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![]() " Please do not feed the troll" |
I have a right to add that and it does not call for an occupation that is just your POV. File the formal complaint and cool heads will prevail. I would also like to point out you have a history of deleting other peoples contributions and legitmate comments on the talk page and I will point this out. I suggest you take a look at the rules. As an "Azari" I have the right to express myself. Now we are talking about expression and you are not allowed to threaten me on breaching any civil conduct when it comes to expression. 72.57.230.179
Thats good to know Grandmaster, I am glad -- - K a s h Talk | email 20:11, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
Instead, please provide some arguments in support of your pointless reverts, and don't remove references. If you disagree, prove your point, providing your own references. Test56 19:30, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
Frankly no I don't think it's appropriate. It's basically emphasizing one point of view which is discussed in the text. There isn't a single encyclopedia that renders an ethnic group in such a contentious manner. I sometimes grow weary of the edit wars, but it's completely useless information. There is a section to discuss the various origins of the Azeris including an Iranic background. A smart move would be to clean-up that section and add relevant info. about South Azerbaijan, but the editors who keep adding that stuff don't seem to be interested in constructive editing it seems. Tombseye 05:38, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi, thanks, I'm also looking forward to work in this project-- Hattusili 21:33, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi I know we have agreements and disagreements. But I do not think we want to make the article about Nizami Ganjavi about his ethnicity. All we are sure of is 100% Kurdish mother. Other than that, the Qom part is in some old manuscripts, and that is just a 'maybe'. I think you should ask your friend to stop, since this will get Iranians involved. Also to deny that Shirin is an Armenian (and note I do not like Armenian Dashnak party or any fascist organization), is also wrong and it could get Armenians involved. I would appreciate it if you guys can come up with an agreement so that other Iranians and even Armenians and Wikipedians are not involved. -- Ali doostzadeh 20:56, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi GM,
I changed it because our friend 72. wanted more Iranian Azeris in the pic, so I picked on I knew. We can change it if there are more objections, he just seems like an interesting guy to me. We can go Googooosh if people don't like it. — Khoikhoi 05:13, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi Grandmaster Thank you about your comment about Ordubad and I really appreciate it. I try not to be bias and your comments will be helpful. Although, as I am new here. I may have some mistakes in first efforts.
Anyway, I believe Ordubad is a Persian name. Because "bad" is a Persian name and you have no problem with it. The word "ordu" is used in either Azeri or Persian but may have a Persian origin. In Persian it also means camp or army. You can find this word in old Persian literature. I bring an example from an old Persian literature written by
Khwaju Kermani (1280- ?), a Persian sufi and poet from south of Iran. The existence of it in old Iranian texts may indicate the Persian origin of this word and in my idea Azeris probably adopted it from Persian.
خوشا چشمي که بيند روي ترکان
خنک بادي که آرد بوي ترکان
مي نوشين و نوشا نوش مستان
در اردو هاياهوي ترکان
دل شيرافکنان افتاده در دام
ز روبه بازي آهوي ترکان
The rough translation of the second line is:
Drink and enjoy drinking drunkenly, while beauties are chanting in the camp (ordu).
What is your idea? If, is that OK with you, I would like to add "Ordubad" again? Thanks,-- Behmod 17:38, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi, Yes, Nakhijevan (Nakhjavan in Persian) has a meaning in Persian(Nakh= String)+(Javan=young). But, you know that the name of Nakhichevan had been altered many times and we should see what was the original name to find the exact meaning of city.
About the ordu, I will try to find a Persian or Azeri linguistic and talk with him and get to a more scientific based conclusion about these subject (however since I am living in US, finding a Persian or an Azeri linguistic could be a hard job), but as a non-specialist in linguistic I can say that ordu has other different formats in Farsi like "orduzadan" means to camp. The fact that either Iranian or Turks used these word. But, we should see whichone adopted it from the other one. You said Farsi has 1200 Azeri word, but you know Azeris word with Iranian origins are much much more than these. I brought an example from old literature of Iran and also another format of this word, do you have an older reference in Turkish(it could help us to find the truth)? You know that Turkic nomads were living in northern borders of Iranian empires for about 2000 years and they adopted many words and traditions from Iranians which were in higher degree of civilization at the time. Moreover, about Kizil Ordu names we should be caution. Many names of tribes or ethnicity are given by other nations for example name of Ossetians ( your neighbours in Caucasus) were given by Greeks (I tried to find about the name origin and history of Kizil Ordu but I could not succeed up to now). Thanks, -- Behmod 22:59, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM, I am not argueing with you too. I just want to discover the factual accuracy whithout any prejudice. That's why I talked with your friend Saposcat and looking in Persian litrature. I did not write the name NakhJevan because I do not have enough information at the moment. Although current name looks like Farsi names but the current name has altered many times and original name may have Assyrian or Armenian origin. --Behmod 15:06, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
I checked different sources. Ordu in Persian means “group of people” and probably is just a homophone with Turkish term ordu, means "army". This word is a Indo-Eruoean and does not have Altaic origin. It has the same origin with heorde in old English, herde in German and Kheordu in P.Gmc and other terms in other Indo-European languages. Also, in Persian other than ordu words like “ordugah” and “orduzadan” are existed which are different formats of this word in Persian language. Ordu is not used as army and Persians have term “lashkar” means army.
I get to conclusion that Ordubad probably means a “town of many people“. Moreover, once I head from a Azeri linguistic who was familiar with Azeri and Persian and Pahlavi(old Persian) that the name of city in Pahlavi means “The City of justice”.
However, I do not have any plan to add any of above definitions to wikipedia at this time, except when I become sure about it or when I found a good citation.
P.S. It is just a friendly correction for you; when you find a common word in Persian and Russian, English, Germany and other Indo-European languages. It does not mean that they borrowed this word from each other necessary. In most cases it means that this word is a common Indo-European word. You may know that all these languages have the same origin. Do you know, what I am saying?
Cheers, --Behmod 09:09, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
Agree. You might like to add {{ primarysources}} too. I will watch the article. - FrancisTyers 14:17, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
"If you revert again, I will ask for administrator interference. Show me a source, not written by Iranians.)"
I am not going to revert, but your threatening comments are not appreciated. Wikipedia is not yours. It is not YOU who anyone needs to show anything. I suggest you take a break instead of posting comments such as above. -- K a s h Talk | email 20:45, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi. What's your take on this [3] [4]? See also this [5]? Pecher Talk 14:21, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
You don't need to revert every single edit I make. Sometimes discussions don't hurt. -- K a s h Talk | email 09:38, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
Ah, I see. When I saw the word "persecution" Menteshashvili's text, I immediately thought of fighting between Armenians and Azeris. For some reason, I didn't think of Stalin's possible involvement.
I apologize if I'm being partial on my recent edits. I certainly hope this does not bring animosity between both of us. You seem to be quite knowledgeable on the subject of Azeri-Armenian relations. I respect that.
