Please note, I've set up a sandbox page at User:SirFozzie/Investigation/Sandbox for all to edit and discuss the evidence if folks have information to provide. Thanks!
Samiharris ( talk · contribs) Mantanmoreland ( talk · contribs) : Apparently used to edit as User:Lastexit, and possibly as User:Tomstoner. See this edit where Mantanmoreland adds to a Tom Stoner statement while saying "revising previous response"
One account uses nothing but open proxies, per the CheckUser result. That means any cross over would be minimal at best. IF the two accounts were used at the same time, any one slip of the open proxy account using whatever IP's the other account is using would give things away if a CheckUser was done. Since there was no non-open proxy use by one account, either there were:
A)No slip ups (most folks eventually screw up, and one edit from a non-open proxy would link the two accounts, so this option may be deprecated slightly)
B)If there's no cross-over, there's a possibility of a two different machines/setups, so a controller would not ever edit at the same time.. either at one machine or the other, but never both at the same time). Both accounts had roughly the same median edit time per Ioeth's analysis via the comparison tool, so a lack of cross-over would be suspicious but not proof.
C) If there's significant crossover, then that may point to a truly unrelated result.
Breakdown of comparison of edits
- Near-simultaneous participation on otherwise untimely pages noted in yellow.
- Mantanmoreland's September withdrawal from Overstock articles noted in red.
- Edits near Samiharris' account creation date of 31 January 2007 noted in green.
| Article | first | last | total | first | last | total | |
| Article | Samiharris | Mantanmoreland | Notes | ||||
| Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Investopedia | 07/19/2007 20:57 | 07/22/2007 22:26 | 2 | 07/19/2007 12:31 | 07/21/2007 15:06 | 13 | After some DTCC edits, Samiharris' first contribution in 8 days |
| Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/MONGO 2 | 01/19/2008 16:21 | 01/19/2008 16:23 | 2 | 01/20/2008 15:38 | 1 | Mantanmoreland's first edit in a week | |
| Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Judd Bagley (2nd nomination) | 09/05/2007 23:28 | 09/08/2007 16:01 | 8 | 09/06/2007 00:48 | 09/07/2007 15:57 | 4 | |
| Wikipedia talk:Requests for arbitration/Attack sites/Proposed decision | 09/21/2007 07:37 | 09/29/2007 14:54 | 18 | 09/20/2007 17:32 | 09/25/2007 06:23 | 7 | |
| Wikipedia talk:No personal attacks | 09/08/2007 00:27 | 10/05/2007 15:31 | 4 | 04/27/2007 14:34 | 09/07/2007 02:39 | 43 | |
| User talk:Piperdown | 03/22/2007 17:16 | 07/31/2007 18:20 | 11 | 03/23/2007 00:50 | 03/23/2007 05:07 | 6 | |
| User talk:MONGO | 01/27/2008 16:23 | 1 | 04/30/2007 22:34 | 01/27/2008 22:49 | 8 | ||
| Thom Calandra | 07/29/2007 18:06 | 1 | 07/29/2007 18:29 | 07/29/2007 19:58 | 12 | Piperdown conflict | |
| Short (finance) | 01/31/2007 23:21 | 12/09/2007 15:06 | 11 | 08/05/2007 16:45 | 01/28/2008 18:20 | 3 | |
| Short and distort | 03/21/2007 01:21 | 06/23/2007 14:38 | 5 | 07/05/2007 17:29 | 08/05/2007 16:46 | 9 | |
| Talk:Short and distort | 04/11/2007 18:15 | 07/07/2007 15:21 | 4 | 07/05/2007 17:57 | 07/16/2007 18:05 | 10 | Agreed with each other to merge article, which they did |
| Pump and dump | 07/27/2007 20:41 | 07/29/2007 18:07 | 13 | 04/14/2006 13:26 | 07/31/2007 13:53 | 13 | |
| Talk:Pump and dump | 07/28/2007 13:03 | 07/28/2007 13:08 | 2 | 09/06/2006 20:31 | 07/30/2007 12:30 | 3 | |
| Patrick M. Byrne | 03/10/2007 21:15 | 01/24/2008 20:41 | 61 | 07/28/2006 12:16 | 09/19/2007 13:28 | 27 | LastExit edited significantly here (9). |
| Talk:Patrick M. Byrne | 05/13/2007 14:44 | 01/25/2008 16:47 | 53 | 08/21/2006 03:11 | 09/20/2007 13:42 | 15 | |
| Overstock.com | 02/14/2007 15:21 | 01/20/2008 17:47 | 52 | 09/06/2007 03:42 | 09/18/2007 16:43 | 5 | LastExit edited significantly here (18). |
| Talk:Overstock.com | 02/14/2007 15:26 | 01/23/2008 17:32 | 20 | 09/07/2007 16:03 | 09/07/2007 20:28 | 10 | LastExit, an apparent Mantanmoreland sock, is this page's #1 contributer |
| Naked short selling | 02/01/2007 16:32 | 01/20/2008 18:17 | 91 | 01/28/2006 20:48 | 12/07/2007 13:53 | 114 | |
| Talk:Naked short selling | 02/02/2007 14:37 | 10/16/2007 14:06 | 36 | 01/28/2006 21:51 | 12/07/2007 13:53 | 162 | |
| Microcap stock fraud | 07/29/2007 14:59 | 10/17/2007 16:18 | 3 | 07/29/2007 20:06 | 09/12/2007 12:47 | 10 | |
| Judd Bagley | 09/05/2007 23:22 | 09/06/2007 00:00 | 2 | 09/06/2007 03:46 | 09/06/2007 05:25 | 3 | |
| Talk:Judd Bagley | 09/06/2007 14:51 | 09/07/2007 20:51 | 5 | 09/06/2007 03:43 | 09/07/2007 15:02 | 2 | |
| Jim Cramer | 05/13/2007 14:51 | 05/13/2007 14:55 | 2 | 03/23/2007 03:56 | 03/26/2007 18:08 | 3 | |
| Hedge fund | 02/01/2007 16:04 | 12/20/2007 19:22 | 70 | 05/19/2006 19:51 | 05/19/2006 20:25 | 5 | |
| Gary Weiss | 05/14/2007 17:27 | 12/19/2007 01:19 | 18 | 04/13/2006 23:16 | 05/15/2007 00:21 | 26 | Curious torch passing here. |
| Talk:Gary Weiss | 05/14/2007 17:31 | 12/12/2007 21:06 | 182 | 10/30/2006 07:38 | 10/20/2007 17:11 | 22 | |
| Chop stock | 07/27/2007 22:21 | 07/29/2007 15:05 | 8 | 07/16/2007 20:42 | 07/31/2007 14:01 | 4 | |
Cool Hand Luke 05:27, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
Time stamps
Time stamps:
I received a data dump of all of Matanmoreland and Samiharris's edits in Excel format, sorted by date. While this is not proof of anything by itself, there are no periods where the two accounts edit at the same time, it's all chains of one editor, and then the other. Going back to 12/30/07, for example, here is the time stamps of edits, and who did it:
Samiharris 30 Dec 2007 19:39
Samiharris 30 Dec 2007 19:45
Samiharris 30 Dec 2007 19:45
Mantanmoreland 30 Dec 2007 20:16
Mantanmoreland 30 Dec 2007 20:19
Mantanmoreland 30 Dec 2007 20:23
Mantanmoreland 30 Dec 2007 20:25
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:40
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:42
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:43
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:43
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:51
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:55
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 15:01
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 15:01
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 15:04
Samiharris 03 Jan 2008 18:32
Samiharris 03 Jan 2008 18:33
Samiharris 05 Jan 2008 18:16
Samiharris 05 Jan 2008 18:19
Samiharris 05 Jan 2008 22:15
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 19:53
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 19:56
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 19:59
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:01
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:01
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:06
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:15
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:17
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:18
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:19
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 15:54
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 15:55
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:15
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:15
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:23
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:28
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:32
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:33
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:36
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:09
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:12
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:14
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:48
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:49
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:31
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:36
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:37
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:38
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:39
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:39
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:41
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 15:45
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 15:46
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 15:53
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:06
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:09
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:30
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:31
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:33
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:28
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:30
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:32
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:35
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:39
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:39
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 19:49
Mantanmoreland 13 Jan 2008 23:35
Samiharris 14 Jan 2008 16:09
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 15:44
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 15:56
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 15:58
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 15:59
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 16:01
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 16:03
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 16:09
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 17:48
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 17:53
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 17:54
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 21:21
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 21:22
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 21:29
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 21:32
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 05:38
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:10
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:15
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:17
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:18
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:22
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:25
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:27
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:34
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:37
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:46
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:49
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:51
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:59
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 16:04
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 16:21
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 16:23
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 18:38
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 18:43
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 19:40
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 19:59
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 20:15
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 20:31
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 20:34
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 20:37
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 21:25
Mantanmoreland 20 Jan 2008 15:38 (U)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 17:46 (.109)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 17:47 (.109)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:17 (.185)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:20 (.185)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:22 (.185)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:56 (.111)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:58 (.111)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:59 (.111)
Mantanmoreland 20 Jan 2008 19:36 (U)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 19:42 (.230)
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 04:37
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 04:43
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 04:44
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 14:53
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 15:39
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 19:24
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 19:27
