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On 16 January 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved to Young-adult literature. The result of the discussion was Procedural close. |
On 16 January 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved from Young adult fiction to Young adult literature. The result of the discussion was moved. |
This page has archives. Sections older than 180 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 5 sections are present. |
No mention of Tolkien in the article. This seems odd, even though The Lord of the Rings is categorised, sometimes, as adult fiction: "Of Tolkien's works, the YA library should have The Hobbit, The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion, and also Unfinished Tales - with further material from The Silmarillion". [1] Rwood128 ( talk) 18:14, 10 May 2023 (UTC)
Thanks again Dan Bloch. I'm continuing to learn while editing here. I'm not a librarian nor high school teacher, so my edits may reveal blindspots in my knowledge.-- Rwood128 ( talk) 22:21, 11 May 2023 (UTC) I will revise the discussion of The Lord of the Rings.-- Rwood128 ( talk) 22:26, 11 May 2023 (UTC)
The original definition of YA as realistic has obviously been replaced: what would be one for 2023? -- Rwood128 ( talk) 18:46, 18 May 2023 (UTC)
References
Hi Dan Bloch, Re your recent deletion, can you explain why YA fiction doesn't fit this definition:
YA is described – and marketed – as category fiction. Wouldn't it have better to have edited, rather than delete, the section? Rwood128 ( talk) 15:36, 23 May 2023 (UTC)
The use of the word genre in connection with YA can be confusing and the early definition from the 1960s does make it sound like a sub-genre. Some of what I said may have been a little confused. However, if "The main genres are crime, fantasy, romance, science fiction and horror—as well as perhaps Western, inspirational and historical fiction," are examples of genre fiction(from the lede of genre fiction), then why aren't YA examples of these genres also genre fiction? In 2016 I thought I knew the answer Talk:Genre fiction#Literature for children and young adults.-- Rwood128 ( talk) 11:45, 24 May 2023 (UTC)
References
Block evasion by User:Dcasey98. |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
I'm taking to the talk page on this. I think people have difficulty placing this series because it evolves significantly over the course of the 7 books. I don't think there is any justification for counting Harry Potter as a "middle grade series" (a la Diary of a Wimpy Kid or Percy Jackson & the Olympians) given the lexile level of the books, their length, the age of the characters, the darker, more violent content, some of the conventions used (like the 7th book's epigraphs from Aeschylus and William Penn) and the very occasional use of language ("slut", "bastard", "bitch") that is not under any circumstance published in titles considered "Middle Grade". I acknowledge the somewhat subjective nature of this debate, but this makes it difficult to cite any one source to properly support either claim - many will say they are Young Adult, some will say Middle Grade, some say that the series progresses from Middle Grade to YA by about book 3 or 4, and the series is often casually referred to as a YA series. The Fantastic Beasts prequel stories to Harry Potter contain adult main characters, World War II imagery, and instances of infanticide. The wizarding world films are mostly PG-13 or 12 rated. The multimedia franchise overall, I'd argue, has complicated this by stretching the appeal and target audience of the franchise and its originating book series significantly. I don't think there is any meaningful argument to support the claim that Harry Potter is Middle Grade beyond "the first book is". I'm happy to revert the page back to where it was before my edits until a consensus is arrived at. Threefrgy ( talk) 04:44, 23 September 2023 (UTC)
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The result of the move request was: Procedural close. Withdrawn by nom. – robertsky ( talk) 14:59, 16 January 2024 (UTC)
Young adult fiction → Young-adult literature – We hyphenate adjective phrases on Wikipedia and the scope is "literature" not fiction. For instance, the page includes the "novel" 61 times and the word "film" only once, so it is far and away about a particular type of fiction: written fiction AKA literature. Wolfdog ( talk) 19:01, 12 January 2024 (UTC) Wolfdog ( talk) 19:01, 12 January 2024 (UTC) This is a contested technical request ( permalink). – robertsky ( talk) 02:17, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
comment contesting the technical request
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The result of the move request was: moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) BilledMammal ( talk) 01:44, 7 February 2024 (UTC)
Young adult fiction → Young adult literature – The scope of the article is clearly "literature" not fiction. For instance, the page includes the word "novel" 61 times and the word "film" only once, so it is far and away about a particular type of fiction: written fiction... AKA literature. This is also an important term in the marketing world and education. Ngrams shows the slight preference for my label: thus WP:COMMONNAME. Wolfdog ( talk) 14:58, 16 January 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. ( t · c) buidhe 17:23, 23 January 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. BilledMammal ( talk) 01:12, 31 January 2024 (UTC)
This
