I doubt that NYC is the worlds financial capital. Consider e.g. that London dominates trading in foreign exchange and metals, eurobonds and European equities.
Well, if Hendrix covered those other songs, someone should tell Dylan about it--he commented once that he found it odd that Hendrix covered only one of them, since they agreed on so much.
On further thought, he may have said that before the "new" Hendrix albums came out--whasn't "watchtower" the only Dylan song on Hendrix' original three studio albums (and, well, I guess we could include Band of Gypsys also)? --KQ
Hello there, welcome to the 'pedia! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. If you need any questions answered about the project then check out Wikipedia:Help or add a question to the Village pump. Cheers! -- maveric149
Nice image of Philip of Macedon. Thanks! Tbarron 21:51 Dec 31, 2002 (UTC)
That sounds a little defensive, as an edit summary. Are you having problems with people editing your changes without good reason? Martin 21:13 18 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Could you take a look at the Race article? An anon user is making some changes you may not like. -- mav
Hi JDG, Any news on the copyright status of that Sperm Whale image? Thanks, Pete 13:02, 25 Sep 2003 (UTC)
On Five Points .... from The Perils of Prosperity, by William E. Leuchtenburg, we have
But I'll modify the article slightly. Change it if need be -- I'm not a New Yorker, and am a bit out of my domain here. -- user:dino
Why did you revert my edit? All I did was combine two sentence fragments and tidy the disambiguation block. -- mav 04:42, 28 Nov 2003 (UTC)
On the Race:Talk page, you wrote: "I don't understand why you consider this as necessarily so damaging to the concept of human subgroups summarized by terms (race, sub-type, ethnic group, whatever)."
That you now realize you don't understand what I've been saying is definitely a sign of progress! It leads me to hope that you will take the opportunity to re-examine your previous interpretations. (It's as though at some point, you started "seeing red" rather than seeing what was actually being written.)
Your first remarks on my edits were fairly complimentary in several respects, so I invite you to reconsider your later less complimentary remarks. In fact, since the "Talk" page seems to be freely editable, please consider erasing the unnecessary insinuations etc. Peak 04:23, 2 Dec 2003 (UTC)
(Moved from main user page) JDG:
Thanks for your comment about NYC. I had not read the NYC article. I simply feel that many nations are their-own-nation-centric and that is it not at all clear to me that the claim that NYC is the financial capital of the world will withstand examination. Being a brit and having lived in Tokyo, London and NYC I know that London has a depth and breadth that is staggering eg it dominates European equity trading and international f/x (foreign exchange trading. I don't know where the various figures that would bear on an accurate comparison might be found. Any analysis would have to be multi-faceted eg comparing f/x, eurobonds, insurance (eg Lloyds),banking, equities and total numbers of people employed in financial services.
Thanks for working on and improving the temp version of the Shroud article. I think it's now getting reasonable, and as I said, I won't stand in the way of a FAC nomination unless anything major changes.-- Eloquence *
The issue isn't whether McCrone's conclusion is the definitive word on the subject. The issue is whether there's any support for your assertion that the "majority consensus" is that McCrone was wrong. What I see from the college newspaper article is: (1) Olin disagrees with McCrone. She "conducted her analysis with the Smithsonian Institution" but this article doesn't mention the "team" or the "crew" (your terms). At any rate, even if several people collaborated, I don't think it would be accurate to count one study as establishing "the majority consensus" just because several people worked on the study. (2) Tully says Olin's work is strong evidence but isn't conclusive. (3) Clark agrees with McCrone.
On that record, I don't think it's incumbent upon me to find some additional authority backing McCrone. The available evidence just doesn't support any claim of "consensus". The article's summary of the Vinland Map dispute is accurate as it stands: "As was the case with the Shroud of Turin, other scientists were involved in studying this object, and some of them reached conclusions that differed from McCrone's." JamesMLane 01:17, 22 Sep 2004 (UTC)
I appreciate your supportive comments concerning the discussion of this article. Belive it or not, I have never been more frustrated. I know you and I have had our differences but I never doubted your knowledge or intentions. I must say, I just don't know what to do any more.