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 19:47
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 19:48
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 20:07
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 22:40
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 00:04
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 00:04
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 03:53
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 03:55
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 03:55
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 04:01
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 04:04
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 14:47
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 15:23
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:34
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:34
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:37
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:39
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:44
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:46
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 18:54
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 18:57
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 19:01
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 17:31
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 17:32
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 17:34
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 17:35
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 20:14
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 20:14
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 20:15
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:05
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:25
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:35
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:49
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:52
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:53
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:55
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 05:10
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 20:41
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 21:07
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 21:27
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 21:33
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 21:35
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:25
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:28
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:39
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:42
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:45
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:56
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:27
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:28
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:41
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:51
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:53
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:18
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:20
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:22
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:23
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:24
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:33
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:35
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:48
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:29
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:31
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:39
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:50
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:59
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 06:00
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 06:22
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 16:42
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 16:44
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 16:47
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 16:53
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 04:43
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 04:49
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:00
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:06
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:09
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:14
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:17
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:21
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:24
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:31
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:35
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:36
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:41
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:43
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:45
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:47
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:49
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 06:18
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 06:43
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 06:55
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 07:08
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 07:10
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 15:27
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 15:28
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 15:30
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 16:12
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 16:48
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:07
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:54
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:55
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:55
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:58
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:16
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:26
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:32
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:33
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:34
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:47
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:59
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:06
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:11
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:13
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:28
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:45
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:54
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:56
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:30
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:32
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:52
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:52
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:58
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:59
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 21:07
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 21:08
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 21:09
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 21:15
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 16:20
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 16:21
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 16:23
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 17:51
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 17:54
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 17:55
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 17:56
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 20:36
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 20:42
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 20:43
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 20:56
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 21:01
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 21:05
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 21:07
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 21:08
Mantanmoreland 27 Jan 2008 22:49
Mantanmoreland 28 Jan 2008 18:20
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 02:30
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 02:37
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 04:55
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 04:57
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 04:58
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 05:01
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 05:03
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 05:04
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 17:07
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 17:09
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 17:12
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 18:22
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 03:22
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 03:26
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 03:27
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 15:38 (U2)
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:19
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:20
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:21
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:23
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:34
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:39
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:41
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:42
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 18:41 (U2)
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 19:02 (U2)
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 19:03 (U2)
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 21:00 (U2)
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:41
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:41
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:43
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:44
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:46
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:51
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:52
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:52
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 22:21
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 22:24
Samiharris 01 Feb 2008 22:30
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:07
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:08
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:13
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:16
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:31
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:36
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:38
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 17:17
Mantanmoreland 03 Feb 2008 19:29
Mantanmoreland 03 Feb 2008 19:31
Samiharris 04 Feb 2008 04:20
Samiharris 04 Feb 2008 04:21
Samiharris 04 Feb 2008 04:24
Samiharris 04 Feb 2008 04:25
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:26
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:45
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:46
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:50
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:53
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:00
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:08
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:17
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:18
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:27
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:42
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:59
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 23:00
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 23:01
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 23:02
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 23:03
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 02:43
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:13
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:26
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:48
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:49
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:49
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:50
This is only a period of five weeks, but the theory holds going back further.