Regards, Clevelander 11:22, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
Hi, you violated the three-revert rule on Azerbaijani people. I have disabled your editing permissions for 24 hours. Please read our guide on dispute resolution during the time you are unable to contribute to Wikipedia. Feel free to return after your block expires, but take your differences to the talk page and please refrain from edit warring. Kcordina Talk 16:15, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
The above block, placed by myself, was given incorrectly. I made a mistake counting the reverts. Kcordina Talk 11:07, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Hello GM. Yes, I see the article is in bad shape. I think this may be my next project (I was going to do Persians and History of Armenia, but perhaps they can wait a bit). I'll talk things through on the discussion page first and after the Iranian peoples and Watchmen (2 articles I want to see make it to featured article status), I'll start working on Azerbaijani people. Cheers. Tombseye 22:33, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM. No, what's disputed is the fact that Altaic is a valid language group, not that Azerbaijani is part of the Altaic group. Anyways, it's still being debated by linguists at the moment so we shouldn't say it's 100% sure for now. — Khoikhoi 05:28, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
I am willing to compromise on Nizami, but this means not just me , but Mr. Baguirov. I'll keep the Iranian side happy. I do not think though the Christianity and Armenianness of Shirin has been doubted by serious scholars. I think the best would be: 1) Kurdish mother 2) Fathers name, but no ethnicity 3) contribution to Persian language and culture, I am willing to go short on the Persian poet although it is found in many many books. This is so to reach an agreement. 4) Born in Ganjah and his heritage is shared by Iran and Azarbaijan. 5) We can mention that Shirin was a Christian (which she definitely was), but the Armenian-ness we will leave out. Of course this is one time compromise, and if it doesn't work out, then I will have to again show the proofs from different texts. -- Ali doostzadeh 13:49, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM. I don't know if you know, but I've been redoing Azeribaijani people quite a bit and I neede some help from you. Can you get pictures of regular Azeris that have no copyright problems that we could use on the page? It would help a lot as I whip it into shape in the next few days. I tried to keep whatever things were sourced and removed redundant and repeated information to provide clarity. anyway, let me know. Cheers. Tombseye 17:18, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
Took out the Lukashenko comparison as its subjective. I'll put in the info. you gave me as well as other stuff I've found. Thanks! Tombseye 20:50, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
This paragraph in Iranian peoples promotes racial purity. The article needs a careful and thorough review.
Moreover, the Iraqi Kurds are an eclectic Iranian people who, although displaying numerous ethnolinguistic ties to other Iranian peoples (particular in their Iranian language, and some cultural traits), are believed to have mixed with Caucasian and Semitic peoples, while the Iranian Kurds are of more pure Iranian stock. Heja Helweda 16:00, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM. I need some advice on the Azeri media, such as films and tv in the performance art section. It has to be brief, but to the point and relevant so can you tell me about some notable films and the broadcast situation etc. and which sites I can link as references? I would appreciate. Also, if you know of any Azeris in the Cinema of Iran that would help a lot as I know there are many azeris involved, but I don't know who as I just watch them because they get good critical reviews. Also, let me know as to current music scene of any suggestions as to what else I can. Thanks. Tombseye 19:41, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
Also some info on Azeri mass media.
The first Azeri newspaper was Ekinchi, published by Hasan Bay Zardabi since July 22, 1875. Recently, the government of Azerbaijan has decided to proclaim July 22 as the National Press Day. Molla Nasraddin was one of the most popular newspapers in Azerbaijan before the Russian revolution and remains influential to this day. See below two views, one Azeri, one Iranian. It's interesting that the article about cartoon in Iran refers to the magazine published in Baku in Azeri language, while Baku at the time was already a part of the Russian empire.
Molla Nasraddin - The Magazine
Caricature and Cartoon in Iran
With regard to the Azeri TV. This is the website of Azerbaijan state TV, but there are several private channels. [16]
The number of newspapers is impossible to count, there are hundreds of them, some are informative, some are just yellow press. The website of Ministry of communications, don’t know if it’s useful or not. [17]
The most famous Azeri cinema is Arshin mal alan, musical, based on the music by Uzeyir Hajibeyov. It has international recognition, but not in the West. But the popularity of this movie in Turkey, Iran, India and other countries of the world was tremendous. See more articles below. Maybe Ibragimbekov should be mentioned in the cinema section, as he’s the most famous Azeri cinematographer. Btw, www.azer.com is the best website about Azerbaijan, you can find information about everything related to Azerbaijan there, and it’s done very professionally. [18] [19] [20] [21] Grandmaster 18:54, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
I've tried unsuccessfully a couple of times, there really is not much I can do if (both sides) continue to just ignore me and spam the talk page with lengthy quotations. I suspect both sides have something to hide as I rarely got a straight answer to my questions. I would recommend you take this to RfC. I would be willing to try mediation again with the following conditions. Both sides nominate a representative (I'd hope you and Fadix as you seem to be the most sane), then we go through it on the talk page, with me deleting anything I think is irrelevant. But as you can see, I requested sources from both sides and the turn out was derisory. - FrancisTyers · 09:21, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
Hello GM. I added the Khazars as part of the invasion list and have left everything else as is. The article is now much longer than any other ethnic group article so I want to avoid any additions as people can click on Khazars and read their activity in the Caucasus anyway. Have also resolved the disputes hopefully. Now we'll see if the article can make it as a FA. Cheers. Tombseye 06:52, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
He's probably somebody, but there's not quite enough for me to do anything just yet. I'd recommend a request for checkuser for the time being. -- InShaneee 18:44, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
I think I uploaded a Soviet version. Apparently currently the coat of arms has a blue background and sea waves below (small version at http://www.window2baku.com/Index.htm in the upper right corner). Thoughts? -- Brand спойт 01:59, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
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You have been temporarily blocked for violation of the three-revert rule. Please feel free to return after the block expires, but also please make an effort to discuss your changes further in the future. |
Just a queston: are you a real chess GM? I myself love playing chess ... though I am not really a GM lol Do you have an ELO rating? A few years ago, when I had time to play "professionally" (in HH, Germany), I had an ELO rating of +/- 2050, my DWZ (German national rating system) being somewhere in between 1950 and 2100 ... not really "international class", but I was happy :) Maybe we could play some chess on Yahoo some time ;) Tājik 12:18, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
Hi GM,
Please look at the latest compromise and let me know what you think. Thanks. -- Ali doostzadeh 14:38, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
I have seen couple pages that summarize (one two parag) the 1918-1922 period between these states. Is there an single page, or even a page that collects the links for unknowledge user to helping within this period? I wish someone can create Armenian-Azəri war 1918-1922, such as Georgian-Armenian War 1918. What do you think?-- OttomanReference 22:30, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
Ah, I see. What do you think of my new pictures? — Khoikhoi 19:28, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM, what is the name of this mosque [24] and where is it? Was gonna add it to the Azeris page. Let me know. Thanks. Tombseye 05:33, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey Grandmaster, yes you can. Either try {{ Promophoto}} or {{ Promotional}}. I'm not sure which one. — Khoikhoi 21:26, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
Great new picture of Aziza. I think I'm in love. What is it with the chicks from the former Soviet Union that makes them so hot? Ah, that's a rhetorical question. ;) Tombseye 09:43, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
