![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | Archive 7 |
Hi; your participation is invited to Template talk:Native peoples of the Pacific Northwest - the conversation had begun at hte Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Oregon page...think I managed to head a few things off at the pass; and we now have people to help us sort out the Oregon-area cultures (i.e. those outside the "Pacific Northwest Coast culture" ecumene)... Skookum1 ( talk) 13:56, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Somewhere I left you a note about this; just found someone wrote an article, needs work, good effort though; foundation for later bighouse articles/cat.... Skookum1 ( talk) 16:48, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
I archived previous discussions. They can be found here. OldManRivers ( talk) 08:15, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
See my changes to cats at Haida Argillite Carvings, which also needs major work. Not your turf, exactly; although getting to be time for the local subcats to Category:Northwest Coast art. Skookum1 ( talk) 18:24, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
Yo; figure I'd ask you to write a welcome/reply to the Haida youth who posted at the Talk:Haida page. It would be great to encourage him to take a regular role in Wikipedia on Haida subjects the way you've come to be for South/Central Coast peoples. Just figure might be best to have the outreach done by someone who went through the ropes learning Wikipedia style/content guidelines who's also come from a FN background, i.e. someone he can relate to so he's not frustrated by all us white folks mucking about in his people's articles.... Saw your edit a little while ago about feeling like a slave, I feel the same way again, still haven't gotten to articles I meant to write when coming back from Wikibreak (well, a few) and find it all eating up my music time and getting-to-the-gym time...gotta learn some discipline and prioritizing..... Skookum1 ( talk) 16:08, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
![]() |
Vancouver Meetup Please come to an informal gathering of Vancouver Wikipedians, Monday, May 5 at 6:30 pm. It will be at Benny's Bagels,
2505 West Broadway. We'd love to see you there, and please invite others! Watch the
Vancouver Meetup page for details. |
Best,
Clayoquot (
talk |
contribs)
06:07, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
Again; same deal as with the Haida guy, could you welcome/coach the person who's inputting this as to WP:MOS. I've got my hands full....article has tone/content/citation problems as well as needs de-capitalizing the title Skookum1 ( talk) 15:23, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
IT doesn't say who it's by, but this article's lead image on http://thetyee.ca shows the Songhees village where the big resort on the Inner Harbour is now.....I've seen other drawings of Songhees, but none giving such a good idea of the scale of the bighouses....or by your definitions, are those longhouses? Skookum1 ( talk) 14:07, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
Can we move here so it's easier to follow the discussion? - TheMightyQuill ( talk) 17:45, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
I've tinkered with this a bit, it's still pretty sloppy. You're from up there, or connected up there; any chance you could gussy this up (over time, no rush). Have a look through its recent history and on the talkpage about the Alert Bay NWT, which I still haven't been able to find any other ref to... Skookum1 ( talk) 15:21, 26 April 2008 (UTC)
Hi; this isn't a Wikipedia topic, not quite anyway (not yet in other words but could you take a look at the comment forums following the article at http://thetyee.ca/Views/2008/04/30/TruthAndAbuse/ and use "find on page" to find posts from "POC04746160"...the article is troubling enough but when I came across this I thought "I better ask OMR about this":
Who could happened to appoint someone "the personal agent of hereditary Squamish Chief Kiapilano"...other than the holder of that name, of course. But is Kiapilano a hereditary CHIEF name, and as we've gotten at before re August Jack/Khahtsahlano "what is a chief anyway?" Does this Kiapilano have the traditional authority to speak for the whole people, and to rule its territory (as if he were a king or hyas tyee), or is it really just a name, like Khahtsahlano? The post where that paragraph comes from (one of several preceding it) ends with:
Looks to me that whoever this is isn't rrepresen5ting the Sikwxwu7mesh, but agitators from the Cree, Mteis, etc... (A.I.M.) and don't even start telling me (as I know you wouldn't) that "Turtle Island" is part of traditional Skwxwu7mesh ideas or that the "traditional Land Law Jurisdiction of Turtle Island" has anything at all to do with traditional culture/law. Anyway the "presiding elder" apparently is presiding over a "genocide tribunal" - a tribunal convened by the the authority of Skwxwu7mesh Uxwuimixw, or by him and his buddies? Who is "Chief Louis Daniels" - the current Kiapilano? Is he even si:am? I don't mean to drag you into this, I just want to know who this guy is/claims to be; and as you can guess I hate the kind of vengeful rhetoric going on; Terry Glavin also happens to be a friend of mine, and is a consistent writer on native human rights and cultural history, and has lived among hte Katzie and worked close with the Tslihqot'in and others. Calling him a racist just stinks, but it's typical of the invective that gets levelled against people when they don't conform to "fundamentalist" ideas (of whatever stripe).; this kind of rhetoric is hardly the path to "truth and reconciliation".... Skookum1 ( talk) 14:51, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