Research by Alanyst
Edit totals in 2006 and 2007
From the period of 2006-01-28 (Mantanmoreland's first edit) to 2007-01-29 (Mantanmoreland's last edit before Samiharris account was created) Mantanmoreland had 3538 non-deleted edits. From the period of 2007-01-31 (Samiharris's first edit) to 2008-02-03 (Samiharris's latest edit) Mantanmoreland had 1667 non-deleted edits, a decrease by nearly 2000 edits. Samiharris has a total of 1400 non-deleted edits over the lifetime of the account.
Roughly speaking, the combined output of the two accounts in 2007 nearly equals (within 500 total edits or so) the output of Mantanmoreland alone in 2006.
Coincidence of editing
By my count, there is a total of 75 days on which both Mantanmoreland and Samiharris edited. On only 5 of those days do their edits "interleave" with each other. (I consider edits to interleave if one editor edits during an apparent string of edits by the other editor. I consider edits to be strung together if there is no more than a 30-minute interval between edits by the same editor. Thus the pattern is ABa, where A and a are part of a string of edits by editor A and B is at least one edit by editor B.)
These dates are:
- 2007-02-09
- 2007-05-14
- 2007-06-28
- 2007-07-29
- 2007-09-15
The closest the two accounts' edits come is within 3 minutes of each other, on 2007-07-29.
Analysis
The pattern suggests that the two accounts draw upon the same basically fixed resource for editing attention. In fewer than 10 instances over the span of an entire year, with over 3000 edits between them, do the two accounts edit within the same narrow time frame (30 minutes of each other). The reduction in output by Mantanmoreland is nearly offset by the new output of Samiharris.
This is not by itself conclusive of sockpuppetry. It's possible that these patterns could be exhibited by two unaffiliated accounts. A control group is needed, either of similar comparisons between known unaffiliated accounts, or of a randomly drawn sample of accounts with similar output and account activity overlap, to show empirically how far from the norm this pattern of editing is.
Further information
Additionally, here's some further information found by reviewing the pattern of edits: (please note: 99.9% of this section was submitted to me by Durova, and is used with her permission:)
Article history: 12 of 29 total edits to this article were made by Samiharris and Mantanmoreland from 16 July to 31 July, 2007. The article was created 16 June 2007 and merged/redirected to "Microcap stock fraud" on 31 July 2007. [1]
The entire edit history of the article talk page is these two accounts agreeing with each other about a merge, posting 10 hours apart. [2]
Less than 50 total edits in the article history, 14 of which come from these two accounts. Unlike "Chop stock", their involvement spans a longer time frame. Mantanmoreland redirected it to "Short (finance)" on August 7, 2007. [3]
A few points:
First edit by Samiharris, 21 March 2007 - prods the article (unsuccessful) [4]
On 5 July, Mantanmoreland suggests a merge/redirect to "Short (finance)" Sami Harris agrees two days later. These are the only two editors who discuss merging the article elsewhere. [5]
On 30 July 2007 Mantanmoreland proposes merging this into newly created "Microcap stock fraud". This is an older article than "Short and distort" or "Chop stock" and has collected a couple hundred edits since July 2003, yet Mantanmoreland redirects it the next day without any talk page response. Both accounts have been editing the article. Talk:Pump_and_dump
Less than 50 total edits since the article was created on July 2007 until the present. Yet Samiharris's only post occurs 16 hours before Mantanmoreland's 12 posts on July 29. [6]
On July 29, both accounts essentially start this article in tandem and then go about merging other articles they've edited into it. [7]
Interesting coincidences:
So is this collusion or two editors with similar interests and opinions? One way to gauge that is their communication.
The only edit at Talk:Microcap stock fraud:
This article, while describing a genuine phenomenon, threatens to duplicate other articles such as pump and dump and chop stocks and maybe others. You may want to consider a merger , perhaps of those articles into this one, or vice versa.--Mantanmoreland 20:04, 29 July 2007 (UTC) [8]
In addition to that I checked the histories of Sami's and Mantan's posts to each other's talk pages. You've both got the dumps on the total posts: 7 by Sami to Mantan's talk page, 6 by Mantan to Sami's talk page. That seems low for two people who share so many interests, although it's possible for two people who e-mail or chat offsite. These are the specific posts where they discuss articles:
21 June, Sami to Mantan – requests advice on short and distort [9]
2 posts: Mantan, to Sami about Naked short selling [10] [11]
Mantan to Sami about Gary Weiss [12]
Mantan to Sami about Microcap stock fraud, pump and dump, and chop stocks. Suggests redirect. [13]
So the mergers are discussed onsite. And two editors editing the same articles happens sometimes. What's missing in this picture is how Mantanmoreland came to the Microcap stock fraud article five hours after Samiharris started it, and why Mantanmoreland took such an interest in the Thom Calandra biography just a few hours after Sami Harris's only edit to it.
Without further context, the above edits are explainable. I'm very interested to see whether that check of the edit times actually bears out over the entire account histories. If they never edit at the same time, and one always uses open proxies, then my eyebrow is definitely raised. The next question would be seeing what scenarios and tests could disprove this appearance. Could they be different people on different work schedules?
When we proved BooyakaDell was JB196 two things were very strong evidence: both accounts consistently used the same misspelling in edit summaries, and BooyakaDell attributed a citation to Jonathan Barber even though the article didn't have a byline. We need a smoking gun here. This is serious stuff, and if Sami Harris isn't Mantanmoreland then these two guys have had more than enough headaches already.
(end of Durova section)
Double !Votes and Dual ArbCom discussion
If this is proven to be a match per DUCK, this is the problem. The two accounts have both taken the same position in the following "!votes" and would be in violation of using multiple accounts in an ArbCom case
Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Investopedia
Wikipedia:Requests_for_adminship/MONGO_2
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Judd Bagley (2nd nomination)
Wikipedia_talk:Requests_for_arbitration/Attack_sites/Proposed_decision
There probably is others, but going through 6500+ edits, even using the tools made available to me, it's hard to find needles in 7000 or so edits worth of haystacks without multiple hours of work)
Also considering the history brought up by Viridae (That Mantanmoreland had previously been let off with a warning by Fred Bauder for editing the same article with multiple accounts previously), is another bit of data that needs to be considered
Before I get accused of ambushing Mantanmoreland with this information: Please note that he came to my talk page earlier today and was asked by Durova about this evidence, [14], but he refused to respond to this request by someone who had no "WR-Axe" to grind on this issue.
