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Thank you for your recent edits. Please note that the public being given the "choice" of selecting 7 of the board members (from a pre approved list not drawn up by the public) is not the same as having ownership and control as stockholders. I appreciate that the sources provided aren't clear, but there must be a middle ground - could we keep most of the substance of User:Mrpoisson's edits? Beganlocal ( talk) 21:41, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
Please be sure to follow wikipedia guidelines WP:POV when making edits and use the relevant discussion page especially when removing well cited material. Yourmanstan ( talk) 17:21, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
Hi Dark Charles,
Thanks for your tireless work on Capitol Hill Babysitting Co-op!
I notice that you’ve integrated my edits into the body of the article; while the changes are generally fine, the removal of “fiat” as in “the scrip is fiat money” is incorrect – the scrip emphatically is fiat money, which is the whole point of Neo-Chartalism. Fiat money means that the government can issue it at will, without it being backed by gold or any other commodity. I understand the confusion given Wikipedia’s vague definition (“not convertible into anything”) – what this system is is a “fiat money system with price controls”. Concretely, the money cannot be redeemed (with the government) for gold or other goods – nor can you force someone to redeem your scrip – you can only offer it (a market economy), which is different from going to Fort Knox, waving a wad of bills and demanding your gold.
Of course, since the standard at Wikipedia is not truth but verifiability, (Mitchell 2009) writes:
I have accordingly restored the statement that it is a fiat money system.
I’d be happy to elaborate or discuss or collaborate further on this article – thanks for all your hard work.
Hello, I believe you're mistaken. Here's Wikipedia's source for the fixed price part of the fiat definition (emphasis added):
The reason for the distinction is that, in some sense, you can argue that the currency (in our case scrip) is actually backed by a good or service (in our case babysitting). It's just that the convertibility is at times suspended. If you let the price of babysitting, in terms of scrip, float, then it would be fiat, though.-- Dark Charles ( talk) 21:05, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
Hello there. Sorry to bother you, but you are (titularly at least) a member of WP:WikiProject Economics, as defined by this category. If you don't know me, I'm a Wikipedia administrator, but an unqualified economist. I enjoy writing about economics, but I'm not very good at it, which is why I would like to support in any way I can the strong body of economists here on Wikipedia. I'm only bothering you because you are probably one of them. Together, I'd like us to establish the future direction of WikiProject Economics, but first, we need to know who we've got to help.
Whatever your area of expertise or level of qualification, if you're interested in helping with the WikiProject (even if only as part of a larger commitment to this wonderful online encyclopedia of ours), would you mind adding your signature to this page? It only takes a second. Thank you.
Message delivered on behalf of User:Jarry1250 by LivingBot.
20:54, 11 July 2010 (UTC)
Be careful of [[WP:3RR] on the article - you're getting close/at the limit. I think Yourmanstan is over it, but I've only just warned him after reverting the change. Ravensfire ( talk) 21:31, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Please see the talk page about Schiff, and please try to understand the meaning of economic predictions. It is not about getting the date right, its about getting the trend right. The USD made record lows throughout 2009 and is continuing to do so to this day, with new all time lows against gold. These are facts and they prove Schiff right. Misessus ( talk) 16:57, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
The rule says: "Wikipedia articles must not contain original research. The term "original research" (OR) is used on Wikipedia to refer to material—such as facts, allegations, ideas, and stories—for which no reliable published source exists.[1] That includes any analysis or synthesis of published material that serves to advance a position not advanced by the sources."
Thomas Woods is a Harvard and Columbia trained, NYT best selling historian. The talk cited is a lecture delivered at a Mises event. How is that OR? Even Samuelson in his false prediction said that the USSR would overtake the US probably by 1990, but at the latest 2015. A 25 year time span, not what you would call very precise, is it? That is the nature of economic predictions, explained by Woods.
Regarding the other sources, it was CNN for heaven's sake!!! How is WSJ article written by people who basically are Schiff's competitors more reliable than CNN? The other source shows a chart of the price of gold. Are you seriously claiming that the price of gold in terms of USD has -not- gone up, i.e. that the USD has dropped significantly?
You keep citing WP-rules with the typical arrogance of a bully, yet you obviously don't know what they mean. And besides, take a look at the talk page. This issue has been discussed before and there is no consensus or even support for including the WSJ article, none whatsoever. Misessus ( talk) 23:38, 26 July 2011 (UTC)
I have copied&pasted the BigK discussion to WT:ECON. If you wish, let's continue the conversation there. -- S. Rich ( talk) 21:15, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
I'm glad that you tend to agree that this edit is fine. I would be interested to know what kind of evidence I need to provide in order to convince you to reinstate it. -- Vision Thing -- 20:01, 23 August 2011 (UTC)
DC, I think you are misconstruing the application of WP:BURDEN. It says: "The burden of evidence lies with the editor who adds or restores material. You may remove any material lacking a reliable source that directly supports it."