Well, first let's NOt start Kevin Annett just yet; I don't have the stomach fora blodbath ;-) But while he may not see this here, oh so very much I want you to lte me quote you above in http://thetyee.ca, or you'[re welcome to do it yourself; that he's never had a potlatch and comes from a "sold-out" family makes it all the more ripe; "ripe" in the British comic sense and also the rotten-fruit kind (where the British sense comes from); "too rich" like an over-icinged and cream-stuffed cake, huh? At least let me quote you as an "anonymous Skwxwu7mesh source)". Skookum1 ( talk) 21:28, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
Sorry; it's the comments forum that follows the article at http://thetyee.ca/Views/2008/04/30/TruthAndAbuse/ - at some point Annett's people/followers start raising Cain, or calling the author that anyway; they' come at me about my not (supposedly) knowing about the all-powerful 4th World Movement yata yata and I came back with "but this guy's not even status", basically; didn't give the details you did....anyway hope you don't mind I spilled a few beans, it's towards the verry bottom of the comment,s but the easiest way to find me is to use "find on pag" for the same username as here/ Skookum1 / although you may find the whole comments forum interesting, including the ravings form Annett's crowd....I don't read it close, it all sounds like cultish stuff to me, especially when they go on about his saintliness...anyway, apprently they get into talking about aliens and Masons, too....no doubt I'm going to be accused of appropriating native culture by my choise of usernames (skookum1, tamanassman) but I'm ready for that ;-). Anyway I'll go see what they've saidsinced and will hold back; don't forget you don't have to give family details like some ou've mentioned, iel the thing with your mother or your great great grandmother etc; ie other wiswe identity yourself; it's why we all have usernames there... it would just be good to have a Skwxwu7mesh perspective on "Te Kapilano", Annett and whta you think of the Lakota and Anishinabe who have cme to help the Skwxwu78mesh pronoucne fatwas on miscreants who do not follow the True Creed. BTW you've seen Brother XII haven't you? BVy the way, what's the context of "Te" in teh name; is it just a prefix or might it bea Skwxwu7mesh adaptation/version of tyee??
[unindent] Wow. it only went up this morning and he had to shut the debate down, it was all happening too fast for the moderator to cope with; I already bcc'd you my letter to the editor; this is very unusual at The Tyee, although there've been controversies among the forum membership about editorial censorship befrore, but in this case Harriet Nahannee weighs in (there's a younger one, right? i.e living) and then Annett himself, with all kidns of charges about Nahannee being an RCMP plottist.....the editor always has to watch rfor legal liabilities; the forums get edited all the time. This one got dangerous; as you'll have noted in my email I mentioned the lack of a proper acquisition/earning/bestowing of the name, no potlatch etc; very curious they'd leave that out, as if (ironically) the real tradition was the suspect one....Anyway all amusing/disturbing. Skookum1 ( talk) 04:14, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
So looks like Chief Kiapalano has set up his own website. Nothing to legitimize your organization, or in his case, "governmnet" then a website. I posted a blog about the band council corruption with the Olympics here. Looks like Gerry seen it, and left a comment for me to email him. Not sure where I'm going to do/say to him yet. Just thought I'd share it with you in case you came across it. OldManRivers ( talk) 22:57, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
Oh man, what a fine shot of Garibaldi; it's too bad it wouldn't look good at 300 px, but otherwise the best illustrative pic of it (esp. as a volcano) I've seen....land-based at least; you've seen Randall & Kat's Flying Photos" no? (google that). Skookum1 ( talk) 21:39, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
I think I've decided my commitment will be to work heavily on one section a week. This is for almost all article. In some cases, it'll be stubbing, or expanding, or something. But I think if I don't do it this way, I'll feel overwhelmed, then never get anything done. Coming next week? Skwxwu7mesh Art. = ) OldManRivers ( talk) 09:04, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
Hi again about the indigenous welcome-mat thing; please see this and note User talk:Sliammonfirstnation. Somebody already gave them some cookies (I got one too;see my talkpage); do you think we could maybe have wiki-eulachon grease ? ;-) Later. Skookum1 ( talk) 04:43, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
