![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | → | Archive 10 |
Thanks for making the graphic! I have a few concerns though. First of all, I'm not aware of a prison guard company in the Home Front Command. Do you have more information on it? It seems strange because I mainly know about MP units. Also, I don't believe that the Erez and Taoz Battallions are subordinate to GOC Headquarters (mazi), but it's possible to check this. Thanks again, Ynhockey ( Talk) 11:45, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
I'm sorry, but it is full of mistakes...
Ground Forces Command neither above Home Front Command (witch is regional command), nor "Logistics, Medical, and the Centers Directorate". Directoriates should be under Genereral Staff, regional commands (North, Central, Southern, Homefront) should also be under Genereral Staff, and the same with IAF, navy and Ground Forces Command, independently.
Corps should be under Ground Forces Command (except Intelligence Corps, Military Police, Education and Youth Corps, General Corps, Medical Corps, and of course, Sea Corps and Air force). But, divisions and brigades (except those of training, like 828 infantry, 460 armor) should be under corresponding regional command (except Homefront, of course).
It would be great if you can fix that, and then I'll tell you all the rest. There are many more little mistakes, like missing or split units, wrong names...
I thing the png should be removed untill it is OK... Flayer 14:01, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
The structure here ( Israel Defense Forces#Military structure) is correct. Lets start from Northern Command: It has 36th "Gaash"/"Rage" armor division, 91st "Galil"/"Galilee" territiorial division, some reserve divisions, 605th "ha-Mahatz"/"The Crush" engineering battalion, "Shahaf"/"Seagull" field intelligence battalion, alpinist SF reserve unit, and probably some other units.36th "Gaash"/"Rage" armor division has 7th armor brigade "Saar me-Golan"/"Storm from Golan", 188th armor brigade "Barak"/"Lightning", 1st infantry brigade "Golani", artillery regiment "Golan" (not sure about the number), and some other units, including the "Golan" territorial brigade. 7th armor brigade has its Merkava mk 2 battalions (Later i can check the names the numbers), AT company, "sayeret 7" recon company, and and probably some other units. 188th armor brigade has its Merkava mk 3 battalions (Later i can check the names the numbers), AT company, "sayeret 188" reserve recon company, and and probably some other units. Infantry brigade "Golani" has its batallions (names & numbers - later), "Egos"/"Nut Tree" anti-guerilla SF battlion, special/recon battalion, signals company, and probably some other minor units. Special/recon battalion has recon ("sayeret") company, AT comapny, and engineering company (names & numbers - later). Artillery regiment "Golan" has its artillery battalions, one of them with MLRS (names & numbers - later). 91st "Galil"/"Galilee" territiorial division has two territiorial divisions 300th "Bar'am" and 169th "Hiram" - both are reserve infantry brigades, 299th "Herev"/"Sword" druze independent infantry battalion (arguably, it belongs directly to northern command or even directly to Infantry and Paratroopers Corps Command) which has a recon "sayeret" company (note that not every SF unit is a "sayeret", "sayeret" means recon unit, so only recon untis should be called "sayeret"), and and probably some other minor units.