Conclusion: Especially considering the median edit time, there is VERY strong circumstantial evidence that the two accounts are linked. For two accounts with such a common interest and common edit times, not to mention common targets (admittedly, a target who has them in common as well), surely at one time or another in over a year and a half they would both be editing at the same time, and their edits would overlap at some point (IE, Editor A/B/A/B in short order...) instead of what we have which is always A/A/A/A/A/A and then B/B/B/B/B then back to A, etcetera. Combined with the common interests and the fact that never do the two accounts find themselves on opposite sides (in other words, they're always supporting each other's actions and arguments), this presents a compelling (if admittedly one with no one "Absolute Proof Smoking Gun") argument that per WP:DUCK, yes, these two accounts are related.
Updated list by FT2
| Page | Mantanmoreland | Mantanmoreland (on talk page) |
Samiharris | Samiharris (on talk page) |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Chop stock | 16 - 31 Jul 07 (4 edits) | 30 Jul 07 (2 edits) | 27 - 29 Jul 07 (8 edits) | 30 Jul 07 (1 edit) |
| diff | 23 May 06 - 11 Aug 07 (48 edits) | 08 Feb 07 - 22 Jan 08 (9 edits) | ||
| Gary Weiss | 16 Apr 06 - 15 May 07 (16 edits) | 24 Jul 06 - 20 Oct 07 (24 edits) | 14 May - 19 Dec 07 (18 edits) | 14 May - 12 Dec 07 (182 edits) |
| Hedge fund | 19 May 06 (5 edits) | 19 May 06 (2 edits) | 01 Feb - 20 Dec 07 (70 edits) | 01 Feb - 21 Dec 07 (30 edits) |
| Investopedia | 19 Jul 07 (2 edits) | 21 Jul 07 (1 edit) | 21 Jul 07 (1 edit) | |
| Jim Cramer | 23 - 26 Mar 07 (3 edits) | 13 May 07 (2 edits) | ||
| Judd Bagley | 06 Sep 07 (3 edits) | 06 - 07 Sep 07 (2 edits) | 05 - 06 Sep 07 (2 edits) | 06 - 07 Sep 07 (5 edits) |
| Microcap stock fraud | 29 Jul - 12 Sep 07 (10 edits) | 29 Jul 07 (2 edits) | 29 Jul - 17 Oct 07 (3 edits) | |
| Naked short selling | 12 Jul 06 - 07 Dec 07 (61 edits) | 12 Jul 06 - 07 Dec 07 (46 edits) | 01 Feb 07 - 20 Jan 08 (91 edits) | 02 Feb - 16 Oct 07 (36 edits) |
| Overstock.com | 06 - 18 Sep 07 (5 edits) | 07 Sep 07 (10 edits) | 14 Feb 07 - 20 Jan 08 (52 edits) | 14 Feb 07 - 23 Jan 08 (20 edits) |
| Patrick M. Byrne | 28 Jul 06 - 19 Sep 07 (27 edits) | 21 Aug 06 - 20 Sep 07 (15 edits) | 10 Mar 07 - 24 Jan 08 (61 edits) | 13 May 07 - 25 Jan 08 (53 edits) |
| Pump and dump | 17 Apr 06 - 31 Jul 07 (12 edits) | 06 Sep 06 - 30 Jul 07 (3 edits) | 27 - 29 Jul 07 (13 edits) | 28 Jul 07 (2 edits) |
| Short (finance) | 05 Aug 07 - 28 Jan 08 (3 edits) | 31 Jan - 09 Dec 07 (11 edits) | 14 May - 29 Sep 07 (3 edits) | |
| Short and distort | 05 Jul - 05 Aug 07 (9 edits) | 05 - 16 Jul 07 (10 edits) | 21 Mar - 23 Jun 07 (5 edits) | 11 Apr - 07 Jul 07 (4 edits) |
| Thom Calandra | 29 Jul 07 (12 edits) | 29 Jul 07 (8 edits) | 29 Jul 07 (1 edit) | |
| WP:AFD/Investopedia | 19 - 21 Jul 07 (13 edits) | 19 - 22 Jul 07 (2 edits) | ||
| WP:AFD/Judd Bagley (2nd nomination) | 06 - 07 Sep 07 (4 edits) | 05 - 08 Sep 07 (8 edits) | ||
| WP:NPA | 26 Apr - 06 Sep 07 (21 edits) | 27 Apr - 07 Sep 07 (46 edits) | 08 Sep - 05 Oct 07 (4 edits) | |
| WP:RFA/MONGO 2 | 20 Jan 08 (1 edit) | 19 Jan 08 (2 edits) | ||
| WP:RFAR | 11 Apr - 07 Sep 07 (7 edits) | 06 - 09 Sep 07 (11 edits) | ||
| WP:RFAR/Attack sites/Evidence | 18 Sep 07 (8 edits) | 21 - 22 Sep 07 (4 edits) | ||
| WP:RFAR/Attack sites/Proposed decision | 20 - 25 Sep 07 (7 edits) | 21 - 29 Sep 07 (18 edits) | ||
| WP:RFAR/Attack sites/Workshop | 14 - 25 Sep 07 (50 edits) | 15 - 19 Sep 07 (3 edits) | 17 Sep 07 (1 edit) | |
| WP:RFC/Economy, trade, and companies | 25 Sep 06 (1 edit) | 09 Feb - 19 Jul 07 (5 edits) | ||
| WP:RFPP | 19 Sep 06 - 19 Sep 07 (6 edits) | 10 Jul 07 - 24 Jan 08 (8 edits) |
A comprehensive list, covering both debates involving !voting, and other articles edited in common (excluding user talk pages). As stated by SirFozzie, on many of these, both accounts were used in the same brief timespans, and hence probably in the same debates. Further examples, eg [15] [16]. FT2 ( Talk | email) 05:10, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
Please note, I've set up a sandbox page at User:SirFozzie/Investigation/Sandbox for all to edit and discuss the evidence if folks have information to provide. Thanks!
