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SpaceX increased their price per kilogram to $5,500. (see: https://www.spacex.com/rideshare/)
This article doesn't discuss Space launch market competition but rather only competition after 2010. Commercial space launch market exists since 1980s (or 70s, depending how you look at it) and a competition on it can be dated back to '90s (Eurockot, Starsem, Arianespace, Sea Launch, cosmos, etc.) This article seems to focus only on a competition that relates to private spaceflight, in which case it'd be appropriate to rename the article. Or add content filling huge time gap of all the events before last 5 years. SkywalkerPL ( talk) 10:35, 4 June 2015 (UTC)
After Challenger disaster in 1986 Reagan ended commercial satellite launches on Space Shuttle. Could say how many the shuttle actually did and when. - Rod57 ( talk) 11:17, 27 July 2018 (UTC)
Businessweek has a cover on the topic now: The New Space Age : Welcome to the next economic frontier, Bloomberg Businessweek, July 2018.
... and here is the lead article: Space is about to get a whole lot more accessible—and potentially profitable. Others in this issue as well.
I don't have time just now to parse the Bizweek articles to improve the WP article, but others feel free if you wish. Cheers. N2e ( talk) 06:14, 29 July 2018 (UTC)
With more and more commercial launches of smallsats, mostly by Rocket Lab to date, but several more are coming, we probably ought to discuss what to do with the number of commercial launches graph as these quite small launches heat up. Rocket Lab alone has done four launches in the past six months. What do other editors think would be the best solution. Add them to the main graph of the larger sat launches, or separate graph, or no graph, or what? Cheers. N2e ( talk) 23:39, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
This article describes an ongoing sort of competition in the US market, not on price, but on the regulatory burden that is placed on launch providers and new entrants into the space launch industry. ULA and its launch industry competitors in pitched fight over regulations, SpaceNews, 3 August 2019. Not really sure how this sort of regulatory competition might be covered in this article on space launch competition. N2e ( talk) 00:55, 9 August 2019 (UTC)
It has been brought to my attention that there are multiple issues with the graph on the page. First, it ostensibly counts number of rocket launches, but one of my edits was reverted under the logic that the graph actually depicts payloads launched. I feel as though that's confusing measurement, and it will grown even more confusing with the rise of LEO constellations. I think we should either standardize around rocket launches, or at the very least, re-label the graph.– Jadebenn ( talk · contribs · subpages) 22:00, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
(Note: This was written in parallel to the comment above) I can see a point for counting Ariane's rideshares twice, but if we count strictly by satellite then Falcon 9 has launched way more. It launched 64 satellites with a rideshare mission in December 2018 alone, and I expect no one wants to check each satellite if they were commercial enough to be included. Iridium satellites were 10 each batch and clearly commercial. What is the justification for counting every satellite for Ariane 5 but not for Falcon 9? Do we only count above some arbitrary mass threshold? Only GTO launches? We could sum the masses of the payloads, that would favor LEO deployments but overall it might give a fairer representation of the market. Ping: User:Jadebenn. -- mfb ( talk) 22:03, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
Here's a link to a report that attempts to summarize 2019 launches globally. "102 Total Orbital Launches ... 492 Total Spacecraft ... 16 Commercial Launches" (in a graphic) and "Of all orbital launches in 2019, 34 came from China, 27 from the U.S., and 22 from Russia." More at the link, and in the report. Attn: JFG and mfb Cheers. N2e ( talk) 22:20, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
The editing comments in the state that the totals should NOT include non-commercial launches. However, I noticed that, for example, Falcon 9 in 2019 had a TOTAL of 13 launches (the same number cited in both the graphic and matrix for this article), which included launches for NASA's Commercial Resupply Services as well as test fights of Dragon-2. I suggest that the numbers be updated to reflect commercial launches only to stay with the guidelines outlined in the article.
user:mnw2000 10:37, 13 June 2020 (UTC)
A source I just ran into: The Recent Large Reduction in Space Launch Cost. Don't have the time to read it now; but could be useful for improving the article. Cheers. N2e ( talk) 03:14, 10 July 2020 (UTC)
"In a restricted market, lower costs might not have much impact. None the less, “Satellite design and manufacturing is beginning to take advantage of these lower-cost options for space launch services.” And, “(T)he satellite manufacturing industry may ‘experience a shock similar to what the launcher industry is experiencing’” (Wikipedia, Space launch market competition)"
Looks like we are finally seeing, in 2021, fuller European initiatives to design/fund/build reusable first stage boosters, along the path that SpaceX began investigating over a decade ago/achieved in 2015/2016, and then made regular and operational (89 landings to date) in 2018-2020.