I removed the pictures for the time being. We can put them back once we've gotten an admin to help us with the Aziza picture and see what else we can do. For the time being, let's leave it as we want the article to make it to Featured Article status. We can worry about pictures after. Also, I've simply inserted brief mention of the Armenian Kingdom and left out the details because we can't really go into much since one person has already complained that the article is too long and I worked to shorten it considerably through restructuring the references. In addition, I simply put that parts of Azerbaijan were controlled by the Armenian kingdoms so that should suffice. I would suggest any detailed mention such as the Iranica reference to be put in both the Armenian Kingdom and History of azerbaijan articles though. Anyway, hopefully we'll get this article passed asap. Thanks! Tombseye 20:03, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
I will try my best, and as to "What is it with the chicks from the former Soviet Union that makes them so hot?" that question, I'd love to know the answer ^___^ - FrancisTyers · 07:56, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
This is a personal attack and very uncivil [ [27]]. Consider youself warned. Be polite and keep all comments directed towards edits. You have no right to make such accusations and additionally no grounds. I will let it pass as a warning and act in good faith and consider it an honest mistake on your part. Regards 69.196.164.190
You're probably right that the article has NPOV problems. Still, a very interesting article, and I hope to see it reach WP:FA. Twinxor t 07:17, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Whew, I'm glad that's over. Well, great news indeed as Azeris is a featured article. Now the only problem remains keeping it that way. Hopefully, your wikiproject can work on that. Well the other good thing is that we managed to put together an article that everyone could agree upon and I'm glad I could help to resolve the disputes that took place before my re-write of the article. Thanks for helping with the article and indeed just let me know when you need help and I'll do what I can. Cheers. Tombseye 18:39, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
As you seem to be an experianced editor, you do not need me to tell you what is civil and uncivil and what are acceptable forms of behaviour and what are unacceptable behaviour. Please stop your attacks and demaing me. I have warned you and Acted in good faith, but you contiNue you uncivil acusations. If you have concenerns go to an adMin, but you have no right to be uncivil And accuse me of being anti-Azari, especially without proof. Consider this your last warning from me. As you are already aware I have notified the admininStrators. After this I will just ignore you and report you for trolling. PlEase be civil. Regrads 69.196.164.190
This comment by you: [ [28]] was uncaled for uncivil.
As I have written on the talk page;
Please remain civil, we want civil discourse here. I am sorry that you are getting upset, but you do not need to address others in an aggressive tone. Your comments were not civil.Your statment: "You talk about the things you have no idea about," was not civil. Keep your comments directed to material or editing, not to individuals. I do not need to warn you as you already know the guide lines for orderly behaviour. I will overlook your uncivil comment and give you a warning. As for the issue; I am fully aware about the issue at hand, one can be excused for coming to the conclusion that maybe certain editors do not know what they are talking about in Wikipedia or maybe they do, but want edits in articles based on POV. In practice NKOA is not a part of the Republic of Azarbaijan (Arran). Once agains, if you want the introduction changed GM, you must demonstate that NKOA is not an independent state (in practice), please. Demonstrate it and the introduction will be changed. And please be civil about it. Thank you.
Regards. 69.196.164.190
Hi Grandmaster, can I ask you to take part in ongoing voting on Talk:Georgia (country)? The argument is to move Georgia (country) to Georgia and make it a search criterion. I will be very grateful if you can find time for it. All the best, -- Kober 09:45, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
Hi. I temporarily can't access my two e-mails at gmail and yandex so please write at togrulsafarov@yahoo.com or simply switch to my talk page. Regards, -- Brand спойт 21:35, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
Hello Grandmaster. I would like to inform you that i started a discussion about the theory, which everyone ignored (For reasons i dont know), so after waiting a day or two, i wrote down that if no one objected, i would assume that people agreed with me, and again i waited one more day just to make sure. then after that, i took action. if you would like to discuss the issue with me, we can here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Azerbaijani_people#The_Turkish_Theory
Thanks. Khosrow II 15:03, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
Hey man, have you finished with the timeline. i.e. does it include every event leading up to the creation of the NKAO that you find important? - FrancisTyers · 12:49, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
Hey man, please let me know what you think about:
The region became a source of dispute between Armenia and Azerbaijan when both countries gained independence in 1918. When the Bolsheviks took the region over two years later, they initially placed Nagorno-Karabakh under the control of Armenia, this was later reversed, and it was placed under the control of Azerbaijan. The Nagorno-Karabakh Autonomous Oblast was established in the Azerbaijan SSR in 1923.
As a reminder, we've been discussing this sentence for about 9 days now. I didn't think it could be done, but I think that "placed under the control of" is even more neutral than "granted" or "transferred". - FrancisTyers · 15:49, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
Hey, GM. I asked you this on the talk page, but you didn't get the note it seems. Anyway, could you give me the page number from the Potier book where that paragraph is specfically mentioned? Thanks! -- Clevelander 19:46, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
... is really getting anoying on the Azerbaijani people page. If he continues to mess up the article with poor and unnecessairy edits, we should at least consider reporting him as an alternative option. Tājik 13:26, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
Привет! Есть такой вопрос. Почему во многих статьях про Азербайджан азербайджанские имена транслитерируются на английский через русский (например: Muslim Magomayev a не Müslüm Maqomayev)? Ведь, скажем турецике имена передаются на английский язык со всеми дополнительными символами... -- Untifler 15:52, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Stop replying to Tabib. Please. If not, we might as well consider this mediation over. - FrancisTyers · 14:40, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
This person seems to be a north azeri, and he is continuously vandalizing the Tabriz rug article. He wont listen to reason, and since you are also azeri yourself i suggest you talk to him and calm him down. he is running on a thin line. It also seems that he as many different user names which he uses to vandalize several articles. I suggest you inform him that this isnt a place to be playing games. thanks. Khosrow II 15:54, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
I've blocked you and User:Eupator for 12 hours for edit warring. - FrancisTyers · 20:48, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
I'd consider lifting the ban if you'd agree to not revert and discuss on the talk page. For the remaining 10 hours or something. After all, bans are preventative not punative. - FrancisTyers · 21:51, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Yes I've noticed some changes all round. I'll take a look when I get the chance. I knew it couldn't last. No matter how well it's written or numerous sources used, people still decide to change the articles. Very frustrating. I'll see what I can do. ;) Tombseye 21:09, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM, I apologize for re-adding the Georgian prof to the Nakhichevn article and for "weaseling my way out" of providing sources. I should have also paid more attention to Adil's original note regarding the Georgian prof's quote. Anyway, I want to extend an olive branch to you, so that we can work together constructively on the Nakhichevan article. I also promise to cross-reference Walker's assertions and see if they are valid and I promise to do this before adding information such as this next time. Cheers! Your colleague, Clevelander 14:49, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Thanks a lot for your invitation. I've been thinking myself about joining for a while, however, I don't believe that I am ready to provide commitment to the project and by joining would only create room for potential misunderstandings and unsatisfied expectations. If you don't mind, I'd rather prefer to contribute on a non-regular basis, since I am short on time during most of the year except these few summer months.-- Mika 14:43, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
Hi There! Can you translate my name in what language you know please, and then post it Here. I would be very grateful if you do (if you know another language apart from English and the ones on my userpage please feel free to post it on) P.S. all th translations are in alpahbetical order so when you add one please put it in alpahbetical order according to the language. Thanks!!! Abdullah Geelah 16:39, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
I want some pictures from the Republic of Azarbaijan and feedback.