Samiharris ( talk · contribs) Mantanmoreland ( talk · contribs) : Apparently used to edit as User:Lastexit, and possibly as User:Tomstoner. See this edit where Mantanmoreland adds to a Tom Stoner statement while saying "revising previous response"
One account uses nothing but open proxies, per the CheckUser result. That means any cross over would be minimal at best. IF the two accounts were used at the same time, any one slip of the open proxy account using whatever IP's the other account is using would give things away if a CheckUser was done. Since there was no non-open proxy use by one account, either there were:
A)No slip ups (most folks eventually screw up, and one edit from a non-open proxy would link the two accounts, so this option may be deprecated slightly)
B)If there's no cross-over, there's a possibility of a two different machines/setups, so a controller would not ever edit at the same time.. either at one machine or the other, but never both at the same time). Both accounts had roughly the same median edit time per Ioeth's analysis via the comparison tool, so a lack of cross-over would be suspicious but not proof.
C) If there's significant crossover, then that may point to a truly unrelated result.
Breakdown of comparison of edits
- Near-simultaneous participation on otherwise untimely pages noted in yellow.
- Mantanmoreland's September withdrawal from Overstock articles noted in red.
- Edits near Samiharris' account creation date of 31 January 2007 noted in green.
| Article | first | last | total | first | last | total | |
| Article | Samiharris | Mantanmoreland | Notes | ||||
| Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Investopedia | 07/19/2007 20:57 | 07/22/2007 22:26 | 2 | 07/19/2007 12:31 | 07/21/2007 15:06 | 13 | After some DTCC edits, Samiharris' first contribution in 8 days |
| Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/MONGO 2 | 01/19/2008 16:21 | 01/19/2008 16:23 | 2 | 01/20/2008 15:38 | 1 | Mantanmoreland's first edit in a week | |
| Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Judd Bagley (2nd nomination) | 09/05/2007 23:28 | 09/08/2007 16:01 | 8 | 09/06/2007 00:48 | 09/07/2007 15:57 | 4 | |
| Wikipedia talk:Requests for arbitration/Attack sites/Proposed decision | 09/21/2007 07:37 | 09/29/2007 14:54 | 18 | 09/20/2007 17:32 | 09/25/2007 06:23 | 7 | |
| Wikipedia talk:No personal attacks | 09/08/2007 00:27 | 10/05/2007 15:31 | 4 | 04/27/2007 14:34 | 09/07/2007 02:39 | 43 | |
| User talk:Piperdown | 03/22/2007 17:16 | 07/31/2007 18:20 | 11 | 03/23/2007 00:50 | 03/23/2007 05:07 | 6 | |
| User talk:MONGO | 01/27/2008 16:23 | 1 | 04/30/2007 22:34 | 01/27/2008 22:49 | 8 | ||
| Thom Calandra | 07/29/2007 18:06 | 1 | 07/29/2007 18:29 | 07/29/2007 19:58 | 12 | Piperdown conflict | |
| Short (finance) | 01/31/2007 23:21 | 12/09/2007 15:06 | 11 | 08/05/2007 16:45 | 01/28/2008 18:20 | 3 | |
| Short and distort | 03/21/2007 01:21 | 06/23/2007 14:38 | 5 | 07/05/2007 17:29 | 08/05/2007 16:46 | 9 | |
| Talk:Short and distort | 04/11/2007 18:15 | 07/07/2007 15:21 | 4 | 07/05/2007 17:57 | 07/16/2007 18:05 | 10 | Agreed with each other to merge article, which they did |
| Pump and dump | 07/27/2007 20:41 | 07/29/2007 18:07 | 13 | 04/14/2006 13:26 | 07/31/2007 13:53 | 13 | |
| Talk:Pump and dump | 07/28/2007 13:03 | 07/28/2007 13:08 | 2 | 09/06/2006 20:31 | 07/30/2007 12:30 | 3 | |
| Patrick M. Byrne | 03/10/2007 21:15 | 01/24/2008 20:41 | 61 | 07/28/2006 12:16 | 09/19/2007 13:28 | 27 | LastExit edited significantly here (9). |
| Talk:Patrick M. Byrne | 05/13/2007 14:44 | 01/25/2008 16:47 | 53 | 08/21/2006 03:11 | 09/20/2007 13:42 | 15 | |
| Overstock.com | 02/14/2007 15:21 | 01/20/2008 17:47 | 52 | 09/06/2007 03:42 | 09/18/2007 16:43 | 5 | LastExit edited significantly here (18). |
| Talk:Overstock.com | 02/14/2007 15:26 | 01/23/2008 17:32 | 20 | 09/07/2007 16:03 | 09/07/2007 20:28 | 10 | LastExit, an apparent Mantanmoreland sock, is this page's #1 contributer |
| Naked short selling | 02/01/2007 16:32 | 01/20/2008 18:17 | 91 | 01/28/2006 20:48 | 12/07/2007 13:53 | 114 | |
| Talk:Naked short selling | 02/02/2007 14:37 | 10/16/2007 14:06 | 36 | 01/28/2006 21:51 | 12/07/2007 13:53 | 162 | |
| Microcap stock fraud | 07/29/2007 14:59 | 10/17/2007 16:18 | 3 | 07/29/2007 20:06 | 09/12/2007 12:47 | 10 | |
| Judd Bagley | 09/05/2007 23:22 | 09/06/2007 00:00 | 2 | 09/06/2007 03:46 | 09/06/2007 05:25 | 3 | |
| Talk:Judd Bagley | 09/06/2007 14:51 | 09/07/2007 20:51 | 5 | 09/06/2007 03:43 | 09/07/2007 15:02 | 2 | |
| Jim Cramer | 05/13/2007 14:51 | 05/13/2007 14:55 | 2 | 03/23/2007 03:56 | 03/26/2007 18:08 | 3 | |
| Hedge fund | 02/01/2007 16:04 | 12/20/2007 19:22 | 70 | 05/19/2006 19:51 | 05/19/2006 20:25 | 5 | |
| Gary Weiss | 05/14/2007 17:27 | 12/19/2007 01:19 | 18 | 04/13/2006 23:16 | 05/15/2007 00:21 | 26 | Curious torch passing here. |
| Talk:Gary Weiss | 05/14/2007 17:31 | 12/12/2007 21:06 | 182 | 10/30/2006 07:38 | 10/20/2007 17:11 | 22 | |
| Chop stock | 07/27/2007 22:21 | 07/29/2007 15:05 | 8 | 07/16/2007 20:42 | 07/31/2007 14:01 | 4 | |
Cool Hand Luke 05:27, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
Time stamps
Time stamps:
I received a data dump of all of Matanmoreland and Samiharris's edits in Excel format, sorted by date. While this is not proof of anything by itself, there are no periods where the two accounts edit at the same time, it's all chains of one editor, and then the other. Going back to 12/30/07, for example, here is the time stamps of edits, and who did it:
Samiharris 30 Dec 2007 19:39
Samiharris 30 Dec 2007 19:45
Samiharris 30 Dec 2007 19:45
Mantanmoreland 30 Dec 2007 20:16
Mantanmoreland 30 Dec 2007 20:19
Mantanmoreland 30 Dec 2007 20:23
Mantanmoreland 30 Dec 2007 20:25
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:40
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:42
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:43
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:43
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:51
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 14:55
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 15:01
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 15:01
Samiharris 31 Dec 2007 15:04
Samiharris 03 Jan 2008 18:32
Samiharris 03 Jan 2008 18:33
Samiharris 05 Jan 2008 18:16
Samiharris 05 Jan 2008 18:19
Samiharris 05 Jan 2008 22:15
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 19:53
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 19:56
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 19:59
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:01
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:01
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:06
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:15
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:17
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:18
Samiharris 07 Jan 2008 20:19
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 15:54
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 15:55
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:15
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:15
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:23
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:28
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:32
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:33
Samiharris 08 Jan 2008 16:36
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:09
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:12
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:14
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:48
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 15:49
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:31
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:36
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:37
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:38
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:39
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:39
Samiharris 09 Jan 2008 22:41
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 15:45
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 15:46
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 15:53
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:06
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:09
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:30
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:31
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 16:33
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:28
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:30
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:32
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:35
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:39
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 17:39
Samiharris 11 Jan 2008 19:49
Mantanmoreland 13 Jan 2008 23:35
Samiharris 14 Jan 2008 16:09
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 15:44
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 15:56
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 15:58
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 15:59
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 16:01
Samiharris 16 Jan 2008 16:03
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 16:09
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 17:48
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 17:53
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 17:54
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 21:21
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 21:22
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 21:29
Samiharris 18 Jan 2008 21:32
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 05:38
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:10
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:15
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:17
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:18
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:22
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:25
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:27
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:34
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:37
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:46
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:49
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:51
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 15:59
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 16:04
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 16:21
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 16:23
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 18:38
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 18:43
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 19:40
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 19:59
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 20:15
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 20:31
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 20:34
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 20:37
Samiharris 19 Jan 2008 21:25
Mantanmoreland 20 Jan 2008 15:38 (U)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 17:46 (.109)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 17:47 (.109)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:17 (.185)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:20 (.185)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:22 (.185)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:56 (.111)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:58 (.111)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 18:59 (.111)
Mantanmoreland 20 Jan 2008 19:36 (U)
Samiharris 20 Jan 2008 19:42 (.230)
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 04:37
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 04:43
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 04:44
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 14:53
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 15:39
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 19:24
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 19:27
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 19:47
