My talk page. FightingMac ( talk) 21:44, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
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Hello, FightingMac. I saw your edits to Square root, which I thought were good. Thanks. I also saw your edits to Talk:Square root, where I thought you made good points, though I do wonder how much point there is in replying to talk page posts from long ago: in at least one case over three years ago. At least a couple of your comments were answers to editors that have not edited since 2008. However, I suppose someone other than the original poster may find what you've written useful.
Perhaps more important is your comment about the section "Square roots of negative and complex numbers". I think the sort of problem you describe occurs in quite a number of mathematical articles. Maybe I will find time to think about editing the section some time. JamesBWatson ( talk) 20:45, 16 April 2011 (UTC)
I was personally involved with the production of this film. I was privy to conversations and interactions with many of the people involved with the production including Barry Spikings at EMI. I was informed by people intimately involved with the finances and the ultimate demise of this film, which occurred prior to its release. The film is not anti American, it is just a silly, funny comedy. However, anti-Americanism is the excuse the distributors wished to use for dumping the film and that is the way it was communicated to the press through very powerful press agents at the time (PKM). Although the primary press wrote reviews of the movie as directed, there were several major reviewers who wrote their own opinions. If all the reviews had been like Rex Reed’s in the Daily News (I have a hard copy of the review, but I was unable to find a copy of it on-line) the movie would have been a smash hit, however, it had been decided well before its release that this movie would not make any money and every effort was made by the distributors toward this end. No expense was spared in the effort to kill this movie and it has nothing to do with its content or quality. There were politics behind the scenes that had to do with the finances of this film and the demise of this film was strictly a power play on the part of some very, very powerful studio executives at the time (who are since deceased). It is amazing to me how there are people who are so determined to continue to disseminate the lies and vitriol that was made up about something that was meant to be simply fun entertainment. The budget of the film tells the tale and if anyone editing for Wikipideia can’t see that obvious fact, then I have to wonder why they are editing for a publication that supposedly wants only verifiable facts. The comments made regarding the content of the film being the cause of its failure are the editor’s opinion. I don’t know what the editor ‘s background is, but unless he’s actually been involved in the production of a Hollywood movie, I can’t see how he could begin to understand the mechanism of the Hollywood machinery. The review in the New York Times was not the cause for the failure of this movie it was the result of the failure of the movie, which occurred before any critics ever even saw it for review. While you can verify all the bad reviews you like, it doesn’t account for what actually happened. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Juliacharles ( talk • contribs) 10:28, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
I concur with the need for citations, and will take up the project (have already started thinking about it) to provide same. It will not be a simple matter, and it is not a project that I relish doing. In fact, it will be a painful process. I am all too familiar with the fact that the production of this film was not “fun,” in spite of the fact that the content was meant to be nothing but fun. Some of the research I’ve done so far has started out with how many high profile British (or for that matter any British directors) have ever directed an American comedy.
Although there have been a few foreign born directors of American comedies such as the German born, Ernst Lubitsch, to date I have not found an instance when the director of an American comedy was British. There are also few instances of American directors who have directed American comedies, I came across Terry Gilliam (an American) a long time member of Monty Python who also eventually directed one of their films, (Holy Grail) after easing his way up to the position. For the most part he was so assimilated that most people don’t realize he is American. While it is true that HTF was a British film, the script was written by an American writer and all the actors are American (no Brits using American accents) and it takes place in America. However, given the fact that it had a British director and producer, it has earned the reputation of being anti-American.
The truth is that HTF was never meant to be such a huge “Hollywood” movie. It originally started out as an idea of Don Boyd’s that he intended to both produce and direct as a small independent film. If it had never gotten into the hands of John Schlesinger, there’s no telling what might have happened to it. Most likely the same thing that happens to so many screenplays - nothing. Getting a script made into a movie is a matter of both talent and luck. It is a very flukie process that is mostly in the hands of powerful agents and wheeler dealers who are first and foremost, in my opinion, rogues.
On one hand it could be said that Schlesinger getting a hold of the script was an exciting development. However, this brings us back to the crux of the matter if you ask me, which is the “across the pond” factor. Let’s face it, similar to the fact that many people in the southern United States still wave the Confederate flag, the differences between America and Britain harkens back to colonial days and is clearly illustrated in the first successful American written comedy, The Contrast, by Royal Tyler, written in 1787. Apart from all the machinations of egomaniacal, backstabbing, love you “Darling,” Hollywood, it is alright for us to poke fun at ourselves, but don’t you (Brits) dare say a word about us, ESPECIALLY, making fun of us. Even if Don Boyd had somehow “magically,” successfully managed to produce, direct and distribute HTF, it still would have suffered from this defining “contrast” so to speak.
On the other hand, Schlesinger getting a hold of the script was its death knell. The fact that it was a high profile British director, only contributed to it being a high profile unmitigated disaster. There came a point in the production of the film that John Schlesinger became most acutely aware that the perception would be negative because he was British, combined with his great insecurity about directing comedy in the first place. Whereas, he could get away with it on a drama, as he did with Midnight Cowboy, he realized that comedy was another matter; Since he was British, the movie would be perceived as anti-American. If the director had been American, this perception never could have existed.
Schlesinger manifested this in very insecure behavior and decided somewhere in his mind that he had to do something about it by spending too much money and began spreading the money around as favors that he could cash in on in the future when things went south for him as he was predicting in his mind. All this was going on in his head prior to principal photography. He vacillated between spending and spending, to insulting the executives in the hopes they would cease production and put it on the shelf in mid-stream (which they almost did.) His insecurity became a critical factor and had an insidious effect on the whole production. It infected everyone and at a later date (it took three years to produce) became like a disease that ran to a fevered pitch as it came closer and closer to the film being pushed toward release. He didn’t want the film released in the worst way- he began stepping on people’s toes in the hopes to avoid it. The result was that he made a lot of people very angry at him and they retaliated in the process of distributing the film.
Behind the scenes, people were running around like chickens with their heads cut off trying to patch up their financial losses as a consequence of Schlesinger’s spending spree, and consequently sold the ancillary rights (including the video cassette rights, which at the time was a brand new medium.) All this, was on top of the “Roy Tucker Tax Avoidance” business. This is how it turned into such a train wreck and it all happened way before any critics saw the movie that was released in August, 1981. In screenings for the critics the reception was initially quite good, but as the story unfolded and people began to retaliate by exercising their power, anything positive got buried underneath a landslide of reviews that focused on the American comedy directed by a British director aspect. No fun whatsoever!
And the person it was the least fun for was the writer. Everyone agreed for a first screenplay, it was extremely promising. If it had not been put under the microscope of being such a high profile British run debacle, the writer would most likely have had a stellar career. I found a short review in Variety, but I have never read the “Variety” review you cite, and I have ordered a copy of it and will receive it in the mail soon, as I have not been able to find it on line (thankfully) I am not looking forward to reading it after all these years because I’m sure it will not be “fun.” Please don’t republish it. When I have gathered all my sources together and put all my ducks in a row, I will attempt to write a paragraph as you’ve described with citations, in order to possibly set the record straight with respect to HTF. I will thank you in advance for your consideration towards me and will appreciate any cooperation you might provide.