Is that alright?
Well different sources say different things on the subject. Britannica calls it a series of migrations [29]. Prof. Tadeusz Swietochowski (whose book I referenced on the Azeri page quite a bit) simply refers to the Turks as entering the region and merging with Iranians (he means Iranian Azerbaijan I believe) [30]. The US Library of Congress calls it an invasion [31]. So there you have it, quite a bit of diverse views. I believe simply saying entered the country is the most neutral way of putting it given the various terminology in use. Iranica (Azerbaijan-Islamic history page 228) simply refers to Alp Arslan take-over by defeating the Shaddadids. They set-up a feudal system in which Turkic overlords were given positions of power and who ruled the area and conducted a perpetual raids against the Armenians and Georgians (for being Christian it seems). So, in effect, ruling dynasties change hands. Once the Seljuqs overthrew the Arabs they simply took-over what they once ruled and then sent Turks (as well as voluntary migrants) to the region. Anyway, hope this helps. Tombseye 22:14, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
I outlined an objective yesterday (which I archived so you might not've seen it), that we discuss our changes on the history section BEFORE adding them. Both you and Tigran seem to have ignored this. Like it or not, the article looks like it's going to be protected soon. This would not be the worst thing as then we can discuss our changes with some civility and not engage in revert wars. -- Clevelander 11:21, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
Alright, looking back at this and my response, I think that I responded poorly at best (mostly because I was half-awake when I wrote my reply which was around 7:00 this morning here in the eastern United States). I didn't read your quote and I apologize for the confusion, etc. Truce? -- Clevelander 13:08, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
Hey Grandmaster. Because of our discussions a few weeks ago, I think you might be interested in this extract of the article "Saljuqs" from the Encyclopaedia of Islam:
"... We need not assume that the actual numbers of the Turkmens were very large, for the ways of life possible in the steppes meant that there were natural and environmental limitations on the numbers of the nomads. Yuri Bregel has implied, working from the 16,000 Oghuz mentioned by the Ghaznawid historian Bayhaki as present on the battle field of Dandankan (Tarikh-i Masudi, Tehran 1324/1945, 619), that we should probably assume, in this instance, a ratio of one fighting man to four other members of the family, yielding some 64,000 Turkmens moving into Khurasan at this time (Turko-Mongol influences in Central Asia, in R.L. Canfield (ed.), Turko-Persia in historical perspective, Cambridge 1991, 58 and n. 10). ..."
So, the Encyclopaedia of Islam estimates the total number of Oghuz Turcomans at the time of the Seljuqs to be less than 100.000 ... comparing this to the actualy population of Persia or the Islamic world (Baghdad had a population of 200.000 at that time), I would not call this a "mass migarion". And since only a part of these Turcomans actually followed the Seljuqs to Anatolia (many Turcomans satyed in Central-Asia and Khurasan, including the ancestors of modern Turkmens, Khorassani-Turks, or the - now - Persian-speaking Bayat, Afshar, or Qajar Turks, the actual number of Turcomans in Anatolia and Azerbaijan was not more than 20.000 (probably only 4-6.000 fighting men).
That's why the turkification of Anatolia began AFTER the fall of the Seljuqs. Anatolia - which was previously Roman-Christian - was almost depopulized after the attack of the Muslim-Seljuq forces; many Christians had fled to Europe. There were no native noble families left (unlike in Persia, Iraq, or Africa), and after the fall of the Seljuqs, power in Anatolia shifted to the only remaining "noble families": the Turcoman Beyliqs.
I hope this was helpful.
Tājik 13:46, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
Grandmaster could you upload some pictures of Nakhichevan (if you have any)? Thanks! -- Clevelander 18:18, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
Hey, great user page, congrats! ;) Kertenkelebek Ⓣ 08:02, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
GM, I want to make a deal with you. I'll promise that the Latin transliteration for the Armenian name of Nakhichevan will not be included in the Nakhichevan article (the Armenian translation will stay, as will the Russian, Turkish, and Persian translations). In return, I wish that you not include the Azeri translation for the name Zangezur (which I promise will remain on the page). Does this sound kosher? -- Clevelander 12:43, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
Please stop putting the tag on the controversy section of the Azerbaijani people article. The only thing you disputed was the name Arran being used, and i changed it so that the reader knows that other names were also applied, such as albania, armenia, georgia, shirvan, etc... what else are you disputing? Khosrow II 04:20, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
Hey Grandmaster, I was wondering if you saw the culture section that I posted on the Nakhichevan talk page. Be sure to give me your feedback. Thanks! -- Clevelander 11:23, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
istedim diyem saghol, chox saghol, azerbaijan haqqinda meqalelere gore
Hi there; I have removed the tag.-- Anthony.bradbury 22:08, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
I think that I got that variant as a result of a mis-translation of my reading Brockhaus - my Russian's a bit rusty. I'll cut that out. -- Clevelander 02:22, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for uploading Image:Govhar-Aga.jpg. I notice the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this file yourself, then there needs to be a justification explaining why we have the right to use it on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you did not create the file yourself, then you need to specify where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.
If the file also doesn't have a copyright tag, then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{ GFDL-self}} tag can be used to release it under the GFDL. If you believe the media meets the criteria at Wikipedia:Fair use, use a tag such as {{ Non-free fair use in|article name}} or one of the other tags listed at Wikipedia:Image copyright tags#Fair_use. See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.
If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their source and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Sherool (talk) 16:37, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
Hi, Grandmaster. At first, I should state that I could not find any dictionary entries for Caran D'ache. I think it's only a trade mark. So, I had to remove it. But I found a new word and I'm not sure about the etymology of it. The word is simply Burunduk, a kind of squirrel found mainly in North-East Europe and Siberia. To tell in Russian "Бурундук, азиатский бурундук (Eutamias sibiricus)". But I'm not sure about the origin of the word, it could be of Mari origin, or it could stem from Turkic languages. Could you help me find the definite etymology of the word? The English counterpart of the word is Borunduk or Baronduki. Istanbul'dan çok selamlar!