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 19:48
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 20:07
Samiharris 21 Jan 2008 22:40
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 00:04
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 00:04
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 03:53
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 03:55
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 03:55
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 04:01
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 04:04
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 14:47
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 15:23
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:34
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:34
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:37
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:39
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:44
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 16:46
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 18:54
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 18:57
Samiharris 22 Jan 2008 19:01
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 17:31
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 17:32
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 17:34
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 17:35
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 20:14
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 20:14
Samiharris 23 Jan 2008 20:15
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:05
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:25
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:35
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:49
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:52
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:53
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 04:55
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 05:10
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 20:41
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 21:07
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 21:27
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 21:33
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 21:35
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:25
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:28
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:39
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:42
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:45
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 22:56
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:27
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:28
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:41
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:51
Samiharris 24 Jan 2008 23:53
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:18
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:20
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:22
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:23
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:24
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:33
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:35
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 04:48
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:29
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:31
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:39
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:50
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 05:59
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 06:00
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 06:22
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 16:42
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 16:44
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 16:47
Samiharris 25 Jan 2008 16:53
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 04:43
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 04:49
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:00
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:06
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:09
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:14
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:17
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:21
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:24
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:31
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:35
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:36
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:41
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:43
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:45
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:47
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 05:49
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 06:18
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 06:43
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 06:55
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 07:08
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 07:10
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 15:27
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 15:28
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 15:30
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 16:12
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 16:48
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:07
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:54
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:55
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:55
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 17:58
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:16
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:26
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:32
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:33
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:34
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:47
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 18:59
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:06
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:11
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:13
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:28
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:45
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:54
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 19:56
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:30
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:32
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:52
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:52
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:58
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 20:59
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 21:07
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 21:08
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 21:09
Mantanmoreland 26 Jan 2008 21:15
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 16:20
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 16:21
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 16:23
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 17:51
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 17:54
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 17:55
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 17:56
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 20:36
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 20:42
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 20:43
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 20:56
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 21:01
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 21:05
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 21:07
Samiharris 27 Jan 2008 21:08
Mantanmoreland 27 Jan 2008 22:49
Mantanmoreland 28 Jan 2008 18:20
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 02:30
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 02:37
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 04:55
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 04:57
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 04:58
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 05:01
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 05:03
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 05:04
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 17:07
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 17:09
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 17:12
Mantanmoreland 29 Jan 2008 18:22
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 03:22
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 03:26
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 03:27
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 15:38 (U2)
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:19
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:20
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:21
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:23
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:34
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:39
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:41
Samiharris 30 Jan 2008 16:42
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 18:41 (U2)
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 19:02 (U2)
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 19:03 (U2)
Mantanmoreland 30 Jan 2008 21:00 (U2)
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:41
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:41
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:43
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:44
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:46
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:51
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:52
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 17:52
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 22:21
Samiharris 31 Jan 2008 22:24
Samiharris 01 Feb 2008 22:30
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:07
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:08
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:13
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:16
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:31
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:36
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 16:38
Mantanmoreland 02 Feb 2008 17:17
Mantanmoreland 03 Feb 2008 19:29
Mantanmoreland 03 Feb 2008 19:31
Samiharris 04 Feb 2008 04:20
Samiharris 04 Feb 2008 04:21
Samiharris 04 Feb 2008 04:24
Samiharris 04 Feb 2008 04:25
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:26
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:45
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:46
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:50
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 21:53
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:00
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:08
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:17
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:18
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:27
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:42
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 22:59
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 23:00
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 23:01
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 23:02
Mantanmoreland 06 Feb 2008 23:03
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 02:43
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:13
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:26
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:48
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:49
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:49
Mantanmoreland 07 Feb 2008 04:50
This is only a period of five weeks, but the theory holds going back further.