I apologize if my previous message was "harsh" towards you. I do not normally edit Wikipedia and have only come to this "stub" as it pertains to me personally. I am not adept in this area and have fumbled my way to even finally find this discussion page, but it seems necessary at this point in time for me to give it a directed amount of attention and somehow figure out a way to set the record straight. I will do my very best to provide the citations you require. Juliacharles 11:18, 1 May 2011 (UTC) Juliacharles 12:56, 30 April 2011 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Juliacharles (talk • contribs)--Juliacharles 11:27, 1 May 2011 (UTC) —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Juliacharles (
talk •
contribs) For example - I don't understand why there is an indication that this is unsigned when I have folowed the instructions and insterted the 4 marks as required.--Juliacharles
12:29, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
Do you mind if I put a wee colon in your comment on that IMF fellow's page to separate our comments? It's a small thing, but I wanted your permission to do so first. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | Say Shalom! 03:00, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
Hi FightingMac, I'm a French journalist and I'm writing an article about the inside debate between Wikipedia contributors about the Dominique Strauss-Kahn page. You might not notice but there's a great difference of treatment between the French WP and the English one. I would like to ask you a few question about that if you can give me a little bit of your time today. Here you can contact me : guaranaseven@hotmail.com
Thank you. Regards, Antoine
-- Guaranaseven ( talk) 14:25, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
These people have nothing to do with this case - please do not replace it again - is is not a soapbox article for opinionated groups. NOBLANKING is just an essay with no support as policy or guideline. Off2riorob ( talk) 23:58, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
Hey - we are edit warring now WP:3RR - is knocking at the door - as I said blanking is an essay -such opinionated comment do not belong in the article. Off2riorob ( talk) 00:08, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
Hi, but I beg to differ about 'we'. It's you who is edit warring. I'm sorry you had a knock at the door from WP:3RR but whose fault is that? The feminist and anti-sexist reaction is here to stay as far as I'm concerned, Off2riorob, and I didn't even create it. Thank you. FightingMac ( talk) 00:16, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
Just dropping by (I'm off out for the day) to mention; you keep using NOBLANKING. But this is an essay which indicates that blanking sections may violate policy, then explains ways in which policies might be violated. It is an essay written completely by Wikid77, with whom I've had a lot of dealings - his views on policy tend to be somewhat "off the wall", and he has a history of writing essays to support his viewpoints (or to keep his content in an article). NOBLANKING is unlikely to hold much sway in the wider community (where it is accepted that your content will end up being deleted outright at some point) and indeed itself "violates" some of our core policies about removing material :) If you are going to use NOBLANKING I suggest explaining specifically why the blanking might violate policy, and which one. -- Errant ( chat!) 09:52, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
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See Talk:Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case#Libelous_or_contentious_additions article talk page quoted below:
See here for examples of the sort of thing I complain of and which is impossible to deal with. I do think these very contentious BLP pages need to better policed against WP:CRUSH editors. What this page will be like when the going really gets dirty god knows. FightingMac ( talk) 07:25, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
Wikipedia takes personal attacks against other editors fairly seriously. That includes many comments you've made on the talk page of DSK over the last few weeks, including numerous insults and gratuitous sarcasm. They are all disruptive and clear violations of civil behavior. Please delete all such personal attacks that you've made from all the DSK talk pages. When in doubt, I'd suggest deleting it. Thanks. -- Wikiwatcher1 ( talk) 05:44, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
Please note that per earlier comments by me and others, I will be deleting any and all article talk page posts that appear to violate guidelines against personal attacks, against me, whether directly by name, or indirectly by insinuation. A sampling of the guidelines FYI:
As a matter of polite and effective discourse, comments should not be personalized. That is, they should be directed at content and actions rather than people. . . .Editors should be civil and adhere to good wiki etiquette when describing disagreements. The appropriate response to an inflammatory statement is to address the issues of content . . . . Linking to external attacks, harassment, or other material, for the purpose of attacking another editor. . . . Accusations about personal behavior that lack evidence. . . . Removing unquestionable personal attacks from your own user talk page is rarely a matter of concern. On other talk pages, especially where such text is directed against you, removal should typically be limited to clear-cut cases where it is obvious the text is a true personal attack. . . . Although editors are encouraged to ignore or respond politely to isolated personal attacks, that should not imply that they are acceptable or without consequences. A pattern of hostility reduces the likelihood of the community assuming good faith, and can be considered disruptive editing. Users who insist on a confrontational style marked by personal attacks are likely to become involved in the dispute resolution process, and may face serious consequences through arbitration . . .
-- Wikiwatcher1 ( talk) 18:27, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
Mac, I've avoided responding to your ongoing comments about me, but you nonetheless continue to attack me personally rather than simply commenting on the substance of my edits or comments. Unfortunately, your latest edit summary here goes even further than your previous comments. Please respect WP:PERSONAL and stop.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 01:07, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
Please stop doing this, external wikis are not reliable sources and should not be inline linked like that, thanks. Off2riorob ( talk) 18:53, 18 June 2011 (UTC)
I've started a topic on WP:EAR that involves you. See here.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 19:00, 18 June 2011 (UTC)
Hi, you mentioned the Polanski BLP. What was your username on that article at that time? Did you work on the Frederic Mitterand issue? Or is this account the only identity you have edit under here at en Wikipedia? Off2riorob ( talk) 19:05, 18 June 2011 (UTC)
[outdent]First a remark befor an edit conflict:
I'll pass on that ;-) What do you think? I mean I get the impression that many committed editors get blocked sooner or later until they realise the errors of their ways, the more so if they take on genuinely difficult editors as you do. But as I've mentioned before my experience with Wikipedia has generally been in quiter waters than present turbulent conditions. I'm not up for arb committee or anything here, Off2riorob, nor will I ever be nor anything of the sort, if only because I am extremely busy with my own work and couldn't possibly afford the time Wikipedia enthusiasts put in. I gathered from your own arb application you work 8 till late. I couldn't begin to offer that degree of commitment. There's nothing here that need concern you, really.
Secondly I absolutely have not been investigating and quoting your edit history to other editors with the exception of ErrantX we've already discussed. Has Wikiwatcher1 been winding you up over this? The position is that you were accusing me at that time of POV pushing feminism and threatening to ban me from the page. We've been through this. Why are we going back over this ground? We really don't need to. I'll be happy to set the record straight wherever you want me to. FightingMac ( talk) 22:20, 18 June 2011 (UTC)
Personally I don't usually have a problem with the Mail except when it's reporting celebrity crap. But you are readding links to it in an article where there are already longer, better written references. Four different references for a couple of statements is utterly unnecessary, as are links to foreign language sources when English ones are easily available. Nevard ( talk) 01:49, 23 June 2011 (UTC)
Thanks for the input on this re: the Nazi book burning article. I'm real reluctant to get into edit wars -- I've read too many anecdotes of people quitting work on WP after getting sick and tired of the politics spoiling their contribution experience. I was just going to let it stand because it wasn't a deal breaker in terms of the article, but after what you've said, I'll re-revert John Nevard's changes. Thanks! Wingman4l7 ( talk)
Still on my todo list - I have a few things to get out of the way first sadly :) Sorry for jumping down your throat today - please don't take it personally. Paraphrasing is a perennial and potentially disastrous problem, unfortunately. Ill wait to see what MRG has to say - I could be going to hard on this. -- Errant ( chat!) 00:08, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
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Hi, just a note to remind you to please add - {{NOINDEX}} - to articles you are working on in your userspace to stop the crawl bots from publishing them to the WWW. Thanks. Off2riorob ( talk) 20:02, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
This - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:ELNO#Links_normally_to_be_avoided - is relating to External links in the external link section not inline links. Off2riorob ( talk) 20:56, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
(edit conflict)
I am not going to talk round in circles - I have posted issues on the Talk:Tristane_Banon#External_links section, as I suggested to you, start a WP:RFC or show me where it is common practice on this wikipedia that you have done it often on this wiki. Off2riorob ( talk) 21:48, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
[Outdent]
As I noted there, I see you have followed me to the Help desk. I find that a bit creepy and on reflection I'll spend time going through the resolution process, archiving it as I proceed.