Hey dude, figure you have a real life, noticed you haven't b een active this last while; when you're back please see Talk:'Nak'waxda'xw#Nahwitti_IR_4 as I'm totally confused now; wanted to start doing Royal Navy/HBC history bits in the Queen Charlotte Strait, including the shelling of Newitty (whichever it was...) and also Fort Rupert; the latter is a big article because of teh HBC history there adn the coal strike and so on.....guess I'll wait, not my turf, very much yours. Been doing what I could on community stubs, e.g. Kingcome, British Columbia..... Skookum1 ( talk) 02:26, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
Just last night I undid tweaks to the Coast Salish#The Peoples article/section where someone had piped Tsleil-waututh First Nation behind Tsleil-waututh.....I remember recently, or sort of recently, you'd said some things about where they came from, who they were etc in relation to Skwxwu7mesh history/relationships but am not sure on which of our many talkpages that was on; or I'd pen up a quick stub to "fill in teh blanks"....I know you're still focussed on Skwxwu7mesh and Kwakwaka'wakw articles but if you could come up with a real basic "people" stub it would help prevent similar pipings to govt articles when there should be ethno ones; there are hundreds of such instances, no doubt, but certain high-profile ones need doing; I recently found some good online sources for Katzie and Kwantlen, though nothing on Kway-quiht-lam yet (however they spell that...) so I can do those, at least as starters; but I don't want to tread on Skwxwu7mesh toes by venturing the Tsleil-waututh one....also btw for your Skwxwu7mesh article there's some bit of HBC log about the first dealings with the Skwxwu7mesh on Howe Sound, cant' remember in whose journals or exactly when; 1830s I think; nice quote from Hill-Tout, and you might want to find Cole Harris' The Resetlement of British Columbia which goes into the epidemics and populatino changes in great detail and he also challengeds the usual low-numbers of whiteman history....the influenza epidemic of hte 1830s was known elsewhere as "the mortality" and I don't think it was ordinary influencza; I remember a reference to a "hemorrhagic fever" or "tropical fever" on either the lower Columbia or lower Fraser and some mysterious ship that brought it in; influenza in its advanced stages is like ebola....(or rather ebola is really a kind of influenza - "a filling up with fluid/blood"...).Anyway back to fixing/sorting cats adn trying to keep various new articles frmo flying out of control ( Stave Falls and Bralorne are home-turf articles for me that others have now started....). later, gonna try and discipline my wikitime in the next whiel as I need to be playing more music and writing more songs...... Skookum1 ( talk) 13:45, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
I've seen that XwMuthkwium' on their page before. But to be honest, I don't even that is right. I think who ever designed the website or gave them that spelling is more along the lines of "how you pronounce our traditional name." Similar to saying Skwa-Xwoh-Mesh, right? In any case, look at this. They flat out spelt the name wrong. The website is crap and the communications department that did it is horrible. In any case, I think Xwméthkwyiem is the proper spelling. Xwmets'kwiyam is my peoples way of saying it. Akin to Keminem, Shishá7lh, or Sel’it’wetulh. Have to find a few sources for the proper Musqueam spelling. It might be harder to go with the "proper" name for them too because of lack of resources. There is significant source to cite Skwxwu7mesh over Squamish, which is why I stuck with it. I just don't know if it's posisble to do the same with Musqueam. OldManRivers ( talk) 20:26, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
Holy cow. Not only did I find a whole set of pictures of the 'Yalis graveyard and a few of Campbell River's but check THIS out. Talk about a great illustration for Coast Salish art, no? Also behooves us to try and get a Comox people article started, political minefield that K'omoks First Nation may turn out to be (AFAIK the Island Comox are subsumed now into the Weywakum, sort of, although maybe hte Qualicums are technically Comox? I'm fuzzy in that area...). One of the 'Yalis pics, I think the one that says "photographic print cut-out etc" may be a great illustration for Thunderbird or Thunderbird and Whale, no? I found these while trying to find pics of the Holy Redeemer Church and its graveyard at Skookumchuck Hot Springs, which I know is in BC Archives somewhere; used to haev it on my HD but wound up accidentally deleting a whole whack of pics a couple of years ago...while preparing to back them up....I also wrote the Vancovuer Museum trying to find those graveyard figures from thte Fraser Canyon I mentioned, they can't find them, so will continue digging. The Comox graveyard totems are great stuff, doncha think? Skookum1 ( talk) 06:21, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
Hope you liked those photographs. None of them can obviously be released to Creative Commons, but I do want to take my own photographs of the Skwxwu7mesh Spindle whorl when I'm in Seattle. What's the protocal on that kind of stuff. Do I have to ask the Musuem to be able to release it to Creative Commons for the Skwxwu7mesh page article, or can I just snap a photo and release the photograph? Hope ya liked the photographs! OldManRivers ( talk) 07:19, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