Now, Central Command: it has 162th "Ha-Plada"/"The Steel" armor division, West bank territiorial division, some reserve divisions (including 98th "Ha-Esh"/"The Fire" paratroopers reserve division), 601st "Asaf" engineering battalion, "Nitzan"/"Bud" field intelligence battalion, and probably some other units. 162th "Ha-Plada"/"The Steel" armor division has 401st "I'kvot Ha-Barzel"/"Iron Trails" armor brigade, 933th Nahal infantry brigade, 900h "Kfir"/"Yong Lion" designated infantry brigade, 215th artillery regiment "Kala David"/Sling of David", and some other units, including the "Jordan Valley" territorial brigade (sometimes called "The Valley" brigade or "Arie"/"Lion" brigade) 401st armor brigade has its Merkava mk 4 battalions (names & numbers - later), AT company, "sayeret 188" recon company, and and probably some other units. "Nahal" has its batallions (names & numbers - later, one of them is paratroppers battalion), special/recon battalion, signals company, and probably some other minor units. Special/recon battalion has recon ("sayeret") company, AT comapny, and engineering company (names & numbers - later). "Kfir" has 6 designated infantry battalions permanently assigned mainly to West bank territiorial division (names, numbers, assignment order - later), and probably some other units. 215th artillery regiment has its artillery battalions(names & numbers - later). 98th "Ha-Esh"/"The Fire" paratroopers reserve division has 35th regular paratroppers brigade "Flying Serpent, some reserve paratroppers brigades: 226th "Ha-Nesher ha-Shahor"/"The Black Eagle", 551th "Hetzei Ha-Esh"/"Arrows of Fire", 623th "Hod Ha-Hanit"/"Head of the Spear", and some other units propably including "Maglan"/"Ibis" (arguably, it belongs directly to central command) SF unit (which is not "sayeret"), AA parachuting unit (arguably, inside "Maglan") and other. West bank territiorial division has 7 territorial brigades ("Yehuda", "Etzion", "Benyamin", "Shomron", "Ephraim", "Menashe", and "Maccabim") and the "Duvdevan"/"Cherry Tree" SF undercover srike unit (arguably, it belongs directly to central command), and some other units, including some MP units.
Sothern Command: it has 366th "Amud ha-Esh"/"Pillar of Fire" reserve armour division, 80th "Edom" territorial division, "Gaza" territirial division, some reserve divisions, 603th "Lahav"/"Blade" engineering battalion, "Nesher"/"Eagle" field intelligence battalion, 33th "Caracal" unisex independent light infantry battalion (arguably, it belongs directly to Infantry and Paratroopers Corps Command), 585th bedouin desert recon battalion (arguably, it belongs to any of the 2 territorial brigades or on the other hand directly to Infantry and Paratroopers Corps Command), and probably some other units, including a reserve Eilat area CT unit. 366th "Amud ha-Esh"/"Pillar of Fire" division has 84th "Giv'ati" infantry brigade, 460th "Bnei Or"/"Sons of Light" training armor brigade (arguably, it belongs directly to Armor Corps Command), artillery regiment "Amud ha-Esh"/"Pillar of Fire" (not sure about the number), and some other units. "Giv'ati" has its batallions (names & numbers - later), special/recon battalion, and probably some other minor units. Special/recon battalion has recon ("sayeret") company, AT comapny, engineering company and signals comapny (names & numbers - later). 460th training armor brigade has its training battalions (names & numbers - later). Artillery regiment has its artillery battalions (names & numbers - later). "Edom" territorial division has "Arava" territorial brigade, "Sagi" territorial brigade and other units. "Gaza" territorial division has "Northern Gaza" territorial brigade, "Sothern Gaza" territorial brigade and other units. "Rimon"/"Pomegranate" SF unit was disbanded decades ago. To be continued. Note that I do not expose any undisclosed inforamtion, and I don't know everything. Flayer 14:23, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
Great job! It would be great to merge all such png graphics into one complete graphic when everyhing is done. Minor things:
Flayer 16:49, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
::Great! "Special Troops Btn" is OK, though we better not call it (untill i find the real names) and its companies "Golani", like "Golani" AT Coy., "Golani" Recon Coy... It's enough one "Golani" inf. br. on top. Typo: name of the art.reg. is "Golan", not "Golani" once more.
Unable to verify names and nubers of the artillery rgt. Flayer 09:12, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
I'll check up later the MP units.
Flayer 21:32, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
Another (the last) reserve paratroopers brigade of 98th div., is 646th "Shualey Merom"/"Sky Foxes" reserve paratroopers brigade.
Flayer
09:30, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
"Jordan Valley" brigade has a number: 417th.
Flayer
09:33, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
"Serpent" ST btn has a number: 5135.
