This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Hispanic and Latino Americans navbox template. |
|
United States: Hispanic and Latino Template‑class | ||||||||||
|
North America Template‑class | |||||||
|
=="Haitians identify as West Indians, Afro-Caribbean or African Caribbean. Afro Caribbean are people whose ancestors were taken from Africa via the trans-Atlantic slave trade to the Caribbean islands. Other names for the ethnic group include Caribbean or West Indian. People of Afro Caribbean descent have between 85-95% African ancestry DNA. In 1804, Haiti, with its overwhelming African population and leadership, became the second nation in the Americas to win independence from a European state. Haiti is the first independent the Caribbean and Latin America. Haitians speak Haitian Creole,It is called Kreyol ayisyen or kreyol by its speakers. A French based vernacular language that developed in the 17th and early 18th centuries. It developed primarily on the sugarcane plantations of Haiti from contacts between the colonizers and African slaves. It has been one of Haiti's official languages since 1987 and is the first language of about 95% of Haitians, Of all the French creoles of Western Hemisphere, Haitian is probably the one that bears the most influence from African languages. Scholars who believe that creoles develop gradually have suggested that this is a result of two factors. One is the high ratio of Africans to Europeans in the colony's early history: 9 to 1 in the 17th century, rising to aproximately 16 to 1 in 1789 and increasing further during the Haitian Revolution (1791-1804),when most of the French colonizers left or died. The other is Haitis isolation from France. There are different types of creole language. Latino is a word that is greatly misused and misunderstood. In the Western Hemisphere, Latin America refers to nations formerly colonized by European countries rooted in Latin languages and cultures (i.e. France, Italy, Portugal, Romania, and Spain). Latino refers to the people from or descended from people from Latin America regardless of race. Hispanic refers to persons from Hispanophone (Spanish-speaking) nations.
Modern day Latinos define a wide group of varying peoples that speak Latin based languages. Millions of Latinos are White, millions of Latinos are Black, and millions of Latinos are Brown (i.e. Mulatto or Mixed). In all honesty, if Latin or Latino was used in its most truthful manner, it would refer to Whites only, since the Ancient Latins were a White tribe, and since 99.99 percent of Spaniards, Portuguese, French, Italians, and Romanians are also indeed White! Furthermore, it would only be a term to use for those people today who are predominantly or 100 percent Latin blood in origin, but I seriously doubt any exists today, even in Italy, where they came to power! All other Latinos are merely Latinized peoples thus, not true Latinos! But, for simplicity's sake, I'll use Latino in its loose sense.
Another point that needs to be established is that Hispanic is not synonymous with Latino. Hispanics refer to only Spanish speaking Latinos. This brings me to another point. Spanish speaking Latinos are the only group of Latinos that are given official status as a group, Hispanic! Seems a bit discriminatory doesn't it! Even Hispanic is a vastly misused and misunderstood term. Hispanic means of a Spanish speaking country, you don't have to be from Spain. The vast majority of Spaniards, some 99.99 percent are White! Hispanic derives from Hispania, the Roman name for Spain. As the Spanish dialects diverged, it soon became Espana.
Another point of importance is that the term Latin America was coined by the French in reference to their own colonies in the Americas! Thus, French/Spanish speaking Cajuns and French speaking Canadians can rightfully be called Latinos!
-- CoCoLumps ( Love yourself) 04:08, 21 May 2013 (UTC)
-- CoCoLumps ( Love yourself) 03:10, 09 May 2013 (UTC)
"Hispanic or Latino" refers to a person of Cuban, Mexican, Puerto Rican, South or Central American, or other Spanish or Portuguese culture or origin regardless of race.
For Census 2000, American Community Survey: People who identify with the terms "Hispanic" or "Latino" are those who classify themselves in one of the specific Hispanic or Latino categories listed on the Census 2000 or ACS questionnaire - "Mexican," "Puerto Rican," or "Cuban" - as well as those who indicate that they are "other Spanish, Hispanic, or Latino." Origin can be viewed as the heritage, nationality group, lineage, or country of birth of the person or the person's parents or ancestors before their arrival in the United States. People who identify their origin as Spanish, Hispanic, or Latino may be of any "race".