For what it is worth I'd be happy to know what you thought of the article itself, Slrubenstein
Thanks for your comment on my page! Your encouragement means a lot to me, especially now, Slrubenstein ANd thanks for your honest and aposit comment on the article talk page! The contrast between their attitude and yours really reveals very starkly what is at stake in terms of wikipedia community and process. Slrubenstein
JDG;
Slrubenstein has said he will not further discuss compromise unless others are involved. Would you care to read or comment on Talk:Cultural and historical background of Jesus#Compromise discussion? - Amgine 20:19, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Sunday, Sunday, Sunday! Come to NYC... +sj +
Hi, I've started a drive to get users to multi-license all of their contributions that they've made to either (1) all U.S. state, county, and city articles or (2) all articles, using the Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike (CC-by-sa) v1.0 and v2.0 Licenses or into the public domain if they prefer. The CC-by-sa license is a true free documentation license that is similar to Wikipedia's license, the GFDL, but it allows other projects, such as WikiTravel, to use our articles. Since you are among the top 2000 Wikipedians by edits, I was wondering if you would be willing to multi-license all of your contributions or at minimum those on the geographic articles. Over 90% of people asked have agreed. For More Information:
To allow us to track those users who muli-license their contributions, many users copy and paste the "{{DualLicenseWithCC-BySA-Dual}}" template into their user page, but there are other options at Template messages/User namespace. The following examples could also copied and pasted into your user page:
OR
Or if you wanted to place your work into the public domain, you could replace "{{DualLicenseWithCC-BySA-Dual}}" with "{{MultiLicensePD}}". If you only prefer using the GFDL, I would like to know that too. Please let me know what you think at my talk page. It's important to know either way so no one keeps asking. -- Ram-Man ( comment| talk)
I re-uploaded the image, this time including the {{PD-old-70}} to make it absolutely clear that it is out of copyright. Thanks. Mpolo 11:27, Dec 13, 2004 (UTC)
I've come across a couple of images that you uploaded from the Library of Congress and noted as "public domain" with a {{PD-USGov}} tag. Please be aware that much of what the Library of Congress holds is not in the public domain. See the Legal Notices page at the LOC for more information. Thanks for your contributions. Kbh3rd 03:29, 21 Jan 2005 (UTC)
Discussion moved to Image talk:Autorecessive tay sachs.gif#Copyright.
What's wrong with your edits to FAC page? It looked OK to me. One thought: make sure your refresh your cache to see the changes on this page. Leave me a message at User Talk:Vaoverland if you still need help after doing this, and please give me some details about what is wrong. I'll try to help. Vaoverland 08:35, Mar 24, 2005 (UTC)
They look OK now. That refresh thing on this particular WP page throws me off. I thought it might have zapped you too. My Carl G. Fisher just made FA tonight, so I am happy. Glad you got it straight. Mark in Richmond. Vaoverland 09:11, Mar 24, 2005 (UTC)
My family was originally from Hoboken, and oddly enough I wrote the very short article on John Jay Gould I, the son of Jay Gould. John Jay Gould III is connected to me by marriage. He married into the O'Malleys, the same ones that owned the Brooklyn Dodgers. -- Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) 02:07, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Please talk about the change rather than forcing your views. Go to User talk:Violetriga/statusdevelopment or Template talk:featured and discuss your objection. It is very easy to change the text (which I believe is an improvement) and the new style works better when coupled with other relevant templates. I've reverted once again and will see any further enforcement of your viewpoint as bullish and a bad faith edit. violet/riga (t) 10:10, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I'm really not very happy with you trying to threaten action against me - that is not the way in which I would expect people to react to an attempt at improving something. I suggest you tone it down somewhat: "you still have a chance to avoid discipline" is not something you should be saying to someone making good faith edits.
I am fully aware of the 3RR (as you clearly were not) and know about gaining consensus. I also know about wikipedia:be bold. I do not need consensus to alter a template such as that. This project is supposed to be collaborative - your edits have been negative and not worked towards a solution. If you don't like something about a change that's been made then you shouldn't unilaterally revert it but update it to your personal suggestion or discuss it with the person that made the change.
