This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Infobox observatory template. |
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![]() | This template does not require a rating on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||
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The template can currently cope with up to six telescopes. If more telescopes need to be on the template, then please let me know (or add support for them yourself). Mike Peel 22:02, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
I have removed this template from the article Mount Wilson Observatory because it insisted on importing false information from Wikidata, namely, that the 200-inch Hale telescope was located at Mount Wilson. This template should redesigned so that it won't import any telescopes from Wikidata if any telescope parameters are completed in the template. Otherwise false or duplicate information may be imported from Wikidata. Any normal user will be mystified as to the templates behavior if information is being mashed together from two different sources. Jc3s5h ( talk) 18:36, 18 September 2016 (UTC)
Does this "Infobox observatories" follow the letter, or spirit, of " Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Wikidata Phase 2", which discussed whether importing data from Wikidata (which is not a reliable source because it is based on data added by unvetted users, just as Wikipedia is not a reliable source because it is edited by unvetted users) adhered to the verifiability policy. The conclusion was "It is appropriate to modify existing infoboxes to permit Wikidata inclusion when there is no existing English Wikipedia data for a specific field in the infobox". This infobox displays all the telescopes that can be found either entered by Wikipedia editors, or contained in the Wikidata item for the observatory. Jc3s5h ( talk) 12:33, 26 September 2016 (UTC)
which is not a reliable source because it is based on data added by unvetted users, just as Wikipedia is not a reliable source because it is edited by unvetted usersis irrelevant. We are not citing Wikidata.
which discussed whether importing data from Wikidata adhered to the verifiability policyis a mis-characterization of the phase 2 RFC. The conclusion is clear, and you highlighted it yourself. -- Izno ( talk) 12:42, 26 September 2016 (UTC)
Author |
George Orwell
![]() |
---|---|
Pages | 92
![]() |
Please see Talk:Royal Observatory, Greenwich#Latitude and longitude invisible to API. I've never used the API, but an editor reports that the API does not provide any coordinates from the Royal Observatory, Greenwich article. This might possibly be related to the fact that the Infobox observatory in this article does not directly contain the coordinates, rather, the coordinates are imported from Wikidata. Jc3s5h ( talk) 21:48, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
I can't understand exactly how this template is interacting with wikidata, but something seems to be wrong in that the API serves up the map image instead of the infobox photo (eg. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=query&format=xml&prop=pageimages&titles=Sherwood%20Observatory), for articles that use this infobox. Regular infoboxes ignore the map and give the photo instead. Is this a bug, or have I misunderstood how infoboxes work? -- Gapfall ( talk) 17:48, 6 July 2017 (UTC)
If Wikidata has multiple images, this template throws a redlink instead of showing one or all images. This happens fairly frequently, see e.g. the current versions of Lick Observatory, Mount Wilson Observatory, Goldstone Deep Space Communications Complex, ... Fram ( talk) 14:40, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
@ Fram and Francis Schonken: This might be a good place to follow up on your comments at Wikipedia:Templates_for_discussion/Log/2017_September_15#Queries (since this isn't directly related to Cite Q). First, Francis, apologies for my edit summary when I reverted his edit at [1] - I hadn't noticed this part of the discussion then.
Fram, you said "Another example. Bagnoud Observatory uses the infobox observatory, which gets populated through Wikidata, and where the location uses the value from the Wikidata location fields (Saint-Luc, Canton of Valais, Switzerland), but the reference from the GRID, "GRID Release 2017-05-22, 22 May 2017, doi:10.6084/M9.FIGSHARE.5032286, Wikidata Q30141628". Well, actually, it doesn't use the actual identifier from the GRID, which is in this case this, but it uses the reference for the identifier, which is an URL found in another Wikidata item. That URL doesn't go to the GRID site, but to a share [2] where the GRID database is available for download. This is an extremely un-userfriendly and roundabout way to present a reference to an editor, and we can't simply change the reference either at the article or in Wikidata. To make matters worse, the actual reference used (assuming you eventually found it) states that the Observatory is in Geneva, Geneva, Switzerland, not in Saint-Luc, Valois, Switzerland [3]. To be clear, the correct location is Saint-Luc, Valois [4]. Confusing, no? Fram ( talk) 13:41, 29 September 2017 (UTC)"
I agree that the GRID reference is not very useful here. I've asked @ ArthurPSmith about that on his Wikidata talk page. In this case it's only used to reference the country, though, not the location within that country. I've added the ofxb reference to Wikidata, and this is now more clear, although I know that doesn't solve the general problem here. Thanks. Mike Peel ( talk) 22:28, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
If the following differentiation[1] between these two words is satisfactory, I suggest using the former instead of the latter.
