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Archive 1 | Archive 2 |
Welcome!
Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:
I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, please be sure to sign your name on Talk and vote pages using four tildes (~~~~) to produce your name and the current date, or three tildes (~~~) for just your name. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!
Redwolf24 9 July 2005 01:22 (UTC)
Just wanted to say that I'm so pleased to see that you've decided to stick around. As silly and frustrating as the edit war over Clay Aiken was, if it means that Wikipedia has gained a new and interested editor then I'll judge it worthwhile. Enjoy yourself and if I can ever be of any help please let me know. · Katefan0 (scribble) 14:48, July 25, 2005 (UTC)
Hey, good to see you keeping an eye on the Clay page. I know we didn't always see eye to eye over there but you were always reasonable and I'm glad we were able to work it out in the end. -- Wilykit 21:24, July 27, 2005 (UTC)
I tend to agree, and am glad to hear that you are going to the source in trying to prevent some of the run-by fruitings. · Katefan0 (scribble) 01:14, August 24, 2005 (UTC)
Hi, I noticed that you have recently contributed in the Mirrors and forks section of Wikipedia. If you planning on helping us eliminate those copyright violators, let me know. I'm currently looking for more people to contribute there. It's rather inactive there. Thanks. -- WB 02:19, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
Hi, WB, thanks for these notes. Should I not send him a letter beforehand stating that this is my next step? If we do take this to that level, I will need help. I'm just following the steps provided on these pages, and haven't done anything like this before. I do think the young man will yield to further pressure. He has made some attempt to correct things, and I think he will respond to continued reminders with specifics about what more is needed for his sites to be in compliance. Chances are with the American Idol season just beginning, he wants to milk the connection without doing a whole lot of extra work right when the hits are starting to come in. He has other irons in the fire, and is trying to make a on-line news database of sorts. Everything is in the hands of "interns" or "staff", he keeps saying. But I'd take 50 of him over some of the crap that's out there right now in the way of "juiceenews" so I'm inclined to cut him some slack and not rush him too much. Also, this isn't something I can put a lot of time into during the week, but I will check his sites this weekend and see if he's made further progress.
If this process goes well, I might be persuaded to get involved in another case. :) Any advice is more than welcome. - Jmh123 00:57, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
Hi - see Mirrors and Forks for update. Frustrating. Thanks for the template!! - Jmh123 00:14, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
Hi, I gather that you are new. When I deleted the category "Baptists" from Clay Aiken (multiple times as you put it in multiple times), it is because there is no evidence from the article or any of the citations of sources for that claim. Wikipedia strives for verifiability. Therefor, information which is known to an editor cannot just be added without citing the sources so that it may be checked. I understand that there are lots of "rumors" about Clay Aiken, but rumors aren't facts and those "rumors" tend to get deleted when someone wants to add them to his article. Hope you understand and if you'd like to edit Clay's article and add the sourcing for the religious affiliation claimed, that's what it's there for. Carlossuarez46 20:19, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
I'd not really looked at this before; I can see room for improvement, but on the whole it doesn't seem too bad to me. Your first point is reasonable — why not just edit it? The point about superstition seems to me to be couched in NPoV terms, though. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 18:16, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
I've filed a request for arbitration here. If it is accepted by the admins you can present your side of the dispute there. - mixvio 01:14, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
Jmh123, thanks for the kind comment. : ) I'm going to keep an eye on Chechypaw. I agree that it is better for someone not involved in a content dispute to do such reverts. I'm not sure what happened with the edits on Mixvio talk page? Looks like an editing mistake. Mixvio will probably notice something is different and check the history. He may fix it or leave it the way it is. PAW is challenging. It helps that I have a lot of other interests that I write about regularly. FloNight talk 16:27, 9 April 2006 (UTC)
It is only a violation, if he reverts a 4th time Agathoclea 10:37, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
We may not have heard the last of this as Otto4711 has asked for a deletion review. [1] - Maria202 20:06, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
Keep up the good work, SqueakBox 22:13, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
I see you have removed wellsourced text, the source and text meets the criteria for inclusion on wikipedia. Please restore the text and source. Nandaba Naota 23:56, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
Hey again,
Most importantly, I would just like to make clear I did not mean to come across as arrogant, and I apologize if I appeared that way. I understand how easily Wikipedians can get upset when newbies start trying to make drastic changes out of no where. Viper2k6 05:25, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
I thought I would shift this over to your talk page.