You and one other person reverted the changes. RoyBoy asked (in a much better approach) why I'd made the changes. If you looked at User talk:Violetriga/statusdevelopment you will note that there were positive comments about the idea and I therefore decided to implement. You seem to think you are representing the masses when I'm afraid you certainly are not. You said "ask people what they don't like about your version", well I have and it's been liked by many - if you allowed it to remain in my suggested version it would be easier to get feedback and work towards a compromise. violet/riga (t) 12:24, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I support you wholeheartedly JDG. It's a pity to see Violetriga causing trouble for yet another good faith and conscientious user. It is not on to accuse you of bad faith when you clearly take time to provide a long reasoned answer to all points thrown out without thought to you. " I expect you to follow proper wikiquette" ... this is just not on. Rather you are correct in saying she needs to "hold up the mirror". This admin is a totally overbearing editor who takes up so much time on trouble caused by her attitude to reasonable editors. She started a talk page for me when I clearly left it red/uncreated as I do not want the time and trouble of maintaining a talk page. Yet she deletes as a "right" other people's contributions and always wrongly marks them as "minor" edits. I, as you also say, do not want to waste time in this way. I want to edit in the little time I wish to spend here.
I filed a RfComment page about her. It was deleted without a "speedy delete" warning template added and without the simple explanation expected in such cases so that it is not even listed on the Deletion log. Other people take the small trouble to do that so why not the deleter of my RfC page? I "wonder" who deleted it. Here is a partial copy (but it is missing the evidence I attached, and was attaching...it takes time, on the full deleted version). If you start a new RfC I will support it. Kreen
First of all, thank you for your kind words, JDG. But looking at this discussion, I think both of you should calm down a bit first before you continue to discuss. JDG, why don't you add your opinion to User talk:Violetriga/statusdevelopment, stating why you don't like the idea of him/her. At that page, pretty much all comments are positive, so I can understand that he/she was bold and changed the templates accordingly. If you object to the change, it would be best to add your arguments calmly to his/her subpage, where the discussion should take place.
As far as I understand this issue, you simply don't like the design of the new template. As you said, that's of course subjective, but that's also not the main point of the change. The point is to have some standard for all these talk-page templates we have, so they don't look more or less random anymore. You can see some examples at Violetriga's subpage. So, do you object to the idea as well, or just the realization of the idea (the design)? If it is just the latter, then maybe we could hold a contest for the best design for the new idea or something like that. -- Conti| ✉ 18:51, Apr 11, 2005 (UTC)
I like Violet's idea. Do you think it's a good idea to hold a poll/vote over the idea and if it passes have a design contest? This way both Violet and JDG get what they want. Overall look would be more consistent and JDG could suggest another look. And not in the least, we'd have a wider consensus. Mgm| (talk) 19:58, Apr 11, 2005 (UTC)
I still feel I'm right, but I'll step back and work for the Wikipedia:Template standardisation system. I hate revert wars (counter-productive) and still stand by everything I've done, but we're both too sure it our views for this. violet/riga (t) 12:36, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I protest this person's repeated attempts to start trouble. Please note that half an hour after I wrote "my first edit was to comment on Violetriga's editing style, having seen it on pages I was interested in, they've given me little time for much else, if I am to answer their comments. I don't intend to spend much online time here, just a little." she again tries to stir up trouble. "You may check the contributions by Kreen to see that the account is indeed created to cause trouble for me." Not true. I found pages I was interested in, I saw that she was trouble, I checked and saw it was habitual for her to behave this way. I drew it to editor's attention. Any sensible person knows that someone could read a site for years before they decide to contribute, as I have done. "look at any of my 7000+ contributions you'll not that I have been in very few disputes. I hope you realise my good intentions," Again not true. Most editors do act in good faith, hence her standing out. I stand by my previous comments, and point out that I expect her to continue to try riling up trouble. If not with me then with users in general. After all what else is she doing in this case with JDG. It is her standard editing to rile people up. She must have her way in everything. Kreen
For your information: After nearly two weeks of the competition to make talk page templates more consistent the template standardisation vote has begun. Voting ends on 1 May 2005. violet/riga (t) 23:56, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I wasn't the one that added the material. I just saw your edit summary "Remove references to current instruments of choice.Muddies up the main point: his live act is going strong but his lasting fame will be as songwriter)" and looked at the diff. Basically you removed information because you didn't think it fit with what you wanted it to say. I don't even know if the information is correct, but if it is, figure out a way to work it in and correct the grammar, don't remove it because you don't like what it says. That is what it seemed like you did, so I added it back. That's all, no biggie. - Taxman 02:57, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)
Just thought I would drop you a line to let you know that I implemented the images fixes that you recommended. You were absolutely right, and I think that the changes brought about a big improvement. – Clockwork Soul 05:35, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Would you care to register an opinon on the Masturbation Talk page as to whether a full color photograph of male masturbation is suitable for that page? Thank you. Force10 21:58, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)
You lately wrote to a person living in Switzerland:
Really this is a pretty offensive form of ethnocentrism or cultural bigotry. Because your fallen country allows this stuff in supermarkets all the rest of us should follow suit.