I was thinking about the same thing lol. Sure, you can create an archive. Black Tusk 17:05, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
Hi; been browsing BC Archives for various reasons; came across a "North Bend Potlatch" which really wans't much of a picture, but check out the Spud City Potlatch in Ashcroft, 1917. Just providing these as cases-in-point about why a separate article for non-coastal-culture potlatches is needed; or at least a sepcial subsection. Skookum1 ( talk) 21:49, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
Hi; I found this which is no doubt of interest/use to you. The Kwakiutl section is less interesting/detailed, though the Haida one turned out to have a big list also (see Talk:Haida#List of Haida villages. BTW the Kwakiutl page at this site idetnified the Nahwitti dialect as being that of the Tlatlaskwala (sp?); sound right? Nahwittis turn up in early historeis all the time,. it would be good to ahve an article on them. Skookum1 ( talk) 17:18, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
Admittedly the Emily Carr site doesn't say thunderbird when it uses that word; I'd assumed it was as xoxo7 or whatever was already on the Thunderbird page; my mistake; the actual Kwak'wala names for the Thunderbird should be here, though, plus any others we can find out about. On the Emily Carr site I think it was either the Blunden Harbour or 'Yalis pages that had a story about an ancestor-thunderbird associated with a particular village/tribe. Skookum1 ( talk) 12:03, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
Siwash Indian Band mean anything to you? I don't know who this is. - TheMightyQuill ( talk) 22:01, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
The image description says it's from Burrard Inlet... - TheMightyQuill ( talk) 13:10, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
I've just spent too much valuable time trying to straighten out User:The Man in Question's questionable edits, including reverting the Sḵwx̱wú7mesh history article, though not quite to the same title-form as you'd had it; ditto with his changes to the cat, which wound up orphaning the Nahanee, Siwash Rock, Andy Paull and Khahtsahlano and other articles; I also changed back his changes to Esla7an etc. I think the cat name should change back, unless you like the new "Sḵwx̱wú7mesh" version better - to me that doesnt' look as good but maybe it's because I'm on MacOS/Camino - you seemed to really like it when the X_ showed up int he main article change; mabye it looks different in Internet Explorer? There may have been useful information in TMiQ's edits, but I undid them wholesale and if there's anything worthwhile in there please add it back in; as i said in one of my edits if he hadnt' gone and deleted valid material his own valid material, if it's valid, would not have been deleted/undone. If his translations and transcriptions of Skwxwu7mesh language are beter, by all means restore them; I really took umbrage with his decision as t o what thet "correct" English/anglicized names were, which is BUNK; no such thing as a "correct" version of a variable rendering, given that in your estimation they're all "mistakes" anyway. Whatever, I just decided to go at this as I noticed a few more recent changes by him, without any response at all either to your advice/comments or to mine. Fine, "be that way". I suspect a POV fork is at work; why else would he NOT change the cat name across all articles in the cat, and why were cdertain articles moved and others not? I'd say we have to watch the Capilano-related articles...... Skookum1 ( talk) 05:53, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
"A Stó:lo-Coast Salish historical atlas" by Keith Thor Carlson and Albert Jules McHalsie (the McHalsie's are from a Chilliwack FN, I believe, and pretty reliable). You can try a search at http://www.worldcat.org maybe under "Coast Salish". Sorry I'm not much help. - TheMightyQuill ( talk) 13:11, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
I think the title is "off" a bit and may refer to Brockton Point; I've never heard of a native village on Coal Harbour, or in the area we refer to as Coal Harbour (on the south side of it, in other words). It's not the Kanaka Rancherie, which Iv'e seen pics of and had "nice houses" with gardens and orchard-trees (where the Lost Lagoon boathouse is now, plus the grassy/treed area towards English Bay from it). Coal Harbour, i.e .the area of the Bayshore Inn etc today, was a squatter settlement in the 1880s; do your people have a tradition of there being a village there? BTW could you get the proper Skwxwu7mesh snichim for "Lucklucky", the usual transcription of the indigenous placename for Gastown/ Maple Tree Square? Skookum1 ( talk) 18:47, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
Hi dude; pls see Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Canadian_communities#Hazelton.2C_British_Columbia_and_sundry. Skookum1 ( talk) 17:12, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Yikes! I just searched BC Archives for "Kitwancool" and hit the jackpot on a whole bunch of totem pole images, one of which I'll pick to illustrate the village, which apparently is nearly intact and undisturbed today, though the pics are old. But check out this war canoe. Wow, huh? Nice piece of work, probably fast as hell too...(meant for use on the very rough Kispiox and Skeena Rivers).. Skookum1 ( talk) 17:27, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | Archive 6 | Archive 7 |
