Hello, Kenosplit, and welcome to Wikipedia. We appreciate encyclopedic contributions, but some of your recent contributions seem to be advertising or for promotional purposes. Wikipedia does not allow advertising. For more information on this, please see:
If you still have questions, there is a new contributors' help page, or you can . You may also find the following pages useful for a general introduction to Wikipedia:
I hope you enjoy editing Wikipedia! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. Feel free to write a note on the bottom of my talk page if you want to get in touch with me. Again, welcome! Lwarrenwiki ( talk) 20:42, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
@ Kenosplit: As you might have guessed, the previous message was a standardized Wikipedia template. In my own words, this time: welcome to Wikipedia. Please continue our conversation either on my talk page, or if appropriate, at Talk:Machine Zone. Lwarrenwiki ( talk) 20:42, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at
Wikipedia:Conflict of interest/Noticeboard regarding a possible
conflict of interest incident in which you may be involved. Thank you.
Lwarrenwiki (
talk)
22:02, 12 April 2016 (UTC)
Hi Kenosplit I work on conflict of interest issues here in Wikipedia. Thanks for disclosing that you work at Machine Zone here. I'm providing you with more formal notice of our COI guideline and paid editing policy, and will have some comments and questions for you below. Please do reply here, below my comments.
Hello, Kenosplit. We
welcome your contributions, but if you have an external relationship with the people, places or things
you have written about on Wikipedia, you may have a
conflict of interest (COI). Editors with a COI may be unduly influenced by their connection to the topic. See the
conflict of interest guideline and
FAQ for organizations for more information. In particular, please:
In addition, you must disclose your employer, client, and affiliation with respect to any contribution for which you receive, or expect to receive, compensation (see WP:PAID).
Please familiarize yourself with relevant policies and guidelines, especially those pertaining to neutral point of view, sourcing and autobiographies. Thank you.
Wikipedia is a widely-used reference work and managing conflict of interest is essential for ensuring the integrity of Wikipedia and retaining the public's trust in it. As in academia, COI is managed here in two steps - disclosure and a form of peer review. Please note that there is no bar to being part of the Wikipedia community if you want to be involved in articles where you have a conflict of interest; there are just some things we ask you to do (and if you are paid, some things you need to do).
Disclosure is the most important, and first, step. You've done that at another user's talk page, and that editor added a template to the article Talk page.
To finish the disclosure piece, would you please add the disclosure to your user page (which is User:Kenosplit - a redlink, because you haven't written anything there yet)? Just something simple like: "I work for Machine Zone and have a conflict of interest with regard to that topic" would be fine. If you want to add anything else there that is relevant to what you want to do in WP feel free to add it, but nothing promotional about the company (see WP:USERPAGE for guidance if you like).
That would finish the the disclosure piece.
As I noted above, there are two pieces to COI management in WP. The first is disclosure. The second is what I call "peer review". This piece may seem a bit strange to you at first, but if you think about it, it will make sense. In Wikipedia, editors can immediately publish their work, with no intervening publisher or standard peer review -- you can just create an article, click save, and viola there is a new article, and you can go into any article, make changes, click save, and done. No intermediary - no publisher, no "editors" as that term is used in the real world.
What we ask editors to do who have a COI and want to work on articles where their COI is relevant, is a) if you want to create an article relevant to a COI you have, create the article as a draft, disclose your COI on the Talk page using the appropriate template, and then submit the draft article through the WP:AFC process so it can be reviewed before it publishes; and b) And if you want to change content in any existing article on a topic where you have a COI, we ask you to propose content on the Talk page for others to review and implement before it goes live, instead of doing it directly yourself. You can make the edit request easily - and provide notice to the community of your request - by using the "edit request" function as described in the conflict of interest guideline. A section has been added to the beige box at the top of the Talk page at Talk:Machine Zone - there is a link at "click here" in that section -- if you click that, the Wikipedia software will automatically format a section in which you can make your request.
By following those "peer review" processes, editors with a COI can contribute where they have a COI, and the integrity of WP can be protected. We get some great contributions that way, when conflicted editors take the time to understand what kinds of proposals are OK under the content policies. (which I will say more about, if you want).