As an administrator, I must remind you that ad hominem attacks, including and especially attacks on another user's country or ethnic origin, are prohibited on Wikipedia. Please keep your arguments to the point instead of making broad judgments of value on entire peoples or countries.
There are plenty of arguments that can be made on the question you're discussing without having to insult Switzerland or whatever country. Such kind of nationalistic arguments are rude, don't contribute anything, and only make everybody more irate. David.Monniaux 10:24, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
I did not know the country he referred to was Switzerland. Then how come did you pass a judgment calling his country "fallen" without even knowing which country it was?
He and another user had already specifically "insulted" my country (saying its emphasis on "morality" was fake and cheap). Neither the words fake or cheap appear on this page. I read Rama's comments, and he just pointed out that the moral positions of the so-called "moral majority" of the United States are not much shared in other developed countries, and that trying to impose them on others showed US-centrism.
I do not see any moral judgment of value being passed on the United States. (I.e. calling a country "shitty", "fallen" or "detestable" is a moral judgment; discussing its morality is not a judgment of value.)
The term I used ("fallen"), while certainly not positive, is not really an emotional ad-hominem term. Yes, it is. ("Fallen angels" and all that.) It supposes that those countries are inferior in some moral ways.
I am getting sincerely weary of Administrators sticking their noses into small tussles like this. [...] Please learn this lesson and spread it among your fellow rookie Administrators I must say I'll decline to learn a lesson from irate and impolite contributors.
I'm personally sick and tired of people making broad attacks and judgments on other people's countries, "morality" or whatever. Such attacks are against official Wikipedia policy, and administrators have the duty to remind participants of those official policies.
Part of the function of Talk pages is to let editors blow off a little steam while they work toward consensus. Blowing a little steam is one thing. Writing derogatory stuff that is very likely to make people irate is another. This includes, for instance, people calling other people's countries "fallen", "immoral" or "decadent".
As for the "rookie": we obviously have different definitions of these words. David.Monniaux 16:59, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
I doubt that NYC is the worlds financial capital. Consider e.g. that London dominates trading in foreign exchange and metals, eurobonds and European equities.
Well, if Hendrix covered those other songs, someone should tell Dylan about it--he commented once that he found it odd that Hendrix covered only one of them, since they agreed on so much.
On further thought, he may have said that before the "new" Hendrix albums came out--whasn't "watchtower" the only Dylan song on Hendrix' original three studio albums (and, well, I guess we could include Band of Gypsys also)? --KQ
Hello there, welcome to the 'pedia! I hope you like the place and decide to stay. If you need any questions answered about the project then check out Wikipedia:Help or add a question to the Village pump. Cheers! -- maveric149
Nice image of Philip of Macedon. Thanks! Tbarron 21:51 Dec 31, 2002 (UTC)
That sounds a little defensive, as an edit summary. Are you having problems with people editing your changes without good reason? Martin 21:13 18 Jun 2003 (UTC)
Could you take a look at the Race article? An anon user is making some changes you may not like. -- mav
Hi JDG, Any news on the copyright status of that Sperm Whale image? Thanks, Pete 13:02, 25 Sep 2003 (UTC)
On Five Points .... from The Perils of Prosperity, by William E. Leuchtenburg, we have
But I'll modify the article slightly. Change it if need be -- I'm not a New Yorker, and am a bit out of my domain here. -- user:dino
Why did you revert my edit? All I did was combine two sentence fragments and tidy the disambiguation block. -- mav 04:42, 28 Nov 2003 (UTC)
On the Race:Talk page, you wrote: "I don't understand why you consider this as necessarily so damaging to the concept of human subgroups summarized by terms (race, sub-type, ethnic group, whatever)."
That you now realize you don't understand what I've been saying is definitely a sign of progress! It leads me to hope that you will take the opportunity to re-examine your previous interpretations. (It's as though at some point, you started "seeing red" rather than seeing what was actually being written.)