Vasmer's Etymological Dictionary - Burunduk
Chapultepec 00:55, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
How have you been? I recently created an article about İsgəndər Həmidov—you heard of him? If so, is there anything that you think should be added? — Khoikhoi 05:43, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
![]() | This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Archive 1 | Archive 2 | Archive 3 | Archive 4 | Archive 5 | → | Archive 8 |
![]() " Please do not feed the troll" |
I have a right to add that and it does not call for an occupation that is just your POV. File the formal complaint and cool heads will prevail. I would also like to point out you have a history of deleting other peoples contributions and legitmate comments on the talk page and I will point this out. I suggest you take a look at the rules. As an "Azari" I have the right to express myself. Now we are talking about expression and you are not allowed to threaten me on breaching any civil conduct when it comes to expression. 72.57.230.179
Thats good to know Grandmaster, I am glad -- - K a s h Talk | email 20:11, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
Instead, please provide some arguments in support of your pointless reverts, and don't remove references. If you disagree, prove your point, providing your own references. Test56 19:30, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
Frankly no I don't think it's appropriate. It's basically emphasizing one point of view which is discussed in the text. There isn't a single encyclopedia that renders an ethnic group in such a contentious manner. I sometimes grow weary of the edit wars, but it's completely useless information. There is a section to discuss the various origins of the Azeris including an Iranic background. A smart move would be to clean-up that section and add relevant info. about South Azerbaijan, but the editors who keep adding that stuff don't seem to be interested in constructive editing it seems. Tombseye 05:38, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi, thanks, I'm also looking forward to work in this project-- Hattusili 21:33, 22 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi I know we have agreements and disagreements. But I do not think we want to make the article about Nizami Ganjavi about his ethnicity. All we are sure of is 100% Kurdish mother. Other than that, the Qom part is in some old manuscripts, and that is just a 'maybe'. I think you should ask your friend to stop, since this will get Iranians involved. Also to deny that Shirin is an Armenian (and note I do not like Armenian Dashnak party or any fascist organization), is also wrong and it could get Armenians involved. I would appreciate it if you guys can come up with an agreement so that other Iranians and even Armenians and Wikipedians are not involved. -- Ali doostzadeh 20:56, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi GM,
I changed it because our friend 72. wanted more Iranian Azeris in the pic, so I picked on I knew. We can change it if there are more objections, he just seems like an interesting guy to me. We can go Googooosh if people don't like it. — Khoikhoi 05:13, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi Grandmaster Thank you about your comment about Ordubad and I really appreciate it. I try not to be bias and your comments will be helpful. Although, as I am new here. I may have some mistakes in first efforts.
Anyway, I believe Ordubad is a Persian name. Because "bad" is a Persian name and you have no problem with it. The word "ordu" is used in either Azeri or Persian but may have a Persian origin. In Persian it also means camp or army. You can find this word in old Persian literature. I bring an example from an old Persian literature written by
Khwaju Kermani (1280- ?), a Persian sufi and poet from south of Iran. The existence of it in old Iranian texts may indicate the Persian origin of this word and in my idea Azeris probably adopted it from Persian.
خوشا چشمي که بيند روي ترکان
خنک بادي که آرد بوي ترکان
مي نوشين و نوشا نوش مستان
در اردو هاياهوي ترکان
دل شيرافکنان افتاده در دام
ز روبه بازي آهوي ترکان
The rough translation of the second line is:
Drink and enjoy drinking drunkenly, while beauties are chanting in the camp (ordu).
What is your idea? If, is that OK with you, I would like to add "Ordubad" again? Thanks,-- Behmod 17:38, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi, Yes, Nakhijevan (Nakhjavan in Persian) has a meaning in Persian(Nakh= String)+(Javan=young). But, you know that the name of Nakhichevan had been altered many times and we should see what was the original name to find the exact meaning of city.
About the ordu, I will try to find a Persian or Azeri linguistic and talk with him and get to a more scientific based conclusion about these subject (however since I am living in US, finding a Persian or an Azeri linguistic could be a hard job), but as a non-specialist in linguistic I can say that ordu has other different formats in Farsi like "orduzadan" means to camp. The fact that either Iranian or Turks used these word. But, we should see whichone adopted it from the other one. You said Farsi has 1200 Azeri word, but you know Azeris word with Iranian origins are much much more than these. I brought an example from old literature of Iran and also another format of this word, do you have an older reference in Turkish(it could help us to find the truth)? You know that Turkic nomads were living in northern borders of Iranian empires for about 2000 years and they adopted many words and traditions from Iranians which were in higher degree of civilization at the time. Moreover, about Kizil Ordu names we should be caution. Many names of tribes or ethnicity are given by other nations for example name of Ossetians ( your neighbours in Caucasus) were given by Greeks (I tried to find about the name origin and history of Kizil Ordu but I could not succeed up to now). Thanks, -- Behmod 22:59, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM, I am not argueing with you too. I just want to discover the factual accuracy whithout any prejudice. That's why I talked with your friend Saposcat and looking in Persian litrature. I did not write the name NakhJevan because I do not have enough information at the moment. Although current name looks like Farsi names but the current name has altered many times and original name may have Assyrian or Armenian origin. --Behmod 15:06, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
I checked different sources. Ordu in Persian means “group of people” and probably is just a homophone with Turkish term ordu, means "army". This word is a Indo-Eruoean and does not have Altaic origin. It has the same origin with heorde in old English, herde in German and Kheordu in P.Gmc and other terms in other Indo-European languages. Also, in Persian other than ordu words like “ordugah” and “orduzadan” are existed which are different formats of this word in Persian language. Ordu is not used as army and Persians have term “lashkar” means army.
I get to conclusion that Ordubad probably means a “town of many people“. Moreover, once I head from a Azeri linguistic who was familiar with Azeri and Persian and Pahlavi(old Persian) that the name of city in Pahlavi means “The City of justice”.
However, I do not have any plan to add any of above definitions to wikipedia at this time, except when I become sure about it or when I found a good citation.
P.S. It is just a friendly correction for you; when you find a common word in Persian and Russian, English, Germany and other Indo-European languages. It does not mean that they borrowed this word from each other necessary. In most cases it means that this word is a common Indo-European word. You may know that all these languages have the same origin. Do you know, what I am saying?
Cheers, --Behmod 09:09, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
Agree. You might like to add {{ primarysources}} too. I will watch the article. - FrancisTyers 14:17, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
"If you revert again, I will ask for administrator interference. Show me a source, not written by Iranians.)"
I am not going to revert, but your threatening comments are not appreciated. Wikipedia is not yours. It is not YOU who anyone needs to show anything. I suggest you take a break instead of posting comments such as above. -- K a s h Talk | email 20:45, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
Hi. What's your take on this [3] [4]? See also this [5]? Pecher Talk 14:21, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
You don't need to revert every single edit I make. Sometimes discussions don't hurt. -- K a s h Talk | email 09:38, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
Ah, I see. When I saw the word "persecution" Menteshashvili's text, I immediately thought of fighting between Armenians and Azeris. For some reason, I didn't think of Stalin's possible involvement.