[1] https://english.stackexchange.com/a/16747 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.117.201.26 ( talk) 08:43, 31 May 2018 (UTC)
{{
Infobox building}} and {{
Infobox shopping mall}} have both recently been updated to automatically show dynamic mapframe maps by default. I am proposing to similarly show such maps by default for this template, with the same optional parameters to adjust the size, frame center point, initial zoom level, and marker icon; and to similarly allow the mapframe map to be turned off using |mapframe=no
. See
Template:Infobox building#Mapframe maps and
Template talk:Infobox building#Change to the map parameter so Kartographer works for further information. (FYI: I'm making similar proposal for other
buildings infobox templates) -
Evad37 [
talk
15:36, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
I just extended support for |qid=
to the coordinates and location maps for
Paul G. Comba. this required adding support for qid to
Module:Coordinates, passing qid to {{
coord}} and {{
wikidata location map}}, and adding support for qid to {{
wikidata location map}}. let me know if this causes any problems.
Frietjes (
talk)
14:54, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
The Observatory code field is not returning a linked code. Instead the entry reads something like [List of observatory codes#050 050] for Stockholm Observatory. The link code should be [https://newton.spacedys.com/neodys/index.php?pc=2.1.0&o=050 050] instead. Unless the idea was to produce [[List of observatory codes#050|050]]. StarryGrandma ( talk) 06:51, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
{{#invoke:WikidataIB|getPreferredValue|P717|name=code|suppressfields={{{suppressfields|}}}|fetchwikidata={{{fetchwikidata|ALL}}}|onlysourced={{{onlysourced|no}}}|linkprefix="List of observatory codes#"|qid={{{qid|}}}|{{{code|}}}
qid=Q681497}}
{{#invoke:WikidataIB |getValue |P717 |rank=b |fwd=ALL |osd=n |lp="https://newton.spacedys.com/neodys/index.php?pc=2.1.0&o=" |qid=Q681497 }}
→
050
{{#invoke:WikidataIB |getValue |P717 |rank=b |name=code |spf={{{suppressfields|}}} |fwd={{{fetchwikidata|ALL}}} |osd={{{onlysourced|no}}} |lp="[List of observatory codes#" |linkpostfix={{!}} |postfix="]" |qid={{{qid|Q681497}}} |{{{code|}}} }}
→
050
I'm using {{ infobox person}} and {{infobox observatory}} on the same page: Gennadiy Borisov. {{infobox observatory}} uses "Also known as" from Gennady Borisov (Q67389917) as the value for alt_names, which is wrong in this case, and provides an "[edit on Wikidata]" link to Gennady Borisov (Q67389917) at the bottom of the box, which is also wrong in this case. How do I tell {{infobox observatory}} to not use Wikidata (as there's currently no Wikidata item for MARGO observatory)? — UnladenSwallow ( talk) 18:19, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
fetchwikidata=NONE
to completely disable Wikidata, or use e.g., suppressfields=organisation
to suppress individual fields. BTW, it's not good practice to have two infoboxes on one page, you can embed this template in infobox person by using {{Infobox person ... |module={{Infobox observatory|child=yes ... }} }}
. Thanks.