Your first remarks on my edits were fairly complimentary in several respects, so I invite you to reconsider your later less complimentary remarks. In fact, since the "Talk" page seems to be freely editable, please consider erasing the unnecessary insinuations etc. Peak 04:23, 2 Dec 2003 (UTC)
(Moved from main user page) JDG:
Thanks for your comment about NYC. I had not read the NYC article. I simply feel that many nations are their-own-nation-centric and that is it not at all clear to me that the claim that NYC is the financial capital of the world will withstand examination. Being a brit and having lived in Tokyo, London and NYC I know that London has a depth and breadth that is staggering eg it dominates European equity trading and international f/x (foreign exchange trading. I don't know where the various figures that would bear on an accurate comparison might be found. Any analysis would have to be multi-faceted eg comparing f/x, eurobonds, insurance (eg Lloyds),banking, equities and total numbers of people employed in financial services.
Thanks for working on and improving the temp version of the Shroud article. I think it's now getting reasonable, and as I said, I won't stand in the way of a FAC nomination unless anything major changes.-- Eloquence *
The issue isn't whether McCrone's conclusion is the definitive word on the subject. The issue is whether there's any support for your assertion that the "majority consensus" is that McCrone was wrong. What I see from the college newspaper article is: (1) Olin disagrees with McCrone. She "conducted her analysis with the Smithsonian Institution" but this article doesn't mention the "team" or the "crew" (your terms). At any rate, even if several people collaborated, I don't think it would be accurate to count one study as establishing "the majority consensus" just because several people worked on the study. (2) Tully says Olin's work is strong evidence but isn't conclusive. (3) Clark agrees with McCrone.
On that record, I don't think it's incumbent upon me to find some additional authority backing McCrone. The available evidence just doesn't support any claim of "consensus". The article's summary of the Vinland Map dispute is accurate as it stands: "As was the case with the Shroud of Turin, other scientists were involved in studying this object, and some of them reached conclusions that differed from McCrone's." JamesMLane 01:17, 22 Sep 2004 (UTC)
I appreciate your supportive comments concerning the discussion of this article. Belive it or not, I have never been more frustrated. I know you and I have had our differences but I never doubted your knowledge or intentions. I must say, I just don't know what to do any more.
For what it is worth I'd be happy to know what you thought of the article itself, Slrubenstein
Thanks for your comment on my page! Your encouragement means a lot to me, especially now, Slrubenstein ANd thanks for your honest and aposit comment on the article talk page! The contrast between their attitude and yours really reveals very starkly what is at stake in terms of wikipedia community and process. Slrubenstein
JDG;
Slrubenstein has said he will not further discuss compromise unless others are involved. Would you care to read or comment on Talk:Cultural and historical background of Jesus#Compromise discussion? - Amgine 20:19, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Sunday, Sunday, Sunday! Come to NYC... +sj +
Hi, I've started a drive to get users to multi-license all of their contributions that they've made to either (1) all U.S. state, county, and city articles or (2) all articles, using the Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike (CC-by-sa) v1.0 and v2.0 Licenses or into the public domain if they prefer. The CC-by-sa license is a true free documentation license that is similar to Wikipedia's license, the GFDL, but it allows other projects, such as WikiTravel, to use our articles. Since you are among the top 2000 Wikipedians by edits, I was wondering if you would be willing to multi-license all of your contributions or at minimum those on the geographic articles. Over 90% of people asked have agreed. For More Information:
To allow us to track those users who muli-license their contributions, many users copy and paste the "{{DualLicenseWithCC-BySA-Dual}}" template into their user page, but there are other options at Template messages/User namespace. The following examples could also copied and pasted into your user page:
OR
Or if you wanted to place your work into the public domain, you could replace "{{DualLicenseWithCC-BySA-Dual}}" with "{{MultiLicensePD}}". If you only prefer using the GFDL, I would like to know that too. Please let me know what you think at my talk page. It's important to know either way so no one keeps asking. -- Ram-Man ( comment| talk)
I re-uploaded the image, this time including the {{PD-old-70}} to make it absolutely clear that it is out of copyright. Thanks. Mpolo 11:27, Dec 13, 2004 (UTC)
I've come across a couple of images that you uploaded from the Library of Congress and noted as "public domain" with a {{PD-USGov}} tag. Please be aware that much of what the Library of Congress holds is not in the public domain. See the Legal Notices page at the LOC for more information. Thanks for your contributions. Kbh3rd 03:29, 21 Jan 2005 (UTC)
Discussion moved to Image talk:Autorecessive tay sachs.gif#Copyright.