I apologize if I'm being partial on my recent edits. I certainly hope this does not bring animosity between both of us. You seem to be quite knowledgeable on the subject of Azeri-Armenian relations. I respect that.
Regards, Clevelander 11:22, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
Hi, you violated the three-revert rule on Azerbaijani people. I have disabled your editing permissions for 24 hours. Please read our guide on dispute resolution during the time you are unable to contribute to Wikipedia. Feel free to return after your block expires, but take your differences to the talk page and please refrain from edit warring. Kcordina Talk 16:15, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
The above block, placed by myself, was given incorrectly. I made a mistake counting the reverts. Kcordina Talk 11:07, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
Hello GM. Yes, I see the article is in bad shape. I think this may be my next project (I was going to do Persians and History of Armenia, but perhaps they can wait a bit). I'll talk things through on the discussion page first and after the Iranian peoples and Watchmen (2 articles I want to see make it to featured article status), I'll start working on Azerbaijani people. Cheers. Tombseye 22:33, 5 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM. No, what's disputed is the fact that Altaic is a valid language group, not that Azerbaijani is part of the Altaic group. Anyways, it's still being debated by linguists at the moment so we shouldn't say it's 100% sure for now. — Khoikhoi 05:28, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
I am willing to compromise on Nizami, but this means not just me , but Mr. Baguirov. I'll keep the Iranian side happy. I do not think though the Christianity and Armenianness of Shirin has been doubted by serious scholars. I think the best would be: 1) Kurdish mother 2) Fathers name, but no ethnicity 3) contribution to Persian language and culture, I am willing to go short on the Persian poet although it is found in many many books. This is so to reach an agreement. 4) Born in Ganjah and his heritage is shared by Iran and Azarbaijan. 5) We can mention that Shirin was a Christian (which she definitely was), but the Armenian-ness we will leave out. Of course this is one time compromise, and if it doesn't work out, then I will have to again show the proofs from different texts. -- Ali doostzadeh 13:49, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM. I don't know if you know, but I've been redoing Azeribaijani people quite a bit and I neede some help from you. Can you get pictures of regular Azeris that have no copyright problems that we could use on the page? It would help a lot as I whip it into shape in the next few days. I tried to keep whatever things were sourced and removed redundant and repeated information to provide clarity. anyway, let me know. Cheers. Tombseye 17:18, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
Took out the Lukashenko comparison as its subjective. I'll put in the info. you gave me as well as other stuff I've found. Thanks! Tombseye 20:50, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
This paragraph in Iranian peoples promotes racial purity. The article needs a careful and thorough review.
Moreover, the Iraqi Kurds are an eclectic Iranian people who, although displaying numerous ethnolinguistic ties to other Iranian peoples (particular in their Iranian language, and some cultural traits), are believed to have mixed with Caucasian and Semitic peoples, while the Iranian Kurds are of more pure Iranian stock. Heja Helweda 16:00, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM. I need some advice on the Azeri media, such as films and tv in the performance art section. It has to be brief, but to the point and relevant so can you tell me about some notable films and the broadcast situation etc. and which sites I can link as references? I would appreciate. Also, if you know of any Azeris in the Cinema of Iran that would help a lot as I know there are many azeris involved, but I don't know who as I just watch them because they get good critical reviews. Also, let me know as to current music scene of any suggestions as to what else I can. Thanks. Tombseye 19:41, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
Also some info on Azeri mass media.
The first Azeri newspaper was Ekinchi, published by Hasan Bay Zardabi since July 22, 1875. Recently, the government of Azerbaijan has decided to proclaim July 22 as the National Press Day. Molla Nasraddin was one of the most popular newspapers in Azerbaijan before the Russian revolution and remains influential to this day. See below two views, one Azeri, one Iranian. It's interesting that the article about cartoon in Iran refers to the magazine published in Baku in Azeri language, while Baku at the time was already a part of the Russian empire.
Molla Nasraddin - The Magazine
Caricature and Cartoon in Iran
With regard to the Azeri TV. This is the website of Azerbaijan state TV, but there are several private channels. [16]
The number of newspapers is impossible to count, there are hundreds of them, some are informative, some are just yellow press. The website of Ministry of communications, don’t know if it’s useful or not. [17]
The most famous Azeri cinema is Arshin mal alan, musical, based on the music by Uzeyir Hajibeyov. It has international recognition, but not in the West. But the popularity of this movie in Turkey, Iran, India and other countries of the world was tremendous. See more articles below. Maybe Ibragimbekov should be mentioned in the cinema section, as he’s the most famous Azeri cinematographer. Btw, www.azer.com is the best website about Azerbaijan, you can find information about everything related to Azerbaijan there, and it’s done very professionally. [18] [19] [20] [21] Grandmaster 18:54, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
I've tried unsuccessfully a couple of times, there really is not much I can do if (both sides) continue to just ignore me and spam the talk page with lengthy quotations. I suspect both sides have something to hide as I rarely got a straight answer to my questions. I would recommend you take this to RfC. I would be willing to try mediation again with the following conditions. Both sides nominate a representative (I'd hope you and Fadix as you seem to be the most sane), then we go through it on the talk page, with me deleting anything I think is irrelevant. But as you can see, I requested sources from both sides and the turn out was derisory. - FrancisTyers · 09:21, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
Hello GM. I added the Khazars as part of the invasion list and have left everything else as is. The article is now much longer than any other ethnic group article so I want to avoid any additions as people can click on Khazars and read their activity in the Caucasus anyway. Have also resolved the disputes hopefully. Now we'll see if the article can make it as a FA. Cheers. Tombseye 06:52, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
He's probably somebody, but there's not quite enough for me to do anything just yet. I'd recommend a request for checkuser for the time being. -- InShaneee 18:44, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
I think I uploaded a Soviet version. Apparently currently the coat of arms has a blue background and sea waves below (small version at http://www.window2baku.com/Index.htm in the upper right corner). Thoughts? -- Brand спойт 01:59, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
![]() |
You have been temporarily blocked for violation of the three-revert rule. Please feel free to return after the block expires, but also please make an effort to discuss your changes further in the future. |
Just a queston: are you a real chess GM? I myself love playing chess ... though I am not really a GM lol Do you have an ELO rating? A few years ago, when I had time to play "professionally" (in HH, Germany), I had an ELO rating of +/- 2050, my DWZ (German national rating system) being somewhere in between 1950 and 2100 ... not really "international class", but I was happy :) Maybe we could play some chess on Yahoo some time ;) Tājik 12:18, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
Hi GM,
Please look at the latest compromise and let me know what you think. Thanks. -- Ali doostzadeh 14:38, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
I have seen couple pages that summarize (one two parag) the 1918-1922 period between these states. Is there an single page, or even a page that collects the links for unknowledge user to helping within this period? I wish someone can create Armenian-Azəri war 1918-1922, such as Georgian-Armenian War 1918. What do you think?-- OttomanReference 22:30, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
Ah, I see. What do you think of my new pictures? — Khoikhoi 19:28, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM, what is the name of this mosque [24] and where is it? Was gonna add it to the Azeris page. Let me know. Thanks. Tombseye 05:33, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
Hey Grandmaster, yes you can. Either try {{ Promophoto}} or {{ Promotional}}. I'm not sure which one. — Khoikhoi 21:26, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
Great new picture of Aziza. I think I'm in love. What is it with the chicks from the former Soviet Union that makes them so hot? Ah, that's a rhetorical question. ;) Tombseye 09:43, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
