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Sons of the Tiger was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 12 November 2019 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into The Deadly Hands of Kung Fu. The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here. |
I've read through WP:EL and the link to the cover images appears to fall within the standard. Please do not delete without discussion. Thank you FrankWilliams 12:29, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
Curtis Magazines published the Deadly Hands of Kung Fu PERIOD. It doesn't matter if Marvel was "Really" at the heart of the mag or not. As an encyclopedia it is important to report just the facts.
Please leave the publishing information to Curtis Magazines. The affiliation with marvel is already in the article. FrankWilliams 19:21, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
You are absolutely wrong about the word "Marvel" being anywhere in this magazine. I have every copy of Deadly Hands of Kung Fu. I've read through every page of several issues; and no where and I do mean no where does the word "Marvel" exist. Every front cover of every magazine has the word "Curtis" printed on it. Furthermore every copyright notice in every issue says and I quote; verbatim:
The Deadly Hands of Kung Fu is published by MAGAZINE MANAGEMENT CO. INC., OFFICE OF PUBLICATION, 575 Madison Avenue, New York, N.Y. 10022. Published Bi-Monthly. Copyright [Year] by MAGAZINE MANAGEMENT CO., INC., A Division of Cadence Industries Corportion. All rights reserved 575 Madison Avenue, New York, N.Y. 10022. All business inquiries should be addressed to Circulation Director JOHN RYAN 6th floor. Vol. 1, No. [#] [Month, Year] issue. Price [.75] per copy in the U.S. and Canada. No similarity between any of the names, characters, persons and/or institutions in this magazine with those of any living or dead person or institution is inteded and any such similarity which may exist is purely coincidental. Printed in the U.S.A.
(The only difference between the above from issue to issue is the information contained in brackets as this changed from issue to issue).
I am using the magazines themselves are sources for the information no matter what some database somewhere says. The only fact that I concede to is that Curtis was indeed an imprint of Marvel Comics and that it was short lived; which the article clearly states. Furthermore the magazine only existed within the context of the "Curtis" name. In other words "Curtis" existed atleast as long as the duration of the entire magazine run. As for people reading the infobox prior to the article itself is:
You cannot know for certain that every Wiki reader reads the infobox first. We do not write articles based on opinions and/or speculations. If you can demonstrate "verse and chapter" of the word "Marvel" appearing on any Deadly Hands of Kung Fu magazines I will verify this information and perhaps modify the information in the article accordingly. Thank you for your time.
BTW: If you click on the "External Links" this will take you to the magazine covers gallery wich contains every cover and you can see that "Curtis" and not "Marvel" appears on each and every cover; just in case you don't actually have the magazines themselves.
FrankWilliams 01:08, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
"As for people reading the info box prior to the article itself is (sic): *A. Your opinion. *B. Your speculation. You can't know for certain that every Wiki reader reads the infobox first."
The intended purpose of the info box is to put the fundamental info out front, easily grasped, and to help a person decide if he wants to read the article itself. Just because some readers may very well ignore it doesn't mean that we aren't bound by its reason for existence in filling it out. I have ALREADY checked a complete collection of cover scans (and used to have a complete set of copies myself), and "Curtis" disappears as of #19. You can't tell me with any credibility whatsoever that "Marvel" doesn't appear on the subscription ads and the letter pages, particularly the mailing addresses therein (I could point out that another offered title in the sub. ads is MARVEL Preview) (I had to choose between making a link to that title's article and emphasizing the word "Marvel"). I can't help but notice you didn't address my statement that the second and third of your three "Fact"s in your previous posting didn't make much if any sense, at least in this context. Since you now concede "Curtis was indeed an imprint of Marvel Comics..." why don't you concede to the definition of the word " imprint" while you're at it, as I asked you to before? That would in turn concede that "Curtis" was not an actual company but a pseudonym of Marvel, and that Marvel was the REAL "company" per se responsible for the magazine, and therefore belongs in the infobox, if only in parenthesis beside "Curtis," which is indeed the least it can possibly deserve. Furthermore, the infobox lists Roy Thomas as "Editor," and throughout the 1970s (the era of this mag) he was working exclusively for Marvel. And for pete's sake, if you don't think that the regular comic story slot for the character Shang Chi, star of the MARVEL four-color comic Master of Kung Fu, frequent appearances of Marvel four-color star Iron Fist, and the fact that DHOKF creation Sons of the Tiger/White Tiger 's characters and plotlines were picked up, resolved, and subsequently utilized in various titles of the aforementioned Marvel four-color line doesn't PROVE deep involvement of Marvel (which in the '70s did not publish anything that they did not own outright--with the explicitly acknowledged special exceptions of a few reprints in Unknown Worlds of Science Fiction--Steve Gerber's attempt to claim ownership of Man-Thing notwithstanding), I feel very sorry for you. Indeed, many of the "Curtis" b/w magazines were tie-ins to Marvel four-color comics (Dracula, Conan, and Ka-Zar were also regulars in both lines around this time). Ted Watson 21:23, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
"Man-Thing" above should be Howard the Duck, My bad and my apologies. I have absolutely no problem admitting I am wrong when I am.