Anyways, thanks for your help in sourcing the Akebono article. It is just too important to be left blank. That was pretty cool that three people were able to just come together and do that. wikipedia power, i guess. XinJeisan 21:16, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
I just set up a proposal at Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals for a Sumo WikiProject. Please sign up. It is at 1.116. I don't know how to link directly to there! XinJeisan 16:54, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for your advice. I hope you decide to join up XinJeisan 20:40, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
Hello again, thanks for giving me a heads up when proposing new content ... that is kinda a lot of citations to skim through. Next time I'll give specific sources and outline the info that I feel is important. Viper2k6 17:53, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
No, you misunderstand. For Wikipe-tan to be "a lolicon" would mean that she had a sexual interest in girls under the age of consent. Read the article, there are a couple different meanings for the word. I don't think describing it as "a lolicon image of Wikipe-tan" makes much sense either, since at most it's an ecchi image. -- tjstrf talk 22:52, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
Thank you so much for stepping in at Talk:Pro-pedophile activism. I really had no idea what I had gotten into. I was very surprised by Squeakbox and DPeterson's accusations of "trolling" and such. I will remember this in the future and do a better job at educating myself of an article's history before commenting, for my own sake.
I do think that it would have been better if one of them had said, "you know what, I haven't seen you here before, so you probably don't know this, but there is a long history of dispute here, and we actually have many good reasons for wanting this template here. Sometime in the next few days I will put together a short list of the main problems, so people, like you, who are new and who see the template will understand that there is a history here."
Anyway, I really appreciate you sticking up for me. I am glad that you pointed out that I am not associated with the problematic group in question. I feel very grateful, thank you. Joie de Vivre 03:45, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
hello. if possible, please comment on the issue being "discussed" at child sexual abuse. i have presented evidence that dpeterson's reasoning is flawed and he has ignored my arguments. an evaluation from someone who seems to be actually interested in editing constuctively would be cool. ~[[ kinda]] 23:01, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
The lolicon debate has been reopened, I have put a note to said effect at AN/I, SqueakBox 23:50, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
WP:IDONTLIKEIT is a counter for arguments where no reason is given except that you don't personally like something, despite there being apparent benefits to it.
User:A - This change will make improvements in the following 3 ways, X, Y, and Z! We should do this! User:B - No, I think it sucks.
Similarly, WP:ILIKEIT is for "arguments" like this, where rather than saying something is wrong because it violates policy you just say that you personally dislike it.
User:A - This article violates the following 3 policies and should be deleted! User:B - But it's cool!
In the case you are speaking of, the reason for using the new image over the old one, and the reason the new image existed in the first place, was that it was an aesthetic improvement. In other words, it looked better while presenting the same content.
While looking better obviously would not be a reason to do something if it violated policies, when choosing between two things that are both of equal standing in other ways, one looking better is a valid reason.
So in other words, my comment towards Tony was that he had cited no reason for thinking the image was inappropriate, simply said that he thought it was.
Finally, I removed the conversation dump from my talk page. I'm not sure what that was there for. If you were trying to remind me of what I said, it's normal to use diff links if you want to discuss a specific change a user made, not paste in the entire conversation. -- tjstrf talk 00:24, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
Thanks very much for your note on my talk page. If you and some of the others need a hand in getting consensus around rewrites, let me know. It would be a very good thing to have well-written and -sourced articles on child abuse topics. I do wonder, however; can such articles, once completed, be guarded in any way from the vandalism that will inevitably result? I do not know what options may exist in this situation. If such protections do exist, the work is certainly valuable and worth every effort. Best, ZeroZ 11:03, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
OK. I killed the catagories, otherwise they will pick up my sub page. Maria202 17:36, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
First off, I'd like to again apologize if I've upset you or acted in a way that was rude. That was not my intention... I am wondering if it is nearing time to file an RfC regarding editor 00a00a0aa ? Regards DPeterson talk 19:06, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
Maybe you could ask David Finkelhor. He is definitely the most significant child sexual abuse researcher, and since he has an agenda (contra to that of pro-pedophile activists) he might be motivated to contribute to a wikipedia article on this. He has written criticisms of studies used by pro-pedophile activists before. His email is david.finkelhor@unh.edu ~[[ kinda]] 21:01, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I did a revert of Monotonehell and Slakr, but retained your edits adding references to the Effects section. Cheers, ZeroZ 08:07, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
Regarding your edit, [3] I wonder if you would take another look. The language of criterion A says:
A. Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving sexual activity with a prepubescent child or children (generally age 13 years or younger) [4]
I believe the 6-month period applies to "behaviors" as well; otherwise there would be a conjuction and no comma between "sexually arousing fantasies" and "sexual urges", above. It would look like this: Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies or sexual urges, or behaviors ...