Mike Peel (
talk)
16:44, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
It's been reported by
Scs
here that, effectively, the |location=
parm specified at
Goldstone Deep Space Communications Complex is being ignored, with the value shown coming from
Goldstone Deep Space Communications Complex's (
d:Q618630) "location" (
d:Property:P276) property
Mojave Desert's (
d:Q184355) second (of four) "located in the administrative territorial entity" (
d:Property:P131) properties – Utah (
d:Property:Q829) – which is wrong in this case (it's in the part of the Mojave desert that's in California). This happens despite the Infobox having an explicit value for the location (|location=
Mojave Desert, California
) that seems to be ignored and should override the wikidata fetch, right? —[
AlanM1 (
talk)]—
05:17, 13 February 2021 (UTC)
|location=
is passed to the embedded {{
Infobox observatory}} and only affects the display of the second part of the infobox, as expected. It has no effect on the {{
Infobox observatory}} itself.|location=
is passed to {{
Infobox observatory}} and should override the value fetched from Wikidata, However, the logic in |data6
in the template definition is borked, using a mixture of Wikidata calls that don't respond uniformly to locally supplied overrides. If you compare {{Wikidata location |qid=Q618630}}
→
Barstow,
California, US with {{Wikidata location |qid=Q618630 |location=[[Mojave Desert]], California}}
→
Mojave Desert, California, you'll see that it can do the job and
Template:Infobox observatory/sandbox makes that change for |data6
. Previewing
Goldstone Deep Space Communications Complex with {{
Infobox observatory/sandbox}}, with and without the first |location=
shows that it works with that article (because California is the first value of
located in the administrative territorial entity (P131) in
Mojave Desert (Q184355)).{{Infobox observatory}}
should use the |location=
parameter if it's given. If not, it should use the location
(P276) property of the article's wikidata item (Q618630) + ", " + located in the administrative territorial entity
(P131) of the same wikidata item (Q618630). If Q618630 doesn't have a P131, it should get the second part of the displayed location from the P131 of the item to which P276 points (Q184355). This allows overriding the defaults at different levels as needed. (Which may well be what the sandbox version now does – I haven't worked with any of the Wikidata templates enough to competently read it). I did verify that the current case does work correctly with the sandbox template: if you put {{Infobox observatory/sandbox|location=foo|...}}
in the GDSCC article, it renders the location as "foo". If you leave out the |location=
, it correctly renders "Mojave Desert, California, US". —[
AlanM1 (
talk)]—
03:49, 14 February 2021 (UTC)Jonesey95, I just found this issue in Barnard Observatory which lead me to this discussion, which seems to have gone dormant. Can you look into this and get the local value for location to override WD? MB 03:22, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
|location=
University of Mississippi campus,
Oxford, Mississippi
. With the sandbox version, I still see "Oxford, Layafette County, Mississippi" (which I assume is from WD, but there is no pencil icon either).
MB
15:45, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
|location=
to override Wikidata. –
Jonesey95 (
talk)
16:16, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
Hello! The documentation says that "established" uses date of official opening (P1619) while "closed" uses end time (P582). I think it would be better to use the following properties in order of fallback:
I don't think start/end time should be preferred because they are not very specific and are used somewhat differently (such as for when something comes into effect). Tol | talk | contribs 21:12, 16 June 2021 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Infobox observatory template. |
|
![]() | This template does not require a rating on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||
|
The template can currently cope with up to six telescopes. If more telescopes need to be on the template, then please let me know (or add support for them yourself). Mike Peel 22:02, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
I have removed this template from the article Mount Wilson Observatory because it insisted on importing false information from Wikidata, namely, that the 200-inch Hale telescope was located at Mount Wilson. This template should redesigned so that it won't import any telescopes from Wikidata if any telescope parameters are completed in the template. Otherwise false or duplicate information may be imported from Wikidata. Any normal user will be mystified as to the templates behavior if information is being mashed together from two different sources. Jc3s5h ( talk) 18:36, 18 September 2016 (UTC)
Does this "Infobox observatories" follow the letter, or spirit, of " Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Wikidata Phase 2", which discussed whether importing data from Wikidata (which is not a reliable source because it is based on data added by unvetted users, just as Wikipedia is not a reliable source because it is edited by unvetted users) adhered to the verifiability policy. The conclusion was "It is appropriate to modify existing infoboxes to permit Wikidata inclusion when there is no existing English Wikipedia data for a specific field in the infobox". This infobox displays all the telescopes that can be found either entered by Wikipedia editors, or contained in the Wikidata item for the observatory. Jc3s5h ( talk) 12:33, 26 September 2016 (UTC)
which is not a reliable source because it is based on data added by unvetted users, just as Wikipedia is not a reliable source because it is edited by unvetted usersis irrelevant. We are not citing Wikidata.