Something I forgot to say before, and I'll just add it on as you have as yet to respond at all, anyway. You wrote, "I am using the magazines themselves as sources of information no matter what some database somewhere says." The point here, however, is to get to the reality of the situation, and the GCD, as its own people abbreviate the name, specializes in this type of publication. Furthermore, it is not subject to the whims of anyone who comes along. One has to sign up, and even then one can't edit at will, but must submit one's information for approval before they put it up. The GCD is a solid source of info on this point, and a Wiki article should, as I said before, report the facts of the situation, not just the pseudonyms (or, for that matter, omissions or misinformation where applicable) that are put forward in the material that is itself the subject of an article [minor clarifying update by TW--26 June]. Your suggesting otherwise is indefensible. Ted Watson 17:23, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Ted, I don't know what your problem with this is and its getting quite silly. We both agree that Curtis was an imprint of Marvel. No dispute there. We both agree that Curtis is physically stamped all over the blasted magazine. Therefore it was published under the Curtis name. The article already says that Curtis is an imprint of Marvel. Kindly leave the information alone. FrankWilliams 13:25, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
To begin, I must say that this is the neatest, most professional argument I have seen in any wikipedia talk page...EVER! You two should be proud of yourselves for keeping to such a relative level of civility...it's ridiculous what happens everywhere else.
I enjoyed reviewing both sides of this argument, and after reading through what I felt was all of the relevant information, I posit my recommendation that the infobox remain as "Curtis." It's like if some new soft drink hits the market under some newfangled brand mark, and it is discovered later that this name is really just a sub-company or division or project of, Coke, let's say, I would assert that the article would include all of the information, but the infobox would just state "Newfangle." While the infobox might aid readers in determining which pages they read, I don't feel that that is a reason to include secondary information like Curtis' 'subsidiery-ship' to Marvel. Again, I don't say that this information is unimportant or irrelevant; rather, only that is is secondary.
It is my hope that you two can use this oppotunity to enjoy each other's obviously deep-seated interest in this comic rather than letting this point of contention lead to a continuation of this rift. Good-day! DRosenbach ( Talk | Contribs) 03:28, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
The Marvel name does NOT appear in any of the magazine information; this has been by position all along. Because of this the infobox should not contain the name Marvel. Furthermore, Marvel went to great lengths to "disassociate" itself from the more mature themed B+W magazines and to blatantly advertise this as a Marvel product in the infobx goes against the intentions of using the imprint name in the first place. If Marvel wanted to advertise its B+W magazines with their Marvel name they would have done so, and there wouldn't be a need for using an imprint.
As for my using the word "blasted magazine" there is nothing wrong, with saying this and it doesn't break any Wiki guidelines, and to suggest otherwise is absurd. In the event anyone doesn't know the expression; it is an emphasis on frustration on a matter that is quite clear. FrankWilliams 12:34, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
To DRosenbach: If you had checked the History listings, you would have seen that I had indeed submitted your "compromise" suggestion (if not exactly verbatim) and Frank reverted it. Not doing so is, given what you came here to do, lacking in competency---a fact relevant to disputing the validity of your "third opinion" that needs to be pointed out, "civil" or not. And if you'd read all that's here, you'd see that we don't agree on the facts. We do not agree on whether or not "Marvel" is in the magazine at all. We do not agree on where "Curtis" is and is not in the magazine, other than the corner of the cover. And I stand by my previous statement that his evasions of some of my points and acting as if my lengthy posting refuting his statements and my brief one indicating his conceding the point by default did not exist does not meet my definition of civil debate. One last argument via hypothetical situation to you: Somebody stumbles on this article through a link. He sees the infobox. He thinks its a straight and serious martial arts magazine. If that interests him, he reads further, and when he finds in the text that its a Marvel comic mag, he gets ticked. If a Marvel comic mag would interest him, he doesn't read further because he thinks its something else and misses out on something he actually would have liked to read. That is why Marvel should be in the infobox!