But the language places all three ("fantasies, urges, or behaviors") equally under the qualification "over a period of at least 6 months". I also asked a psychiatrist colleague, who agrees, but I would prefer if you checked for yourself. Cheers, ZeroZ 09:51, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
Congratulations on becoming an admin!
Could you please look at the Rosie O'Donnell entry? I found that an untruth had been inserted there regarding Clay Aiken ("he has never said if he was gay or not"), so I rephrased and included a source, Rolling Stone. I included a quote from the Rolling Stone interview in the edit notes ("...either you're a womanizer or you've got to be gay. Since I'm neither one of those...."), but my change was removed today and replaced with the old statement. What he said on GMA & Larry King was that he was tired of answering because people are going to believe what they want to believe anyway, but that point went right over most people's heads. Normally reliable sources did report at that time that "he has never said if he was gay or not," but those reliable sources were incorrect. I could list multiple sources for statements that he has made in the past that he is not gay, but it's really beside the point to this section in O'Donnell to get into all that. Hope you can help. Thanks. - Jmh123 14:48, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
(no indent for better format of response) Thanks. Note that at the end of page 2 of the Rolling Stone link it states, (Excerpted from RS 926, July 10, 2003). This excerpt is not the full article. Nonetheless, Rolling Stone is a reliable source and is freely available in libraries and in full text online archives. The full context is:
"Some people, for example, seem to think that because he is slender, has long, fluttering eyelashes, and currently doesn't have a girlfriend, he must be gay. Indeed, after Aiken somewhat awkwardly tossed the first pitch at a Durham Bulls minor-league baseball game, dreadful comic Jimmy Kimmel felt called upon to tell his talk show's audience, "But that's OK, folks, because Clay's a catcher, not a pitcher." Even so, this kind of stuff seems to amuse Aiken more than it upsets him.
"One thing I've found of people in the public eye," Aiken says, "either you're a womanizer or you've got to be gay. Since I'm neither one of those, people are completely concerned about me. They're like, What are you, then?' I'm sure it has to do with being raised by women. I wouldn't want somebody gawking at my mom and grabbing her butt and catcalling at her, trying to hook up with her at a bar. I'm not saying I'm not going to look. Hello! But you know what I mean?"
Another reference, also not available on line, is the Prime Time Live interview with Diane Sawyer, 10/09/03,
Diane: In Rolling Stone he hinted he's a virgin and denied what's asked him over and over again. Is he gay? He says no.... "I think it's high time there's somebody who represents people who aren't gay, but doesn't sleep around with everybody...you know. If I'm supposed to carry the banner for all the nerds in the world I'm fine with that, too, so...."
There are other sources from that time period (Star, J-14), none on line, which seem to be derivative of one of these two sources, as well as several interviews in 2004 during the Independent Tour promotion, all in "for pay only" newspaper archives.
