edits as 'minor' has been brought to your attention before, but it just caught my eye too. This comment on WT:MOS probably shouldn't have been flagged as minor; neither should this removal of an OR item. Maybe these were just mistakes or your interpretation is different; if the latter, at least now you know that I, for one, really don't consider those minor. Use that information however you wish :-)
Regards, Phaunt ( talk) 18:41, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
Hey Stanton, long time no speak. Reagarding SMcCandlish/Ithiel de Sola Pool, I was just about to post "Declining speedy deletion. While this was probably meant as a subpage and not for the mainspace, this is an established and trusted user who will do the right thing" but I when I clicked save it had already been deleted.:-)-- Fuhghettaboutit ( talk) 20:16, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
Further to my previous note, the issue of reconciling this bloated page with WP:MEDMOS is long overdue, and strengthens the case for more centralised coordination. Tony (talk) 05:30, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
Some loose ends, since I [User:SMcCandlish] can't reply at the now closed CfD:
1. Re: "It's a real pity that when there have been several substantive responses here addressing the criteria in the relevant guideline, ... We have here a specific, relevant guideline; please do try to adress the tests which it sets."
I did address them to the extent that I considered them applicable (while you ignored my salient points, simply saying " WP:CATGRS says..." again and again), and I further noted that CATGRS on this matter conflicts with WP:OVERCAT, which I believe to have much broader support. Just because a guideline exists does not mean that it is perfect and always correct in every situation. Others besides me strongly disagreed with your interpretation of CATGRS's permissiveness, including the closer of the CfD. Your mistake is clear in your wording "the relevant guideline" (emphasis added); you seem to think (and regardless what you really think, you advance the argument that) there can be only one, a fallacious position.
2. Re: "...you prefer to make assumptions about my 'beliefs and feelings on gender issues' when I have not discussed them are not at issue."
Um, no. Let's quote you a little:
And so on, including a couple of sourcing sprees about the issues surrounding women in modeling, a minilecture about superwaifs, etc., etc. You seem to want to talk about nothing but: a) Your beliefs and feelings on gender issues, which were not actually germane to the discussion at all, and you managed to engage in multiple borderline WP:NPA violations in the process. (if I were a whiney-butt and ran to WP:ANI about it, I have little doubt that others would agree with me on that point; but my skin is thicker than that and I prefer to resolve things personally). And b) your very permissive interpretation of CATGRS (which is in such conflict with OVERCAT that I've now brought the issue up on OVERCAT's talk page), an interpretation others did not seem willing to support (even the keep !votes didn't go that far, and appeared to amount to "I like it" and "it's useful" mis-arguments, per WP:AADD, thus the "no consensus" closure – had the keep rationales not been AADD it would have been an overwhelming keep closure).
3. Re: "if this category is deleted, it is but a small tidyup matter to delete the subcats in a further CfD; the difference with depopulation is that emptying a category removes evidence of what he category was being used for, whereas populating an existing category is a widely-encouraged form of editing."
Not when the category is under deletion discussion! As an admin for a year or so, you must know this already. Well, you do now, since the closer chided you for it.
I'm sorry that we got into such a ruckus; I do not edit Wikipedia for the purpose of getting into verbal fights. But you have to expect one when you repeatedly insinuate that someone is a mysogynist just because they CfD a category that incidentally happens to be related to women in some way, and they express strong feelings that the category is a bad idea because of its uselessness and redundancy (i.e. it is dumb and ridiculous) and it conflicts with consensus and with WP:OVERCAT that F/M split categories should not exist except in exceptional cases, this obviously not being one them.