Progress so far is that I took the dispute to the Talk page of the article you issued the edit warring notice from and I've sought help from the Help desk. Nevertheless you still haven't addressed any of the three issues I raise 1 why you are deleting these links when you agree they are not against policy 2 when they are not being used as RS as was your original concern 3 why my fresh approach, formatting as Michèle Sabban (see French Wikipedia article), as recommended by Help:Interlanguage_links#Purpose to deal with your new concerns about reader expectations was immediately reverted by you without explanantion and a 3R edit-warring warning released instead.
Give these some time to produce results and then let's proceed to the next stage of the resolution process. You suggest a RFC so let's do an RFC. You can start or I shall. Don't mind. Let me know but please stop hounding me. That is likely to upset me. FightingMac ( talk) 14:35, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
I've asked for a Third opinion here since this seems to be a two editor affair. See what comes of that. FightingMac ( talk) 05:54, 4 July 2011 (UTC)
The Barnstar of Good Humor | |
For displaying a rather jolly sense of humour about a fairly sordid set of circumstances in the DSK sex abuse article, and particularly the talk page Egg Centric 16:27, 3 July 2011 (UTC) |
Thank you so much, Egg Centric! Appreciated. FightingMac ( talk) 16:50, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
Don't worry. I hadn't noticed! I've no idea why the caurt case was moved to a separate page. That's not necessary with such a short article. The moving editor created a formatting chaos. Paul B ( talk) 18:56, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
I am happy to take your comment as a compliment - "Off2riorob's extremely cogent observation" I do stand up for my position, or rather my best understanding of policy as I see you do and I do sometimes fall out with users that disagree but one think I am always open to is revisiting and re-evaluating and making up and leaving what is in the past behind, no worries, Rob - Off2riorob ( talk) 22:06, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
Doh!
I have been lazily calling him "Kahn" in the talk pages just to save some typing. But I can't believe I did so in the article. If you fixed that, thanks.
-- Bob drobbs ( talk) 04:29, 6 July 2011 (UTC)
Hi Bob. Wasn't me who fixed. I was amused :-). Don't worry. We all do it. Just a tip in case you're new to posting. Rowing in like that, changing section headers and so on without discussion on the Talk page is probably quite a lot bolder than you perhaps ought to be right now. An awful lot of water, really a lot, got swept under the bridge discussing headers in the early days of this article and I know ErrantX spent a lot of time, I mean really a lot of time, sorting all that out. Changing headers and stuff as you fancy is fairly dickish in my view. A lot of people don't like loads of subsections. It usually just means the editor can't cope with paragraphs. No, seriously. However, whatever you feel comfortable with ... FightingMac ( talk) 04:58, 6 July 2011 (UTC)
You currently appear to be engaged in an
edit war. Users are expected to
collaborate with others and avoid editing
disruptively.
In particular, the three-revert rule states that:
If you find yourself in an editing dispute, use the article's talk page to discuss controversial changes; work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at an appropriate noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases it may be appropriate to request temporary page protection. If you continue to edit war, you may be blocked from editing without further notice.
- - - - -
You have done at minimum 5 reverts in the past 24 hours. Not only my changes, but wikiwatcher's and Pat's and more.
Please, as the template says, seek to find consensus and negotiations with other editors rather than reverting their work.
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438218357
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438299649
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438290567
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438290083
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438301721
-- Bob drobbs ( talk) 21:30, 7 July 2011 (UTC)
We've reached resolution on this, so there is no fall out (which is why 3RR exists). I came very close to asking for article protection earlier and I am pleased that the matter got resolved fairly simply in the end. I noted Mac, that you have done quite a few RV's today - although I never made a big deal of it because the article has been through the mill the last few days and some cut and thrust is inevitable. Although the tension has been high and some decorum has been lost it is definitely not as bad as some articles I have worked on (where the abuse just *flies* and article content seems mostly secondary!). However with that said, WP:3RR is one of the most bright lines we have - no matter if you are right to the nines it is something never to be broken. Not to preach of course, I've clicked RV one too many times on a fast moving article, and done in good faith most admins will accept the mistake. But the point of 3RR is to avoid situations like today - both of you reverted too much - and the discussion/resolution could have happened a lot earlier than it did. 3RR is not there as a way to get people blocked (though sadly it is used that way far too often) but as a hard limit to force discussion and compromise :) So just to say; I don't think anyone did wrong and between the 5 or 6 of us (yep, including WW) we've ended up with some decent material. Good job. -- Errant ( chat!) 23:08, 7 July 2011 (UTC)
The Resilient Barnstar | |
Knowing you're a Scotsman, I hope you don't mind me saying that you're sometimes stubborn and sarcastic (like many I know); but I've always liked that in people. And more often than not you are right (and the rest of the time I am ;)). Thanks for sticking the article - I know it is a frustration and tense, but you would not still be here if you didn't love it.
The article would not be as good as it is without your efforts! Errant ( chat!) 23:11, 7 July 2011 (UTC) |
FYI NickCT ( talk) 00:57, 10 July 2011 (UTC)
I'm sorry, but both you and ErrantX are 100% wrong here.
There is absolutely nothing in WP:BLP which says that the facts of a libel case cannot be listed. Please read it!! WP:BLP simply says that things have to be well-referenced.
Beyond that, there is a long precedent here. In each of these notable libel cases, the article discusses what the claimed libel was: Ashley Olson World Net Daily Jose Santos
e.g. "In 2005, Ashley filed a $40 million lawsuit against tabloid magazine National Enquirer for printing a headline reading "Ashley Olsen Caught In Drug Scandal,"
Now, please think about this seriously.
Why can we list the libel against Ashley Olsen, Jose Santos, and Clark Jones, but not the details of a lawsuit filed by housekeeper whom we can't even name??
Are you now going to start deleting important, notable, and well-reference material from all of those pages too. I hope not. But if you are, will you _please_ seek out advice from other editors and truly understand WP:BLP before you continue your habit of reverting the work of other editors!
-- Bob drobbs ( talk) 06:41, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
Hi Bob,
That was my thinking too when I first presented, through an edit, the libel case but I got a serious ticking off from ErrantX for doing it (I mean I was up all night agonising and even broke cover over it so conflicted I was) and I'm inclined to think he's probably right and give him the benefit of the doubt. I mean I just don't have time to go through the entire Wikipedia policy corpus, no way I'm ever going to put up myself for admin me, but I can see where a policy of never mentioning the nature of a libel might make sense in a BLP. At any rate EX adjured us to think long and hard about it and that at least I hope you will do. Of course I won't revert you again.