Research by Alanyst
Edit totals in 2006 and 2007
From the period of 2006-01-28 (Mantanmoreland's first edit) to 2007-01-29 (Mantanmoreland's last edit before Samiharris account was created) Mantanmoreland had 3538 non-deleted edits. From the period of 2007-01-31 (Samiharris's first edit) to 2008-02-03 (Samiharris's latest edit) Mantanmoreland had 1667 non-deleted edits, a decrease by nearly 2000 edits. Samiharris has a total of 1400 non-deleted edits over the lifetime of the account.
Roughly speaking, the combined output of the two accounts in 2007 nearly equals (within 500 total edits or so) the output of Mantanmoreland alone in 2006.
Coincidence of editing
By my count, there is a total of 75 days on which both Mantanmoreland and Samiharris edited. On only 5 of those days do their edits "interleave" with each other. (I consider edits to interleave if one editor edits during an apparent string of edits by the other editor. I consider edits to be strung together if there is no more than a 30-minute interval between edits by the same editor. Thus the pattern is ABa, where A and a are part of a string of edits by editor A and B is at least one edit by editor B.)
These dates are:
- 2007-02-09
- 2007-05-14
- 2007-06-28
- 2007-07-29
- 2007-09-15
The closest the two accounts' edits come is within 3 minutes of each other, on 2007-07-29.
Analysis
The pattern suggests that the two accounts draw upon the same basically fixed resource for editing attention. In fewer than 10 instances over the span of an entire year, with over 3000 edits between them, do the two accounts edit within the same narrow time frame (30 minutes of each other). The reduction in output by Mantanmoreland is nearly offset by the new output of Samiharris.
This is not by itself conclusive of sockpuppetry. It's possible that these patterns could be exhibited by two unaffiliated accounts. A control group is needed, either of similar comparisons between known unaffiliated accounts, or of a randomly drawn sample of accounts with similar output and account activity overlap, to show empirically how far from the norm this pattern of editing is.
Further information
Additionally, here's some further information found by reviewing the pattern of edits: (please note: 99.9% of this section was submitted to me by Durova, and is used with her permission:)
Article history: 12 of 29 total edits to this article were made by Samiharris and Mantanmoreland from 16 July to 31 July, 2007. The article was created 16 June 2007 and merged/redirected to "Microcap stock fraud" on 31 July 2007. [1]
The entire edit history of the article talk page is these two accounts agreeing with each other about a merge, posting 10 hours apart. [2]
Less than 50 total edits in the article history, 14 of which come from these two accounts. Unlike "Chop stock", their involvement spans a longer time frame. Mantanmoreland redirected it to "Short (finance)" on August 7, 2007. [3]
A few points:
First edit by Samiharris, 21 March 2007 - prods the article (unsuccessful) [4]
On 5 July, Mantanmoreland suggests a merge/redirect to "Short (finance)" Sami Harris agrees two days later. These are the only two editors who discuss merging the article elsewhere. [5]
On 30 July 2007 Mantanmoreland proposes merging this into newly created "Microcap stock fraud". This is an older article than "Short and distort" or "Chop stock" and has collected a couple hundred edits since July 2003, yet Mantanmoreland redirects it the next day without any talk page response. Both accounts have been editing the article. Talk:Pump_and_dump
Less than 50 total edits since the article was created on July 2007 until the present. Yet Samiharris's only post occurs 16 hours before Mantanmoreland's 12 posts on July 29. [6]
On July 29, both accounts essentially start this article in tandem and then go about merging other articles they've edited into it. [7]
Interesting coincidences:
So is this collusion or two editors with similar interests and opinions? One way to gauge that is their communication.
The only edit at Talk:Microcap stock fraud:
This article, while describing a genuine phenomenon, threatens to duplicate other articles such as pump and dump and chop stocks and maybe others. You may want to consider a merger , perhaps of those articles into this one, or vice versa.--Mantanmoreland 20:04, 29 July 2007 (UTC) [8]
In addition to that I checked the histories of Sami's and Mantan's posts to each other's talk pages. You've both got the dumps on the total posts: 7 by Sami to Mantan's talk page, 6 by Mantan to Sami's talk page. That seems low for two people who share so many interests, although it's possible for two people who e-mail or chat offsite. These are the specific posts where they discuss articles:
21 June, Sami to Mantan – requests advice on short and distort [9]
2 posts: Mantan, to Sami about Naked short selling [10] [11]
Mantan to Sami about Gary Weiss [12]
Mantan to Sami about Microcap stock fraud, pump and dump, and chop stocks. Suggests redirect. [13]
So the mergers are discussed onsite. And two editors editing the same articles happens sometimes. What's missing in this picture is how Mantanmoreland came to the Microcap stock fraud article five hours after Samiharris started it, and why Mantanmoreland took such an interest in the Thom Calandra biography just a few hours after Sami Harris's only edit to it.
Without further context, the above edits are explainable. I'm very interested to see whether that check of the edit times actually bears out over the entire account histories. If they never edit at the same time, and one always uses open proxies, then my eyebrow is definitely raised. The next question would be seeing what scenarios and tests could disprove this appearance. Could they be different people on different work schedules?
When we proved BooyakaDell was JB196 two things were very strong evidence: both accounts consistently used the same misspelling in edit summaries, and BooyakaDell attributed a citation to Jonathan Barber even though the article didn't have a byline. We need a smoking gun here. This is serious stuff, and if Sami Harris isn't Mantanmoreland then these two guys have had more than enough headaches already.
(end of Durova section)
Double !Votes and Dual ArbCom discussion
If this is proven to be a match per DUCK, this is the problem. The two accounts have both taken the same position in the following "!votes" and would be in violation of using multiple accounts in an ArbCom case
Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Investopedia
Wikipedia:Requests_for_adminship/MONGO_2
Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Judd Bagley (2nd nomination)
Wikipedia_talk:Requests_for_arbitration/Attack_sites/Proposed_decision
There probably is others, but going through 6500+ edits, even using the tools made available to me, it's hard to find needles in 7000 or so edits worth of haystacks without multiple hours of work)
Also considering the history brought up by Viridae (That Mantanmoreland had previously been let off with a warning by Fred Bauder for editing the same article with multiple accounts previously), is another bit of data that needs to be considered
Before I get accused of ambushing Mantanmoreland with this information: Please note that he came to my talk page earlier today and was asked by Durova about this evidence, [14], but he refused to respond to this request by someone who had no "WR-Axe" to grind on this issue.