level-5 vital article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||
|
On 16 January 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved to Young-adult literature. The result of the discussion was Procedural close. |
On 16 January 2024, it was proposed that this article be moved from Young adult fiction to Young adult literature. The result of the discussion was moved. |
This page has archives. Sections older than 180 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 5 sections are present. |
No mention of Tolkien in the article. This seems odd, even though The Lord of the Rings is categorised, sometimes, as adult fiction: "Of Tolkien's works, the YA library should have The Hobbit, The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion, and also Unfinished Tales - with further material from The Silmarillion". [1] Rwood128 ( talk) 18:14, 10 May 2023 (UTC)
Thanks again Dan Bloch. I'm continuing to learn while editing here. I'm not a librarian nor high school teacher, so my edits may reveal blindspots in my knowledge.-- Rwood128 ( talk) 22:21, 11 May 2023 (UTC) I will revise the discussion of The Lord of the Rings.-- Rwood128 ( talk) 22:26, 11 May 2023 (UTC)
The original definition of YA as realistic has obviously been replaced: what would be one for 2023? -- Rwood128 ( talk) 18:46, 18 May 2023 (UTC)
References
Hi Dan Bloch, Re your recent deletion, can you explain why YA fiction doesn't fit this definition:
YA is described – and marketed – as category fiction. Wouldn't it have better to have edited, rather than delete, the section? Rwood128 ( talk) 15:36, 23 May 2023 (UTC)
The use of the word genre in connection with YA can be confusing and the early definition from the 1960s does make it sound like a sub-genre. Some of what I said may have been a little confused. However, if "The main genres are crime, fantasy, romance, science fiction and horror—as well as perhaps Western, inspirational and historical fiction," are examples of genre fiction(from the lede of genre fiction), then why aren't YA examples of these genres also genre fiction? In 2016 I thought I knew the answer Talk:Genre fiction#Literature for children and young adults.-- Rwood128 ( talk) 11:45, 24 May 2023 (UTC)
References
Block evasion by User:Dcasey98. |
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The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it. |
I'm taking to the talk page on this. I think people have difficulty placing this series because it evolves significantly over the course of the 7 books. I don't think there is any justification for counting Harry Potter as a "middle grade series" (a la Diary of a Wimpy Kid or Percy Jackson & the Olympians) given the lexile level of the books, their length, the age of the characters, the darker, more violent content, some of the conventions used (like the 7th book's epigraphs from Aeschylus and William Penn) and the very occasional use of language ("slut", "bastard", "bitch") that is not under any circumstance published in titles considered "Middle Grade". I acknowledge the somewhat subjective nature of this debate, but this makes it difficult to cite any one source to properly support either claim - many will say they are Young Adult, some will say Middle Grade, some say that the series progresses from Middle Grade to YA by about book 3 or 4, and the series is often casually referred to as a YA series. The Fantastic Beasts prequel stories to Harry Potter contain adult main characters, World War II imagery, and instances of infanticide. The wizarding world films are mostly PG-13 or 12 rated. The multimedia franchise overall, I'd argue, has complicated this by stretching the appeal and target audience of the franchise and its originating book series significantly. I don't think there is any meaningful argument to support the claim that Harry Potter is Middle Grade beyond "the first book is". I'm happy to revert the page back to where it was before my edits until a consensus is arrived at. Threefrgy ( talk) 04:44, 23 September 2023 (UTC)
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The result of the move request was: Procedural close. Withdrawn by nom. – robertsky ( talk) 14:59, 16 January 2024 (UTC)
Young adult fiction → Young-adult literature – We hyphenate adjective phrases on Wikipedia and the scope is "literature" not fiction. For instance, the page includes the "novel" 61 times and the word "film" only once, so it is far and away about a particular type of fiction: written fiction AKA literature. Wolfdog ( talk) 19:01, 12 January 2024 (UTC) Wolfdog ( talk) 19:01, 12 January 2024 (UTC) This is a contested technical request ( permalink). – robertsky ( talk) 02:17, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
comment contesting the technical request
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The result of the move request was: moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) BilledMammal ( talk) 01:44, 7 February 2024 (UTC)
Young adult fiction → Young adult literature – The scope of the article is clearly "literature" not fiction. For instance, the page includes the word "novel" 61 times and the word "film" only once, so it is far and away about a particular type of fiction: written fiction... AKA literature. This is also an important term in the marketing world and education. Ngrams shows the slight preference for my label: thus WP:COMMONNAME. Wolfdog ( talk) 14:58, 16 January 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. ( t · c) buidhe 17:23, 23 January 2024 (UTC) — Relisting. BilledMammal ( talk) 01:12, 31 January 2024 (UTC)