which discussed whether importing data from Wikidata adhered to the verifiability policyis a mis-characterization of the phase 2 RFC. The conclusion is clear, and you highlighted it yourself. -- Izno ( talk) 12:42, 26 September 2016 (UTC)
Author |
George Orwell
![]() |
---|---|
Pages | 92
![]() |
Please see Talk:Royal Observatory, Greenwich#Latitude and longitude invisible to API. I've never used the API, but an editor reports that the API does not provide any coordinates from the Royal Observatory, Greenwich article. This might possibly be related to the fact that the Infobox observatory in this article does not directly contain the coordinates, rather, the coordinates are imported from Wikidata. Jc3s5h ( talk) 21:48, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
I can't understand exactly how this template is interacting with wikidata, but something seems to be wrong in that the API serves up the map image instead of the infobox photo (eg. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=query&format=xml&prop=pageimages&titles=Sherwood%20Observatory), for articles that use this infobox. Regular infoboxes ignore the map and give the photo instead. Is this a bug, or have I misunderstood how infoboxes work? -- Gapfall ( talk) 17:48, 6 July 2017 (UTC)
If Wikidata has multiple images, this template throws a redlink instead of showing one or all images. This happens fairly frequently, see e.g. the current versions of Lick Observatory, Mount Wilson Observatory, Goldstone Deep Space Communications Complex, ... Fram ( talk) 14:40, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
@ Fram and Francis Schonken: This might be a good place to follow up on your comments at Wikipedia:Templates_for_discussion/Log/2017_September_15#Queries (since this isn't directly related to Cite Q). First, Francis, apologies for my edit summary when I reverted his edit at [1] - I hadn't noticed this part of the discussion then.
Fram, you said "Another example. Bagnoud Observatory uses the infobox observatory, which gets populated through Wikidata, and where the location uses the value from the Wikidata location fields (Saint-Luc, Canton of Valais, Switzerland), but the reference from the GRID, "GRID Release 2017-05-22, 22 May 2017, doi:10.6084/M9.FIGSHARE.5032286, Wikidata Q30141628". Well, actually, it doesn't use the actual identifier from the GRID, which is in this case this, but it uses the reference for the identifier, which is an URL found in another Wikidata item. That URL doesn't go to the GRID site, but to a share [2] where the GRID database is available for download. This is an extremely un-userfriendly and roundabout way to present a reference to an editor, and we can't simply change the reference either at the article or in Wikidata. To make matters worse, the actual reference used (assuming you eventually found it) states that the Observatory is in Geneva, Geneva, Switzerland, not in Saint-Luc, Valois, Switzerland [3]. To be clear, the correct location is Saint-Luc, Valois [4]. Confusing, no? Fram ( talk) 13:41, 29 September 2017 (UTC)"
I agree that the GRID reference is not very useful here. I've asked @ ArthurPSmith about that on his Wikidata talk page. In this case it's only used to reference the country, though, not the location within that country. I've added the ofxb reference to Wikidata, and this is now more clear, although I know that doesn't solve the general problem here. Thanks. Mike Peel ( talk) 22:28, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
If the following differentiation[1] between these two words is satisfactory, I suggest using the former instead of the latter.
[1] https://english.stackexchange.com/a/16747 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.117.201.26 ( talk) 08:43, 31 May 2018 (UTC)
{{
Infobox building}} and {{
Infobox shopping mall}} have both recently been updated to automatically show dynamic mapframe maps by default. I am proposing to similarly show such maps by default for this template, with the same optional parameters to adjust the size, frame center point, initial zoom level, and marker icon; and to similarly allow the mapframe map to be turned off using |mapframe=no
. See
Template:Infobox building#Mapframe maps and
Template talk:Infobox building#Change to the map parameter so Kartographer works for further information. (FYI: I'm making similar proposal for other
buildings infobox templates) -
Evad37 [
talk
15:36, 31 August 2018 (UTC)
I just extended support for |qid=
to the coordinates and location maps for
Paul G. Comba. this required adding support for qid to
Module:Coordinates, passing qid to {{
coord}} and {{
wikidata location map}}, and adding support for qid to {{
wikidata location map}}. let me know if this causes any problems.
Frietjes (
talk)
14:54, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
The Observatory code field is not returning a linked code. Instead the entry reads something like [List of observatory codes#050 050] for Stockholm Observatory. The link code should be [https://newton.spacedys.com/neodys/index.php?pc=2.1.0&o=050 050] instead. Unless the idea was to produce [[List of observatory codes#050|050]]. StarryGrandma ( talk) 06:51, 29 August 2019 (UTC)
{{#invoke:WikidataIB|getPreferredValue|P717|name=code|suppressfields={{{suppressfields|}}}|fetchwikidata={{{fetchwikidata|ALL}}}|onlysourced={{{onlysourced|no}}}|linkprefix="List of observatory codes#"|qid={{{qid|}}}|{{{code|}}}
qid=Q681497}}
{{#invoke:WikidataIB |getValue |P717 |rank=b |fwd=ALL |osd=n |lp="https://newton.spacedys.com/neodys/index.php?pc=2.1.0&o=" |qid=Q681497 }}
→
050
{{#invoke:WikidataIB |getValue |P717 |rank=b |name=code |spf={{{suppressfields|}}} |fwd={{{fetchwikidata|ALL}}} |osd={{{onlysourced|no}}} |lp="[List of observatory codes#" |linkpostfix={{!}} |postfix="]" |qid={{{qid|Q681497}}} |{{{code|}}} }}
→
050
I'm using {{ infobox person}} and {{infobox observatory}} on the same page: Gennadiy Borisov. {{infobox observatory}} uses "Also known as" from Gennady Borisov (Q67389917) as the value for alt_names, which is wrong in this case, and provides an "[edit on Wikidata]" link to Gennady Borisov (Q67389917) at the bottom of the box, which is also wrong in this case. How do I tell {{infobox observatory}} to not use Wikidata (as there's currently no Wikidata item for MARGO observatory)? — UnladenSwallow ( talk) 18:19, 6 October 2019 (UTC)
fetchwikidata=NONE
to completely disable Wikidata, or use e.g., suppressfields=organisation
to suppress individual fields. BTW, it's not good practice to have two infoboxes on one page, you can embed this template in infobox person by using {{Infobox person ... |module={{Infobox observatory|child=yes ... }} }}
. Thanks.