To FrankWilliams: If you really think I was faulting your use of the word "blasted" (and given your history of evasions and misrepresentations here, I don't), you do have problems. That just is not there. I was denying any accuracy to "all over the...magazine." Let me tell you that your new claim that "Marvel went to great lengths to 'disassociate' itself" from the b/w line is absolutely out of line with the facts. As I have already said, they utilized several of their four-color heroes (and other characters) in them, Marvel staffers made them, they promoted them in their color comics, and they named one of them MARVEL Preview! When I said, "Attributing the copyright notice to Roy Thomas, editor of the first two issues, is absurd," I meant attributing it to any editor at all, not one specific one as opposed to all of them. What's your source for what "CC" stands for (not that I haven't always figured it very likely that "Curtis" was part of it)? In any event, with that change, "Curtis" per se disappeared from the magazine entirely, working against the claim that it and only it should be in the infobox's company slot. Ted Watson 20:48, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
The Curtis name is in fact on every cover. After issue #19 it was changed to CC which stood for Curtis Circulation. Just click on the Curtis Magazines link and that article will give you this information (perhaps you'd like to argue with the author of that article now); if you bothered doing that in the first place you wouldn't make these wild claims. Also using the word "Marvel" in an editorial is not the same as making it part of the magazine copyright information which I still maintain does not exist. If the editorial mentioned DC Comics would that mean the "The Deadly Hands of Kung Fu" magazine is now affiliated with DC Comics? I think NOT. If someone can prove that the Marvel name is any of the magazines as part of the "OFFICIAL" magazine listed information I will recant; but short of this Stare decisis. FrankWilliams 22:08, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
The statement above:
is relevant because:
The Comics Code Authority (CCA) is part of the Comics Magazine Association of America (CMAA), and was created to regulate the content of comic books in the United States. Member publishers submit comic books to the CCA, which screens them for conformance to its Comics Code, and authorizes the use of their seal on the cover if the books comply. At the height of its influence, it was a de facto censor for the U.S. comic book industry. The Deadly Hands of Kung Fu magazine did not have the CCA Seal [1] because the magazine did not conform to the Comics Code (IE. The magazines were of a more mature nature and the CCA was NOT willing to approve them). Thus the need for utilizing an imprint name rather then their real name Marvel. A quick synopsis of this is as follows:
Comic books with the Marvel Name had the CCA Logo B+W Magazine utilizing imprint nameS did NOT have the CCA Logo
MAJOR DISCTINCTION and a source of disassociation. FrankWilliams 17:43, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
I appreciate the extended analysis, but I think the initial description of the culture and fad of Kung Fu in the 70's is sufficient with the description of the popularity of Chopsocky movies. Phrases like "everyone was" and "shaking their booty" aren't really necessary. Snowfire51 16:42, 11 July 2007 (UTC)Snowfire51
Thanks for the rewrite of the paragraph; I think it says what I initially intended but only better. I wish more editors would do this instead of just deleting stuff. Thanks again. FrankWilliams 18:28, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
This article needs the B-Class checklist filled in to remain a B-Class article for the Comics WikiProject. If the checklist is not filled in by 7th August this article will be re-assessed as C-Class. The checklist should be filled out referencing the guidance given at Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Assessment/B-Class criteria. For further details please contact the Comics WikiProject. Comics-awb ( talk) 16:17, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
In the nearly a year and a half since our disagreement and my requested third party opinion relevant thereto went incomprehensibly against me, there has been a consensus reached across the articles about these magazines against your position. See Savage Tales, Savage Sword of Conan, Rampaging Hulk and even Curtis Magazines itself, among others. Many editors, unlike you and DRosenbach (the third opinion supplier, who in the end admitted that he knew and cared nothing about these magazines, effectively declaring himself unqualified to form an opinion here, as dispute resolutions need to deal with the facts of the subject, not with only what Wiki-regs say), care about the reality of the situation, rather than just the legal fine print that is contradicted by a large quantity of blatantly presented evidence to the contrary elsewhere in the same issues. I repeat, a consensus against your position has been reached, hence the alterations to this article that you found and have just reverted (*I* didn't do them). I am therefore undoing you here. -- Ted Watson ( talk) 21:47, 1 December 2008 (UTC)
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Sons of the Tiger was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 12 November 2019 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into The Deadly Hands of Kung Fu. The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here. |
I've read through WP:EL and the link to the cover images appears to fall within the standard. Please do not delete without discussion. Thank you FrankWilliams 12:29, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
Curtis Magazines published the Deadly Hands of Kung Fu PERIOD. It doesn't matter if Marvel was "Really" at the heart of the mag or not. As an encyclopedia it is important to report just the facts.