It's not "about winning" but all the same one does rather want to emerge on the winning side, that's only natural. Three things I suggest you don't want to take sides too closely on young Bob 1 the Fulani phone call 2 the prostitution libel 3 the going into another room to clean it after getting herself gob-fucked (I mean she was there all right, but less than a minute on leaked key-data).
Just friendly strictly non-attributive advice. Bed-time again here. What was your take on the Gaza flotilla by the way? Just curious, not one of the things I felt moved to make another addition to my sock-farm over :-). I was sympathetic to the Israeli version myself (hope that doesn't return a flood of invective) but I do sometimes thinks that supporters of the cause are often their worst own enemies. St. Mel of the Mail for a start, unhappily departed from The Spectator coffee-house over her own recent little libel difficulties.
I rather admire you sticking it in there. Keep me posted. Regards FightingMac ( talk) 07:25, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
I'm not impressed by you, your edits to wheatfield were poor, and given that you are a new account who obviously has no problem with socking and inventing eloberate stories (a cousin null editing the Lavrentiy Beria article over and over to pass autoconfirm so she could agree with you on a sex scandal artice talk), be warned, I'm watching, not impressed. I'm not an admin, but wont tolerate you folowing me about either. Reply here, if you edit my talk I'll revert you. Ceoil 11:41, 16 July 2011 (UTC)
I think your edits to Vincent van Gogh have been pointy and I think that comments such as this are as incivil as the incivility you complain about. Ceoil has given you and opportunity above to discuss - do so. Explain why you're following him around, and why a new account's first edit shows such knowledge of Wikipedia. Maybe you have an alternative account, maybe you edit on other wikis. I've been plagued and harassed by sockpuppets recently as have editors who collaborate with me, so an explanation would be helpful at this point. And toning down would be extremely helpful. Truthkeeper88 ( talk) 14:20, 17 July 2011 (UTC)
Hi, back again. I thought I'd leave the thread above to you and Ceoil. Regarding death - I understand that you don't like the description, but I have about 7 books stacked up, dunno should probably count them, and each one says the same thing. I decided to source to the one that came closest to the current wording - simply because I'm lazy and have spent a lot of time tidying the page. Meant to tell you btw, in the tidying I had to throw out your weblinks for the funeral and the reburial section, and added a book source, so hope you don't mind too much. If you want an alternate opinion regarding the last paintings, go ahead and post again on the talk page, or keep it here, but give me a chance to look through the books. Rome wasn't built in a day you know. Truthkeeper88 ( talk) 18:51, 18 July 2011 (UTC)
Hello! Your submission of Auberge Ravoux at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Jayjg (talk) 02:25, 19 July 2011 (UTC)
Just a note in the pious hope that I may be saved further time and trouble thereby :-{ (from the Oxford English Dictionary)
nail, v. Add: [1.] [d.] Also, to nail a lie (charge, etc.): to expose or put out of circulation (a falsehood, allegation, etc.).
[1624 J. Gee Foot out of Snare v. 33 Heere is a knocking and long-lasting lie, worthy to be nailed upon a post or pillory.] 1895 Funk's Stand. Dict. II. 1175/1 The phrase to nail a lie+was suggested by the nailing of counterfeit coins to the counter by shopkeepers. 1915 E. Pound Let. 1 Dec. (1971) 66, I think however that the charge of my being jealous of Frost ought to be nailed, perhaps even at the disclosure of state secrets. 1987 News on Sunday 12 July 3/3 The caring family man+has risked public ridicule in a bid to ‘nail the lie’ as he put it.
n.b. thus not necessarily an actual lie and its perpetrator not necessarily an actual liar. FightingMac ( talk) 18:27, 19 July 2011 (UTC)
Hello FightingMac. I don't believe we have had the pleasure of corresponding before. I have followed with interest your recent edits to the Van Gogh page but I am becoming increasingly concerned that you are overstepping the mark, particularly in your reactions on the talk page. As you must realize, there are not too many of us who are seriously interested in contributing to the visual arts pages on Wikipedia. Those who are involved generally take their work very seriously. While I have noticed you have made some useful observations and a few pertinent edits in the past week or two, I now think there is a real danger that your rather demanding attitude may well drive people away. Ceoil, who admittedly was not at all civil in your initial exchanges, has obviously decided to withdraw for the time being. TK and Modernist, who have been valiant contributors in the past, are now increasingly concerned about how to proceed. I know also of others who would be happy to contribute at present but are concerned about the unfriendly atmosphere that has developed on the talk page. I have a rather simple but perhaps effective solution to all this. Before undertaking what you consider to be well documented edits in the article, why not bring them up first on the talk page. In that way you can build up consenus and keep everyone happy. If the general consensus is that your suggestions are not appropriate, then you should be prepared to give way or to argue your case more convincingly. Alternatively, if you are so interested in the "Death" section, perhaps it would be helpful to start a new article. The VvG article is getting longer and longer anyway and it would help if some of the sections could refer to better documented "Main articles" such as your Auberge Ravoux. And finally, I must say mea culpa to the present placing of "At Eternity's Gate" on the VvG page. It had been adjacent to the lead until I suggested it was perhaps not appropriate there. Interestingly, it is based on a number of VvG's sketches years before his death and therefore is perhaps not so closely related to his mood over the last few weeks. Anyway, I hope we can all instill more enthusiam (and less antagonism) in this important article. - Ipigott ( talk) 18:16, 21 July 2011 (UTC)
What previous user name(s) have you edited under? -- John ( talk) 09:34, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
Much of the immediately preceding sections refer. Some of the debate on the Talk page has disappeared and is preserved for posterity here for those curious. FightingMac ( talk) 18:45, 24 July 2011 (UTC)
The recent postings you have made with respect to the identity of another user have been suppressed by me not by that other user. The problem is that you are associating the name of a person with a Wikipedia account, outing them. You are free to continue to address this matter, but please do it privately by emailing the arbitration committee, not by posting the person's name. User:Fred Bauder Talk 04:31, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
I am one of the arbitrators. If you have a concern whose discussion may tend to reveal the offline identity of editors who edit anonymously, you may e-mail the committee. Please do not raise these issues again on Wikipedia, as your doing so is a violation of policy (see, WP:OUTING) and may lead to your account being blocked from editing without further warnings. Newyorkbrad ( talk) 12:41, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
A second FfD on File:Dominique Strauss-Kahn perp walk.jpg has been opened. Since you commented at length in the first one, you may want to comment in this one as well. Daniel Case ( talk) 19:27, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
You have been blocked as a sock of indefinitely-blocked User:Rinpoche, as well as for participating in discussions with both a named account and an IP without identifying that you are the same user; using another sock to make an edit while your main account was discussing the same edit on the talk page of an article; and making logged-out edits intended to further battles with other editors. In addition, you have continued to pursue allegations of conflict of interest against various editors through either your named or IP accounts, despite the fact that you yourself have identified familial or other personal relationships with the subjects of several articles you have edited. You may request unblock by completing the {{unblock}} template. Any reviewing administrators should note that this is a checkuser block and should, at minimum, be reviewed by a checkuser prior to consideration of unblocking. Risker ( talk) 04:36, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
You **** **** ***** piece of **** ****** fu**** - what a ***** ***** - Good riddance. Off2riorob ( talk) 20:31, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
My talk page. FightingMac ( talk) 21:44, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
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Hello, FightingMac. I saw your edits to Square root, which I thought were good. Thanks. I also saw your edits to Talk:Square root, where I thought you made good points, though I do wonder how much point there is in replying to talk page posts from long ago: in at least one case over three years ago. At least a couple of your comments were answers to editors that have not edited since 2008. However, I suppose someone other than the original poster may find what you've written useful.