— SMcCandlish [ talk] [ cont] ‹(-¿-)› 19:16, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
If you persist in personally attacking me, in talk or in edit summaries as you did again here, I will escalate this to WP:ANI. Being an admin does not make you magically exempt from WP:NPA, nor does it make you magically immune to having issues with your editing raised on your talk page. Feel free to immediately archive or even delete this ( WP:USERPAGE specifically state that warnings may be removed, as tacit acknowledgment that they have been read); I do not intend this one to be a conversation of any kind. — SMcCandlish [ talk] [ cont] ‹(-¿-)› 13:45, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the tips. I'd seen other category talk pages within the parent category that had those and strove for consistency. I was right that consistency was needed, but now that I've researched this further, I see that you're right and a different kind of consistency was what was needed. If I goof on something, I want to learn it quickly, so your remarks are appreciated. We never stop learning. Doczilla ( talk) 02:49, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
I noticed you requested a doppelganger account at WP:ACC, before removing the request. I almost tried to do something similar a while ago (I wanted to create User:Bameca to prevent impersonation), but then realized that if you can't create the doppelganger yourself, then neither can an impersonator. So you don't need to use WP:ACC for doppelganger account creation. -- barneca ( talk) 04:16, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
I just noticed you're having some trouble with her as well: she also abuses her administrative powers to delete articles about supercentenarians. Extremely sexy ( talk) 14:17, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
cite me a wikipedia policy or guideline that states that i must capitalize my sentences or personal pronouns on talk pages, then your unsolicited comments will have some actual substance. otherwise, please find more constructive use of your time here. wikipedia is not an IM or text messaging system, quite correct. talk pages are not encyclopedia articles. you will not find a single instance where my edits of actual encyclopedia articles are less than appropriate. we are here to edit an encyclopedia, not bitch about other user's style on talk pages. i don't recall ever having interacted with you in any manner, why do you feel it appropriate to castigate me as you have? Please try to be more civil. Anastrophe ( talk) 15:48, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi SMcC. Just a few small things to raise.
As for "non–San Franscisco"/"non – San Franscisco", that's a no-brainer. That should be a hypen not an en-dash, and we don't space hyphens that way. I don't care if one magazine does it. They're simply being goofy.
6.85 In place of a hyphen
The en dash is used in place of a hyphen in a compound adjective when one of its elements is an open compound or when two or more of its elements are open compounds or hyphenated compounds (see 7.83). As illustrated by the first four examples below, en dashes separate the main elements of the new compounds more clearly than hyphens would (“hospital” versus “nursing home,” “post” versus “World War II,” etc.), thus preventing ambiguity. In the last two examples, however, to have used en dashes between “non” and “English” and between “user” and “designed” would merely have created an awkward asymmetry; the meaning is clear with hyphens.
the post–World War II years
a hospital–nursing home connection
a nursing home–home care policy
a quasi-public–quasi-judicial body (or, better, a judicial body that is quasi-public and quasi-judicial)
but
non-English-speaking peoples
a wheelchair-user-designed environment (or, better, an environment designed for wheelchair users)
(Abbreviations for compounds are treated as single words, so a hyphen, not an en dash, is used in such phrases as “U.S.-Canadian relations.”)
– Noetica?? Talk 23:53, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
– Noetica?? Talk 23:53, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
The difficulty does not arise for double quotes, and this is one of the reasons the latter are recommended.
This difficulty does not arise for double quotes, and this is one of the reasons the latter are recommended.
Finally, I like your work and I hope that we can collaborate on a few fronts. My own push would be for reforms to the editing system itself (you've noted and supported the one concerning the hard space, I see), and for a trimmed, centralised, and coordinated suite of style guidelines for Wikipedia. Tony, you, and I all want these things, I think. But for me the real worry is that none of this will turn out to be feasible. I'm still considering, as I say above, what if anything I want to do, since it may take up too much time, effort, and life. Anyway, best wishes to you – however things work out.
– Noetica?? Talk 23:53, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
I tried to undo the edit you made yesterday on this page, and I noticed that you changed it back. By my own admission, I am not as good as you with the codes. The reason I changed your edit is because, for some reasons -- and I do not know why -- your edit eliminates Shane Van Boening's name on the American pool player category. Look at the very bottom of Shane Van Boening's page. The edit somehow makes everything else invisible, thereby Shane's inclusion of American pool player category is gone. Could you maybe see what is going on there? I can't fix it other than undo your edit. I know you will make it right! :>) RailbirdJAM ( talk) 08:32, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
re: this
Because of my family history, I've spent— oh, say 47 years, give or take one way or another with one foot in the blue collar world, and the other in professional work (only 23 personally, though just as many helping my Dad in his practice)—so I hope you'll forgive me if I spoke strongly, for I meant no offense. BUT... in the blue collar world, one of the WORST things one can be accused of, is stealing another man's tools, which neglecting monetary and material costs, almost always means one is also undertaking the ultimate incivil (web) act— the one of stealing some of his time as well, for having the proper tool to do the job is almost always a big time saver, and time is something none of us have enough of in a busy life.