Please leave the publishing information to Curtis Magazines. The affiliation with marvel is already in the article. FrankWilliams 19:21, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
You are absolutely wrong about the word "Marvel" being anywhere in this magazine. I have every copy of Deadly Hands of Kung Fu. I've read through every page of several issues; and no where and I do mean no where does the word "Marvel" exist. Every front cover of every magazine has the word "Curtis" printed on it. Furthermore every copyright notice in every issue says and I quote; verbatim:
The Deadly Hands of Kung Fu is published by MAGAZINE MANAGEMENT CO. INC., OFFICE OF PUBLICATION, 575 Madison Avenue, New York, N.Y. 10022. Published Bi-Monthly. Copyright [Year] by MAGAZINE MANAGEMENT CO., INC., A Division of Cadence Industries Corportion. All rights reserved 575 Madison Avenue, New York, N.Y. 10022. All business inquiries should be addressed to Circulation Director JOHN RYAN 6th floor. Vol. 1, No. [#] [Month, Year] issue. Price [.75] per copy in the U.S. and Canada. No similarity between any of the names, characters, persons and/or institutions in this magazine with those of any living or dead person or institution is inteded and any such similarity which may exist is purely coincidental. Printed in the U.S.A.
(The only difference between the above from issue to issue is the information contained in brackets as this changed from issue to issue).
I am using the magazines themselves are sources for the information no matter what some database somewhere says. The only fact that I concede to is that Curtis was indeed an imprint of Marvel Comics and that it was short lived; which the article clearly states. Furthermore the magazine only existed within the context of the "Curtis" name. In other words "Curtis" existed atleast as long as the duration of the entire magazine run. As for people reading the infobox prior to the article itself is:
You cannot know for certain that every Wiki reader reads the infobox first. We do not write articles based on opinions and/or speculations. If you can demonstrate "verse and chapter" of the word "Marvel" appearing on any Deadly Hands of Kung Fu magazines I will verify this information and perhaps modify the information in the article accordingly. Thank you for your time.
BTW: If you click on the "External Links" this will take you to the magazine covers gallery wich contains every cover and you can see that "Curtis" and not "Marvel" appears on each and every cover; just in case you don't actually have the magazines themselves.
FrankWilliams 01:08, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
"As for people reading the info box prior to the article itself is (sic): *A. Your opinion. *B. Your speculation. You can't know for certain that every Wiki reader reads the infobox first."
The intended purpose of the info box is to put the fundamental info out front, easily grasped, and to help a person decide if he wants to read the article itself. Just because some readers may very well ignore it doesn't mean that we aren't bound by its reason for existence in filling it out. I have ALREADY checked a complete collection of cover scans (and used to have a complete set of copies myself), and "Curtis" disappears as of #19. You can't tell me with any credibility whatsoever that "Marvel" doesn't appear on the subscription ads and the letter pages, particularly the mailing addresses therein (I could point out that another offered title in the sub. ads is MARVEL Preview) (I had to choose between making a link to that title's article and emphasizing the word "Marvel"). I can't help but notice you didn't address my statement that the second and third of your three "Fact"s in your previous posting didn't make much if any sense, at least in this context. Since you now concede "Curtis was indeed an imprint of Marvel Comics..." why don't you concede to the definition of the word " imprint" while you're at it, as I asked you to before? That would in turn concede that "Curtis" was not an actual company but a pseudonym of Marvel, and that Marvel was the REAL "company" per se responsible for the magazine, and therefore belongs in the infobox, if only in parenthesis beside "Curtis," which is indeed the least it can possibly deserve. Furthermore, the infobox lists Roy Thomas as "Editor," and throughout the 1970s (the era of this mag) he was working exclusively for Marvel. And for pete's sake, if you don't think that the regular comic story slot for the character Shang Chi, star of the MARVEL four-color comic Master of Kung Fu, frequent appearances of Marvel four-color star Iron Fist, and the fact that DHOKF creation Sons of the Tiger/White Tiger 's characters and plotlines were picked up, resolved, and subsequently utilized in various titles of the aforementioned Marvel four-color line doesn't PROVE deep involvement of Marvel (which in the '70s did not publish anything that they did not own outright--with the explicitly acknowledged special exceptions of a few reprints in Unknown Worlds of Science Fiction--Steve Gerber's attempt to claim ownership of Man-Thing notwithstanding), I feel very sorry for you. Indeed, many of the "Curtis" b/w magazines were tie-ins to Marvel four-color comics (Dracula, Conan, and Ka-Zar were also regulars in both lines around this time). Ted Watson 21:23, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
"Man-Thing" above should be Howard the Duck, My bad and my apologies. I have absolutely no problem admitting I am wrong when I am.