1990 Census of Population and Housing: A self-designated classification for people whose origins are from Spain, the Spanish-speaking countries of Central or South America, the Caribbean, or those identifying themselves generally as Spanish, Spanish-American, etc. Origin can be viewed as ancestry, nationality, or country of birth of the person or person's parents or ancestors prior to their arrival in the United States.
So far, the vast weight of sources that have been cited in this discussion say that Haitians are not Latino / Latin American. CoCoLumps is the only person in this thread arguing that Haitians should be identified as being Latino / Latin American. Let's try to reach consensus here. CoCoLumps--do you have any sources that support your views? Otherwise, the vast weight of the evidence points to reverting back to list Haitians as not being Latin American. If no sources are forthcoming, and if no one else chimes in to support the idea that Haitians are Latino, then I think we need to follow the sources and remove the references to Latino / Latin America. Let's give it 5-7 days and see where things stand. Anyone opposed? Goodsdrew ( talk) 14:25, 17 May 2013 (UTC)
Do to the Philippine islands being part of the Hispanadad ( http://pinas.dlsu.edu.ph/history/history.html , http://philippines-timeline.com/spanish.htm) and Filipinos of Southern California helping in race relations. Last but never the least Filipino Americans are differentiated just as are Latinos Some are Natives others are not.... In pure defense just because they have been classified as only Asians in older American history references, that archaic classification should not give us current historians and Americans the right to discount their Hispanic lineage any longer. That pretense falls under the same attitudes of people discounting the white race of mixed raced people because they are brown of skin tone. Be as it will I changed the box. -- Iamiyouareyou ( talk) 14:51, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
It never will be fair that Filipino Americans of Hispanic decent receive twice the classification and twice the ethnic community. That is just what it is and it is are duty to stand tall and be unbiased and write the truthful information down.-- Iamiyouareyou ( talk) 14:57, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
More sources /info/en/?search=Hispanic_%28U.S._Census%29 , /info/en/?search=Hispanic, /info/en/?search=Filipino_people#Colonial_influence, /info/en/?search=Filipino_people_of_Spanish_ancestry , /info/en/?search=Spanish_influence_on_Filipino_culture , http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdLQ1nXDRSE
-- Iamiyouareyou ( talk) 13:53, 26 April 2014 (UTC)
reverted edit that removed Filipinos do to categorization of list being "Hispanic and Latino" And not a list exclusively of Latino groups. Stating once again Filipinos are Hispanic. Iamiyouareyou ( talk)
This edit removed this again, saying "reverted unexplained reversion, Filipino Americans are not categorized by the U.S. Census Bureau as being Lationo/Hispanic".
Guys, please don't edit war over this -- especially in a template used by quite a few articles.