I did not ask that mention of controversy over Aiken's orientation be removed, only the incorrect statement that "he has never stated whether he is homosexual or not." The link to the GMA interview, cited as a source for this statement actually says the opposite, "Aiken said he protested similar rumors a few years ago because he was naive. 'I walked out of that 'American Idol' door after being sequestered in a house for 16 weeks into the real world,' he said. '[The rumor] surprised me I guess a little bit. … It's, apparently, fascinating to everyone.' " It's not online anymore either, by the way, but You can read it here
[6]. -
Jmh123
17:22, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
Hi, not sure why any reference to Clay Aiken's sexuality need to be expunged when the article clearly stated his denial of talking about it and no proof has been presented showing evidence of him being gay. And if it did? Who cares? The section is about perceived homophobia which can happen to strait people who are simply perceived as being gay whether the person making that judgment is correct or not isn't the point. I've further softened the language to read "Although some have speculated or joked that Aiken is gay[44] he has steadfastly refused to discuss his sexuality stating "What I do in my private life is nobody's business anymore."[45]" I hope this further revision is acceptable. Benjiboi 06:12, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
(moved from my page)
Well that is sad. I do believe that in such a situation a locked lack of consensus is not a reason to do nothing, that would have been fine if there had been only opposition to the move but givenn some people wanted it and others didnt isnt a reason to stay with those who didnt want the move. Far from harming the project I think merging articles helps make for a better project in almost all cases (certainly not just paedophilia cases) and do believe that having the 3 articles in one place will help improve all 3 articles. I would also say that Jim Burton's creation of the anti pedophile activism article was POV based and much more harmful to the project than the recent merge but was att he root of it. Anyway, best wishes, SqueakBox 17:53, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Mass_redirects_with_no_consensus Thanks.-- Flamgirlant 23:06, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
A compelling argument has been made to re-visit the article on Tory Mason for the purposes of deletion. The argument is listed on the talk page there, under Editing and prod tag rationale. The last time the article was up for AfD, back in January, it was decided to keep it, with twelve saying delete and five saying keep -- hardly a consensus and seemingly irregular. The article is stuffed with irrelevancy and is little more than a string of citations of porn websites, all cited to make the subject look notable. The actor simply has done nothing noteworthy. A prod tag has been restored after being deleted by an editor; a challenge has been issued to that editor and any dissenting editors to keep the prod tag in place and allow the deletion process to proceed again. Please consider re-nominating the article yourself for AfD (as I am unable to) should the editors decline the challenge. I don't think the article will survive with the argument listed there, assuming the delete process is allowed to run its course. Any assistance you can render will be appreciated. Thank you. 72.76.78.30 14:06, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
What you are doing is blatant censorship. I have not reverted it three times in 24hrs. You are trying to erase a record of the discussion, what is this Nineteen Eighty-Four ???? WacoJacko 09:29, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
"Individual is not notable, article is unsourced" is not a criterion for speedy deletion. I have removed your tag. Picaroon (Talk) 20:54, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, I meant to leave you a note telling you to see the talk page. I felt like we needed to discuss what to do with that section you removed before simply deleting it. Sorry for the confusion. Mike D78 22:09, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 |
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 |
Welcome!
Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:
I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, please be sure to sign your name on Talk and vote pages using four tildes (~~~~) to produce your name and the current date, or three tildes (~~~) for just your name. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome!
Redwolf24 9 July 2005 01:22 (UTC)
Just wanted to say that I'm so pleased to see that you've decided to stick around. As silly and frustrating as the edit war over Clay Aiken was, if it means that Wikipedia has gained a new and interested editor then I'll judge it worthwhile. Enjoy yourself and if I can ever be of any help please let me know. · Katefan0 (scribble) 14:48, July 25, 2005 (UTC)
Hey, good to see you keeping an eye on the Clay page. I know we didn't always see eye to eye over there but you were always reasonable and I'm glad we were able to work it out in the end. -- Wilykit 21:24, July 27, 2005 (UTC)
I tend to agree, and am glad to hear that you are going to the source in trying to prevent some of the run-by fruitings. · Katefan0 (scribble) 01:14, August 24, 2005 (UTC)
Hi, I noticed that you have recently contributed in the Mirrors and forks section of Wikipedia. If you planning on helping us eliminate those copyright violators, let me know. I'm currently looking for more people to contribute there. It's rather inactive there. Thanks. -- WB 02:19, 16 January 2006 (UTC)
Hi, WB, thanks for these notes. Should I not send him a letter beforehand stating that this is my next step? If we do take this to that level, I will need help. I'm just following the steps provided on these pages, and haven't done anything like this before. I do think the young man will yield to further pressure. He has made some attempt to correct things, and I think he will respond to continued reminders with specifics about what more is needed for his sites to be in compliance. Chances are with the American Idol season just beginning, he wants to milk the connection without doing a whole lot of extra work right when the hits are starting to come in. He has other irons in the fire, and is trying to make a on-line news database of sorts. Everything is in the hands of "interns" or "staff", he keeps saying. But I'd take 50 of him over some of the crap that's out there right now in the way of "juiceenews" so I'm inclined to cut him some slack and not rush him too much. Also, this isn't something I can put a lot of time into during the week, but I will check his sites this weekend and see if he's made further progress.