I hope that makes sense to you, and that you will stop editing the article directly.
I want to add here that per the WP:COI guideline, if you want to directly update simple, uncontroversial facts (for example, correcting the facts about where the company has offices) you can do that directly in the article, without making an edit request on the Talk page. Just be sure to always cite a reliable source for the information you change, and make sure it is simple, factual, uncontroversial content.
Will you please agree to follow the peer review processes going forward, when you want to work on the Machine Zone article or any article where your COI is relevant? Do let me know, and if anything above doesn't make sense I would be happy to discuss. And if you want me to quickly go over the content policies, I can do that. Just let me know. Thanks! Jytdog ( talk) 16:54, 14 April 2016 (UTC)
OK, so I would like to get you oriented to how Wikipedia works, including our criteria for whether articles should exist, or not. There are some non-intuitive things about editing here, that I can zip through ~pretty~ quickly....
The first thing, is that our mission is to produce articles that provide readers encyclopedia articles that summarize accepted knowledge, and to do that as a community that anyone can be a part of. That's the mission. As you can imagine, if this place had no norms, it would be a Mad Max kind of world interpersonally, and content would be a slag heap (the quality is really bad in parts, despite our best efforts). But over the past 15 years the community has developed a whole slew of norms, via loads of discussion. One of the first, is that we decide things by consensus. That decision itself, is recorded here: WP:CONSENSUS, which is one of our "policies". (There is a whole forest of things, in "Wikipedia space" - pages in Wikipedia that start with "Wikipedia:AAAA" or for short, "WP:AAAA". WP:CONSENSUS is different from Consensus. ) And when we decide things by consensus, that is not just local in space and time, but includes meta-discussions that have happened in the past. The results of those past meta-discussions are the norms that we follow now. We call them policies and guidelines - and these documents all reside in Wikipedia space. There are policies and guidelines that govern content, and separate ones that govern behavior. Here is very quick rundown:
In terms of behavior, the key norms are:
If you can get all that (the content and behavior policies and guidelines) under your belt, you will become truly "clueful", as we say. If that is where you want to go, of course. I know that was a lot of information, but hopefully it is digestable enough.
SO... Anytime you want to create an article, here is what to do.
There you go! Let me know if you have questions about any of that
Anyway - there it is. Hope that makes sense. I know you already created your the article has already been created so a bunch of that is not necessary. But it might help you understand how others will react to it.
Once you have that under your belt, we can have a real discussion about article content at Machine Zone, based on these policies and guidelines. Jytdog ( talk) 19:26, 14 April 2016 (UTC) (redact per below Jytdog ( talk) 21:56, 14 April 2016 (UTC))
@ Kenosplit and Jytdog: See commons:File talk:MZ logo.png. Kenosplit, I'm not asking you or anyone to delete the logo. It could be a potential concern, but I'm not making suggestions or advising you about it. Not my place. Lwarrenwiki ( talk) 15:24, 15 April 2016 (UTC)
{{
unblock|reason=Your reason here ~~~~}}
.
Bbb23 (
talk)
01:11, 2 May 2016 (UTC)Kenosplit ( block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser ( log))
Request reason:
I formally request that my account be unblocked because I did not violate Wikipedia's rules. I was apparently accused of using 2 accounts to edit "Machine Zone" pages, but I have only ever edited or proposed edits to a single "Machine Zone" page through a single account. The other account that I am accused of using was not used by me but was, apparently, used by someone else at my company to create a new "MZ" page to focus on different aspects of Machine Zone's business. Neither one of our edits were done maliciously or in an attempt to circumvent Wikipedia's rules, and I did not create the new "MZ" page or make any edits to it, nor did I direct anyone to do it. I only ask that I be unblocked so that I may make proposed edits to the "Machine Zone" page to update it as it is quite outdated. I agree not to make direct edits without authorization and am only asking for an opportunity to help improve the "Machine Zone" page. Thank you. Kenosplit (talk) 23:31, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
Decline reason:
I don't think you are being honest. Based on the evidence it was not just someone at the same company, but sitting at the very same computer. It also appears you are here just to promote your company, this is not what Wikipedia is for. HighInBC Need help? {{ping|HighInBC}} 16:23, 29 June 2016 (UTC)
If you want to make any further unblock requests, please read the guide to appealing blocks first, then use the {{ unblock}} template again. If you make too many unconvincing or disruptive unblock requests, you may be prevented from editing this page until your block has expired. Do not remove this unblock review while you are blocked.