Perhaps more important is your comment about the section "Square roots of negative and complex numbers". I think the sort of problem you describe occurs in quite a number of mathematical articles. Maybe I will find time to think about editing the section some time. JamesBWatson ( talk) 20:45, 16 April 2011 (UTC)
I was personally involved with the production of this film. I was privy to conversations and interactions with many of the people involved with the production including Barry Spikings at EMI. I was informed by people intimately involved with the finances and the ultimate demise of this film, which occurred prior to its release. The film is not anti American, it is just a silly, funny comedy. However, anti-Americanism is the excuse the distributors wished to use for dumping the film and that is the way it was communicated to the press through very powerful press agents at the time (PKM). Although the primary press wrote reviews of the movie as directed, there were several major reviewers who wrote their own opinions. If all the reviews had been like Rex Reed’s in the Daily News (I have a hard copy of the review, but I was unable to find a copy of it on-line) the movie would have been a smash hit, however, it had been decided well before its release that this movie would not make any money and every effort was made by the distributors toward this end. No expense was spared in the effort to kill this movie and it has nothing to do with its content or quality. There were politics behind the scenes that had to do with the finances of this film and the demise of this film was strictly a power play on the part of some very, very powerful studio executives at the time (who are since deceased). It is amazing to me how there are people who are so determined to continue to disseminate the lies and vitriol that was made up about something that was meant to be simply fun entertainment. The budget of the film tells the tale and if anyone editing for Wikipideia can’t see that obvious fact, then I have to wonder why they are editing for a publication that supposedly wants only verifiable facts. The comments made regarding the content of the film being the cause of its failure are the editor’s opinion. I don’t know what the editor ‘s background is, but unless he’s actually been involved in the production of a Hollywood movie, I can’t see how he could begin to understand the mechanism of the Hollywood machinery. The review in the New York Times was not the cause for the failure of this movie it was the result of the failure of the movie, which occurred before any critics ever even saw it for review. While you can verify all the bad reviews you like, it doesn’t account for what actually happened. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Juliacharles ( talk • contribs) 10:28, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
I concur with the need for citations, and will take up the project (have already started thinking about it) to provide same. It will not be a simple matter, and it is not a project that I relish doing. In fact, it will be a painful process. I am all too familiar with the fact that the production of this film was not “fun,” in spite of the fact that the content was meant to be nothing but fun. Some of the research I’ve done so far has started out with how many high profile British (or for that matter any British directors) have ever directed an American comedy.
Although there have been a few foreign born directors of American comedies such as the German born, Ernst Lubitsch, to date I have not found an instance when the director of an American comedy was British. There are also few instances of American directors who have directed American comedies, I came across Terry Gilliam (an American) a long time member of Monty Python who also eventually directed one of their films, (Holy Grail) after easing his way up to the position. For the most part he was so assimilated that most people don’t realize he is American. While it is true that HTF was a British film, the script was written by an American writer and all the actors are American (no Brits using American accents) and it takes place in America. However, given the fact that it had a British director and producer, it has earned the reputation of being anti-American.
The truth is that HTF was never meant to be such a huge “Hollywood” movie. It originally started out as an idea of Don Boyd’s that he intended to both produce and direct as a small independent film. If it had never gotten into the hands of John Schlesinger, there’s no telling what might have happened to it. Most likely the same thing that happens to so many screenplays - nothing. Getting a script made into a movie is a matter of both talent and luck. It is a very flukie process that is mostly in the hands of powerful agents and wheeler dealers who are first and foremost, in my opinion, rogues.
On one hand it could be said that Schlesinger getting a hold of the script was an exciting development. However, this brings us back to the crux of the matter if you ask me, which is the “across the pond” factor. Let’s face it, similar to the fact that many people in the southern United States still wave the Confederate flag, the differences between America and Britain harkens back to colonial days and is clearly illustrated in the first successful American written comedy, The Contrast, by Royal Tyler, written in 1787. Apart from all the machinations of egomaniacal, backstabbing, love you “Darling,” Hollywood, it is alright for us to poke fun at ourselves, but don’t you (Brits) dare say a word about us, ESPECIALLY, making fun of us. Even if Don Boyd had somehow “magically,” successfully managed to produce, direct and distribute HTF, it still would have suffered from this defining “contrast” so to speak.
On the other hand, Schlesinger getting a hold of the script was its death knell. The fact that it was a high profile British director, only contributed to it being a high profile unmitigated disaster. There came a point in the production of the film that John Schlesinger became most acutely aware that the perception would be negative because he was British, combined with his great insecurity about directing comedy in the first place. Whereas, he could get away with it on a drama, as he did with Midnight Cowboy, he realized that comedy was another matter; Since he was British, the movie would be perceived as anti-American. If the director had been American, this perception never could have existed.
Schlesinger manifested this in very insecure behavior and decided somewhere in his mind that he had to do something about it by spending too much money and began spreading the money around as favors that he could cash in on in the future when things went south for him as he was predicting in his mind. All this was going on in his head prior to principal photography. He vacillated between spending and spending, to insulting the executives in the hopes they would cease production and put it on the shelf in mid-stream (which they almost did.) His insecurity became a critical factor and had an insidious effect on the whole production. It infected everyone and at a later date (it took three years to produce) became like a disease that ran to a fevered pitch as it came closer and closer to the film being pushed toward release. He didn’t want the film released in the worst way- he began stepping on people’s toes in the hopes to avoid it. The result was that he made a lot of people very angry at him and they retaliated in the process of distributing the film.
Behind the scenes, people were running around like chickens with their heads cut off trying to patch up their financial losses as a consequence of Schlesinger’s spending spree, and consequently sold the ancillary rights (including the video cassette rights, which at the time was a brand new medium.) All this, was on top of the “Roy Tucker Tax Avoidance” business. This is how it turned into such a train wreck and it all happened way before any critics saw the movie that was released in August, 1981. In screenings for the critics the reception was initially quite good, but as the story unfolded and people began to retaliate by exercising their power, anything positive got buried underneath a landslide of reviews that focused on the American comedy directed by a British director aspect. No fun whatsoever!
And the person it was the least fun for was the writer. Everyone agreed for a first screenplay, it was extremely promising. If it had not been put under the microscope of being such a high profile British run debacle, the writer would most likely have had a stellar career. I found a short review in Variety, but I have never read the “Variety” review you cite, and I have ordered a copy of it and will receive it in the mail soon, as I have not been able to find it on line (thankfully) I am not looking forward to reading it after all these years because I’m sure it will not be “fun.” Please don’t republish it. When I have gathered all my sources together and put all my ducks in a row, I will attempt to write a paragraph as you’ve described with citations, in order to possibly set the record straight with respect to HTF. I will thank you in advance for your consideration towards me and will appreciate any cooperation you might provide.