If this process goes well, I might be persuaded to get involved in another case. :) Any advice is more than welcome. - Jmh123 00:57, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
Hi - see Mirrors and Forks for update. Frustrating. Thanks for the template!! - Jmh123 00:14, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
Hi, I gather that you are new. When I deleted the category "Baptists" from Clay Aiken (multiple times as you put it in multiple times), it is because there is no evidence from the article or any of the citations of sources for that claim. Wikipedia strives for verifiability. Therefor, information which is known to an editor cannot just be added without citing the sources so that it may be checked. I understand that there are lots of "rumors" about Clay Aiken, but rumors aren't facts and those "rumors" tend to get deleted when someone wants to add them to his article. Hope you understand and if you'd like to edit Clay's article and add the sourcing for the religious affiliation claimed, that's what it's there for. Carlossuarez46 20:19, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
I'd not really looked at this before; I can see room for improvement, but on the whole it doesn't seem too bad to me. Your first point is reasonable — why not just edit it? The point about superstition seems to me to be couched in NPoV terms, though. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 18:16, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
I've filed a request for arbitration here. If it is accepted by the admins you can present your side of the dispute there. - mixvio 01:14, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
Jmh123, thanks for the kind comment. : ) I'm going to keep an eye on Chechypaw. I agree that it is better for someone not involved in a content dispute to do such reverts. I'm not sure what happened with the edits on Mixvio talk page? Looks like an editing mistake. Mixvio will probably notice something is different and check the history. He may fix it or leave it the way it is. PAW is challenging. It helps that I have a lot of other interests that I write about regularly. FloNight talk 16:27, 9 April 2006 (UTC)
It is only a violation, if he reverts a 4th time Agathoclea 10:37, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
We may not have heard the last of this as Otto4711 has asked for a deletion review. [1] - Maria202 20:06, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
Keep up the good work, SqueakBox 22:13, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
I see you have removed wellsourced text, the source and text meets the criteria for inclusion on wikipedia. Please restore the text and source. Nandaba Naota 23:56, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
Hey again,
Most importantly, I would just like to make clear I did not mean to come across as arrogant, and I apologize if I appeared that way. I understand how easily Wikipedians can get upset when newbies start trying to make drastic changes out of no where. Viper2k6 05:25, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
I thought I would shift this over to your talk page.
Anyways, thanks for your help in sourcing the Akebono article. It is just too important to be left blank. That was pretty cool that three people were able to just come together and do that. wikipedia power, i guess. XinJeisan 21:16, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
I just set up a proposal at Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals for a Sumo WikiProject. Please sign up. It is at 1.116. I don't know how to link directly to there! XinJeisan 16:54, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for your advice. I hope you decide to join up XinJeisan 20:40, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
Hello again, thanks for giving me a heads up when proposing new content ... that is kinda a lot of citations to skim through. Next time I'll give specific sources and outline the info that I feel is important. Viper2k6 17:53, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
No, you misunderstand. For Wikipe-tan to be "a lolicon" would mean that she had a sexual interest in girls under the age of consent. Read the article, there are a couple different meanings for the word. I don't think describing it as "a lolicon image of Wikipe-tan" makes much sense either, since at most it's an ecchi image. -- tjstrf talk 22:52, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
Thank you so much for stepping in at Talk:Pro-pedophile activism. I really had no idea what I had gotten into. I was very surprised by Squeakbox and DPeterson's accusations of "trolling" and such. I will remember this in the future and do a better job at educating myself of an article's history before commenting, for my own sake.
I do think that it would have been better if one of them had said, "you know what, I haven't seen you here before, so you probably don't know this, but there is a long history of dispute here, and we actually have many good reasons for wanting this template here. Sometime in the next few days I will put together a short list of the main problems, so people, like you, who are new and who see the template will understand that there is a history here."
Anyway, I really appreciate you sticking up for me. I am glad that you pointed out that I am not associated with the problematic group in question. I feel very grateful, thank you. Joie de Vivre 03:45, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
hello. if possible, please comment on the issue being "discussed" at child sexual abuse. i have presented evidence that dpeterson's reasoning is flawed and he has ignored my arguments. an evaluation from someone who seems to be actually interested in editing constuctively would be cool. ~[[ kinda]] 23:01, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
The lolicon debate has been reopened, I have put a note to said effect at AN/I, SqueakBox 23:50, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
WP:IDONTLIKEIT is a counter for arguments where no reason is given except that you don't personally like something, despite there being apparent benefits to it.