What's wrong with your edits to FAC page? It looked OK to me. One thought: make sure your refresh your cache to see the changes on this page. Leave me a message at User Talk:Vaoverland if you still need help after doing this, and please give me some details about what is wrong. I'll try to help. Vaoverland 08:35, Mar 24, 2005 (UTC)
They look OK now. That refresh thing on this particular WP page throws me off. I thought it might have zapped you too. My Carl G. Fisher just made FA tonight, so I am happy. Glad you got it straight. Mark in Richmond. Vaoverland 09:11, Mar 24, 2005 (UTC)
My family was originally from Hoboken, and oddly enough I wrote the very short article on John Jay Gould I, the son of Jay Gould. John Jay Gould III is connected to me by marriage. He married into the O'Malleys, the same ones that owned the Brooklyn Dodgers. -- Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) 02:07, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Please talk about the change rather than forcing your views. Go to User talk:Violetriga/statusdevelopment or Template talk:featured and discuss your objection. It is very easy to change the text (which I believe is an improvement) and the new style works better when coupled with other relevant templates. I've reverted once again and will see any further enforcement of your viewpoint as bullish and a bad faith edit. violet/riga (t) 10:10, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I'm really not very happy with you trying to threaten action against me - that is not the way in which I would expect people to react to an attempt at improving something. I suggest you tone it down somewhat: "you still have a chance to avoid discipline" is not something you should be saying to someone making good faith edits.
I am fully aware of the 3RR (as you clearly were not) and know about gaining consensus. I also know about wikipedia:be bold. I do not need consensus to alter a template such as that. This project is supposed to be collaborative - your edits have been negative and not worked towards a solution. If you don't like something about a change that's been made then you shouldn't unilaterally revert it but update it to your personal suggestion or discuss it with the person that made the change.
You and one other person reverted the changes. RoyBoy asked (in a much better approach) why I'd made the changes. If you looked at User talk:Violetriga/statusdevelopment you will note that there were positive comments about the idea and I therefore decided to implement. You seem to think you are representing the masses when I'm afraid you certainly are not. You said "ask people what they don't like about your version", well I have and it's been liked by many - if you allowed it to remain in my suggested version it would be easier to get feedback and work towards a compromise. violet/riga (t) 12:24, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I support you wholeheartedly JDG. It's a pity to see Violetriga causing trouble for yet another good faith and conscientious user. It is not on to accuse you of bad faith when you clearly take time to provide a long reasoned answer to all points thrown out without thought to you. " I expect you to follow proper wikiquette" ... this is just not on. Rather you are correct in saying she needs to "hold up the mirror". This admin is a totally overbearing editor who takes up so much time on trouble caused by her attitude to reasonable editors. She started a talk page for me when I clearly left it red/uncreated as I do not want the time and trouble of maintaining a talk page. Yet she deletes as a "right" other people's contributions and always wrongly marks them as "minor" edits. I, as you also say, do not want to waste time in this way. I want to edit in the little time I wish to spend here.
I filed a RfComment page about her. It was deleted without a "speedy delete" warning template added and without the simple explanation expected in such cases so that it is not even listed on the Deletion log. Other people take the small trouble to do that so why not the deleter of my RfC page? I "wonder" who deleted it. Here is a partial copy (but it is missing the evidence I attached, and was attaching...it takes time, on the full deleted version). If you start a new RfC I will support it. Kreen
First of all, thank you for your kind words, JDG. But looking at this discussion, I think both of you should calm down a bit first before you continue to discuss. JDG, why don't you add your opinion to User talk:Violetriga/statusdevelopment, stating why you don't like the idea of him/her. At that page, pretty much all comments are positive, so I can understand that he/she was bold and changed the templates accordingly. If you object to the change, it would be best to add your arguments calmly to his/her subpage, where the discussion should take place.
