The following note was left on the Spirit of St Louis aircraft article:
The Orteig Prize was offered to the first aviator to fly non-stop from New York City to Paris, however, the Atlantic had been crossed in non-stop flights previously. Although Lindbergh was the first to fly solo from New York to Paris non-stop, he was not the first aviator to complete a transatlantic heavier-than-air aircraft flight. That had been done first in stages by the crew of the NC-4, in May 1919, although their flying boat broke down and had to be repaired before continuing. The NC-4 flights took 19 days to cross the Atlantic Ocean.
The first truly non-stop transatlantic flight was achieved nearly eight years before by two British flyers, John Alcock and Arthur Whitten Brown in a modified Vickers Vimy IV bomber on 14 June-15 June 1919, departing Lester's Field near St. Johns, Newfoundland and arriving at Clifden, Ireland (a shorter route than Lindbergh's). A total of 81 people had flown across the Atlantic prior to Lindbergh. However, his was the first solo, non-stop transatlantic flight.
The fact that the Spirit of St. Louis was used in a solo flight is what makes it unique. Others have the claim of being the first across the Atlantic in a non-stop flight. FWIW Bzuk 02:11, 10 July 2007 (UTC)."
As I believe that you are a newcomer, I would like to remind you that addressing controversial issues even when it revolves around one word has to be brought up at the discussion page of the article. As well constant reverting of a good-faith edit is not acceptable and will result in a block after the third revert. FWIW Bzuk 00:10, 12 July 2007 (UTC).
I understand you're new to Wikipedia, and may not understand our ways fully yet, so besides the welcome message I'll leave below, let me say that article content is established two ways here: The first and most important is by reference. There are a plethora of references that state that others made earlier non-stop transatlantic flights, as wes as a plethora that say one of the significant elements of Lindy's was that it was solo. Please stop removing this information. Second, changes are made by consensus. If you have issue with it, propose the change on the article's talk page, give your reasons and see how others respond. Don't remove the information prematurely, though. If other's disagree with you, either a) modify your proposal to make it acceptable b) respect the consensus...you can't win every battle. If you have any questions, let me know. AKRadecki Speaketh 13:47, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Welcome!
Hello, Jquicksall, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:
- The five pillars of Wikipedia
- How to edit a page
- Help pages
- Tutorial
- How to write a great article
- Manual of Style
I noticed your interest in aircraft-related articles. There is a group of editors here at Wikipedia who have come together to form WikiProject Aircraft in order to improve aircraft-related articles. You are invited to check us out and, if interested, join our team. Our project page has a lot of resources as well as article guidelines that you might find helpful.
I hope you enjoy editing here and being a
Wikipedian! Please
sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out
Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Again, welcome!
AKRadecki
Speaketh
13:47, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Several editors have expressed concern at your edits to the Spirit of St. Louis article. Reviewing the case, I agree that the edit seriously skews the statement to a non-neutral point of view. The difference between "first" and "first solo" is a very major one, IMHO, and cannot be allowed into the article as-is. Alcock and Brown clearly make the first non-stop flight, by removing the word "solo" you are creating a false statement in the article. This is a serious problem.
I see several attempts to discuss the matter both here on your talk page and in the Talk:Spirit_of_St._Louis talk page, but I have seen no responses from you to date. This is another important wikipedia policy; change is fine, even radical change, but if it results in controversy you should address the concerns. Simply put, you have not done so.
I don't want to harsh out here, but I do need to make sure the message is clear: unless you have a good explaination, and tell us what it is, any further edits to re-include this change will be treated as vandalism and result in a blocking of your editing privileges. If you really feel that this change is minor, and accurate, then you need to address the concerns brought forth by the other editors first.