In this edit: [1] you removed a text and a reference plus a sentence about what Hayek says which was supported by a quote from Hayek himself. The editor(s) who put that material there met the burden -- that is, the material was supported by WP:RS.
Now if the RS did not support what the text said, then tagging the text/ref as failed verification would be appropriate. (Orif there was no RS then removal would be appropriate as quoted above.
As I view these various edits, it looks like you want to remove the material more because you disagree with the material. (Am I mistaken?) If that is so, then your simple disagreement with the material is not a valid reason for removing it -- WP does not care about "truth". And it has even less tolerance for POV.
Also, your edit summary of BURDEN confuses the issue as to what or why you reverted that particular edit. Are you saying there is a burden regarding the COI issue? E.g., did you revert my edit because I did not meet some burden about showing a lack of COI? (Please note that I reverted an edit which restored the text to the latest version that I had created. In effect I was reverting the changes which restored my own text!) I reverted because Lawrencekhoo's edit summary cited COI as a problem. But how does COI come in to play? If he is alleging COI, he should specify. If not, then he should WP:AGF.
Again, DC, I have seen you use this BURDEN tag as a justification for various edits -- but this justification, as you apply it, is not well-founded. -- S. Rich ( talk) 17:07, 1 September 2011 (UTC)
{{
cite book}}
: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (
link)/ref (text portion) In response, Austrian School adherent historian
Thomas Woods has argued in his book
Meltdown that the crashes were caused by various privately-owned banks (with state charters) which issued paper money, supposedly convertible to gold, in amounts greatly exceeding their gold reserves. ref {cite book |last=Woods |first=Thomas E., Jr. |title=Meltdown: A Free-Market Look at Why the Stock Market Collapsed, the Economy Tanked, and Government Bailouts Will Make Things Worse |publisher=Regnery Publishing, Inc. |year=2009 |edition=1st |pages=88–94 |isbn=9781596985872 }/refCharles, your restoration of the criticism has a cite error. (I don't know if the error was included previously.) Can you fix it? -- S. Rich ( talk) 01:47, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
Please Charles, be precise in your edits. Krugman did not use the word "failure" in his piece -- it was used by some of the reader comments to Krugman's blog. But as you know those reader comments are not RS. Nor did Krugman imply anything about out the Austrians not using explicit gobbledy-gook as being "more generally". -- S. Rich ( talk) 06:55, 22 September 2011 (UTC)
[3] First, it isn’t. Second, it would not be a valid argument at all: see WP:MOSINTRO. Incnis Mrsi ( talk) 21:28, 20 July 2013 (UTC)
Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current
Arbitration Committee election. The
Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia
arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose
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the voting page. For the Election committee,
MediaWiki message delivery (
talk) 14:01, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current
Arbitration Committee election. The
Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia
arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose
site bans,
topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The
arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to
review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on
the voting page. For the Election committee,
MediaWiki message delivery (
talk) 14:11, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Hello, Dark Charles. Voting in the 2016 Arbitration Committee elections is open from Monday, 00:00, 21 November through Sunday, 23:59, 4 December to all unblocked users who have registered an account before Wednesday, 00:00, 28 October 2016 and have made at least 150 mainspace edits before Sunday, 00:00, 1 November 2016.
The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.
If you wish to participate in the 2016 election, please review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 22:08, 21 November 2016 (UTC)
tremble
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).{{
cite journal}}
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(
help); Unknown parameter |month=
ignored (
help)
{{
cite book}}
: Invalid |ref=harv
(
help)
{{
cite book}}
: Invalid |ref=harv
(
help)
{{
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: Invalid |ref=harv
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{{
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This user may have left Wikipedia. Dark Charles has not edited Wikipedia since 24 July 2019. As a result, any requests made here may not receive a response. If you are seeking assistance, you may need to approach someone else. |
|
Thanks for uploading relativity. You don't seem to have indicated the license status of the image. Wikipedia uses a set of image copyright tags to indicate this information; to add a tag to the image, select the appropriate tag from this list, click on this link, then click "Edit this page" and add the tag to the image's description. If there doesn't seem to be a suitable tag, the image is probably not appropriate for use on Wikipedia.