Mike Peel (
talk)
16:44, 7 October 2019 (UTC)
It's been reported by
Scs
here that, effectively, the |location=
parm specified at
Goldstone Deep Space Communications Complex is being ignored, with the value shown coming from
Goldstone Deep Space Communications Complex's (
d:Q618630) "location" (
d:Property:P276) property
Mojave Desert's (
d:Q184355) second (of four) "located in the administrative territorial entity" (
d:Property:P131) properties – Utah (
d:Property:Q829) – which is wrong in this case (it's in the part of the Mojave desert that's in California). This happens despite the Infobox having an explicit value for the location (|location=
Mojave Desert, California
) that seems to be ignored and should override the wikidata fetch, right? —[
AlanM1 (
talk)]—
05:17, 13 February 2021 (UTC)
|location=
is passed to the embedded {{
Infobox observatory}} and only affects the display of the second part of the infobox, as expected. It has no effect on the {{
Infobox observatory}} itself.|location=
is passed to {{
Infobox observatory}} and should override the value fetched from Wikidata, However, the logic in |data6
in the template definition is borked, using a mixture of Wikidata calls that don't respond uniformly to locally supplied overrides. If you compare {{Wikidata location |qid=Q618630}}
→
Barstow,
California, US with {{Wikidata location |qid=Q618630 |location=[[Mojave Desert]], California}}
→
Mojave Desert, California, you'll see that it can do the job and
Template:Infobox observatory/sandbox makes that change for |data6
. Previewing
Goldstone Deep Space Communications Complex with {{
Infobox observatory/sandbox}}, with and without the first |location=
shows that it works with that article (because California is the first value of
located in the administrative territorial entity (P131) in
Mojave Desert (Q184355)).{{Infobox observatory}}
should use the |location=
parameter if it's given. If not, it should use the location
(P276) property of the article's wikidata item (Q618630) + ", " + located in the administrative territorial entity
(P131) of the same wikidata item (Q618630). If Q618630 doesn't have a P131, it should get the second part of the displayed location from the P131 of the item to which P276 points (Q184355). This allows overriding the defaults at different levels as needed. (Which may well be what the sandbox version now does – I haven't worked with any of the Wikidata templates enough to competently read it). I did verify that the current case does work correctly with the sandbox template: if you put {{Infobox observatory/sandbox|location=foo|...}}
in the GDSCC article, it renders the location as "foo". If you leave out the |location=
, it correctly renders "Mojave Desert, California, US". —[
AlanM1 (
talk)]—
03:49, 14 February 2021 (UTC)Jonesey95, I just found this issue in Barnard Observatory which lead me to this discussion, which seems to have gone dormant. Can you look into this and get the local value for location to override WD? MB 03:22, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
|location=
University of Mississippi campus,
Oxford, Mississippi
. With the sandbox version, I still see "Oxford, Layafette County, Mississippi" (which I assume is from WD, but there is no pencil icon either).
MB
15:45, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
|location=
to override Wikidata. –
Jonesey95 (
talk)
16:16, 28 June 2021 (UTC)
Hello! The documentation says that "established" uses date of official opening (P1619) while "closed" uses end time (P582). I think it would be better to use the following properties in order of fallback:
I don't think start/end time should be preferred because they are not very specific and are used somewhat differently (such as for when something comes into effect). Tol | talk | contribs 21:12, 16 June 2021 (UTC)