Flayer
09:44, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
401th armor brigade battalions:
Flayer 17:42, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Flayer 18:50, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
Additional general info from official source:
Another info: each regular armor engineering btn (601th, 603th, 605th) has a heavy equipment company (with D9 armored bulldozers and other vehicles). Moreover, "Gaza" territorial division has its own heavy equipment company ("Abirey ha-Plada"/"Knights of Steel"). Same with West Bank territorial division ("Hatuley ha-Bar"/"Wild Cats" heavy equipment company). Flayer 15:30, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, I got a mistake. Regular armor engineering btn (601th, 603th, 605th) still belong to regular armor divisions (correspondingly, 401th, 7th, 188th). But yet each regional command has a battalion-size engineering unit.
Special command teams of each regional command no longer exist. Flayer —The preceding signed but undated comment was added at 16:40, August 20, 2007 (UTC).
460th training armor brigade (arguably belongs to armor corps command)
Givati has a normal structure. some sources say its signal company is a part of special troops btn.
Flayer 14:40, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Brigades, I meant brigades...
Regional commands engineering units build fortifications, bunkers, outposts, pave roads, cooperate with civilian contractor that do the same... Flayer 20:47, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Flayer 09:36, 21 August 2007 (UTC) Later I'll complete it...
Not yet completed.... Flayer 11:16, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
Almost done! Flayer 16:00, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
Air and Space Arm and Sea Arm remins! Flayer 16:24, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
Great work on the IDF Noclador! Am I correct to think that most of your information is coming from Flayer? Cheers Buckshot06 07:15, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
Just out of interest, what software do you use to make these organization charts? -- Ynhockey ( Talk) 06:27, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
I would suggest only a few things:
It appears twice, but is not a part of MALI. Flayer 15:11, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Sorry for being annoying... "Maglan" is rather an airborn unit. Capable of non-airborn operaions, like any other parachuting unit in the IDF, but usually described as an airborn behind-enemy-lines long-range demolition, AT and anti-AT SF unit. Flayer 09:52, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
Its number is available: 934. Flayer 10:17, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
It has also a reserve armor brigade, called "Merkavot ha-Esh"/"Chariots of Fire". Flayer 18:54, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
Recently revealed, Central Command has a special transportation/combat-driving unit. Flayer 19:04, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
I have been observing your structure charts of IDF units and from my personal knowledge never really understood where you took much of your info from (it all seemed just plain wrong to me). Just now I realized that much of the information relates only to wartime situations where the structure of the army changes fundamentally.
Take for example Image:IDF Central Command.png, where it says that there is a logistics regiment under one of the divisions, as well as an MP company. The entire logistics regiment (called Almar, short for Egged Logisti Merhavi - Regional Logistical Regiment) is a pure emergency reservist-only unit, which has nothing to do with how the army generally works. There are six of these regiments (3 in the north, 1 in the center and 2 in the south).
I think the sources need to be checked again, because I have no all-encompassing knowledge about the army and therefore cannot hope to correct every mistake. It is probably better to withhold the information from Wikipedia rather than give the wrong information.
In order to avoid mistakes, I think it's best to go only a few levels (for example, the army structure should only have brigade-level units and higher, a brigade structure should have company and higher, etc.) and not go too much into details, that way it's more difficult to make a mistake.
-- Ynhockey ( Talk) 11:01, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
Hi, man!
According to User:Ynhockey, the Northern Gaza Territorial Brigade called "Gefen" and the Southern Gaza Territorial Brigade is called "Katif". It would be nice to put it in. Flayer ( talk) 12:54, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
Also, Golan Territorial Brigade is 474th. Flayer ( talk) 14:11, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
- There, "Merkavot ha-Esh" is 263th. Flayer ( talk) 14:18, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
Ok - listen don't give me every tima a unit - make a list tell me all, as I don't want to open file - change file - upload file - have to read there is something else to do, make the list. i will be back in 2 haours and update the graphics than. -- noclador ( talk) 14:20, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
If the graphics became too wide, you can cut and paste the 3 rightmost units of southern command somewhere beneath Edom Ter.Div, and also rearrange the homefront by deleting the repeating reserve NBC Defence btn + Rescue btn of each district. Flayer ( talk) 14:30, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
Hi man! There are some minor changes in the IDF structure.