Around here, things (proposals, actions, etc.) which cost others time, or might do so, tend to be things that get me "hot and bothered", for far too many here are too young to appreciate their impact on others downstream, as it were. It really wears, but only time and experience will cure them, and by then, they'll probably be soo soo soooo frustrated they'll have ceased to put up with the hostile environment such constant changes cause that like far too many editors here have in the past, they'll stop... and edit no more.
SO minimizing unnecessary CHANGES is a good thing... it helps expert retention and learning curves for newbies. Not just confusing activity (with dubious payback) with progress. So, forgive me if I think that sort of proposal is precisely the wrong thing to be doing at Tfd... the time cost is too high far too often when one is converting a generic tool that has long been established. Where is the harm in having a second wrench in the toolkit? Bottom line: Any self-respecting craftsmen would have tens of such, not just one or two.
Were your proposal feasible, the proper way to go about it would be to rewrite the older {'2', '3', ...,'7'} templates to use '8', verify each is working, and perhaps shuffle out the numbers so there were less in the end. [but only if nothing is currently linking the template page. Identify the least used lower number and clear THAT, move '8' there, and then you can proceed with others. But this is conversion work that can go on solely if the syntaxes are fully compatible, or a redirect can be made, etc. I'm sure you know what I mean.]
But the WORK AND TIME COST should be born by YOU... not someone else you victimize unwittingly because you happened to have an impulse one day to "trim fat" or however you rationalize such a deletion package.
One thing is certain... were those all to disappear or need special pipetrick coding, someone else will have to PAY A TIMECOST going forward to learn a new syntax, simply because you are insensitive today anticipating the problem you will cost them.
None of that addresses the problems you might be causing in template expansion limits, which are likely enough given that such templates tend to be used solely on long complex list articles, not simple pages.
You want to do something immediately useful, clean up the damn usage in '8' so it's not referring to '7' which has nothing in usage at all. It's a bit hard for someone to know you know what you're talking about when neither usage repeats, and I fought long and hard for decent documentation capability and find unclear 'references' to other pages offensive. If nothing else, consolidate the usage in one page and use {{
Documentation|Common usage pagename}}
calls. Be well, and have a good day! //
Fra
nkB
15:14, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 5 | ← | Archive 10 | Archive 11 | Archive 12 | Archive 13 | Archive 14 | Archive 15 |
regards, Rich 02:26, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
Regarding your comment on User talk:Gerbrant/hidePane.js, did you mean to say that there should be some kind of description, or that it doesn't appear to work for you? B.t.w. I'm thinking of redesigning the script, such that the pop-up menu's will be located at the top. I'm not sure how to go about it yet, but ideally all the "interface" shouldn't take up more than one line or so. I think the article is what's important, all that clutter in the left pane may be useful sometimes, but when you're reading an article it just gets in the way. Shinobu 14:50, 2 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi there, are you still interested in becoming an admin? I would be happy to nominate you if you were. Tim Vickers 21:42, 7 November 2007 (UTC)
Oxford American Dictionary albino |al?bi-no-| noun ( pl. -nos) a person or animal having a congenital absence of pigment in the skin and hair (which are white) and the eyes (which are typically pink). • informal an abnormally white animal or plant : [as modifier ] an albino tiger.
Is not "genetic disorder" or "medical condition"... IS A "NATURAL CONDITION"
race noun each of the major divisions of humankind, having distinct physical characteristics
You are very offensive, and ignorant...
You remember when the homosexuality was a "medical condition"?
Albinistic is very offensive, "person with albinism" is very offensive because you are considering like a disease "person with albinism" is like "person with AIDS"...
why the blondes, brown, homosexual... are "natural"... and the albinos a disorder, a "medical condition"?
"black people" have diseases that "white people" do not have or "Asian people" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.97.77.181 ( talk) 21:02, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
I asked at Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style about this, but got no response. I am now spamming people whe participate in MOS with this request: would you look at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College football#NCAAFootballSingleGameHeader template usage and tell me what you think? - Peregrine Fisher 07:00, 10 November 2007 (UTC)
I have removed [1] an unsourced statement you added [2]:
"The UPA is in competition with the Billiard Congress of America and the International Pool Tour for US market dominance in cue sports."