Hi; your participation is invited to Template talk:Native peoples of the Pacific Northwest - the conversation had begun at hte Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Oregon page...think I managed to head a few things off at the pass; and we now have people to help us sort out the Oregon-area cultures (i.e. those outside the "Pacific Northwest Coast culture" ecumene)... Skookum1 ( talk) 13:56, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Somewhere I left you a note about this; just found someone wrote an article, needs work, good effort though; foundation for later bighouse articles/cat.... Skookum1 ( talk) 16:48, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
I archived previous discussions. They can be found here. OldManRivers ( talk) 08:15, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
See my changes to cats at Haida Argillite Carvings, which also needs major work. Not your turf, exactly; although getting to be time for the local subcats to Category:Northwest Coast art. Skookum1 ( talk) 18:24, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
Yo; figure I'd ask you to write a welcome/reply to the Haida youth who posted at the Talk:Haida page. It would be great to encourage him to take a regular role in Wikipedia on Haida subjects the way you've come to be for South/Central Coast peoples. Just figure might be best to have the outreach done by someone who went through the ropes learning Wikipedia style/content guidelines who's also come from a FN background, i.e. someone he can relate to so he's not frustrated by all us white folks mucking about in his people's articles.... Saw your edit a little while ago about feeling like a slave, I feel the same way again, still haven't gotten to articles I meant to write when coming back from Wikibreak (well, a few) and find it all eating up my music time and getting-to-the-gym time...gotta learn some discipline and prioritizing..... Skookum1 ( talk) 16:08, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
![]() |
Vancouver Meetup Please come to an informal gathering of Vancouver Wikipedians, Monday, May 5 at 6:30 pm. It will be at Benny's Bagels,
2505 West Broadway. We'd love to see you there, and please invite others! Watch the
Vancouver Meetup page for details. |
Best,
Clayoquot (
talk |
contribs)
06:07, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
Again; same deal as with the Haida guy, could you welcome/coach the person who's inputting this as to WP:MOS. I've got my hands full....article has tone/content/citation problems as well as needs de-capitalizing the title Skookum1 ( talk) 15:23, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
IT doesn't say who it's by, but this article's lead image on http://thetyee.ca shows the Songhees village where the big resort on the Inner Harbour is now.....I've seen other drawings of Songhees, but none giving such a good idea of the scale of the bighouses....or by your definitions, are those longhouses? Skookum1 ( talk) 14:07, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
Can we move here so it's easier to follow the discussion? - TheMightyQuill ( talk) 17:45, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
I've tinkered with this a bit, it's still pretty sloppy. You're from up there, or connected up there; any chance you could gussy this up (over time, no rush). Have a look through its recent history and on the talkpage about the Alert Bay NWT, which I still haven't been able to find any other ref to... Skookum1 ( talk) 15:21, 26 April 2008 (UTC)
Hi; this isn't a Wikipedia topic, not quite anyway (not yet in other words but could you take a look at the comment forums following the article at http://thetyee.ca/Views/2008/04/30/TruthAndAbuse/ and use "find on page" to find posts from "POC04746160"...the article is troubling enough but when I came across this I thought "I better ask OMR about this":
Who could happened to appoint someone "the personal agent of hereditary Squamish Chief Kiapilano"...other than the holder of that name, of course. But is Kiapilano a hereditary CHIEF name, and as we've gotten at before re August Jack/Khahtsahlano "what is a chief anyway?" Does this Kiapilano have the traditional authority to speak for the whole people, and to rule its territory (as if he were a king or hyas tyee), or is it really just a name, like Khahtsahlano? The post where that paragraph comes from (one of several preceding it) ends with:
Looks to me that whoever this is isn't rrepresen5ting the Sikwxwu7mesh, but agitators from the Cree, Mteis, etc... (A.I.M.) and don't even start telling me (as I know you wouldn't) that "Turtle Island" is part of traditional Skwxwu7mesh ideas or that the "traditional Land Law Jurisdiction of Turtle Island" has anything at all to do with traditional culture/law. Anyway the "presiding elder" apparently is presiding over a "genocide tribunal" - a tribunal convened by the the authority of Skwxwu7mesh Uxwuimixw, or by him and his buddies? Who is "Chief Louis Daniels" - the current Kiapilano? Is he even si:am? I don't mean to drag you into this, I just want to know who this guy is/claims to be; and as you can guess I hate the kind of vengeful rhetoric going on; Terry Glavin also happens to be a friend of mine, and is a consistent writer on native human rights and cultural history, and has lived among hte Katzie and worked close with the Tslihqot'in and others. Calling him a racist just stinks, but it's typical of the invective that gets levelled against people when they don't conform to "fundamentalist" ideas (of whatever stripe).; this kind of rhetoric is hardly the path to "truth and reconciliation".... Skookum1 ( talk) 14:51, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