User:A - This change will make improvements in the following 3 ways, X, Y, and Z! We should do this! User:B - No, I think it sucks.
Similarly, WP:ILIKEIT is for "arguments" like this, where rather than saying something is wrong because it violates policy you just say that you personally dislike it.
User:A - This article violates the following 3 policies and should be deleted! User:B - But it's cool!
In the case you are speaking of, the reason for using the new image over the old one, and the reason the new image existed in the first place, was that it was an aesthetic improvement. In other words, it looked better while presenting the same content.
While looking better obviously would not be a reason to do something if it violated policies, when choosing between two things that are both of equal standing in other ways, one looking better is a valid reason.
So in other words, my comment towards Tony was that he had cited no reason for thinking the image was inappropriate, simply said that he thought it was.
Finally, I removed the conversation dump from my talk page. I'm not sure what that was there for. If you were trying to remind me of what I said, it's normal to use diff links if you want to discuss a specific change a user made, not paste in the entire conversation. -- tjstrf talk 00:24, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
Thanks very much for your note on my talk page. If you and some of the others need a hand in getting consensus around rewrites, let me know. It would be a very good thing to have well-written and -sourced articles on child abuse topics. I do wonder, however; can such articles, once completed, be guarded in any way from the vandalism that will inevitably result? I do not know what options may exist in this situation. If such protections do exist, the work is certainly valuable and worth every effort. Best, ZeroZ 11:03, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
OK. I killed the catagories, otherwise they will pick up my sub page. Maria202 17:36, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
First off, I'd like to again apologize if I've upset you or acted in a way that was rude. That was not my intention... I am wondering if it is nearing time to file an RfC regarding editor 00a00a0aa ? Regards DPeterson talk 19:06, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
Maybe you could ask David Finkelhor. He is definitely the most significant child sexual abuse researcher, and since he has an agenda (contra to that of pro-pedophile activists) he might be motivated to contribute to a wikipedia article on this. He has written criticisms of studies used by pro-pedophile activists before. His email is david.finkelhor@unh.edu ~[[ kinda]] 21:01, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
I did a revert of Monotonehell and Slakr, but retained your edits adding references to the Effects section. Cheers, ZeroZ 08:07, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
Regarding your edit, [3] I wonder if you would take another look. The language of criterion A says:
A. Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving sexual activity with a prepubescent child or children (generally age 13 years or younger) [4]
I believe the 6-month period applies to "behaviors" as well; otherwise there would be a conjuction and no comma between "sexually arousing fantasies" and "sexual urges", above. It would look like this: Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies or sexual urges, or behaviors ...
But the language places all three ("fantasies, urges, or behaviors") equally under the qualification "over a period of at least 6 months". I also asked a psychiatrist colleague, who agrees, but I would prefer if you checked for yourself. Cheers, ZeroZ 09:51, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
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Could you please look at the Rosie O'Donnell entry? I found that an untruth had been inserted there regarding Clay Aiken ("he has never said if he was gay or not"), so I rephrased and included a source, Rolling Stone. I included a quote from the Rolling Stone interview in the edit notes ("...either you're a womanizer or you've got to be gay. Since I'm neither one of those...."), but my change was removed today and replaced with the old statement. What he said on GMA & Larry King was that he was tired of answering because people are going to believe what they want to believe anyway, but that point went right over most people's heads. Normally reliable sources did report at that time that "he has never said if he was gay or not," but those reliable sources were incorrect. I could list multiple sources for statements that he has made in the past that he is not gay, but it's really beside the point to this section in O'Donnell to get into all that. Hope you can help. Thanks. - Jmh123 14:48, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
(no indent for better format of response) Thanks. Note that at the end of page 2 of the Rolling Stone link it states, (Excerpted from RS 926, July 10, 2003). This excerpt is not the full article. Nonetheless, Rolling Stone is a reliable source and is freely available in libraries and in full text online archives. The full context is:
"Some people, for example, seem to think that because he is slender, has long, fluttering eyelashes, and currently doesn't have a girlfriend, he must be gay. Indeed, after Aiken somewhat awkwardly tossed the first pitch at a Durham Bulls minor-league baseball game, dreadful comic Jimmy Kimmel felt called upon to tell his talk show's audience, "But that's OK, folks, because Clay's a catcher, not a pitcher." Even so, this kind of stuff seems to amuse Aiken more than it upsets him.