Flayer ( talk) 10:28, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
Well, lets try to form a structure, before it's too late. ;-)
I'll let you know when it is done. :)
Flayer (
talk)
15:54, 31 August 2008 (UTC)
Well, it it obviously incomplete, but I don't thing I'll be able to find some more structure-related data. Maybe some
squadrons' badges, if you like:)
Flayer (
talk)
16:47, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
Units and Structure minor details:
to be continued...
Flayer (
talk) 13:52, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
OK :)
Flayer (
talk)
16:43, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
That's all, probably. :-) Flayer ( talk) 19:31, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
P.S
Typo: 107th Squadron has F-16I, not F-15I. Flayer ( talk) 17:33, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Hi, again. I still have some negative feedback about some details.
Hi, did you notice the above? Flayer ( talk) 18:30, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
It wasn't easy! :)
Flayer (
talk)
23:05, 18 December 2008 (UTC)
Hi Noclador! Wikipedia 0.7 will soon be out on DVD, and the IDF main article has been selected to be part of it, which means it will almost certainly include your detailed structure. I am asking, if you have time, to fix some mistakes. Here are the ones I found so far:
Please try to fix these :) if you can't do this anytime soon, let me know and I will try to emulate your entire chart in CorelDRAW and make the necessary changes.
Cheers, Ynhockey ( Talk) 12:49, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
By the way, I also found something. Desert recon. btn. and probably "Caracal" light infantry btn. use wheeled transportation. Flayer ( talk) 20:35, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the update and the e-mail! There's still a problem with the Logistics Supprt Units - the ones I told you about are the only ones that exist (there are no non-reserve logistics support units), so putting them near the command's main box, and then putting another one at the bottom, gives the impression that there are logistics support units in the regular service under the commands. The 5005th unit is actually called "Southwest" by the way (but operates in Gaza); apologies for not making it clear earlier. By the way, you can send the PSD (although I was hoping for a vector format) to ynhockey at gmail dot com. Cheers, Ynhockey ( Talk) 18:57, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
P.S. Due to the new placement for the Logistics Support Units, it seems like there are no space constraints, so you can add 'territorial' (i.e. Territorial Logistics Support Unit). On a side note, when I have time I'll check for you about other reserve units - can't remember them off the top of my head, but it's likely that quite a few other units on your chart are actually reservist. -- Ynhockey ( Talk) 19:00, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
P.P.S. The Hebrew Wikipedia says that the Alpinist Unit is battalion-level. Of course, we can't be sure. However, if you don't have a source saying otherwise, I think HeWiki is believable in this regard. Also, the Caracal Battalion is surobdinate to the Sagi Territorial Brigade in the Southern Command. -- Ynhockey ( Talk) 21:04, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
Hi again! You gave me a link a while ago to the legend to your OrBat graphics, but I can't find it in my talk archives :( can you please give the link again? Thanks! -- Ynhockey ( Talk) 22:51, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
Hi, man!
I have some additional information about IDF Southern Command:
Flayer ( talk) 19:25, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Hi noclador! Sorry to be bothering you again, but I've resumed work on my IDF schematic (it's indeed taking much longer than I had hoped), and would like to include the navy and air force. Unfortunately, I still don't fully understand the color scheme you used for the IDF, and can't copy the navy part because I haven't found any of your OrBat graphics related to navies. Can you please tell me what color to use for naval formations? A full explanation of the color scheme would be more helpful, but you probably don't have time for this if it's not ready in a document. You e-mailed me some files a while ago, but they don't seem to explain the color scheme, just the App-6 symbols. Cheers, Ynhockey ( Talk) 09:39, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | → | Archive 10 |
Thanks for making the graphic! I have a few concerns though. First of all, I'm not aware of a prison guard company in the Home Front Command. Do you have more information on it? It seems strange because I mainly know about MP units. Also, I don't believe that the Erez and Taoz Battallions are subordinate to GOC Headquarters (mazi), but it's possible to check this. Thanks again, Ynhockey ( Talk) 11:45, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
I'm sorry, but it is full of mistakes...
