My interest is in filling in the gaps that continue to exist in so many Wikipedia articles, whenever I come across them in subjects that I know reasonably well.
Since I started doing edits in summer 2007, I have found myself gravitating to articles about Canada's official languages. The relations between French and English represent the central issue of Canadian politics, and the articles on the subject are often inadequate to give a really good understanding of the complexities of Canada's linguistic environment.
Particular shortfalls, in this area, that I see at the moment include:
Flint and Fire ( talk) 12:14, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
Your recent edit to Official bilingualism in Canada ( here) is incorrect. As noted in the text you deleted [1], the Constitution Act, 1965 is one example of a part of the Constitution that was enacted equally in English and French. Also it is not really correct to say that the situation was "remedied" in 1982, because large parts of the Constitution still exist (for official legal purposes) in English only. (They have French translations of course, but technically the French translations are unofficial -- though in practice the courts may use them almost as if they were official.) -- Mathew5000 ( talk) 15:31, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for making the above-noted adjustment, Mathew5000.
In your comments above, you note that I had deleted the reference (which I had regarded as being somewhat cryptic) to the “Constitution Act, 1965” in Spoken languages of Canada. But you did not include any mention of the Constitution Act, 1965, or of any other bilingual parts of the pre-1982 constitution, in your edits. This leaves a gap that ought to be filled. I suggest that the section of Official Bilingualism in Canada that deals with the Constitution be edited to explain which provisions of the pre-1982 Constitution of Canada were bilingual, and why these provisions were bilingual but others were in English only.
I’ve looked up British North America Acts. This article indicates
I assume that it was these five amendments, and no others, that were enacted in both official languages. To the best of your knowledge, is this correct? Flint and Fire ( talk) 00:08, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the update, Mathew5000. Based on this, it appears to me that in order to compile a list for Official bilingualism in Canada, the following would be correct:
Any comments as to the completeness of this list? In particular, are you aware of any constitutional provisions originating in Canada’s parliament, other than the British North America Act, 1952, which didn’t make it into the schedule mentioned in section 52(2), and hence onto the list provided in List of Canadian constitutional documents?
Flint and Fire ( talk) 12:00, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
On Dec. 24, 2007, I updated the table titled “Geographic Distribution” in Spoken languages of Canada. In the explanatory note, I wrote, ‘Figures combine single and multiple responses. Multiple responses for “French/English”, “French/Other” and “English/Other” were allocated with one-half of all respondents placed in either linguistic category. Multiple responses for English/French/Other” were allocated with one-third of all respondents being placed in each of the three categories.’
But the numbers that I included were in fact only the single responses (that is, people who reported in the 2006 census that they use only one language at home). The trouble with this is that the numbers don’t add up. Take a look at the earlier version of this chart, and you’ll see what I mean. In Canada, 576,000 individuals reported using more than one “home language”. All these people were left out of the table, as drafted on Dec. 27th.
The edit that I have done today corrects this. These 576,000 people have been appropriately allocated, by province and by language use.
Flint and Fire ( talk) 17:15, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
You've obviously done some detailed work here. But because this is a sub-topic (or a " fork" as we call it) that builds on the work of Official bilingualism in Canada, and Languages in Canada, you would be better off seeking consensus for the creation of such an article, rather than doing all the work and seeing it deleted. That's just my advice. Kevlar67 ( talk) 23:52, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
Hi Kevlar67. You are quite right, of course. My fear was that a chronology that contains any kind of thorough chronological list of official bilingualism-related events would wind up swallowing the main article on Official bilingualism in Canada. The main article is theme-based (language in education, provincial policy, etc.), and just doesn't seem to work well when overlaid with a chronology. Thus the logic of putting the chronology separately.
To me, the chronology article is a bit like an orange that's been sliced vertically instead of horizontally. It's another way of looking at all the same information, that may help to give a better understanding of the same subject matter.