I'll comment here that neither Wikipedia not YouTube are reliable sources. I'll also suggest that it might be useful to read the Latin Americans article (a WP article and therefore not in itself a reliable source). Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 23:02, 10 October 2014 (UTC)
I have reverted the WP:BOLD change by Iamiyouareyou ( talk · contribs). There is no consensus or reliable sources that verify that Filipino Americans are categorized by the USCB as being Latino/Hispanic. There has been no change to consensus or reliable sources on the subject and I ask Wtmitchell ( talk · contribs) to weigh in on the matter as he has been involved with this subject in the past, and as Iamiyouareyou has declared an edit war on my talk page.-- RightCowLeftCoast ( talk) 00:56, 8 February 2017 (UTC)
The template links to Basque Americans. However, as I understand it, Basque Americans are neither Latino (being from Europe) nor Hispanic (being not of Spanish-speaking origin). Is it misplaced on the template? -- Gerrit C U T E D H 14:05, 14 January 2014 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Hispanic and Latino Americans navbox template. |
|
United States: Hispanic and Latino Template‑class | ||||||||||
|
North America Template‑class | |||||||
|
=="Haitians identify as West Indians, Afro-Caribbean or African Caribbean. Afro Caribbean are people whose ancestors were taken from Africa via the trans-Atlantic slave trade to the Caribbean islands. Other names for the ethnic group include Caribbean or West Indian. People of Afro Caribbean descent have between 85-95% African ancestry DNA. In 1804, Haiti, with its overwhelming African population and leadership, became the second nation in the Americas to win independence from a European state. Haiti is the first independent the Caribbean and Latin America. Haitians speak Haitian Creole,It is called Kreyol ayisyen or kreyol by its speakers. A French based vernacular language that developed in the 17th and early 18th centuries. It developed primarily on the sugarcane plantations of Haiti from contacts between the colonizers and African slaves. It has been one of Haiti's official languages since 1987 and is the first language of about 95% of Haitians, Of all the French creoles of Western Hemisphere, Haitian is probably the one that bears the most influence from African languages. Scholars who believe that creoles develop gradually have suggested that this is a result of two factors. One is the high ratio of Africans to Europeans in the colony's early history: 9 to 1 in the 17th century, rising to aproximately 16 to 1 in 1789 and increasing further during the Haitian Revolution (1791-1804),when most of the French colonizers left or died. The other is Haitis isolation from France. There are different types of creole language. Latino is a word that is greatly misused and misunderstood. In the Western Hemisphere, Latin America refers to nations formerly colonized by European countries rooted in Latin languages and cultures (i.e. France, Italy, Portugal, Romania, and Spain). Latino refers to the people from or descended from people from Latin America regardless of race. Hispanic refers to persons from Hispanophone (Spanish-speaking) nations.
Modern day Latinos define a wide group of varying peoples that speak Latin based languages. Millions of Latinos are White, millions of Latinos are Black, and millions of Latinos are Brown (i.e. Mulatto or Mixed). In all honesty, if Latin or Latino was used in its most truthful manner, it would refer to Whites only, since the Ancient Latins were a White tribe, and since 99.99 percent of Spaniards, Portuguese, French, Italians, and Romanians are also indeed White! Furthermore, it would only be a term to use for those people today who are predominantly or 100 percent Latin blood in origin, but I seriously doubt any exists today, even in Italy, where they came to power! All other Latinos are merely Latinized peoples thus, not true Latinos! But, for simplicity's sake, I'll use Latino in its loose sense.
Another point that needs to be established is that Hispanic is not synonymous with Latino. Hispanics refer to only Spanish speaking Latinos. This brings me to another point. Spanish speaking Latinos are the only group of Latinos that are given official status as a group, Hispanic! Seems a bit discriminatory doesn't it! Even Hispanic is a vastly misused and misunderstood term. Hispanic means of a Spanish speaking country, you don't have to be from Spain. The vast majority of Spaniards, some 99.99 percent are White! Hispanic derives from Hispania, the Roman name for Spain. As the Spanish dialects diverged, it soon became Espana.
Another point of importance is that the term Latin America was coined by the French in reference to their own colonies in the Americas! Thus, French/Spanish speaking Cajuns and French speaking Canadians can rightfully be called Latinos!
-- CoCoLumps ( Love yourself) 04:08, 21 May 2013 (UTC)
-- CoCoLumps ( Love yourself) 03:10, 09 May 2013 (UTC)
"Hispanic or Latino" refers to a person of Cuban, Mexican, Puerto Rican, South or Central American, or other Spanish or Portuguese culture or origin regardless of race.
For Census 2000, American Community Survey: People who identify with the terms "Hispanic" or "Latino" are those who classify themselves in one of the specific Hispanic or Latino categories listed on the Census 2000 or ACS questionnaire - "Mexican," "Puerto Rican," or "Cuban" - as well as those who indicate that they are "other Spanish, Hispanic, or Latino." Origin can be viewed as the heritage, nationality group, lineage, or country of birth of the person or the person's parents or ancestors before their arrival in the United States. People who identify their origin as Spanish, Hispanic, or Latino may be of any "race".