After a CheckUser SPI investigation, this editor was blocked for sockpuppetry. The unblock request states "I did not violate Wikipedia's rules." Earlier denials of socking appear above at #May 2016.
The following three points don't seem to be in dispute:
The blocked editor's pattern of past edits and edit requests was to add content to Machine Zone that was similar or identical to MZ's press releases or other marketing material. After a notice at COI/N, all of Kenosplit's edits were reverted by an administrator, JzG ( talk), with an edit comment about "blatantly promotional material". At that point, Kenosplit stopped directly editing the page. The activity of the sock Wesmail ( talk · contribs) started one day earlier.
Taken together with past statements, the unblock request indicates no acknowledgement or acceptance that previous edits/requests had issues with non-neutral wording or problematic marketing language in violation of WP:PROMOTION, WP:PUBLICITY, or WP:NPOV. After being asked to read those policies, and after violations were pointed out in detail, Kenosplit maintained that the COI edits made the article more accurate and up-to-date. See above: "I am fine with making suggested edits to the article rather than editing it directly, but my suggested edits will be in line with the edits I made before, which I do not believe are promotional."
I'd suggest that the policy on Advertising-only accounts also applies here. The unblock request uses the word "only" to describe the editor's only purpose here. Even if the sockpuppetry was excusable, this unblock should be denied because the editor demonstrates no intention, if unblocked, of making any constructive contributions to Wikipedia that are unrelated to the subject of Machine Zone. Lwarrenwiki ( talk) 15:35, 29 June 2016 (UTC)
Hello, Kenosplit, and welcome to Wikipedia. We appreciate encyclopedic contributions, but some of your recent contributions seem to be advertising or for promotional purposes. Wikipedia does not allow advertising. For more information on this, please see:
If you still have questions, there is a new contributors' help page, or you can . You may also find the following pages useful for a general introduction to Wikipedia:
I hope you enjoy editing Wikipedia! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. Feel free to write a note on the bottom of my talk page if you want to get in touch with me. Again, welcome! Lwarrenwiki ( talk) 20:42, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
@ Kenosplit: As you might have guessed, the previous message was a standardized Wikipedia template. In my own words, this time: welcome to Wikipedia. Please continue our conversation either on my talk page, or if appropriate, at Talk:Machine Zone. Lwarrenwiki ( talk) 20:42, 11 April 2016 (UTC)
This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at
Wikipedia:Conflict of interest/Noticeboard regarding a possible
conflict of interest incident in which you may be involved. Thank you.
Lwarrenwiki (
talk)
22:02, 12 April 2016 (UTC)
Hi Kenosplit I work on conflict of interest issues here in Wikipedia. Thanks for disclosing that you work at Machine Zone here. I'm providing you with more formal notice of our COI guideline and paid editing policy, and will have some comments and questions for you below. Please do reply here, below my comments.
Hello, Kenosplit. We
welcome your contributions, but if you have an external relationship with the people, places or things
you have written about on Wikipedia, you may have a
conflict of interest (COI). Editors with a COI may be unduly influenced by their connection to the topic. See the
conflict of interest guideline and
FAQ for organizations for more information. In particular, please:
In addition, you must disclose your employer, client, and affiliation with respect to any contribution for which you receive, or expect to receive, compensation (see WP:PAID).
Please familiarize yourself with relevant policies and guidelines, especially those pertaining to neutral point of view, sourcing and autobiographies. Thank you.