Something I forgot to say before, and I'll just add it on as you have as yet to respond at all, anyway. You wrote, "I am using the magazines themselves as sources of information no matter what some database somewhere says." The point here, however, is to get to the reality of the situation, and the GCD, as its own people abbreviate the name, specializes in this type of publication. Furthermore, it is not subject to the whims of anyone who comes along. One has to sign up, and even then one can't edit at will, but must submit one's information for approval before they put it up. The GCD is a solid source of info on this point, and a Wiki article should, as I said before, report the facts of the situation, not just the pseudonyms (or, for that matter, omissions or misinformation where applicable) that are put forward in the material that is itself the subject of an article [minor clarifying update by TW--26 June]. Your suggesting otherwise is indefensible. Ted Watson 17:23, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Ted, I don't know what your problem with this is and its getting quite silly. We both agree that Curtis was an imprint of Marvel. No dispute there. We both agree that Curtis is physically stamped all over the blasted magazine. Therefore it was published under the Curtis name. The article already says that Curtis is an imprint of Marvel. Kindly leave the information alone. FrankWilliams 13:25, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
To begin, I must say that this is the neatest, most professional argument I have seen in any wikipedia talk page...EVER! You two should be proud of yourselves for keeping to such a relative level of civility...it's ridiculous what happens everywhere else.
I enjoyed reviewing both sides of this argument, and after reading through what I felt was all of the relevant information, I posit my recommendation that the infobox remain as "Curtis." It's like if some new soft drink hits the market under some newfangled brand mark, and it is discovered later that this name is really just a sub-company or division or project of, Coke, let's say, I would assert that the article would include all of the information, but the infobox would just state "Newfangle." While the infobox might aid readers in determining which pages they read, I don't feel that that is a reason to include secondary information like Curtis' 'subsidiery-ship' to Marvel. Again, I don't say that this information is unimportant or irrelevant; rather, only that is is secondary.
It is my hope that you two can use this oppotunity to enjoy each other's obviously deep-seated interest in this comic rather than letting this point of contention lead to a continuation of this rift. Good-day! DRosenbach ( Talk | Contribs) 03:28, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
The Marvel name does NOT appear in any of the magazine information; this has been by position all along. Because of this the infobox should not contain the name Marvel. Furthermore, Marvel went to great lengths to "disassociate" itself from the more mature themed B+W magazines and to blatantly advertise this as a Marvel product in the infobx goes against the intentions of using the imprint name in the first place. If Marvel wanted to advertise its B+W magazines with their Marvel name they would have done so, and there wouldn't be a need for using an imprint.
As for my using the word "blasted magazine" there is nothing wrong, with saying this and it doesn't break any Wiki guidelines, and to suggest otherwise is absurd. In the event anyone doesn't know the expression; it is an emphasis on frustration on a matter that is quite clear. FrankWilliams 12:34, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
To DRosenbach: If you had checked the History listings, you would have seen that I had indeed submitted your "compromise" suggestion (if not exactly verbatim) and Frank reverted it. Not doing so is, given what you came here to do, lacking in competency---a fact relevant to disputing the validity of your "third opinion" that needs to be pointed out, "civil" or not. And if you'd read all that's here, you'd see that we don't agree on the facts. We do not agree on whether or not "Marvel" is in the magazine at all. We do not agree on where "Curtis" is and is not in the magazine, other than the corner of the cover. And I stand by my previous statement that his evasions of some of my points and acting as if my lengthy posting refuting his statements and my brief one indicating his conceding the point by default did not exist does not meet my definition of civil debate. One last argument via hypothetical situation to you: Somebody stumbles on this article through a link. He sees the infobox. He thinks its a straight and serious martial arts magazine. If that interests him, he reads further, and when he finds in the text that its a Marvel comic mag, he gets ticked. If a Marvel comic mag would interest him, he doesn't read further because he thinks its something else and misses out on something he actually would have liked to read. That is why Marvel should be in the infobox!