Ground Forces Command neither above Home Front Command (witch is regional command), nor "Logistics, Medical, and the Centers Directorate". Directoriates should be under Genereral Staff, regional commands (North, Central, Southern, Homefront) should also be under Genereral Staff, and the same with IAF, navy and Ground Forces Command, independently.
Corps should be under Ground Forces Command (except Intelligence Corps, Military Police, Education and Youth Corps, General Corps, Medical Corps, and of course, Sea Corps and Air force). But, divisions and brigades (except those of training, like 828 infantry, 460 armor) should be under corresponding regional command (except Homefront, of course).
It would be great if you can fix that, and then I'll tell you all the rest. There are many more little mistakes, like missing or split units, wrong names...
I thing the png should be removed untill it is OK... Flayer 14:01, 11 August 2007 (UTC)
The structure here ( Israel Defense Forces#Military structure) is correct. Lets start from Northern Command: It has 36th "Gaash"/"Rage" armor division, 91st "Galil"/"Galilee" territiorial division, some reserve divisions, 605th "ha-Mahatz"/"The Crush" engineering battalion, "Shahaf"/"Seagull" field intelligence battalion, alpinist SF reserve unit, and probably some other units.36th "Gaash"/"Rage" armor division has 7th armor brigade "Saar me-Golan"/"Storm from Golan", 188th armor brigade "Barak"/"Lightning", 1st infantry brigade "Golani", artillery regiment "Golan" (not sure about the number), and some other units, including the "Golan" territorial brigade. 7th armor brigade has its Merkava mk 2 battalions (Later i can check the names the numbers), AT company, "sayeret 7" recon company, and and probably some other units. 188th armor brigade has its Merkava mk 3 battalions (Later i can check the names the numbers), AT company, "sayeret 188" reserve recon company, and and probably some other units. Infantry brigade "Golani" has its batallions (names & numbers - later), "Egos"/"Nut Tree" anti-guerilla SF battlion, special/recon battalion, signals company, and probably some other minor units. Special/recon battalion has recon ("sayeret") company, AT comapny, and engineering company (names & numbers - later). Artillery regiment "Golan" has its artillery battalions, one of them with MLRS (names & numbers - later). 91st "Galil"/"Galilee" territiorial division has two territiorial divisions 300th "Bar'am" and 169th "Hiram" - both are reserve infantry brigades, 299th "Herev"/"Sword" druze independent infantry battalion (arguably, it belongs directly to northern command or even directly to Infantry and Paratroopers Corps Command) which has a recon "sayeret" company (note that not every SF unit is a "sayeret", "sayeret" means recon unit, so only recon untis should be called "sayeret"), and and probably some other minor units.