I removed the pictures for the time being. We can put them back once we've gotten an admin to help us with the Aziza picture and see what else we can do. For the time being, let's leave it as we want the article to make it to Featured Article status. We can worry about pictures after. Also, I've simply inserted brief mention of the Armenian Kingdom and left out the details because we can't really go into much since one person has already complained that the article is too long and I worked to shorten it considerably through restructuring the references. In addition, I simply put that parts of Azerbaijan were controlled by the Armenian kingdoms so that should suffice. I would suggest any detailed mention such as the Iranica reference to be put in both the Armenian Kingdom and History of azerbaijan articles though. Anyway, hopefully we'll get this article passed asap. Thanks! Tombseye 20:03, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
I will try my best, and as to "What is it with the chicks from the former Soviet Union that makes them so hot?" that question, I'd love to know the answer ^___^ - FrancisTyers · 07:56, 23 June 2006 (UTC)
This is a personal attack and very uncivil [ [27]]. Consider youself warned. Be polite and keep all comments directed towards edits. You have no right to make such accusations and additionally no grounds. I will let it pass as a warning and act in good faith and consider it an honest mistake on your part. Regards 69.196.164.190
You're probably right that the article has NPOV problems. Still, a very interesting article, and I hope to see it reach WP:FA. Twinxor t 07:17, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Whew, I'm glad that's over. Well, great news indeed as Azeris is a featured article. Now the only problem remains keeping it that way. Hopefully, your wikiproject can work on that. Well the other good thing is that we managed to put together an article that everyone could agree upon and I'm glad I could help to resolve the disputes that took place before my re-write of the article. Thanks for helping with the article and indeed just let me know when you need help and I'll do what I can. Cheers. Tombseye 18:39, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
As you seem to be an experianced editor, you do not need me to tell you what is civil and uncivil and what are acceptable forms of behaviour and what are unacceptable behaviour. Please stop your attacks and demaing me. I have warned you and Acted in good faith, but you contiNue you uncivil acusations. If you have concenerns go to an adMin, but you have no right to be uncivil And accuse me of being anti-Azari, especially without proof. Consider this your last warning from me. As you are already aware I have notified the admininStrators. After this I will just ignore you and report you for trolling. PlEase be civil. Regrads 69.196.164.190
This comment by you: [ [28]] was uncaled for uncivil.
As I have written on the talk page;
Please remain civil, we want civil discourse here. I am sorry that you are getting upset, but you do not need to address others in an aggressive tone. Your comments were not civil.Your statment: "You talk about the things you have no idea about," was not civil. Keep your comments directed to material or editing, not to individuals. I do not need to warn you as you already know the guide lines for orderly behaviour. I will overlook your uncivil comment and give you a warning. As for the issue; I am fully aware about the issue at hand, one can be excused for coming to the conclusion that maybe certain editors do not know what they are talking about in Wikipedia or maybe they do, but want edits in articles based on POV. In practice NKOA is not a part of the Republic of Azarbaijan (Arran). Once agains, if you want the introduction changed GM, you must demonstate that NKOA is not an independent state (in practice), please. Demonstrate it and the introduction will be changed. And please be civil about it. Thank you.
Regards. 69.196.164.190
Hi Grandmaster, can I ask you to take part in ongoing voting on Talk:Georgia (country)? The argument is to move Georgia (country) to Georgia and make it a search criterion. I will be very grateful if you can find time for it. All the best, -- Kober 09:45, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
Hi. I temporarily can't access my two e-mails at gmail and yandex so please write at togrulsafarov@yahoo.com or simply switch to my talk page. Regards, -- Brand спойт 21:35, 8 July 2006 (UTC)
Hello Grandmaster. I would like to inform you that i started a discussion about the theory, which everyone ignored (For reasons i dont know), so after waiting a day or two, i wrote down that if no one objected, i would assume that people agreed with me, and again i waited one more day just to make sure. then after that, i took action. if you would like to discuss the issue with me, we can here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Azerbaijani_people#The_Turkish_Theory
Thanks. Khosrow II 15:03, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
Hey man, have you finished with the timeline. i.e. does it include every event leading up to the creation of the NKAO that you find important? - FrancisTyers · 12:49, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
Hey man, please let me know what you think about:
The region became a source of dispute between Armenia and Azerbaijan when both countries gained independence in 1918. When the Bolsheviks took the region over two years later, they initially placed Nagorno-Karabakh under the control of Armenia, this was later reversed, and it was placed under the control of Azerbaijan. The Nagorno-Karabakh Autonomous Oblast was established in the Azerbaijan SSR in 1923.
As a reminder, we've been discussing this sentence for about 9 days now. I didn't think it could be done, but I think that "placed under the control of" is even more neutral than "granted" or "transferred". - FrancisTyers · 15:49, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
Hey, GM. I asked you this on the talk page, but you didn't get the note it seems. Anyway, could you give me the page number from the Potier book where that paragraph is specfically mentioned? Thanks! -- Clevelander 19:46, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
... is really getting anoying on the Azerbaijani people page. If he continues to mess up the article with poor and unnecessairy edits, we should at least consider reporting him as an alternative option. Tājik 13:26, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
Привет! Есть такой вопрос. Почему во многих статьях про Азербайджан азербайджанские имена транслитерируются на английский через русский (например: Muslim Magomayev a не Müslüm Maqomayev)? Ведь, скажем турецике имена передаются на английский язык со всеми дополнительными символами... -- Untifler 15:52, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Stop replying to Tabib. Please. If not, we might as well consider this mediation over. - FrancisTyers · 14:40, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
This person seems to be a north azeri, and he is continuously vandalizing the Tabriz rug article. He wont listen to reason, and since you are also azeri yourself i suggest you talk to him and calm him down. he is running on a thin line. It also seems that he as many different user names which he uses to vandalize several articles. I suggest you inform him that this isnt a place to be playing games. thanks. Khosrow II 15:54, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
I've blocked you and User:Eupator for 12 hours for edit warring. - FrancisTyers · 20:48, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
I'd consider lifting the ban if you'd agree to not revert and discuss on the talk page. For the remaining 10 hours or something. After all, bans are preventative not punative. - FrancisTyers · 21:51, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Yes I've noticed some changes all round. I'll take a look when I get the chance. I knew it couldn't last. No matter how well it's written or numerous sources used, people still decide to change the articles. Very frustrating. I'll see what I can do. ;) Tombseye 21:09, 25 July 2006 (UTC)
Hey GM, I apologize for re-adding the Georgian prof to the Nakhichevn article and for "weaseling my way out" of providing sources. I should have also paid more attention to Adil's original note regarding the Georgian prof's quote. Anyway, I want to extend an olive branch to you, so that we can work together constructively on the Nakhichevan article. I also promise to cross-reference Walker's assertions and see if they are valid and I promise to do this before adding information such as this next time. Cheers! Your colleague, Clevelander 14:49, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Thanks a lot for your invitation. I've been thinking myself about joining for a while, however, I don't believe that I am ready to provide commitment to the project and by joining would only create room for potential misunderstandings and unsatisfied expectations. If you don't mind, I'd rather prefer to contribute on a non-regular basis, since I am short on time during most of the year except these few summer months.-- Mika 14:43, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
Hi There! Can you translate my name in what language you know please, and then post it Here. I would be very grateful if you do (if you know another language apart from English and the ones on my userpage please feel free to post it on) P.S. all th translations are in alpahbetical order so when you add one please put it in alpahbetical order according to the language. Thanks!!! Abdullah Geelah 16:39, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
I want some pictures from the Republic of Azarbaijan and feedback.