1990 Census of Population and Housing: A self-designated classification for people whose origins are from Spain, the Spanish-speaking countries of Central or South America, the Caribbean, or those identifying themselves generally as Spanish, Spanish-American, etc. Origin can be viewed as ancestry, nationality, or country of birth of the person or person's parents or ancestors prior to their arrival in the United States.
So far, the vast weight of sources that have been cited in this discussion say that Haitians are not Latino / Latin American. CoCoLumps is the only person in this thread arguing that Haitians should be identified as being Latino / Latin American. Let's try to reach consensus here. CoCoLumps--do you have any sources that support your views? Otherwise, the vast weight of the evidence points to reverting back to list Haitians as not being Latin American. If no sources are forthcoming, and if no one else chimes in to support the idea that Haitians are Latino, then I think we need to follow the sources and remove the references to Latino / Latin America. Let's give it 5-7 days and see where things stand. Anyone opposed? Goodsdrew ( talk) 14:25, 17 May 2013 (UTC)
Do to the Philippine islands being part of the Hispanadad ( http://pinas.dlsu.edu.ph/history/history.html , http://philippines-timeline.com/spanish.htm) and Filipinos of Southern California helping in race relations. Last but never the least Filipino Americans are differentiated just as are Latinos Some are Natives others are not.... In pure defense just because they have been classified as only Asians in older American history references, that archaic classification should not give us current historians and Americans the right to discount their Hispanic lineage any longer. That pretense falls under the same attitudes of people discounting the white race of mixed raced people because they are brown of skin tone. Be as it will I changed the box. -- Iamiyouareyou ( talk) 14:51, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
It never will be fair that Filipino Americans of Hispanic decent receive twice the classification and twice the ethnic community. That is just what it is and it is are duty to stand tall and be unbiased and write the truthful information down.-- Iamiyouareyou ( talk) 14:57, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
More sources /info/en/?search=Hispanic_%28U.S._Census%29 , /info/en/?search=Hispanic, /info/en/?search=Filipino_people#Colonial_influence, /info/en/?search=Filipino_people_of_Spanish_ancestry , /info/en/?search=Spanish_influence_on_Filipino_culture , http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdLQ1nXDRSE
-- Iamiyouareyou ( talk) 13:53, 26 April 2014 (UTC)
reverted edit that removed Filipinos do to categorization of list being "Hispanic and Latino" And not a list exclusively of Latino groups. Stating once again Filipinos are Hispanic. Iamiyouareyou ( talk)
This edit removed this again, saying "reverted unexplained reversion, Filipino Americans are not categorized by the U.S. Census Bureau as being Lationo/Hispanic".
Guys, please don't edit war over this -- especially in a template used by quite a few articles.
I'll comment here that neither Wikipedia not YouTube are reliable sources. I'll also suggest that it might be useful to read the Latin Americans article (a WP article and therefore not in itself a reliable source). Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 23:02, 10 October 2014 (UTC)
I have reverted the WP:BOLD change by Iamiyouareyou ( talk · contribs). There is no consensus or reliable sources that verify that Filipino Americans are categorized by the USCB as being Latino/Hispanic. There has been no change to consensus or reliable sources on the subject and I ask Wtmitchell ( talk · contribs) to weigh in on the matter as he has been involved with this subject in the past, and as Iamiyouareyou has declared an edit war on my talk page.-- RightCowLeftCoast ( talk) 00:56, 8 February 2017 (UTC)
The template links to Basque Americans. However, as I understand it, Basque Americans are neither Latino (being from Europe) nor Hispanic (being not of Spanish-speaking origin). Is it misplaced on the template? -- Gerrit C U T E D H 14:05, 14 January 2014 (UTC)