I know nothing about the subject but there was a help desk complaint and then I didn't want to just tag it as unsourced. PrimeHunter 12:00, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi SMcCandlish. That large, annoying {{ NCAAFootballSingleGameHeader}} scoreboard posted at the top of the Chicken Soup Game article now at DRV brought me to this post of yours. Would you mind if I used your post as the reasoning behing my listing that template at TfD? (Or would you consider listing that template at TfD yourself). Thanks. -- Jreferee t/ c 15:12, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
Template:NCAAFootballSingleGameHeader has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. — Jreferee t/ c 06:30, 23 November 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for your answer on the manual of style discussion page. I threw up some other points. Could you respond to them if possible? Mrshaba ( talk) 07:31, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi again... I've been using your {{ rp}} template while developing my Solar energy glossary... So far so good... I think I need to add the Notes section back to get full use of your template's power but I'll get to that. I have another question you might be able to help with. Here's the situation. I want to define a field of text as a master "driver text". Then I want to have "passenger links" relate back to this original master field. This has to do with the popup idea I asked you about. When I scroll over a "passenger link" I want to see the popup text from the "driver" field. If the "driver" field is updated I want the "passenger link" popup reflect the changes. I understand this might be too complicated for WP but I'm asking for my own edification. Can HTML do this? I've asked the gurus at work and despite some honest work we haven't been able to get a Word document to accomplish this. Just asking... Thanks again for the template suggestion. Mrshaba ( talk) 18:25, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
Hey Stanton,
I see the issue of flagging edits as 'minor' has been brought to your attention before, but it just caught my eye too. This comment on WT:MOS probably shouldn't have been flagged as minor; neither should this removal of an OR item. Maybe these were just mistakes or your interpretation is different; if the latter, at least now you know that I, for one, really don't consider those minor. Use that information however you wish :-)
Regards, Phaunt ( talk) 18:41, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
Hey Stanton, long time no speak. Reagarding SMcCandlish/Ithiel de Sola Pool, I was just about to post "Declining speedy deletion. While this was probably meant as a subpage and not for the mainspace, this is an established and trusted user who will do the right thing" but I when I clicked save it had already been deleted.:-)-- Fuhghettaboutit ( talk) 20:16, 24 November 2007 (UTC)
Further to my previous note, the issue of reconciling this bloated page with WP:MEDMOS is long overdue, and strengthens the case for more centralised coordination. Tony (talk) 05:30, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
Some loose ends, since I [User:SMcCandlish] can't reply at the now closed CfD:
1. Re: "It's a real pity that when there have been several substantive responses here addressing the criteria in the relevant guideline, ... We have here a specific, relevant guideline; please do try to adress the tests which it sets."
I did address them to the extent that I considered them applicable (while you ignored my salient points, simply saying " WP:CATGRS says..." again and again), and I further noted that CATGRS on this matter conflicts with WP:OVERCAT, which I believe to have much broader support. Just because a guideline exists does not mean that it is perfect and always correct in every situation. Others besides me strongly disagreed with your interpretation of CATGRS's permissiveness, including the closer of the CfD. Your mistake is clear in your wording "the relevant guideline" (emphasis added); you seem to think (and regardless what you really think, you advance the argument that) there can be only one, a fallacious position.
2. Re: "...you prefer to make assumptions about my 'beliefs and feelings on gender issues' when I have not discussed them are not at issue."
Um, no. Let's quote you a little:
And so on, including a couple of sourcing sprees about the issues surrounding women in modeling, a minilecture about superwaifs, etc., etc. You seem to want to talk about nothing but: a) Your beliefs and feelings on gender issues, which were not actually germane to the discussion at all, and you managed to engage in multiple borderline WP:NPA violations in the process. (if I were a whiney-butt and ran to WP:ANI about it, I have little doubt that others would agree with me on that point; but my skin is thicker than that and I prefer to resolve things personally). And b) your very permissive interpretation of CATGRS (which is in such conflict with OVERCAT that I've now brought the issue up on OVERCAT's talk page), an interpretation others did not seem willing to support (even the keep !votes didn't go that far, and appeared to amount to "I like it" and "it's useful" mis-arguments, per WP:AADD, thus the "no consensus" closure – had the keep rationales not been AADD it would have been an overwhelming keep closure).