Is that alright?
Well different sources say different things on the subject. Britannica calls it a series of migrations [29]. Prof. Tadeusz Swietochowski (whose book I referenced on the Azeri page quite a bit) simply refers to the Turks as entering the region and merging with Iranians (he means Iranian Azerbaijan I believe) [30]. The US Library of Congress calls it an invasion [31]. So there you have it, quite a bit of diverse views. I believe simply saying entered the country is the most neutral way of putting it given the various terminology in use. Iranica (Azerbaijan-Islamic history page 228) simply refers to Alp Arslan take-over by defeating the Shaddadids. They set-up a feudal system in which Turkic overlords were given positions of power and who ruled the area and conducted a perpetual raids against the Armenians and Georgians (for being Christian it seems). So, in effect, ruling dynasties change hands. Once the Seljuqs overthrew the Arabs they simply took-over what they once ruled and then sent Turks (as well as voluntary migrants) to the region. Anyway, hope this helps. Tombseye 22:14, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
I outlined an objective yesterday (which I archived so you might not've seen it), that we discuss our changes on the history section BEFORE adding them. Both you and Tigran seem to have ignored this. Like it or not, the article looks like it's going to be protected soon. This would not be the worst thing as then we can discuss our changes with some civility and not engage in revert wars. -- Clevelander 11:21, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
Alright, looking back at this and my response, I think that I responded poorly at best (mostly because I was half-awake when I wrote my reply which was around 7:00 this morning here in the eastern United States). I didn't read your quote and I apologize for the confusion, etc. Truce? -- Clevelander 13:08, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
Hey Grandmaster. Because of our discussions a few weeks ago, I think you might be interested in this extract of the article "Saljuqs" from the Encyclopaedia of Islam:
"... We need not assume that the actual numbers of the Turkmens were very large, for the ways of life possible in the steppes meant that there were natural and environmental limitations on the numbers of the nomads. Yuri Bregel has implied, working from the 16,000 Oghuz mentioned by the Ghaznawid historian Bayhaki as present on the battle field of Dandankan (Tarikh-i Masudi, Tehran 1324/1945, 619), that we should probably assume, in this instance, a ratio of one fighting man to four other members of the family, yielding some 64,000 Turkmens moving into Khurasan at this time (Turko-Mongol influences in Central Asia, in R.L. Canfield (ed.), Turko-Persia in historical perspective, Cambridge 1991, 58 and n. 10). ..."
So, the Encyclopaedia of Islam estimates the total number of Oghuz Turcomans at the time of the Seljuqs to be less than 100.000 ... comparing this to the actualy population of Persia or the Islamic world (Baghdad had a population of 200.000 at that time), I would not call this a "mass migarion". And since only a part of these Turcomans actually followed the Seljuqs to Anatolia (many Turcomans satyed in Central-Asia and Khurasan, including the ancestors of modern Turkmens, Khorassani-Turks, or the - now - Persian-speaking Bayat, Afshar, or Qajar Turks, the actual number of Turcomans in Anatolia and Azerbaijan was not more than 20.000 (probably only 4-6.000 fighting men).
That's why the turkification of Anatolia began AFTER the fall of the Seljuqs. Anatolia - which was previously Roman-Christian - was almost depopulized after the attack of the Muslim-Seljuq forces; many Christians had fled to Europe. There were no native noble families left (unlike in Persia, Iraq, or Africa), and after the fall of the Seljuqs, power in Anatolia shifted to the only remaining "noble families": the Turcoman Beyliqs.
I hope this was helpful.
Tājik 13:46, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
Grandmaster could you upload some pictures of Nakhichevan (if you have any)? Thanks! -- Clevelander 18:18, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
Hey, great user page, congrats! ;) Kertenkelebek Ⓣ 08:02, 10 August 2006 (UTC)
GM, I want to make a deal with you. I'll promise that the Latin transliteration for the Armenian name of Nakhichevan will not be included in the Nakhichevan article (the Armenian translation will stay, as will the Russian, Turkish, and Persian translations). In return, I wish that you not include the Azeri translation for the name Zangezur (which I promise will remain on the page). Does this sound kosher? -- Clevelander 12:43, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
Please stop putting the tag on the controversy section of the Azerbaijani people article. The only thing you disputed was the name Arran being used, and i changed it so that the reader knows that other names were also applied, such as albania, armenia, georgia, shirvan, etc... what else are you disputing? Khosrow II 04:20, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
Hey Grandmaster, I was wondering if you saw the culture section that I posted on the Nakhichevan talk page. Be sure to give me your feedback. Thanks! -- Clevelander 11:23, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
istedim diyem saghol, chox saghol, azerbaijan haqqinda meqalelere gore
Hi there; I have removed the tag.-- Anthony.bradbury 22:08, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
I think that I got that variant as a result of a mis-translation of my reading Brockhaus - my Russian's a bit rusty. I'll cut that out. -- Clevelander 02:22, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for uploading Image:Govhar-Aga.jpg. I notice the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this file yourself, then there needs to be a justification explaining why we have the right to use it on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you did not create the file yourself, then you need to specify where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.
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Hi, Grandmaster. At first, I should state that I could not find any dictionary entries for Caran D'ache. I think it's only a trade mark. So, I had to remove it. But I found a new word and I'm not sure about the etymology of it. The word is simply Burunduk, a kind of squirrel found mainly in North-East Europe and Siberia. To tell in Russian "Бурундук, азиатский бурундук (Eutamias sibiricus)". But I'm not sure about the origin of the word, it could be of Mari origin, or it could stem from Turkic languages. Could you help me find the definite etymology of the word? The English counterpart of the word is Borunduk or Baronduki. Istanbul'dan çok selamlar!
Vasmer's Etymological Dictionary - Burunduk
Chapultepec 00:55, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
How have you been? I recently created an article about İsgəndər Həmidov—you heard of him? If so, is there anything that you think should be added? — Khoikhoi 05:43, 14 September 2006 (UTC)