As far as I understand this issue, you simply don't like the design of the new template. As you said, that's of course subjective, but that's also not the main point of the change. The point is to have some standard for all these talk-page templates we have, so they don't look more or less random anymore. You can see some examples at Violetriga's subpage. So, do you object to the idea as well, or just the realization of the idea (the design)? If it is just the latter, then maybe we could hold a contest for the best design for the new idea or something like that. -- Conti| ✉ 18:51, Apr 11, 2005 (UTC)
I like Violet's idea. Do you think it's a good idea to hold a poll/vote over the idea and if it passes have a design contest? This way both Violet and JDG get what they want. Overall look would be more consistent and JDG could suggest another look. And not in the least, we'd have a wider consensus. Mgm| (talk) 19:58, Apr 11, 2005 (UTC)
I still feel I'm right, but I'll step back and work for the Wikipedia:Template standardisation system. I hate revert wars (counter-productive) and still stand by everything I've done, but we're both too sure it our views for this. violet/riga (t) 12:36, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I protest this person's repeated attempts to start trouble. Please note that half an hour after I wrote "my first edit was to comment on Violetriga's editing style, having seen it on pages I was interested in, they've given me little time for much else, if I am to answer their comments. I don't intend to spend much online time here, just a little." she again tries to stir up trouble. "You may check the contributions by Kreen to see that the account is indeed created to cause trouble for me." Not true. I found pages I was interested in, I saw that she was trouble, I checked and saw it was habitual for her to behave this way. I drew it to editor's attention. Any sensible person knows that someone could read a site for years before they decide to contribute, as I have done. "look at any of my 7000+ contributions you'll not that I have been in very few disputes. I hope you realise my good intentions," Again not true. Most editors do act in good faith, hence her standing out. I stand by my previous comments, and point out that I expect her to continue to try riling up trouble. If not with me then with users in general. After all what else is she doing in this case with JDG. It is her standard editing to rile people up. She must have her way in everything. Kreen
For your information: After nearly two weeks of the competition to make talk page templates more consistent the template standardisation vote has begun. Voting ends on 1 May 2005. violet/riga (t) 23:56, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
I wasn't the one that added the material. I just saw your edit summary "Remove references to current instruments of choice.Muddies up the main point: his live act is going strong but his lasting fame will be as songwriter)" and looked at the diff. Basically you removed information because you didn't think it fit with what you wanted it to say. I don't even know if the information is correct, but if it is, figure out a way to work it in and correct the grammar, don't remove it because you don't like what it says. That is what it seemed like you did, so I added it back. That's all, no biggie. - Taxman 02:57, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)
Just thought I would drop you a line to let you know that I implemented the images fixes that you recommended. You were absolutely right, and I think that the changes brought about a big improvement. – Clockwork Soul 05:35, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Would you care to register an opinon on the Masturbation Talk page as to whether a full color photograph of male masturbation is suitable for that page? Thank you. Force10 21:58, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)
You lately wrote to a person living in Switzerland:
Really this is a pretty offensive form of ethnocentrism or cultural bigotry. Because your fallen country allows this stuff in supermarkets all the rest of us should follow suit.
As an administrator, I must remind you that ad hominem attacks, including and especially attacks on another user's country or ethnic origin, are prohibited on Wikipedia. Please keep your arguments to the point instead of making broad judgments of value on entire peoples or countries.
There are plenty of arguments that can be made on the question you're discussing without having to insult Switzerland or whatever country. Such kind of nationalistic arguments are rude, don't contribute anything, and only make everybody more irate. David.Monniaux 10:24, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
I did not know the country he referred to was Switzerland. Then how come did you pass a judgment calling his country "fallen" without even knowing which country it was?
He and another user had already specifically "insulted" my country (saying its emphasis on "morality" was fake and cheap). Neither the words fake or cheap appear on this page. I read Rama's comments, and he just pointed out that the moral positions of the so-called "moral majority" of the United States are not much shared in other developed countries, and that trying to impose them on others showed US-centrism.
I do not see any moral judgment of value being passed on the United States. (I.e. calling a country "shitty", "fallen" or "detestable" is a moral judgment; discussing its morality is not a judgment of value.)
The term I used ("fallen"), while certainly not positive, is not really an emotional ad-hominem term. Yes, it is. ("Fallen angels" and all that.) It supposes that those countries are inferior in some moral ways.
I am getting sincerely weary of Administrators sticking their noses into small tussles like this. [...] Please learn this lesson and spread it among your fellow rookie Administrators I must say I'll decline to learn a lesson from irate and impolite contributors.
I'm personally sick and tired of people making broad attacks and judgments on other people's countries, "morality" or whatever. Such attacks are against official Wikipedia policy, and administrators have the duty to remind participants of those official policies.
Part of the function of Talk pages is to let editors blow off a little steam while they work toward consensus. Blowing a little steam is one thing. Writing derogatory stuff that is very likely to make people irate is another. This includes, for instance, people calling other people's countries "fallen", "immoral" or "decadent".
As for the "rookie": we obviously have different definitions of these words. David.Monniaux 16:59, 2 May 2005 (UTC)