3. Re: "if this category is deleted, it is but a small tidyup matter to delete the subcats in a further CfD; the difference with depopulation is that emptying a category removes evidence of what he category was being used for, whereas populating an existing category is a widely-encouraged form of editing."
Not when the category is under deletion discussion! As an admin for a year or so, you must know this already. Well, you do now, since the closer chided you for it.
I'm sorry that we got into such a ruckus; I do not edit Wikipedia for the purpose of getting into verbal fights. But you have to expect one when you repeatedly insinuate that someone is a mysogynist just because they CfD a category that incidentally happens to be related to women in some way, and they express strong feelings that the category is a bad idea because of its uselessness and redundancy (i.e. it is dumb and ridiculous) and it conflicts with consensus and with WP:OVERCAT that F/M split categories should not exist except in exceptional cases, this obviously not being one them.
— SMcCandlish [ talk] [ cont] ‹(-¿-)› 19:16, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
If you persist in personally attacking me, in talk or in edit summaries as you did again here, I will escalate this to WP:ANI. Being an admin does not make you magically exempt from WP:NPA, nor does it make you magically immune to having issues with your editing raised on your talk page. Feel free to immediately archive or even delete this ( WP:USERPAGE specifically state that warnings may be removed, as tacit acknowledgment that they have been read); I do not intend this one to be a conversation of any kind. — SMcCandlish [ talk] [ cont] ‹(-¿-)› 13:45, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the tips. I'd seen other category talk pages within the parent category that had those and strove for consistency. I was right that consistency was needed, but now that I've researched this further, I see that you're right and a different kind of consistency was what was needed. If I goof on something, I want to learn it quickly, so your remarks are appreciated. We never stop learning. Doczilla ( talk) 02:49, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
I noticed you requested a doppelganger account at WP:ACC, before removing the request. I almost tried to do something similar a while ago (I wanted to create User:Bameca to prevent impersonation), but then realized that if you can't create the doppelganger yourself, then neither can an impersonator. So you don't need to use WP:ACC for doppelganger account creation. -- barneca ( talk) 04:16, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
I just noticed you're having some trouble with her as well: she also abuses her administrative powers to delete articles about supercentenarians. Extremely sexy ( talk) 14:17, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
cite me a wikipedia policy or guideline that states that i must capitalize my sentences or personal pronouns on talk pages, then your unsolicited comments will have some actual substance. otherwise, please find more constructive use of your time here. wikipedia is not an IM or text messaging system, quite correct. talk pages are not encyclopedia articles. you will not find a single instance where my edits of actual encyclopedia articles are less than appropriate. we are here to edit an encyclopedia, not bitch about other user's style on talk pages. i don't recall ever having interacted with you in any manner, why do you feel it appropriate to castigate me as you have? Please try to be more civil. Anastrophe ( talk) 15:48, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
Hi SMcC. Just a few small things to raise.
As for "non–San Franscisco"/"non – San Franscisco", that's a no-brainer. That should be a hypen not an en-dash, and we don't space hyphens that way. I don't care if one magazine does it. They're simply being goofy.
6.85 In place of a hyphen
The en dash is used in place of a hyphen in a compound adjective when one of its elements is an open compound or when two or more of its elements are open compounds or hyphenated compounds (see 7.83). As illustrated by the first four examples below, en dashes separate the main elements of the new compounds more clearly than hyphens would (“hospital” versus “nursing home,” “post” versus “World War II,” etc.), thus preventing ambiguity. In the last two examples, however, to have used en dashes between “non” and “English” and between “user” and “designed” would merely have created an awkward asymmetry; the meaning is clear with hyphens.
the post–World War II years
a hospital–nursing home connection
a nursing home–home care policy
a quasi-public–quasi-judicial body (or, better, a judicial body that is quasi-public and quasi-judicial)
but
non-English-speaking peoples
a wheelchair-user-designed environment (or, better, an environment designed for wheelchair users)
(Abbreviations for compounds are treated as single words, so a hyphen, not an en dash, is used in such phrases as “U.S.-Canadian relations.”)