Maury 16:38, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
- Your edits are obviously controversial. Please discuss them on the projects talk page where you are welcome to discuss any desired changes. If you need help with this, please let me know on my user talk page. If you continue this disruptive behavior, you may recieve a temporary block to allow you time to read up on wikipedias policies. Thanks and good luck. -- Chrislk02 (Chris Kreider) 18:42, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
The following note was left on the Spirit of St Louis aircraft article:
The Orteig Prize was offered to the first aviator to fly non-stop from New York City to Paris, however, the Atlantic had been crossed in non-stop flights previously. Although Lindbergh was the first to fly solo from New York to Paris non-stop, he was not the first aviator to complete a transatlantic heavier-than-air aircraft flight. That had been done first in stages by the crew of the NC-4, in May 1919, although their flying boat broke down and had to be repaired before continuing. The NC-4 flights took 19 days to cross the Atlantic Ocean.
The first truly non-stop transatlantic flight was achieved nearly eight years before by two British flyers, John Alcock and Arthur Whitten Brown in a modified Vickers Vimy IV bomber on 14 June-15 June 1919, departing Lester's Field near St. Johns, Newfoundland and arriving at Clifden, Ireland (a shorter route than Lindbergh's). A total of 81 people had flown across the Atlantic prior to Lindbergh. However, his was the first solo, non-stop transatlantic flight.
The fact that the Spirit of St. Louis was used in a solo flight is what makes it unique. Others have the claim of being the first across the Atlantic in a non-stop flight. FWIW Bzuk 02:11, 10 July 2007 (UTC)."
As I believe that you are a newcomer, I would like to remind you that addressing controversial issues even when it revolves around one word has to be brought up at the discussion page of the article. As well constant reverting of a good-faith edit is not acceptable and will result in a block after the third revert. FWIW Bzuk 00:10, 12 July 2007 (UTC).
I understand you're new to Wikipedia, and may not understand our ways fully yet, so besides the welcome message I'll leave below, let me say that article content is established two ways here: The first and most important is by reference. There are a plethora of references that state that others made earlier non-stop transatlantic flights, as wes as a plethora that say one of the significant elements of Lindy's was that it was solo. Please stop removing this information. Second, changes are made by consensus. If you have issue with it, propose the change on the article's talk page, give your reasons and see how others respond. Don't remove the information prematurely, though. If other's disagree with you, either a) modify your proposal to make it acceptable b) respect the consensus...you can't win every battle. If you have any questions, let me know. AKRadecki Speaketh 13:47, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Welcome!
Hello, Jquicksall, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:
- The five pillars of Wikipedia
- How to edit a page
- Help pages
- Tutorial
- How to write a great article
- Manual of Style
I noticed your interest in aircraft-related articles. There is a group of editors here at Wikipedia who have come together to form WikiProject Aircraft in order to improve aircraft-related articles. You are invited to check us out and, if interested, join our team. Our project page has a lot of resources as well as article guidelines that you might find helpful.
I hope you enjoy editing here and being a
Wikipedian! Please
sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out
Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Again, welcome!
AKRadecki
Speaketh
13:47, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Several editors have expressed concern at your edits to the Spirit of St. Louis article. Reviewing the case, I agree that the edit seriously skews the statement to a non-neutral point of view. The difference between "first" and "first solo" is a very major one, IMHO, and cannot be allowed into the article as-is. Alcock and Brown clearly make the first non-stop flight, by removing the word "solo" you are creating a false statement in the article. This is a serious problem.
I see several attempts to discuss the matter both here on your talk page and in the Talk:Spirit_of_St._Louis talk page, but I have seen no responses from you to date. This is another important wikipedia policy; change is fine, even radical change, but if it results in controversy you should address the concerns. Simply put, you have not done so.
I don't want to harsh out here, but I do need to make sure the message is clear: unless you have a good explaination, and tell us what it is, any further edits to re-include this change will be treated as vandalism and result in a blocking of your editing privileges. If you really feel that this change is minor, and accurate, then you need to address the concerns brought forth by the other editors first.
Maury 16:38, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
- Your edits are obviously controversial. Please discuss them on the projects talk page where you are welcome to discuss any desired changes. If you need help with this, please let me know on my user talk page. If you continue this disruptive behavior, you may recieve a temporary block to allow you time to read up on wikipedias policies. Thanks and good luck. -- Chrislk02 (Chris Kreider) 18:42, 12 July 2007 (UTC)