Now, Central Command: it has 162th "Ha-Plada"/"The Steel" armor division, West bank territiorial division, some reserve divisions (including 98th "Ha-Esh"/"The Fire" paratroopers reserve division), 601st "Asaf" engineering battalion, "Nitzan"/"Bud" field intelligence battalion, and probably some other units. 162th "Ha-Plada"/"The Steel" armor division has 401st "I'kvot Ha-Barzel"/"Iron Trails" armor brigade, 933th Nahal infantry brigade, 900h "Kfir"/"Yong Lion" designated infantry brigade, 215th artillery regiment "Kala David"/Sling of David", and some other units, including the "Jordan Valley" territorial brigade (sometimes called "The Valley" brigade or "Arie"/"Lion" brigade) 401st armor brigade has its Merkava mk 4 battalions (names & numbers - later), AT company, "sayeret 188" recon company, and and probably some other units. "Nahal" has its batallions (names & numbers - later, one of them is paratroppers battalion), special/recon battalion, signals company, and probably some other minor units. Special/recon battalion has recon ("sayeret") company, AT comapny, and engineering company (names & numbers - later). "Kfir" has 6 designated infantry battalions permanently assigned mainly to West bank territiorial division (names, numbers, assignment order - later), and probably some other units. 215th artillery regiment has its artillery battalions(names & numbers - later). 98th "Ha-Esh"/"The Fire" paratroopers reserve division has 35th regular paratroppers brigade "Flying Serpent, some reserve paratroppers brigades: 226th "Ha-Nesher ha-Shahor"/"The Black Eagle", 551th "Hetzei Ha-Esh"/"Arrows of Fire", 623th "Hod Ha-Hanit"/"Head of the Spear", and some other units propably including "Maglan"/"Ibis" (arguably, it belongs directly to central command) SF unit (which is not "sayeret"), AA parachuting unit (arguably, inside "Maglan") and other. West bank territiorial division has 7 territorial brigades ("Yehuda", "Etzion", "Benyamin", "Shomron", "Ephraim", "Menashe", and "Maccabim") and the "Duvdevan"/"Cherry Tree" SF undercover srike unit (arguably, it belongs directly to central command), and some other units, including some MP units.
Sothern Command: it has 366th "Amud ha-Esh"/"Pillar of Fire" reserve armour division, 80th "Edom" territorial division, "Gaza" territirial division, some reserve divisions, 603th "Lahav"/"Blade" engineering battalion, "Nesher"/"Eagle" field intelligence battalion, 33th "Caracal" unisex independent light infantry battalion (arguably, it belongs directly to Infantry and Paratroopers Corps Command), 585th bedouin desert recon battalion (arguably, it belongs to any of the 2 territorial brigades or on the other hand directly to Infantry and Paratroopers Corps Command), and probably some other units, including a reserve Eilat area CT unit. 366th "Amud ha-Esh"/"Pillar of Fire" division has 84th "Giv'ati" infantry brigade, 460th "Bnei Or"/"Sons of Light" training armor brigade (arguably, it belongs directly to Armor Corps Command), artillery regiment "Amud ha-Esh"/"Pillar of Fire" (not sure about the number), and some other units. "Giv'ati" has its batallions (names & numbers - later), special/recon battalion, and probably some other minor units. Special/recon battalion has recon ("sayeret") company, AT comapny, engineering company and signals comapny (names & numbers - later). 460th training armor brigade has its training battalions (names & numbers - later). Artillery regiment has its artillery battalions (names & numbers - later). "Edom" territorial division has "Arava" territorial brigade, "Sagi" territorial brigade and other units. "Gaza" territorial division has "Northern Gaza" territorial brigade, "Sothern Gaza" territorial brigade and other units. "Rimon"/"Pomegranate" SF unit was disbanded decades ago. To be continued. Note that I do not expose any undisclosed inforamtion, and I don't know everything. Flayer 14:23, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
Great job! It would be great to merge all such png graphics into one complete graphic when everyhing is done. Minor things:
Flayer 16:49, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
::Great! "Special Troops Btn" is OK, though we better not call it (untill i find the real names) and its companies "Golani", like "Golani" AT Coy., "Golani" Recon Coy... It's enough one "Golani" inf. br. on top. Typo: name of the art.reg. is "Golan", not "Golani" once more.
Unable to verify names and nubers of the artillery rgt. Flayer 09:12, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
I'll check up later the MP units.
Flayer 21:32, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
Another (the last) reserve paratroopers brigade of 98th div., is 646th "Shualey Merom"/"Sky Foxes" reserve paratroopers brigade.
Flayer
09:30, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
"Jordan Valley" brigade has a number: 417th.
Flayer
09:33, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
"Serpent" ST btn has a number: 5135.