Well, first let's NOt start Kevin Annett just yet; I don't have the stomach fora blodbath ;-) But while he may not see this here, oh so very much I want you to lte me quote you above in http://thetyee.ca, or you'[re welcome to do it yourself; that he's never had a potlatch and comes from a "sold-out" family makes it all the more ripe; "ripe" in the British comic sense and also the rotten-fruit kind (where the British sense comes from); "too rich" like an over-icinged and cream-stuffed cake, huh? At least let me quote you as an "anonymous Skwxwu7mesh source)". Skookum1 ( talk) 21:28, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
Sorry; it's the comments forum that follows the article at http://thetyee.ca/Views/2008/04/30/TruthAndAbuse/ - at some point Annett's people/followers start raising Cain, or calling the author that anyway; they' come at me about my not (supposedly) knowing about the all-powerful 4th World Movement yata yata and I came back with "but this guy's not even status", basically; didn't give the details you did....anyway hope you don't mind I spilled a few beans, it's towards the verry bottom of the comment,s but the easiest way to find me is to use "find on pag" for the same username as here/ Skookum1 / although you may find the whole comments forum interesting, including the ravings form Annett's crowd....I don't read it close, it all sounds like cultish stuff to me, especially when they go on about his saintliness...anyway, apprently they get into talking about aliens and Masons, too....no doubt I'm going to be accused of appropriating native culture by my choise of usernames (skookum1, tamanassman) but I'm ready for that ;-). Anyway I'll go see what they've saidsinced and will hold back; don't forget you don't have to give family details like some ou've mentioned, iel the thing with your mother or your great great grandmother etc; ie other wiswe identity yourself; it's why we all have usernames there... it would just be good to have a Skwxwu7mesh perspective on "Te Kapilano", Annett and whta you think of the Lakota and Anishinabe who have cme to help the Skwxwu78mesh pronoucne fatwas on miscreants who do not follow the True Creed. BTW you've seen Brother XII haven't you? BVy the way, what's the context of "Te" in teh name; is it just a prefix or might it bea Skwxwu7mesh adaptation/version of tyee??
[unindent] Wow. it only went up this morning and he had to shut the debate down, it was all happening too fast for the moderator to cope with; I already bcc'd you my letter to the editor; this is very unusual at The Tyee, although there've been controversies among the forum membership about editorial censorship befrore, but in this case Harriet Nahannee weighs in (there's a younger one, right? i.e living) and then Annett himself, with all kidns of charges about Nahannee being an RCMP plottist.....the editor always has to watch rfor legal liabilities; the forums get edited all the time. This one got dangerous; as you'll have noted in my email I mentioned the lack of a proper acquisition/earning/bestowing of the name, no potlatch etc; very curious they'd leave that out, as if (ironically) the real tradition was the suspect one....Anyway all amusing/disturbing. Skookum1 ( talk) 04:14, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
So looks like Chief Kiapalano has set up his own website. Nothing to legitimize your organization, or in his case, "governmnet" then a website. I posted a blog about the band council corruption with the Olympics here. Looks like Gerry seen it, and left a comment for me to email him. Not sure where I'm going to do/say to him yet. Just thought I'd share it with you in case you came across it. OldManRivers ( talk) 22:57, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
Oh man, what a fine shot of Garibaldi; it's too bad it wouldn't look good at 300 px, but otherwise the best illustrative pic of it (esp. as a volcano) I've seen....land-based at least; you've seen Randall & Kat's Flying Photos" no? (google that). Skookum1 ( talk) 21:39, 1 May 2008 (UTC)
I think I've decided my commitment will be to work heavily on one section a week. This is for almost all article. In some cases, it'll be stubbing, or expanding, or something. But I think if I don't do it this way, I'll feel overwhelmed, then never get anything done. Coming next week? Skwxwu7mesh Art. = ) OldManRivers ( talk) 09:04, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
Hi again about the indigenous welcome-mat thing; please see this and note User talk:Sliammonfirstnation. Somebody already gave them some cookies (I got one too;see my talkpage); do you think we could maybe have wiki-eulachon grease ? ;-) Later. Skookum1 ( talk) 04:43, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