"One thing I've found of people in the public eye," Aiken says, "either you're a womanizer or you've got to be gay. Since I'm neither one of those, people are completely concerned about me. They're like, What are you, then?' I'm sure it has to do with being raised by women. I wouldn't want somebody gawking at my mom and grabbing her butt and catcalling at her, trying to hook up with her at a bar. I'm not saying I'm not going to look. Hello! But you know what I mean?"
Another reference, also not available on line, is the Prime Time Live interview with Diane Sawyer, 10/09/03,
Diane: In Rolling Stone he hinted he's a virgin and denied what's asked him over and over again. Is he gay? He says no.... "I think it's high time there's somebody who represents people who aren't gay, but doesn't sleep around with everybody...you know. If I'm supposed to carry the banner for all the nerds in the world I'm fine with that, too, so...."
There are other sources from that time period (Star, J-14), none on line, which seem to be derivative of one of these two sources, as well as several interviews in 2004 during the Independent Tour promotion, all in "for pay only" newspaper archives.
I did not ask that mention of controversy over Aiken's orientation be removed, only the incorrect statement that "he has never stated whether he is homosexual or not." The link to the GMA interview, cited as a source for this statement actually says the opposite, "Aiken said he protested similar rumors a few years ago because he was naive. 'I walked out of that 'American Idol' door after being sequestered in a house for 16 weeks into the real world,' he said. '[The rumor] surprised me I guess a little bit. … It's, apparently, fascinating to everyone.' " It's not online anymore either, by the way, but You can read it here
[6]. -
Jmh123
17:22, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
Hi, not sure why any reference to Clay Aiken's sexuality need to be expunged when the article clearly stated his denial of talking about it and no proof has been presented showing evidence of him being gay. And if it did? Who cares? The section is about perceived homophobia which can happen to strait people who are simply perceived as being gay whether the person making that judgment is correct or not isn't the point. I've further softened the language to read "Although some have speculated or joked that Aiken is gay[44] he has steadfastly refused to discuss his sexuality stating "What I do in my private life is nobody's business anymore."[45]" I hope this further revision is acceptable. Benjiboi 06:12, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
(moved from my page)
Well that is sad. I do believe that in such a situation a locked lack of consensus is not a reason to do nothing, that would have been fine if there had been only opposition to the move but givenn some people wanted it and others didnt isnt a reason to stay with those who didnt want the move. Far from harming the project I think merging articles helps make for a better project in almost all cases (certainly not just paedophilia cases) and do believe that having the 3 articles in one place will help improve all 3 articles. I would also say that Jim Burton's creation of the anti pedophile activism article was POV based and much more harmful to the project than the recent merge but was att he root of it. Anyway, best wishes, SqueakBox 17:53, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Mass_redirects_with_no_consensus Thanks.-- Flamgirlant 23:06, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
A compelling argument has been made to re-visit the article on Tory Mason for the purposes of deletion. The argument is listed on the talk page there, under Editing and prod tag rationale. The last time the article was up for AfD, back in January, it was decided to keep it, with twelve saying delete and five saying keep -- hardly a consensus and seemingly irregular. The article is stuffed with irrelevancy and is little more than a string of citations of porn websites, all cited to make the subject look notable. The actor simply has done nothing noteworthy. A prod tag has been restored after being deleted by an editor; a challenge has been issued to that editor and any dissenting editors to keep the prod tag in place and allow the deletion process to proceed again. Please consider re-nominating the article yourself for AfD (as I am unable to) should the editors decline the challenge. I don't think the article will survive with the argument listed there, assuming the delete process is allowed to run its course. Any assistance you can render will be appreciated. Thank you. 72.76.78.30 14:06, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
What you are doing is blatant censorship. I have not reverted it three times in 24hrs. You are trying to erase a record of the discussion, what is this Nineteen Eighty-Four ???? WacoJacko 09:29, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
"Individual is not notable, article is unsourced" is not a criterion for speedy deletion. I have removed your tag. Picaroon (Talk) 20:54, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, I meant to leave you a note telling you to see the talk page. I felt like we needed to discuss what to do with that section you removed before simply deleting it. Sorry for the confusion. Mike D78 22:09, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
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