Flayer
09:44, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
401th armor brigade battalions:
Flayer 17:42, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Flayer 18:50, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
Additional general info from official source:
Another info: each regular armor engineering btn (601th, 603th, 605th) has a heavy equipment company (with D9 armored bulldozers and other vehicles). Moreover, "Gaza" territorial division has its own heavy equipment company ("Abirey ha-Plada"/"Knights of Steel"). Same with West Bank territorial division ("Hatuley ha-Bar"/"Wild Cats" heavy equipment company). Flayer 15:30, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, I got a mistake. Regular armor engineering btn (601th, 603th, 605th) still belong to regular armor divisions (correspondingly, 401th, 7th, 188th). But yet each regional command has a battalion-size engineering unit.
Special command teams of each regional command no longer exist. Flayer —The preceding signed but undated comment was added at 16:40, August 20, 2007 (UTC).
460th training armor brigade (arguably belongs to armor corps command)
Givati has a normal structure. some sources say its signal company is a part of special troops btn.
Flayer 14:40, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Brigades, I meant brigades...
Regional commands engineering units build fortifications, bunkers, outposts, pave roads, cooperate with civilian contractor that do the same... Flayer 20:47, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Flayer 09:36, 21 August 2007 (UTC) Later I'll complete it...
Not yet completed.... Flayer 11:16, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
Almost done! Flayer 16:00, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
Air and Space Arm and Sea Arm remins! Flayer 16:24, 21 August 2007 (UTC)
Great work on the IDF Noclador! Am I correct to think that most of your information is coming from Flayer? Cheers Buckshot06 07:15, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
Just out of interest, what software do you use to make these organization charts? -- Ynhockey ( Talk) 06:27, 24 August 2007 (UTC)
I would suggest only a few things:
It appears twice, but is not a part of MALI. Flayer 15:11, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Sorry for being annoying... "Maglan" is rather an airborn unit. Capable of non-airborn operaions, like any other parachuting unit in the IDF, but usually described as an airborn behind-enemy-lines long-range demolition, AT and anti-AT SF unit. Flayer 09:52, 28 August 2007 (UTC)
Its number is available: 934. Flayer 10:17, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
It has also a reserve armor brigade, called "Merkavot ha-Esh"/"Chariots of Fire". Flayer 18:54, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
Recently revealed, Central Command has a special transportation/combat-driving unit. Flayer 19:04, 30 August 2007 (UTC)
I have been observing your structure charts of IDF units and from my personal knowledge never really understood where you took much of your info from (it all seemed just plain wrong to me). Just now I realized that much of the information relates only to wartime situations where the structure of the army changes fundamentally.
Take for example Image:IDF Central Command.png, where it says that there is a logistics regiment under one of the divisions, as well as an MP company. The entire logistics regiment (called Almar, short for Egged Logisti Merhavi - Regional Logistical Regiment) is a pure emergency reservist-only unit, which has nothing to do with how the army generally works. There are six of these regiments (3 in the north, 1 in the center and 2 in the south).
I think the sources need to be checked again, because I have no all-encompassing knowledge about the army and therefore cannot hope to correct every mistake. It is probably better to withhold the information from Wikipedia rather than give the wrong information.
In order to avoid mistakes, I think it's best to go only a few levels (for example, the army structure should only have brigade-level units and higher, a brigade structure should have company and higher, etc.) and not go too much into details, that way it's more difficult to make a mistake.
-- Ynhockey ( Talk) 11:01, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
Hi, man!
According to User:Ynhockey, the Northern Gaza Territorial Brigade called "Gefen" and the Southern Gaza Territorial Brigade is called "Katif". It would be nice to put it in. Flayer ( talk) 12:54, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
Also, Golan Territorial Brigade is 474th. Flayer ( talk) 14:11, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
- There, "Merkavot ha-Esh" is 263th. Flayer ( talk) 14:18, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
Ok - listen don't give me every tima a unit - make a list tell me all, as I don't want to open file - change file - upload file - have to read there is something else to do, make the list. i will be back in 2 haours and update the graphics than. -- noclador ( talk) 14:20, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
If the graphics became too wide, you can cut and paste the 3 rightmost units of southern command somewhere beneath Edom Ter.Div, and also rearrange the homefront by deleting the repeating reserve NBC Defence btn + Rescue btn of each district. Flayer ( talk) 14:30, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
Hi man! There are some minor changes in the IDF structure.