Hey dude, figure you have a real life, noticed you haven't b een active this last while; when you're back please see Talk:'Nak'waxda'xw#Nahwitti_IR_4 as I'm totally confused now; wanted to start doing Royal Navy/HBC history bits in the Queen Charlotte Strait, including the shelling of Newitty (whichever it was...) and also Fort Rupert; the latter is a big article because of teh HBC history there adn the coal strike and so on.....guess I'll wait, not my turf, very much yours. Been doing what I could on community stubs, e.g. Kingcome, British Columbia..... Skookum1 ( talk) 02:26, 18 May 2008 (UTC)
Just last night I undid tweaks to the Coast Salish#The Peoples article/section where someone had piped Tsleil-waututh First Nation behind Tsleil-waututh.....I remember recently, or sort of recently, you'd said some things about where they came from, who they were etc in relation to Skwxwu7mesh history/relationships but am not sure on which of our many talkpages that was on; or I'd pen up a quick stub to "fill in teh blanks"....I know you're still focussed on Skwxwu7mesh and Kwakwaka'wakw articles but if you could come up with a real basic "people" stub it would help prevent similar pipings to govt articles when there should be ethno ones; there are hundreds of such instances, no doubt, but certain high-profile ones need doing; I recently found some good online sources for Katzie and Kwantlen, though nothing on Kway-quiht-lam yet (however they spell that...) so I can do those, at least as starters; but I don't want to tread on Skwxwu7mesh toes by venturing the Tsleil-waututh one....also btw for your Skwxwu7mesh article there's some bit of HBC log about the first dealings with the Skwxwu7mesh on Howe Sound, cant' remember in whose journals or exactly when; 1830s I think; nice quote from Hill-Tout, and you might want to find Cole Harris' The Resetlement of British Columbia which goes into the epidemics and populatino changes in great detail and he also challengeds the usual low-numbers of whiteman history....the influenza epidemic of hte 1830s was known elsewhere as "the mortality" and I don't think it was ordinary influencza; I remember a reference to a "hemorrhagic fever" or "tropical fever" on either the lower Columbia or lower Fraser and some mysterious ship that brought it in; influenza in its advanced stages is like ebola....(or rather ebola is really a kind of influenza - "a filling up with fluid/blood"...).Anyway back to fixing/sorting cats adn trying to keep various new articles frmo flying out of control ( Stave Falls and Bralorne are home-turf articles for me that others have now started....). later, gonna try and discipline my wikitime in the next whiel as I need to be playing more music and writing more songs...... Skookum1 ( talk) 13:45, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
I've seen that XwMuthkwium' on their page before. But to be honest, I don't even that is right. I think who ever designed the website or gave them that spelling is more along the lines of "how you pronounce our traditional name." Similar to saying Skwa-Xwoh-Mesh, right? In any case, look at this. They flat out spelt the name wrong. The website is crap and the communications department that did it is horrible. In any case, I think Xwméthkwyiem is the proper spelling. Xwmets'kwiyam is my peoples way of saying it. Akin to Keminem, Shishá7lh, or Sel’it’wetulh. Have to find a few sources for the proper Musqueam spelling. It might be harder to go with the "proper" name for them too because of lack of resources. There is significant source to cite Skwxwu7mesh over Squamish, which is why I stuck with it. I just don't know if it's posisble to do the same with Musqueam. OldManRivers ( talk) 20:26, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
Holy cow. Not only did I find a whole set of pictures of the 'Yalis graveyard and a few of Campbell River's but check THIS out. Talk about a great illustration for Coast Salish art, no? Also behooves us to try and get a Comox people article started, political minefield that K'omoks First Nation may turn out to be (AFAIK the Island Comox are subsumed now into the Weywakum, sort of, although maybe hte Qualicums are technically Comox? I'm fuzzy in that area...). One of the 'Yalis pics, I think the one that says "photographic print cut-out etc" may be a great illustration for Thunderbird or Thunderbird and Whale, no? I found these while trying to find pics of the Holy Redeemer Church and its graveyard at Skookumchuck Hot Springs, which I know is in BC Archives somewhere; used to haev it on my HD but wound up accidentally deleting a whole whack of pics a couple of years ago...while preparing to back them up....I also wrote the Vancovuer Museum trying to find those graveyard figures from thte Fraser Canyon I mentioned, they can't find them, so will continue digging. The Comox graveyard totems are great stuff, doncha think? Skookum1 ( talk) 06:21, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
Hope you liked those photographs. None of them can obviously be released to Creative Commons, but I do want to take my own photographs of the Skwxwu7mesh Spindle whorl when I'm in Seattle. What's the protocal on that kind of stuff. Do I have to ask the Musuem to be able to release it to Creative Commons for the Skwxwu7mesh page article, or can I just snap a photo and release the photograph? Hope ya liked the photographs! OldManRivers ( talk) 07:19, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