I apologize if my previous message was "harsh" towards you. I do not normally edit Wikipedia and have only come to this "stub" as it pertains to me personally. I am not adept in this area and have fumbled my way to even finally find this discussion page, but it seems necessary at this point in time for me to give it a directed amount of attention and somehow figure out a way to set the record straight. I will do my very best to provide the citations you require. Juliacharles 11:18, 1 May 2011 (UTC) Juliacharles 12:56, 30 April 2011 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Juliacharles (talk • contribs)--Juliacharles 11:27, 1 May 2011 (UTC) —Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Juliacharles (
talk •
contribs) For example - I don't understand why there is an indication that this is unsigned when I have folowed the instructions and insterted the 4 marks as required.--Juliacharles
12:29, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
Do you mind if I put a wee colon in your comment on that IMF fellow's page to separate our comments? It's a small thing, but I wanted your permission to do so first. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | Say Shalom! 03:00, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
Hi FightingMac, I'm a French journalist and I'm writing an article about the inside debate between Wikipedia contributors about the Dominique Strauss-Kahn page. You might not notice but there's a great difference of treatment between the French WP and the English one. I would like to ask you a few question about that if you can give me a little bit of your time today. Here you can contact me : guaranaseven@hotmail.com
Thank you. Regards, Antoine
-- Guaranaseven ( talk) 14:25, 19 May 2011 (UTC)
These people have nothing to do with this case - please do not replace it again - is is not a soapbox article for opinionated groups. NOBLANKING is just an essay with no support as policy or guideline. Off2riorob ( talk) 23:58, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
Hey - we are edit warring now WP:3RR - is knocking at the door - as I said blanking is an essay -such opinionated comment do not belong in the article. Off2riorob ( talk) 00:08, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
Hi, but I beg to differ about 'we'. It's you who is edit warring. I'm sorry you had a knock at the door from WP:3RR but whose fault is that? The feminist and anti-sexist reaction is here to stay as far as I'm concerned, Off2riorob, and I didn't even create it. Thank you. FightingMac ( talk) 00:16, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
Just dropping by (I'm off out for the day) to mention; you keep using NOBLANKING. But this is an essay which indicates that blanking sections may violate policy, then explains ways in which policies might be violated. It is an essay written completely by Wikid77, with whom I've had a lot of dealings - his views on policy tend to be somewhat "off the wall", and he has a history of writing essays to support his viewpoints (or to keep his content in an article). NOBLANKING is unlikely to hold much sway in the wider community (where it is accepted that your content will end up being deleted outright at some point) and indeed itself "violates" some of our core policies about removing material :) If you are going to use NOBLANKING I suggest explaining specifically why the blanking might violate policy, and which one. -- Errant ( chat!) 09:52, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
Thanks for uploading File:Tristane Banon 31 janvier 2001.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status and its source. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously.
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See Talk:Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case#Libelous_or_contentious_additions article talk page quoted below:
See here for examples of the sort of thing I complain of and which is impossible to deal with. I do think these very contentious BLP pages need to better policed against WP:CRUSH editors. What this page will be like when the going really gets dirty god knows. FightingMac ( talk) 07:25, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
Wikipedia takes personal attacks against other editors fairly seriously. That includes many comments you've made on the talk page of DSK over the last few weeks, including numerous insults and gratuitous sarcasm. They are all disruptive and clear violations of civil behavior. Please delete all such personal attacks that you've made from all the DSK talk pages. When in doubt, I'd suggest deleting it. Thanks. -- Wikiwatcher1 ( talk) 05:44, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
Please note that per earlier comments by me and others, I will be deleting any and all article talk page posts that appear to violate guidelines against personal attacks, against me, whether directly by name, or indirectly by insinuation. A sampling of the guidelines FYI:
As a matter of polite and effective discourse, comments should not be personalized. That is, they should be directed at content and actions rather than people. . . .Editors should be civil and adhere to good wiki etiquette when describing disagreements. The appropriate response to an inflammatory statement is to address the issues of content . . . . Linking to external attacks, harassment, or other material, for the purpose of attacking another editor. . . . Accusations about personal behavior that lack evidence. . . . Removing unquestionable personal attacks from your own user talk page is rarely a matter of concern. On other talk pages, especially where such text is directed against you, removal should typically be limited to clear-cut cases where it is obvious the text is a true personal attack. . . . Although editors are encouraged to ignore or respond politely to isolated personal attacks, that should not imply that they are acceptable or without consequences. A pattern of hostility reduces the likelihood of the community assuming good faith, and can be considered disruptive editing. Users who insist on a confrontational style marked by personal attacks are likely to become involved in the dispute resolution process, and may face serious consequences through arbitration . . .
-- Wikiwatcher1 ( talk) 18:27, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
Mac, I've avoided responding to your ongoing comments about me, but you nonetheless continue to attack me personally rather than simply commenting on the substance of my edits or comments. Unfortunately, your latest edit summary here goes even further than your previous comments. Please respect WP:PERSONAL and stop.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 01:07, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
Please stop doing this, external wikis are not reliable sources and should not be inline linked like that, thanks. Off2riorob ( talk) 18:53, 18 June 2011 (UTC)
I've started a topic on WP:EAR that involves you. See here.-- Bbb23 ( talk) 19:00, 18 June 2011 (UTC)
Hi, you mentioned the Polanski BLP. What was your username on that article at that time? Did you work on the Frederic Mitterand issue? Or is this account the only identity you have edit under here at en Wikipedia? Off2riorob ( talk) 19:05, 18 June 2011 (UTC)
[outdent]First a remark befor an edit conflict:
I'll pass on that ;-) What do you think? I mean I get the impression that many committed editors get blocked sooner or later until they realise the errors of their ways, the more so if they take on genuinely difficult editors as you do. But as I've mentioned before my experience with Wikipedia has generally been in quiter waters than present turbulent conditions. I'm not up for arb committee or anything here, Off2riorob, nor will I ever be nor anything of the sort, if only because I am extremely busy with my own work and couldn't possibly afford the time Wikipedia enthusiasts put in. I gathered from your own arb application you work 8 till late. I couldn't begin to offer that degree of commitment. There's nothing here that need concern you, really.
Secondly I absolutely have not been investigating and quoting your edit history to other editors with the exception of ErrantX we've already discussed. Has Wikiwatcher1 been winding you up over this? The position is that you were accusing me at that time of POV pushing feminism and threatening to ban me from the page. We've been through this. Why are we going back over this ground? We really don't need to. I'll be happy to set the record straight wherever you want me to. FightingMac ( talk) 22:20, 18 June 2011 (UTC)
Personally I don't usually have a problem with the Mail except when it's reporting celebrity crap. But you are readding links to it in an article where there are already longer, better written references. Four different references for a couple of statements is utterly unnecessary, as are links to foreign language sources when English ones are easily available. Nevard ( talk) 01:49, 23 June 2011 (UTC)
Thanks for the input on this re: the Nazi book burning article. I'm real reluctant to get into edit wars -- I've read too many anecdotes of people quitting work on WP after getting sick and tired of the politics spoiling their contribution experience. I was just going to let it stand because it wasn't a deal breaker in terms of the article, but after what you've said, I'll re-revert John Nevard's changes. Thanks! Wingman4l7 ( talk)
Still on my todo list - I have a few things to get out of the way first sadly :) Sorry for jumping down your throat today - please don't take it personally. Paraphrasing is a perennial and potentially disastrous problem, unfortunately. Ill wait to see what MRG has to say - I could be going to hard on this. -- Errant ( chat!) 00:08, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
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Hi, just a note to remind you to please add - {{NOINDEX}} - to articles you are working on in your userspace to stop the crawl bots from publishing them to the WWW. Thanks. Off2riorob ( talk) 20:02, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
This - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:ELNO#Links_normally_to_be_avoided - is relating to External links in the external link section not inline links. Off2riorob ( talk) 20:56, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
(edit conflict)
I am not going to talk round in circles - I have posted issues on the Talk:Tristane_Banon#External_links section, as I suggested to you, start a WP:RFC or show me where it is common practice on this wikipedia that you have done it often on this wiki. Off2riorob ( talk) 21:48, 2 July 2011 (UTC)
[Outdent]
As I noted there, I see you have followed me to the Help desk. I find that a bit creepy and on reflection I'll spend time going through the resolution process, archiving it as I proceed.