Flayer ( talk) 10:28, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
Well, lets try to form a structure, before it's too late. ;-)
I'll let you know when it is done. :)
Flayer (
talk)
15:54, 31 August 2008 (UTC)
Well, it it obviously incomplete, but I don't thing I'll be able to find some more structure-related data. Maybe some
squadrons' badges, if you like:)
Flayer (
talk)
16:47, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
Units and Structure minor details:
to be continued...
Flayer (
talk) 13:52, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
OK :)
Flayer (
talk)
16:43, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
That's all, probably. :-) Flayer ( talk) 19:31, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
P.S
Typo: 107th Squadron has F-16I, not F-15I. Flayer ( talk) 17:33, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
Hi, again. I still have some negative feedback about some details.
Hi, did you notice the above? Flayer ( talk) 18:30, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
It wasn't easy! :)
Flayer (
talk)
23:05, 18 December 2008 (UTC)
Hi Noclador! Wikipedia 0.7 will soon be out on DVD, and the IDF main article has been selected to be part of it, which means it will almost certainly include your detailed structure. I am asking, if you have time, to fix some mistakes. Here are the ones I found so far:
Please try to fix these :) if you can't do this anytime soon, let me know and I will try to emulate your entire chart in CorelDRAW and make the necessary changes.
Cheers, Ynhockey ( Talk) 12:49, 29 September 2008 (UTC)
By the way, I also found something. Desert recon. btn. and probably "Caracal" light infantry btn. use wheeled transportation. Flayer ( talk) 20:35, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the update and the e-mail! There's still a problem with the Logistics Supprt Units - the ones I told you about are the only ones that exist (there are no non-reserve logistics support units), so putting them near the command's main box, and then putting another one at the bottom, gives the impression that there are logistics support units in the regular service under the commands. The 5005th unit is actually called "Southwest" by the way (but operates in Gaza); apologies for not making it clear earlier. By the way, you can send the PSD (although I was hoping for a vector format) to ynhockey at gmail dot com. Cheers, Ynhockey ( Talk) 18:57, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
P.S. Due to the new placement for the Logistics Support Units, it seems like there are no space constraints, so you can add 'territorial' (i.e. Territorial Logistics Support Unit). On a side note, when I have time I'll check for you about other reserve units - can't remember them off the top of my head, but it's likely that quite a few other units on your chart are actually reservist. -- Ynhockey ( Talk) 19:00, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
P.P.S. The Hebrew Wikipedia says that the Alpinist Unit is battalion-level. Of course, we can't be sure. However, if you don't have a source saying otherwise, I think HeWiki is believable in this regard. Also, the Caracal Battalion is surobdinate to the Sagi Territorial Brigade in the Southern Command. -- Ynhockey ( Talk) 21:04, 4 October 2008 (UTC)
Hi again! You gave me a link a while ago to the legend to your OrBat graphics, but I can't find it in my talk archives :( can you please give the link again? Thanks! -- Ynhockey ( Talk) 22:51, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
Hi, man!
I have some additional information about IDF Southern Command:
Flayer ( talk) 19:25, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Hi noclador! Sorry to be bothering you again, but I've resumed work on my IDF schematic (it's indeed taking much longer than I had hoped), and would like to include the navy and air force. Unfortunately, I still don't fully understand the color scheme you used for the IDF, and can't copy the navy part because I haven't found any of your OrBat graphics related to navies. Can you please tell me what color to use for naval formations? A full explanation of the color scheme would be more helpful, but you probably don't have time for this if it's not ready in a document. You e-mailed me some files a while ago, but they don't seem to explain the color scheme, just the App-6 symbols. Cheers, Ynhockey ( Talk) 09:39, 11 January 2009 (UTC)