I was thinking about the same thing lol. Sure, you can create an archive. Black Tusk 17:05, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
Hi; been browsing BC Archives for various reasons; came across a "North Bend Potlatch" which really wans't much of a picture, but check out the Spud City Potlatch in Ashcroft, 1917. Just providing these as cases-in-point about why a separate article for non-coastal-culture potlatches is needed; or at least a sepcial subsection. Skookum1 ( talk) 21:49, 23 May 2008 (UTC)
Hi; I found this which is no doubt of interest/use to you. The Kwakiutl section is less interesting/detailed, though the Haida one turned out to have a big list also (see Talk:Haida#List of Haida villages. BTW the Kwakiutl page at this site idetnified the Nahwitti dialect as being that of the Tlatlaskwala (sp?); sound right? Nahwittis turn up in early historeis all the time,. it would be good to ahve an article on them. Skookum1 ( talk) 17:18, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
Admittedly the Emily Carr site doesn't say thunderbird when it uses that word; I'd assumed it was as xoxo7 or whatever was already on the Thunderbird page; my mistake; the actual Kwak'wala names for the Thunderbird should be here, though, plus any others we can find out about. On the Emily Carr site I think it was either the Blunden Harbour or 'Yalis pages that had a story about an ancestor-thunderbird associated with a particular village/tribe. Skookum1 ( talk) 12:03, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
Siwash Indian Band mean anything to you? I don't know who this is. - TheMightyQuill ( talk) 22:01, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
The image description says it's from Burrard Inlet... - TheMightyQuill ( talk) 13:10, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
I've just spent too much valuable time trying to straighten out User:The Man in Question's questionable edits, including reverting the Sḵwx̱wú7mesh history article, though not quite to the same title-form as you'd had it; ditto with his changes to the cat, which wound up orphaning the Nahanee, Siwash Rock, Andy Paull and Khahtsahlano and other articles; I also changed back his changes to Esla7an etc. I think the cat name should change back, unless you like the new "Sḵwx̱wú7mesh" version better - to me that doesnt' look as good but maybe it's because I'm on MacOS/Camino - you seemed to really like it when the X_ showed up int he main article change; mabye it looks different in Internet Explorer? There may have been useful information in TMiQ's edits, but I undid them wholesale and if there's anything worthwhile in there please add it back in; as i said in one of my edits if he hadnt' gone and deleted valid material his own valid material, if it's valid, would not have been deleted/undone. If his translations and transcriptions of Skwxwu7mesh language are beter, by all means restore them; I really took umbrage with his decision as t o what thet "correct" English/anglicized names were, which is BUNK; no such thing as a "correct" version of a variable rendering, given that in your estimation they're all "mistakes" anyway. Whatever, I just decided to go at this as I noticed a few more recent changes by him, without any response at all either to your advice/comments or to mine. Fine, "be that way". I suspect a POV fork is at work; why else would he NOT change the cat name across all articles in the cat, and why were cdertain articles moved and others not? I'd say we have to watch the Capilano-related articles...... Skookum1 ( talk) 05:53, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
"A Stó:lo-Coast Salish historical atlas" by Keith Thor Carlson and Albert Jules McHalsie (the McHalsie's are from a Chilliwack FN, I believe, and pretty reliable). You can try a search at http://www.worldcat.org maybe under "Coast Salish". Sorry I'm not much help. - TheMightyQuill ( talk) 13:11, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
I think the title is "off" a bit and may refer to Brockton Point; I've never heard of a native village on Coal Harbour, or in the area we refer to as Coal Harbour (on the south side of it, in other words). It's not the Kanaka Rancherie, which Iv'e seen pics of and had "nice houses" with gardens and orchard-trees (where the Lost Lagoon boathouse is now, plus the grassy/treed area towards English Bay from it). Coal Harbour, i.e .the area of the Bayshore Inn etc today, was a squatter settlement in the 1880s; do your people have a tradition of there being a village there? BTW could you get the proper Skwxwu7mesh snichim for "Lucklucky", the usual transcription of the indigenous placename for Gastown/ Maple Tree Square? Skookum1 ( talk) 18:47, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
Hi dude; pls see Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Canadian_communities#Hazelton.2C_British_Columbia_and_sundry. Skookum1 ( talk) 17:12, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
Yikes! I just searched BC Archives for "Kitwancool" and hit the jackpot on a whole bunch of totem pole images, one of which I'll pick to illustrate the village, which apparently is nearly intact and undisturbed today, though the pics are old. But check out this war canoe. Wow, huh? Nice piece of work, probably fast as hell too...(meant for use on the very rough Kispiox and Skeena Rivers).. Skookum1 ( talk) 17:27, 16 June 2008 (UTC)