Wikipedia is a widely-used reference work and managing conflict of interest is essential for ensuring the integrity of Wikipedia and retaining the public's trust in it. As in academia, COI is managed here in two steps - disclosure and a form of peer review. Please note that there is no bar to being part of the Wikipedia community if you want to be involved in articles where you have a conflict of interest; there are just some things we ask you to do (and if you are paid, some things you need to do).
Disclosure is the most important, and first, step. You've done that at another user's talk page, and that editor added a template to the article Talk page.
To finish the disclosure piece, would you please add the disclosure to your user page (which is User:Kenosplit - a redlink, because you haven't written anything there yet)? Just something simple like: "I work for Machine Zone and have a conflict of interest with regard to that topic" would be fine. If you want to add anything else there that is relevant to what you want to do in WP feel free to add it, but nothing promotional about the company (see WP:USERPAGE for guidance if you like).
That would finish the the disclosure piece.
As I noted above, there are two pieces to COI management in WP. The first is disclosure. The second is what I call "peer review". This piece may seem a bit strange to you at first, but if you think about it, it will make sense. In Wikipedia, editors can immediately publish their work, with no intervening publisher or standard peer review -- you can just create an article, click save, and viola there is a new article, and you can go into any article, make changes, click save, and done. No intermediary - no publisher, no "editors" as that term is used in the real world.
What we ask editors to do who have a COI and want to work on articles where their COI is relevant, is a) if you want to create an article relevant to a COI you have, create the article as a draft, disclose your COI on the Talk page using the appropriate template, and then submit the draft article through the WP:AFC process so it can be reviewed before it publishes; and b) And if you want to change content in any existing article on a topic where you have a COI, we ask you to propose content on the Talk page for others to review and implement before it goes live, instead of doing it directly yourself. You can make the edit request easily - and provide notice to the community of your request - by using the "edit request" function as described in the conflict of interest guideline. A section has been added to the beige box at the top of the Talk page at Talk:Machine Zone - there is a link at "click here" in that section -- if you click that, the Wikipedia software will automatically format a section in which you can make your request.
By following those "peer review" processes, editors with a COI can contribute where they have a COI, and the integrity of WP can be protected. We get some great contributions that way, when conflicted editors take the time to understand what kinds of proposals are OK under the content policies. (which I will say more about, if you want).
I hope that makes sense to you, and that you will stop editing the article directly.
I want to add here that per the WP:COI guideline, if you want to directly update simple, uncontroversial facts (for example, correcting the facts about where the company has offices) you can do that directly in the article, without making an edit request on the Talk page. Just be sure to always cite a reliable source for the information you change, and make sure it is simple, factual, uncontroversial content.
Will you please agree to follow the peer review processes going forward, when you want to work on the Machine Zone article or any article where your COI is relevant? Do let me know, and if anything above doesn't make sense I would be happy to discuss. And if you want me to quickly go over the content policies, I can do that. Just let me know. Thanks! Jytdog ( talk) 16:54, 14 April 2016 (UTC)
OK, so I would like to get you oriented to how Wikipedia works, including our criteria for whether articles should exist, or not. There are some non-intuitive things about editing here, that I can zip through ~pretty~ quickly....
The first thing, is that our mission is to produce articles that provide readers encyclopedia articles that summarize accepted knowledge, and to do that as a community that anyone can be a part of. That's the mission. As you can imagine, if this place had no norms, it would be a Mad Max kind of world interpersonally, and content would be a slag heap (the quality is really bad in parts, despite our best efforts). But over the past 15 years the community has developed a whole slew of norms, via loads of discussion. One of the first, is that we decide things by consensus. That decision itself, is recorded here: WP:CONSENSUS, which is one of our "policies". (There is a whole forest of things, in "Wikipedia space" - pages in Wikipedia that start with "Wikipedia:AAAA" or for short, "WP:AAAA". WP:CONSENSUS is different from Consensus. ) And when we decide things by consensus, that is not just local in space and time, but includes meta-discussions that have happened in the past. The results of those past meta-discussions are the norms that we follow now. We call them policies and guidelines - and these documents all reside in Wikipedia space. There are policies and guidelines that govern content, and separate ones that govern behavior. Here is very quick rundown:
In terms of behavior, the key norms are:
If you can get all that (the content and behavior policies and guidelines) under your belt, you will become truly "clueful", as we say. If that is where you want to go, of course. I know that was a lot of information, but hopefully it is digestable enough.