To FrankWilliams: If you really think I was faulting your use of the word "blasted" (and given your history of evasions and misrepresentations here, I don't), you do have problems. That just is not there. I was denying any accuracy to "all over the...magazine." Let me tell you that your new claim that "Marvel went to great lengths to 'disassociate' itself" from the b/w line is absolutely out of line with the facts. As I have already said, they utilized several of their four-color heroes (and other characters) in them, Marvel staffers made them, they promoted them in their color comics, and they named one of them MARVEL Preview! When I said, "Attributing the copyright notice to Roy Thomas, editor of the first two issues, is absurd," I meant attributing it to any editor at all, not one specific one as opposed to all of them. What's your source for what "CC" stands for (not that I haven't always figured it very likely that "Curtis" was part of it)? In any event, with that change, "Curtis" per se disappeared from the magazine entirely, working against the claim that it and only it should be in the infobox's company slot. Ted Watson 20:48, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
The Curtis name is in fact on every cover. After issue #19 it was changed to CC which stood for Curtis Circulation. Just click on the Curtis Magazines link and that article will give you this information (perhaps you'd like to argue with the author of that article now); if you bothered doing that in the first place you wouldn't make these wild claims. Also using the word "Marvel" in an editorial is not the same as making it part of the magazine copyright information which I still maintain does not exist. If the editorial mentioned DC Comics would that mean the "The Deadly Hands of Kung Fu" magazine is now affiliated with DC Comics? I think NOT. If someone can prove that the Marvel name is any of the magazines as part of the "OFFICIAL" magazine listed information I will recant; but short of this Stare decisis. FrankWilliams 22:08, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
The statement above:
is relevant because:
The Comics Code Authority (CCA) is part of the Comics Magazine Association of America (CMAA), and was created to regulate the content of comic books in the United States. Member publishers submit comic books to the CCA, which screens them for conformance to its Comics Code, and authorizes the use of their seal on the cover if the books comply. At the height of its influence, it was a de facto censor for the U.S. comic book industry. The Deadly Hands of Kung Fu magazine did not have the CCA Seal [1] because the magazine did not conform to the Comics Code (IE. The magazines were of a more mature nature and the CCA was NOT willing to approve them). Thus the need for utilizing an imprint name rather then their real name Marvel. A quick synopsis of this is as follows:
Comic books with the Marvel Name had the CCA Logo B+W Magazine utilizing imprint nameS did NOT have the CCA Logo
MAJOR DISCTINCTION and a source of disassociation. FrankWilliams 17:43, 9 July 2007 (UTC)
I appreciate the extended analysis, but I think the initial description of the culture and fad of Kung Fu in the 70's is sufficient with the description of the popularity of Chopsocky movies. Phrases like "everyone was" and "shaking their booty" aren't really necessary. Snowfire51 16:42, 11 July 2007 (UTC)Snowfire51
Thanks for the rewrite of the paragraph; I think it says what I initially intended but only better. I wish more editors would do this instead of just deleting stuff. Thanks again. FrankWilliams 18:28, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
This article needs the B-Class checklist filled in to remain a B-Class article for the Comics WikiProject. If the checklist is not filled in by 7th August this article will be re-assessed as C-Class. The checklist should be filled out referencing the guidance given at Wikipedia:Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Assessment/B-Class criteria. For further details please contact the Comics WikiProject. Comics-awb ( talk) 16:17, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
In the nearly a year and a half since our disagreement and my requested third party opinion relevant thereto went incomprehensibly against me, there has been a consensus reached across the articles about these magazines against your position. See Savage Tales, Savage Sword of Conan, Rampaging Hulk and even Curtis Magazines itself, among others. Many editors, unlike you and DRosenbach (the third opinion supplier, who in the end admitted that he knew and cared nothing about these magazines, effectively declaring himself unqualified to form an opinion here, as dispute resolutions need to deal with the facts of the subject, not with only what Wiki-regs say), care about the reality of the situation, rather than just the legal fine print that is contradicted by a large quantity of blatantly presented evidence to the contrary elsewhere in the same issues. I repeat, a consensus against your position has been reached, hence the alterations to this article that you found and have just reverted (*I* didn't do them). I am therefore undoing you here. -- Ted Watson ( talk) 21:47, 1 December 2008 (UTC)