Progress so far is that I took the dispute to the Talk page of the article you issued the edit warring notice from and I've sought help from the Help desk. Nevertheless you still haven't addressed any of the three issues I raise 1 why you are deleting these links when you agree they are not against policy 2 when they are not being used as RS as was your original concern 3 why my fresh approach, formatting as Michèle Sabban (see French Wikipedia article), as recommended by Help:Interlanguage_links#Purpose to deal with your new concerns about reader expectations was immediately reverted by you without explanantion and a 3R edit-warring warning released instead.
Give these some time to produce results and then let's proceed to the next stage of the resolution process. You suggest a RFC so let's do an RFC. You can start or I shall. Don't mind. Let me know but please stop hounding me. That is likely to upset me. FightingMac ( talk) 14:35, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
I've asked for a Third opinion here since this seems to be a two editor affair. See what comes of that. FightingMac ( talk) 05:54, 4 July 2011 (UTC)
The Barnstar of Good Humor | |
For displaying a rather jolly sense of humour about a fairly sordid set of circumstances in the DSK sex abuse article, and particularly the talk page Egg Centric 16:27, 3 July 2011 (UTC) |
Thank you so much, Egg Centric! Appreciated. FightingMac ( talk) 16:50, 3 July 2011 (UTC)
Don't worry. I hadn't noticed! I've no idea why the caurt case was moved to a separate page. That's not necessary with such a short article. The moving editor created a formatting chaos. Paul B ( talk) 18:56, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
I am happy to take your comment as a compliment - "Off2riorob's extremely cogent observation" I do stand up for my position, or rather my best understanding of policy as I see you do and I do sometimes fall out with users that disagree but one think I am always open to is revisiting and re-evaluating and making up and leaving what is in the past behind, no worries, Rob - Off2riorob ( talk) 22:06, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
Doh!
I have been lazily calling him "Kahn" in the talk pages just to save some typing. But I can't believe I did so in the article. If you fixed that, thanks.
-- Bob drobbs ( talk) 04:29, 6 July 2011 (UTC)
Hi Bob. Wasn't me who fixed. I was amused :-). Don't worry. We all do it. Just a tip in case you're new to posting. Rowing in like that, changing section headers and so on without discussion on the Talk page is probably quite a lot bolder than you perhaps ought to be right now. An awful lot of water, really a lot, got swept under the bridge discussing headers in the early days of this article and I know ErrantX spent a lot of time, I mean really a lot of time, sorting all that out. Changing headers and stuff as you fancy is fairly dickish in my view. A lot of people don't like loads of subsections. It usually just means the editor can't cope with paragraphs. No, seriously. However, whatever you feel comfortable with ... FightingMac ( talk) 04:58, 6 July 2011 (UTC)
You currently appear to be engaged in an
edit war. Users are expected to
collaborate with others and avoid editing
disruptively.
In particular, the three-revert rule states that:
If you find yourself in an editing dispute, use the article's talk page to discuss controversial changes; work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at an appropriate noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases it may be appropriate to request temporary page protection. If you continue to edit war, you may be blocked from editing without further notice.
- - - - -
You have done at minimum 5 reverts in the past 24 hours. Not only my changes, but wikiwatcher's and Pat's and more.
Please, as the template says, seek to find consensus and negotiations with other editors rather than reverting their work.
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438218357
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438299649
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438290567
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438290083
http://en.wikipedia.org/?title=Dominique_Strauss-Kahn_sexual_assault_case&oldid=438301721
-- Bob drobbs ( talk) 21:30, 7 July 2011 (UTC)
We've reached resolution on this, so there is no fall out (which is why 3RR exists). I came very close to asking for article protection earlier and I am pleased that the matter got resolved fairly simply in the end. I noted Mac, that you have done quite a few RV's today - although I never made a big deal of it because the article has been through the mill the last few days and some cut and thrust is inevitable. Although the tension has been high and some decorum has been lost it is definitely not as bad as some articles I have worked on (where the abuse just *flies* and article content seems mostly secondary!). However with that said, WP:3RR is one of the most bright lines we have - no matter if you are right to the nines it is something never to be broken. Not to preach of course, I've clicked RV one too many times on a fast moving article, and done in good faith most admins will accept the mistake. But the point of 3RR is to avoid situations like today - both of you reverted too much - and the discussion/resolution could have happened a lot earlier than it did. 3RR is not there as a way to get people blocked (though sadly it is used that way far too often) but as a hard limit to force discussion and compromise :) So just to say; I don't think anyone did wrong and between the 5 or 6 of us (yep, including WW) we've ended up with some decent material. Good job. -- Errant ( chat!) 23:08, 7 July 2011 (UTC)
The Resilient Barnstar | |
Knowing you're a Scotsman, I hope you don't mind me saying that you're sometimes stubborn and sarcastic (like many I know); but I've always liked that in people. And more often than not you are right (and the rest of the time I am ;)). Thanks for sticking the article - I know it is a frustration and tense, but you would not still be here if you didn't love it.
The article would not be as good as it is without your efforts! Errant ( chat!) 23:11, 7 July 2011 (UTC) |
FYI NickCT ( talk) 00:57, 10 July 2011 (UTC)
I'm sorry, but both you and ErrantX are 100% wrong here.
There is absolutely nothing in WP:BLP which says that the facts of a libel case cannot be listed. Please read it!! WP:BLP simply says that things have to be well-referenced.
Beyond that, there is a long precedent here. In each of these notable libel cases, the article discusses what the claimed libel was: Ashley Olson World Net Daily Jose Santos
e.g. "In 2005, Ashley filed a $40 million lawsuit against tabloid magazine National Enquirer for printing a headline reading "Ashley Olsen Caught In Drug Scandal,"
Now, please think about this seriously.
Why can we list the libel against Ashley Olsen, Jose Santos, and Clark Jones, but not the details of a lawsuit filed by housekeeper whom we can't even name??
Are you now going to start deleting important, notable, and well-reference material from all of those pages too. I hope not. But if you are, will you _please_ seek out advice from other editors and truly understand WP:BLP before you continue your habit of reverting the work of other editors!
-- Bob drobbs ( talk) 06:41, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
Hi Bob,
That was my thinking too when I first presented, through an edit, the libel case but I got a serious ticking off from ErrantX for doing it (I mean I was up all night agonising and even broke cover over it so conflicted I was) and I'm inclined to think he's probably right and give him the benefit of the doubt. I mean I just don't have time to go through the entire Wikipedia policy corpus, no way I'm ever going to put up myself for admin me, but I can see where a policy of never mentioning the nature of a libel might make sense in a BLP. At any rate EX adjured us to think long and hard about it and that at least I hope you will do. Of course I won't revert you again.