SO... Anytime you want to create an article, here is what to do.
There you go! Let me know if you have questions about any of that
Anyway - there it is. Hope that makes sense. I know you already created your the article has already been created so a bunch of that is not necessary. But it might help you understand how others will react to it.
Once you have that under your belt, we can have a real discussion about article content at Machine Zone, based on these policies and guidelines. Jytdog ( talk) 19:26, 14 April 2016 (UTC) (redact per below Jytdog ( talk) 21:56, 14 April 2016 (UTC))
@ Kenosplit and Jytdog: See commons:File talk:MZ logo.png. Kenosplit, I'm not asking you or anyone to delete the logo. It could be a potential concern, but I'm not making suggestions or advising you about it. Not my place. Lwarrenwiki ( talk) 15:24, 15 April 2016 (UTC)
{{
unblock|reason=Your reason here ~~~~}}
.
Bbb23 (
talk)
01:11, 2 May 2016 (UTC)Kenosplit ( block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser ( log))
Request reason:
I formally request that my account be unblocked because I did not violate Wikipedia's rules. I was apparently accused of using 2 accounts to edit "Machine Zone" pages, but I have only ever edited or proposed edits to a single "Machine Zone" page through a single account. The other account that I am accused of using was not used by me but was, apparently, used by someone else at my company to create a new "MZ" page to focus on different aspects of Machine Zone's business. Neither one of our edits were done maliciously or in an attempt to circumvent Wikipedia's rules, and I did not create the new "MZ" page or make any edits to it, nor did I direct anyone to do it. I only ask that I be unblocked so that I may make proposed edits to the "Machine Zone" page to update it as it is quite outdated. I agree not to make direct edits without authorization and am only asking for an opportunity to help improve the "Machine Zone" page. Thank you. Kenosplit (talk) 23:31, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
Decline reason:
I don't think you are being honest. Based on the evidence it was not just someone at the same company, but sitting at the very same computer. It also appears you are here just to promote your company, this is not what Wikipedia is for. HighInBC Need help? {{ping|HighInBC}} 16:23, 29 June 2016 (UTC)
If you want to make any further unblock requests, please read the guide to appealing blocks first, then use the {{ unblock}} template again. If you make too many unconvincing or disruptive unblock requests, you may be prevented from editing this page until your block has expired. Do not remove this unblock review while you are blocked.
After a CheckUser SPI investigation, this editor was blocked for sockpuppetry. The unblock request states "I did not violate Wikipedia's rules." Earlier denials of socking appear above at #May 2016.
The following three points don't seem to be in dispute:
The blocked editor's pattern of past edits and edit requests was to add content to Machine Zone that was similar or identical to MZ's press releases or other marketing material. After a notice at COI/N, all of Kenosplit's edits were reverted by an administrator, JzG ( talk), with an edit comment about "blatantly promotional material". At that point, Kenosplit stopped directly editing the page. The activity of the sock Wesmail ( talk · contribs) started one day earlier.
Taken together with past statements, the unblock request indicates no acknowledgement or acceptance that previous edits/requests had issues with non-neutral wording or problematic marketing language in violation of WP:PROMOTION, WP:PUBLICITY, or WP:NPOV. After being asked to read those policies, and after violations were pointed out in detail, Kenosplit maintained that the COI edits made the article more accurate and up-to-date. See above: "I am fine with making suggested edits to the article rather than editing it directly, but my suggested edits will be in line with the edits I made before, which I do not believe are promotional."
I'd suggest that the policy on Advertising-only accounts also applies here. The unblock request uses the word "only" to describe the editor's only purpose here. Even if the sockpuppetry was excusable, this unblock should be denied because the editor demonstrates no intention, if unblocked, of making any constructive contributions to Wikipedia that are unrelated to the subject of Machine Zone. Lwarrenwiki ( talk) 15:35, 29 June 2016 (UTC)