– Noetica?? Talk 23:53, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
– Noetica?? Talk 23:53, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
The difficulty does not arise for double quotes, and this is one of the reasons the latter are recommended.
This difficulty does not arise for double quotes, and this is one of the reasons the latter are recommended.
Finally, I like your work and I hope that we can collaborate on a few fronts. My own push would be for reforms to the editing system itself (you've noted and supported the one concerning the hard space, I see), and for a trimmed, centralised, and coordinated suite of style guidelines for Wikipedia. Tony, you, and I all want these things, I think. But for me the real worry is that none of this will turn out to be feasible. I'm still considering, as I say above, what if anything I want to do, since it may take up too much time, effort, and life. Anyway, best wishes to you – however things work out.
– Noetica?? Talk 23:53, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
I tried to undo the edit you made yesterday on this page, and I noticed that you changed it back. By my own admission, I am not as good as you with the codes. The reason I changed your edit is because, for some reasons -- and I do not know why -- your edit eliminates Shane Van Boening's name on the American pool player category. Look at the very bottom of Shane Van Boening's page. The edit somehow makes everything else invisible, thereby Shane's inclusion of American pool player category is gone. Could you maybe see what is going on there? I can't fix it other than undo your edit. I know you will make it right! :>) RailbirdJAM ( talk) 08:32, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
re: this
Because of my family history, I've spent— oh, say 47 years, give or take one way or another with one foot in the blue collar world, and the other in professional work (only 23 personally, though just as many helping my Dad in his practice)—so I hope you'll forgive me if I spoke strongly, for I meant no offense. BUT... in the blue collar world, one of the WORST things one can be accused of, is stealing another man's tools, which neglecting monetary and material costs, almost always means one is also undertaking the ultimate incivil (web) act— the one of stealing some of his time as well, for having the proper tool to do the job is almost always a big time saver, and time is something none of us have enough of in a busy life.
Around here, things (proposals, actions, etc.) which cost others time, or might do so, tend to be things that get me "hot and bothered", for far too many here are too young to appreciate their impact on others downstream, as it were. It really wears, but only time and experience will cure them, and by then, they'll probably be soo soo soooo frustrated they'll have ceased to put up with the hostile environment such constant changes cause that like far too many editors here have in the past, they'll stop... and edit no more.
SO minimizing unnecessary CHANGES is a good thing... it helps expert retention and learning curves for newbies. Not just confusing activity (with dubious payback) with progress. So, forgive me if I think that sort of proposal is precisely the wrong thing to be doing at Tfd... the time cost is too high far too often when one is converting a generic tool that has long been established. Where is the harm in having a second wrench in the toolkit? Bottom line: Any self-respecting craftsmen would have tens of such, not just one or two.
Were your proposal feasible, the proper way to go about it would be to rewrite the older {'2', '3', ...,'7'} templates to use '8', verify each is working, and perhaps shuffle out the numbers so there were less in the end. [but only if nothing is currently linking the template page. Identify the least used lower number and clear THAT, move '8' there, and then you can proceed with others. But this is conversion work that can go on solely if the syntaxes are fully compatible, or a redirect can be made, etc. I'm sure you know what I mean.]
But the WORK AND TIME COST should be born by YOU... not someone else you victimize unwittingly because you happened to have an impulse one day to "trim fat" or however you rationalize such a deletion package.
One thing is certain... were those all to disappear or need special pipetrick coding, someone else will have to PAY A TIMECOST going forward to learn a new syntax, simply because you are insensitive today anticipating the problem you will cost them.
None of that addresses the problems you might be causing in template expansion limits, which are likely enough given that such templates tend to be used solely on long complex list articles, not simple pages.
You want to do something immediately useful, clean up the damn usage in '8' so it's not referring to '7' which has nothing in usage at all. It's a bit hard for someone to know you know what you're talking about when neither usage repeats, and I fought long and hard for decent documentation capability and find unclear 'references' to other pages offensive. If nothing else, consolidate the usage in one page and use {{
Documentation|Common usage pagename}}
calls. Be well, and have a good day! //
Fra
nkB
15:14, 30 November 2007 (UTC)