That said, these are the kinds of arguments that I suppose ought to be given in advance of creating a fork, rather than after the fact.
Flint and Fire ( talk) 01:12, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
I made an edit to the article English language updating the information on Canada to the 2006 census, but now I realize I might be confused about something. Maybe you can help. Is the census data on mother tongue wildly different depending on whether it is based on the 20% sample or the 100% sample? What I mean is this:
If you look at catalogue no. 97-555-XWE2006002, "Language Highlight Tables", Table 401, it separates out a response of "English and" some other language(s) as mother tongues, from a response of English only. So it looks from that table that the total figure for English as a mother tongue is:
17,882,775 + 98,625 + 240,005 + 10,790 = 18,232,195
That figure agrees (essentially) with catalogue no. 97-555-XWE2006007, "Language", Detailed Mother Tongue.
Both those tables were based on data from the 20% sample data.
But look at some of the census data based on the 100% sample data, such as catalogue no. 97-555-XWE2006019 or catalogue no. 97-555-XWE2006021 (both released last Tuesday). These tables, such as for mother tongue by age group, sex, CMA and CA give larger figures for the total speaking English as a mother tongue:
18,588,050 + 239,185 + 590,905 + 63,685 = 19,481,825
I kind of think I am misunderstanding something, but not sure what. Is the number of people in Canada (as of census day 2006) whose mother tongue is English (either alone or with some other language(s)) 18.2 million, or 19.5 million? Do you have any thoughts on this? Thanks. You can reply here, I will watch this page. --
Mathew5000 (
talk)
16:01, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
...just so you know. — mono 23:53, 6 July 2010 (UTC)
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My interest is in filling in the gaps that continue to exist in so many Wikipedia articles, whenever I come across them in subjects that I know reasonably well.
Since I started doing edits in summer 2007, I have found myself gravitating to articles about Canada's official languages. The relations between French and English represent the central issue of Canadian politics, and the articles on the subject are often inadequate to give a really good understanding of the complexities of Canada's linguistic environment.
Particular shortfalls, in this area, that I see at the moment include:
Flint and Fire ( talk) 12:14, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
Your recent edit to Official bilingualism in Canada ( here) is incorrect. As noted in the text you deleted [1], the Constitution Act, 1965 is one example of a part of the Constitution that was enacted equally in English and French. Also it is not really correct to say that the situation was "remedied" in 1982, because large parts of the Constitution still exist (for official legal purposes) in English only. (They have French translations of course, but technically the French translations are unofficial -- though in practice the courts may use them almost as if they were official.) -- Mathew5000 ( talk) 15:31, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for making the above-noted adjustment, Mathew5000.
In your comments above, you note that I had deleted the reference (which I had regarded as being somewhat cryptic) to the “Constitution Act, 1965” in Spoken languages of Canada. But you did not include any mention of the Constitution Act, 1965, or of any other bilingual parts of the pre-1982 constitution, in your edits. This leaves a gap that ought to be filled. I suggest that the section of Official Bilingualism in Canada that deals with the Constitution be edited to explain which provisions of the pre-1982 Constitution of Canada were bilingual, and why these provisions were bilingual but others were in English only.
I’ve looked up British North America Acts. This article indicates
I assume that it was these five amendments, and no others, that were enacted in both official languages. To the best of your knowledge, is this correct? Flint and Fire ( talk) 00:08, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the update, Mathew5000. Based on this, it appears to me that in order to compile a list for Official bilingualism in Canada, the following would be correct:
Any comments as to the completeness of this list? In particular, are you aware of any constitutional provisions originating in Canada’s parliament, other than the British North America Act, 1952, which didn’t make it into the schedule mentioned in section 52(2), and hence onto the list provided in List of Canadian constitutional documents?