For help in choosing the correct tag, or for any other questions, leave a message on Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. Thank you for your cooperation. -- ImageTaggingBot ( talk) 08:05, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
Thank you for your recent edits. Please note that the public being given the "choice" of selecting 7 of the board members (from a pre approved list not drawn up by the public) is not the same as having ownership and control as stockholders. I appreciate that the sources provided aren't clear, but there must be a middle ground - could we keep most of the substance of User:Mrpoisson's edits? Beganlocal ( talk) 21:41, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
Please be sure to follow wikipedia guidelines WP:POV when making edits and use the relevant discussion page especially when removing well cited material. Yourmanstan ( talk) 17:21, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
Hi Dark Charles,
Thanks for your tireless work on Capitol Hill Babysitting Co-op!
I notice that you’ve integrated my edits into the body of the article; while the changes are generally fine, the removal of “fiat” as in “the scrip is fiat money” is incorrect – the scrip emphatically is fiat money, which is the whole point of Neo-Chartalism. Fiat money means that the government can issue it at will, without it being backed by gold or any other commodity. I understand the confusion given Wikipedia’s vague definition (“not convertible into anything”) – what this system is is a “fiat money system with price controls”. Concretely, the money cannot be redeemed (with the government) for gold or other goods – nor can you force someone to redeem your scrip – you can only offer it (a market economy), which is different from going to Fort Knox, waving a wad of bills and demanding your gold.
Of course, since the standard at Wikipedia is not truth but verifiability, (Mitchell 2009) writes:
I have accordingly restored the statement that it is a fiat money system.
I’d be happy to elaborate or discuss or collaborate further on this article – thanks for all your hard work.
Hello, I believe you're mistaken. Here's Wikipedia's source for the fixed price part of the fiat definition (emphasis added):
The reason for the distinction is that, in some sense, you can argue that the currency (in our case scrip) is actually backed by a good or service (in our case babysitting). It's just that the convertibility is at times suspended. If you let the price of babysitting, in terms of scrip, float, then it would be fiat, though.-- Dark Charles ( talk) 21:05, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
Hello there. Sorry to bother you, but you are (titularly at least) a member of WP:WikiProject Economics, as defined by this category. If you don't know me, I'm a Wikipedia administrator, but an unqualified economist. I enjoy writing about economics, but I'm not very good at it, which is why I would like to support in any way I can the strong body of economists here on Wikipedia. I'm only bothering you because you are probably one of them. Together, I'd like us to establish the future direction of WikiProject Economics, but first, we need to know who we've got to help.
Whatever your area of expertise or level of qualification, if you're interested in helping with the WikiProject (even if only as part of a larger commitment to this wonderful online encyclopedia of ours), would you mind adding your signature to this page? It only takes a second. Thank you.
Message delivered on behalf of User:Jarry1250 by LivingBot.
20:54, 11 July 2010 (UTC)
Be careful of [[WP:3RR] on the article - you're getting close/at the limit. I think Yourmanstan is over it, but I've only just warned him after reverting the change. Ravensfire ( talk) 21:31, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Please see the talk page about Schiff, and please try to understand the meaning of economic predictions. It is not about getting the date right, its about getting the trend right. The USD made record lows throughout 2009 and is continuing to do so to this day, with new all time lows against gold. These are facts and they prove Schiff right. Misessus ( talk) 16:57, 25 July 2011 (UTC)
The rule says: "Wikipedia articles must not contain original research. The term "original research" (OR) is used on Wikipedia to refer to material—such as facts, allegations, ideas, and stories—for which no reliable published source exists.[1] That includes any analysis or synthesis of published material that serves to advance a position not advanced by the sources."
Thomas Woods is a Harvard and Columbia trained, NYT best selling historian. The talk cited is a lecture delivered at a Mises event. How is that OR? Even Samuelson in his false prediction said that the USSR would overtake the US probably by 1990, but at the latest 2015. A 25 year time span, not what you would call very precise, is it? That is the nature of economic predictions, explained by Woods.
Regarding the other sources, it was CNN for heaven's sake!!! How is WSJ article written by people who basically are Schiff's competitors more reliable than CNN? The other source shows a chart of the price of gold. Are you seriously claiming that the price of gold in terms of USD has -not- gone up, i.e. that the USD has dropped significantly?