It's not "about winning" but all the same one does rather want to emerge on the winning side, that's only natural. Three things I suggest you don't want to take sides too closely on young Bob 1 the Fulani phone call 2 the prostitution libel 3 the going into another room to clean it after getting herself gob-fucked (I mean she was there all right, but less than a minute on leaked key-data).
Just friendly strictly non-attributive advice. Bed-time again here. What was your take on the Gaza flotilla by the way? Just curious, not one of the things I felt moved to make another addition to my sock-farm over :-). I was sympathetic to the Israeli version myself (hope that doesn't return a flood of invective) but I do sometimes thinks that supporters of the cause are often their worst own enemies. St. Mel of the Mail for a start, unhappily departed from The Spectator coffee-house over her own recent little libel difficulties.
I rather admire you sticking it in there. Keep me posted. Regards FightingMac ( talk) 07:25, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
I'm not impressed by you, your edits to wheatfield were poor, and given that you are a new account who obviously has no problem with socking and inventing eloberate stories (a cousin null editing the Lavrentiy Beria article over and over to pass autoconfirm so she could agree with you on a sex scandal artice talk), be warned, I'm watching, not impressed. I'm not an admin, but wont tolerate you folowing me about either. Reply here, if you edit my talk I'll revert you. Ceoil 11:41, 16 July 2011 (UTC)
I think your edits to Vincent van Gogh have been pointy and I think that comments such as this are as incivil as the incivility you complain about. Ceoil has given you and opportunity above to discuss - do so. Explain why you're following him around, and why a new account's first edit shows such knowledge of Wikipedia. Maybe you have an alternative account, maybe you edit on other wikis. I've been plagued and harassed by sockpuppets recently as have editors who collaborate with me, so an explanation would be helpful at this point. And toning down would be extremely helpful. Truthkeeper88 ( talk) 14:20, 17 July 2011 (UTC)
Hi, back again. I thought I'd leave the thread above to you and Ceoil. Regarding death - I understand that you don't like the description, but I have about 7 books stacked up, dunno should probably count them, and each one says the same thing. I decided to source to the one that came closest to the current wording - simply because I'm lazy and have spent a lot of time tidying the page. Meant to tell you btw, in the tidying I had to throw out your weblinks for the funeral and the reburial section, and added a book source, so hope you don't mind too much. If you want an alternate opinion regarding the last paintings, go ahead and post again on the talk page, or keep it here, but give me a chance to look through the books. Rome wasn't built in a day you know. Truthkeeper88 ( talk) 18:51, 18 July 2011 (UTC)
Hello! Your submission of Auberge Ravoux at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Jayjg (talk) 02:25, 19 July 2011 (UTC)
Just a note in the pious hope that I may be saved further time and trouble thereby :-{ (from the Oxford English Dictionary)
nail, v. Add: [1.] [d.] Also, to nail a lie (charge, etc.): to expose or put out of circulation (a falsehood, allegation, etc.).
[1624 J. Gee Foot out of Snare v. 33 Heere is a knocking and long-lasting lie, worthy to be nailed upon a post or pillory.] 1895 Funk's Stand. Dict. II. 1175/1 The phrase to nail a lie+was suggested by the nailing of counterfeit coins to the counter by shopkeepers. 1915 E. Pound Let. 1 Dec. (1971) 66, I think however that the charge of my being jealous of Frost ought to be nailed, perhaps even at the disclosure of state secrets. 1987 News on Sunday 12 July 3/3 The caring family man+has risked public ridicule in a bid to ‘nail the lie’ as he put it.
n.b. thus not necessarily an actual lie and its perpetrator not necessarily an actual liar. FightingMac ( talk) 18:27, 19 July 2011 (UTC)
Hello FightingMac. I don't believe we have had the pleasure of corresponding before. I have followed with interest your recent edits to the Van Gogh page but I am becoming increasingly concerned that you are overstepping the mark, particularly in your reactions on the talk page. As you must realize, there are not too many of us who are seriously interested in contributing to the visual arts pages on Wikipedia. Those who are involved generally take their work very seriously. While I have noticed you have made some useful observations and a few pertinent edits in the past week or two, I now think there is a real danger that your rather demanding attitude may well drive people away. Ceoil, who admittedly was not at all civil in your initial exchanges, has obviously decided to withdraw for the time being. TK and Modernist, who have been valiant contributors in the past, are now increasingly concerned about how to proceed. I know also of others who would be happy to contribute at present but are concerned about the unfriendly atmosphere that has developed on the talk page. I have a rather simple but perhaps effective solution to all this. Before undertaking what you consider to be well documented edits in the article, why not bring them up first on the talk page. In that way you can build up consenus and keep everyone happy. If the general consensus is that your suggestions are not appropriate, then you should be prepared to give way or to argue your case more convincingly. Alternatively, if you are so interested in the "Death" section, perhaps it would be helpful to start a new article. The VvG article is getting longer and longer anyway and it would help if some of the sections could refer to better documented "Main articles" such as your Auberge Ravoux. And finally, I must say mea culpa to the present placing of "At Eternity's Gate" on the VvG page. It had been adjacent to the lead until I suggested it was perhaps not appropriate there. Interestingly, it is based on a number of VvG's sketches years before his death and therefore is perhaps not so closely related to his mood over the last few weeks. Anyway, I hope we can all instill more enthusiam (and less antagonism) in this important article. - Ipigott ( talk) 18:16, 21 July 2011 (UTC)
What previous user name(s) have you edited under? -- John ( talk) 09:34, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
Much of the immediately preceding sections refer. Some of the debate on the Talk page has disappeared and is preserved for posterity here for those curious. FightingMac ( talk) 18:45, 24 July 2011 (UTC)
The recent postings you have made with respect to the identity of another user have been suppressed by me not by that other user. The problem is that you are associating the name of a person with a Wikipedia account, outing them. You are free to continue to address this matter, but please do it privately by emailing the arbitration committee, not by posting the person's name. User:Fred Bauder Talk 04:31, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
I am one of the arbitrators. If you have a concern whose discussion may tend to reveal the offline identity of editors who edit anonymously, you may e-mail the committee. Please do not raise these issues again on Wikipedia, as your doing so is a violation of policy (see, WP:OUTING) and may lead to your account being blocked from editing without further warnings. Newyorkbrad ( talk) 12:41, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
A second FfD on File:Dominique Strauss-Kahn perp walk.jpg has been opened. Since you commented at length in the first one, you may want to comment in this one as well. Daniel Case ( talk) 19:27, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
You have been blocked as a sock of indefinitely-blocked User:Rinpoche, as well as for participating in discussions with both a named account and an IP without identifying that you are the same user; using another sock to make an edit while your main account was discussing the same edit on the talk page of an article; and making logged-out edits intended to further battles with other editors. In addition, you have continued to pursue allegations of conflict of interest against various editors through either your named or IP accounts, despite the fact that you yourself have identified familial or other personal relationships with the subjects of several articles you have edited. You may request unblock by completing the {{unblock}} template. Any reviewing administrators should note that this is a checkuser block and should, at minimum, be reviewed by a checkuser prior to consideration of unblocking. Risker ( talk) 04:36, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
You **** **** ***** piece of **** ****** fu**** - what a ***** ***** - Good riddance. Off2riorob ( talk) 20:31, 29 July 2011 (UTC)