Flint and Fire ( talk) 12:00, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
On Dec. 24, 2007, I updated the table titled “Geographic Distribution” in Spoken languages of Canada. In the explanatory note, I wrote, ‘Figures combine single and multiple responses. Multiple responses for “French/English”, “French/Other” and “English/Other” were allocated with one-half of all respondents placed in either linguistic category. Multiple responses for English/French/Other” were allocated with one-third of all respondents being placed in each of the three categories.’
But the numbers that I included were in fact only the single responses (that is, people who reported in the 2006 census that they use only one language at home). The trouble with this is that the numbers don’t add up. Take a look at the earlier version of this chart, and you’ll see what I mean. In Canada, 576,000 individuals reported using more than one “home language”. All these people were left out of the table, as drafted on Dec. 27th.
The edit that I have done today corrects this. These 576,000 people have been appropriately allocated, by province and by language use.
Flint and Fire ( talk) 17:15, 3 January 2008 (UTC)
You've obviously done some detailed work here. But because this is a sub-topic (or a " fork" as we call it) that builds on the work of Official bilingualism in Canada, and Languages in Canada, you would be better off seeking consensus for the creation of such an article, rather than doing all the work and seeing it deleted. That's just my advice. Kevlar67 ( talk) 23:52, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
Hi Kevlar67. You are quite right, of course. My fear was that a chronology that contains any kind of thorough chronological list of official bilingualism-related events would wind up swallowing the main article on Official bilingualism in Canada. The main article is theme-based (language in education, provincial policy, etc.), and just doesn't seem to work well when overlaid with a chronology. Thus the logic of putting the chronology separately.
To me, the chronology article is a bit like an orange that's been sliced vertically instead of horizontally. It's another way of looking at all the same information, that may help to give a better understanding of the same subject matter.
That said, these are the kinds of arguments that I suppose ought to be given in advance of creating a fork, rather than after the fact.
Flint and Fire ( talk) 01:12, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
I made an edit to the article English language updating the information on Canada to the 2006 census, but now I realize I might be confused about something. Maybe you can help. Is the census data on mother tongue wildly different depending on whether it is based on the 20% sample or the 100% sample? What I mean is this:
If you look at catalogue no. 97-555-XWE2006002, "Language Highlight Tables", Table 401, it separates out a response of "English and" some other language(s) as mother tongues, from a response of English only. So it looks from that table that the total figure for English as a mother tongue is:
17,882,775 + 98,625 + 240,005 + 10,790 = 18,232,195
That figure agrees (essentially) with catalogue no. 97-555-XWE2006007, "Language", Detailed Mother Tongue.
Both those tables were based on data from the 20% sample data.
But look at some of the census data based on the 100% sample data, such as catalogue no. 97-555-XWE2006019 or catalogue no. 97-555-XWE2006021 (both released last Tuesday). These tables, such as for mother tongue by age group, sex, CMA and CA give larger figures for the total speaking English as a mother tongue:
18,588,050 + 239,185 + 590,905 + 63,685 = 19,481,825
I kind of think I am misunderstanding something, but not sure what. Is the number of people in Canada (as of census day 2006) whose mother tongue is English (either alone or with some other language(s)) 18.2 million, or 19.5 million? Do you have any thoughts on this? Thanks. You can reply here, I will watch this page. --
Mathew5000 (
talk)
16:01, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
...just so you know. — mono 23:53, 6 July 2010 (UTC)
Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current
Arbitration Committee election. The
Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia
arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose
site bans,
topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The
arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to
review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on
the voting page. For the Election committee,
MediaWiki message delivery (
talk)
13:32, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Hello, Flint and Fire. Voting in the 2016 Arbitration Committee elections is open from Monday, 00:00, 21 November through Sunday, 23:59, 4 December to all unblocked users who have registered an account before Wednesday, 00:00, 28 October 2016 and have made at least 150 mainspace edits before Sunday, 00:00, 1 November 2016.
The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.
If you wish to participate in the 2016 election, please review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 22:08, 21 November 2016 (UTC)