You keep citing WP-rules with the typical arrogance of a bully, yet you obviously don't know what they mean. And besides, take a look at the talk page. This issue has been discussed before and there is no consensus or even support for including the WSJ article, none whatsoever. Misessus ( talk) 23:38, 26 July 2011 (UTC)
I have copied&pasted the BigK discussion to WT:ECON. If you wish, let's continue the conversation there. -- S. Rich ( talk) 21:15, 22 August 2011 (UTC)
I'm glad that you tend to agree that this edit is fine. I would be interested to know what kind of evidence I need to provide in order to convince you to reinstate it. -- Vision Thing -- 20:01, 23 August 2011 (UTC)
DC, I think you are misconstruing the application of WP:BURDEN. It says: "The burden of evidence lies with the editor who adds or restores material. You may remove any material lacking a reliable source that directly supports it."
In this edit: [1] you removed a text and a reference plus a sentence about what Hayek says which was supported by a quote from Hayek himself. The editor(s) who put that material there met the burden -- that is, the material was supported by WP:RS.
Now if the RS did not support what the text said, then tagging the text/ref as failed verification would be appropriate. (Orif there was no RS then removal would be appropriate as quoted above.
As I view these various edits, it looks like you want to remove the material more because you disagree with the material. (Am I mistaken?) If that is so, then your simple disagreement with the material is not a valid reason for removing it -- WP does not care about "truth". And it has even less tolerance for POV.
Also, your edit summary of BURDEN confuses the issue as to what or why you reverted that particular edit. Are you saying there is a burden regarding the COI issue? E.g., did you revert my edit because I did not meet some burden about showing a lack of COI? (Please note that I reverted an edit which restored the text to the latest version that I had created. In effect I was reverting the changes which restored my own text!) I reverted because Lawrencekhoo's edit summary cited COI as a problem. But how does COI come in to play? If he is alleging COI, he should specify. If not, then he should WP:AGF.
Again, DC, I have seen you use this BURDEN tag as a justification for various edits -- but this justification, as you apply it, is not well-founded. -- S. Rich ( talk) 17:07, 1 September 2011 (UTC)
{{
cite book}}
: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (
link)/ref (text portion) In response, Austrian School adherent historian
Thomas Woods has argued in his book
Meltdown that the crashes were caused by various privately-owned banks (with state charters) which issued paper money, supposedly convertible to gold, in amounts greatly exceeding their gold reserves. ref {cite book |last=Woods |first=Thomas E., Jr. |title=Meltdown: A Free-Market Look at Why the Stock Market Collapsed, the Economy Tanked, and Government Bailouts Will Make Things Worse |publisher=Regnery Publishing, Inc. |year=2009 |edition=1st |pages=88–94 |isbn=9781596985872 }/refCharles, your restoration of the criticism has a cite error. (I don't know if the error was included previously.) Can you fix it? -- S. Rich ( talk) 01:47, 20 September 2011 (UTC)
Please Charles, be precise in your edits. Krugman did not use the word "failure" in his piece -- it was used by some of the reader comments to Krugman's blog. But as you know those reader comments are not RS. Nor did Krugman imply anything about out the Austrians not using explicit gobbledy-gook as being "more generally". -- S. Rich ( talk) 06:55, 22 September 2011 (UTC)
[3] First, it isn’t. Second, it would not be a valid argument at all: see WP:MOSINTRO. Incnis Mrsi ( talk) 21:28, 20 July 2013 (UTC)
Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current
Arbitration Committee election. The
Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia
arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose
site bans,
topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The
arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to
review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on
the voting page. For the Election committee,
MediaWiki message delivery (
talk) 14:01, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current
Arbitration Committee election. The
Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia
arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose
site bans,
topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The
arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to
review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on
the voting page. For the Election committee,
MediaWiki message delivery (
talk) 14:11, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Hello, Dark Charles. Voting in the 2016 Arbitration Committee elections is open from Monday, 00:00, 21 November through Sunday, 23:59, 4 December to all unblocked users who have registered an account before Wednesday, 00:00, 28 October 2016 and have made at least 150 mainspace edits before Sunday, 00:00, 1 November 2016.
The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.
If you wish to participate in the 2016 election, please review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. MediaWiki message delivery ( talk) 22:08, 21 November 2016 (UTC)
tremble
was invoked but never defined (see the
help page).{{
cite journal}}
: Invalid |ref=harv
(
help); Unknown parameter |month=
ignored (
help)
{{
cite book}}
: Invalid |ref=harv
(
help)
{{
cite book}}
: Invalid |ref=harv
(
help)
{{
cite document}}
: Invalid |ref=harv
(
help)
{{
cite book}}
: Invalid |ref=harv
(
help)