Conclusion: Especially considering the median edit time, there is VERY strong circumstantial evidence that the two accounts are linked. For two accounts with such a common interest and common edit times, not to mention common targets (admittedly, a target who has them in common as well), surely at one time or another in over a year and a half they would both be editing at the same time, and their edits would overlap at some point (IE, Editor A/B/A/B in short order...) instead of what we have which is always A/A/A/A/A/A and then B/B/B/B/B then back to A, etcetera. Combined with the common interests and the fact that never do the two accounts find themselves on opposite sides (in other words, they're always supporting each other's actions and arguments), this presents a compelling (if admittedly one with no one "Absolute Proof Smoking Gun") argument that per WP:DUCK, yes, these two accounts are related.
Updated list by FT2
| Page | Mantanmoreland | Mantanmoreland (on talk page) |
Samiharris | Samiharris (on talk page) |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Chop stock | 16 - 31 Jul 07 (4 edits) | 30 Jul 07 (2 edits) | 27 - 29 Jul 07 (8 edits) | 30 Jul 07 (1 edit) |
| diff | 23 May 06 - 11 Aug 07 (48 edits) | 08 Feb 07 - 22 Jan 08 (9 edits) | ||
| Gary Weiss | 16 Apr 06 - 15 May 07 (16 edits) | 24 Jul 06 - 20 Oct 07 (24 edits) | 14 May - 19 Dec 07 (18 edits) | 14 May - 12 Dec 07 (182 edits) |
| Hedge fund | 19 May 06 (5 edits) | 19 May 06 (2 edits) | 01 Feb - 20 Dec 07 (70 edits) | 01 Feb - 21 Dec 07 (30 edits) |
| Investopedia | 19 Jul 07 (2 edits) | 21 Jul 07 (1 edit) | 21 Jul 07 (1 edit) | |
| Jim Cramer | 23 - 26 Mar 07 (3 edits) | 13 May 07 (2 edits) | ||
| Judd Bagley | 06 Sep 07 (3 edits) | 06 - 07 Sep 07 (2 edits) | 05 - 06 Sep 07 (2 edits) | 06 - 07 Sep 07 (5 edits) |
| Microcap stock fraud | 29 Jul - 12 Sep 07 (10 edits) | 29 Jul 07 (2 edits) | 29 Jul - 17 Oct 07 (3 edits) | |
| Naked short selling | 12 Jul 06 - 07 Dec 07 (61 edits) | 12 Jul 06 - 07 Dec 07 (46 edits) | 01 Feb 07 - 20 Jan 08 (91 edits) | 02 Feb - 16 Oct 07 (36 edits) |
| Overstock.com | 06 - 18 Sep 07 (5 edits) | 07 Sep 07 (10 edits) | 14 Feb 07 - 20 Jan 08 (52 edits) | 14 Feb 07 - 23 Jan 08 (20 edits) |
| Patrick M. Byrne | 28 Jul 06 - 19 Sep 07 (27 edits) | 21 Aug 06 - 20 Sep 07 (15 edits) | 10 Mar 07 - 24 Jan 08 (61 edits) | 13 May 07 - 25 Jan 08 (53 edits) |
| Pump and dump | 17 Apr 06 - 31 Jul 07 (12 edits) | 06 Sep 06 - 30 Jul 07 (3 edits) | 27 - 29 Jul 07 (13 edits) | 28 Jul 07 (2 edits) |
| Short (finance) | 05 Aug 07 - 28 Jan 08 (3 edits) | 31 Jan - 09 Dec 07 (11 edits) | 14 May - 29 Sep 07 (3 edits) | |
| Short and distort | 05 Jul - 05 Aug 07 (9 edits) | 05 - 16 Jul 07 (10 edits) | 21 Mar - 23 Jun 07 (5 edits) | 11 Apr - 07 Jul 07 (4 edits) |
| Thom Calandra | 29 Jul 07 (12 edits) | 29 Jul 07 (8 edits) | 29 Jul 07 (1 edit) | |
| WP:AFD/Investopedia | 19 - 21 Jul 07 (13 edits) | 19 - 22 Jul 07 (2 edits) | ||
| WP:AFD/Judd Bagley (2nd nomination) | 06 - 07 Sep 07 (4 edits) | 05 - 08 Sep 07 (8 edits) | ||
| WP:NPA | 26 Apr - 06 Sep 07 (21 edits) | 27 Apr - 07 Sep 07 (46 edits) | 08 Sep - 05 Oct 07 (4 edits) | |
| WP:RFA/MONGO 2 | 20 Jan 08 (1 edit) | 19 Jan 08 (2 edits) | ||
| WP:RFAR | 11 Apr - 07 Sep 07 (7 edits) | 06 - 09 Sep 07 (11 edits) | ||
| WP:RFAR/Attack sites/Evidence | 18 Sep 07 (8 edits) | 21 - 22 Sep 07 (4 edits) | ||
| WP:RFAR/Attack sites/Proposed decision | 20 - 25 Sep 07 (7 edits) | 21 - 29 Sep 07 (18 edits) | ||
| WP:RFAR/Attack sites/Workshop | 14 - 25 Sep 07 (50 edits) | 15 - 19 Sep 07 (3 edits) | 17 Sep 07 (1 edit) | |
| WP:RFC/Economy, trade, and companies | 25 Sep 06 (1 edit) | 09 Feb - 19 Jul 07 (5 edits) | ||
| WP:RFPP | 19 Sep 06 - 19 Sep 07 (6 edits) | 10 Jul 07 - 24 Jan 08 (8 edits) |
A comprehensive list, covering both debates involving !voting, and other articles edited in common (excluding user talk pages). As stated by SirFozzie, on many of these, both accounts were used in the same brief timespans, and hence probably in the same debates. Further examples, eg [15] [16]. FT2 ( Talk | email) 05:10, 13 February 2008 (UTC)