This is from Peter de Selding, who does the best/deepest coverage of the European launch scene, but his stuff is mostly behind a paywall. ( link). I cannot tell from the link if this is pure-play nation state funded, as traditional in European space tech sector, or if private funds driven by economic incentives (rather than geopolitical incentives of the country-level actors). But interesting to see nonetheless. If we can find non-paywalled sources, we could use to improve the article on the European response(s) to this increased market competitiveness in spaceflight services. N2e ( talk) 11:09, 6 July 2021 (UTC)
Article in ArsTechnica, 13 Sep 2013 by long time space journalist Eric Berger has an interesting paragraph on the competitive losses the Russian government space program has experienced over the past decade as a result of competition from SpaceX.
At the same time, Rogozin has seen SpaceX largely destroy important revenue streams for Russia's space industry. Most notably, Crew Dragon has cut off the approximately $400 million NASA paid to Roscosmos every year for crew transport services to the International Space Station. Additionally, SpaceX lobbied for a congressional mandate preventing United Launch Alliance from buying RD-180 rocket engines from Russia. Finally, the low-cost Falcon 9 rocket has eroded the commercial launch business for the Russian Proton rocket, a former workhorse that now launches about once a year.
Might be useful to improve some part of the article, especially looking back after the result has been seen in the launch numbers and pricing. N2e ( talk) 17:49, 13 September 2021 (UTC)
Propose delete section ( Launch vehicle cost vs mass launch cost ) - It seems generic waffle - just plugging an old report - adds nothing to this article. Anyone think it's worth improving/keeping ? - Rod57 ( talk) 00:58, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
There have been some debate about the statistics section, which revolve around the necessity to either count rocket launches, satellites placed in orbit, or total launch mass. Given that the focus of this article is competition in the satellite launch market, I had earlier focused the graph on counting satellites rather than launches. Besides, if we truly want to reflect what happens in the launch market, we should in my opinion exclude all non-competitive launches, such as military payloads (e.g. NRO spysats). There are also questions around how many satellites should be counted for each multiple launch. Therefore I'd like to re-open the debate, and start with my suggestions for counting criteria:
The floor is yours. Hopefully we can reach a consensus and implement it shortly. — JFG talk 14:06, 24 June 2022 (UTC)
Maybe constellations could be split out from the other statistics? – Jadebenn ( talk · contribs · subpages) 15:39, 24 June 2022 (UTC)
Need to have more information about recent activity along side the updated SpaceX pricing: Most of the information in the article appears to be 2021 or prior, and does not capture recent changes within the last two years. In just the cost per rocket and the rockets being launched, there are many changes. I.e:
Another source for SpaceX pricing:
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/23/spacex-raises-prices-for-launches-and-starlink-due-to-inflation.html
https://www.space.com/spacex-raises-prices-launch-starlink-inflation
Rocket Lab's Neutron rocket and pricing:
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/03/24/rocket-lab-neutron-launch-price-challenges-spacex.html
Astra's Rocket 4:
https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/08/as-losses-mount-astra-announces-a-radical-pivot-to-a-larger-launch-vehicle/ SynnerInChief ( talk) 04:31, 31 July 2023 (UTC)
Thanks for reading - — Preceding unsigned comment added by SynnerInChief ( talk • contribs) 04:32, 31 July 2023 (UTC)
The "Launch market" table has had a citation needed tag on it for over five years, since 2017. The table fails WP:V as there are no citations to support that these launches were a) made and b) actually "in the market" by being competitive launches and not launches restricted to particular nation state/country launchers.
It appears that this has gotten worse in recent years of the data in the table, where many editors can and have input/changed the data, but always without reliable source WP:CS citations. I don't know how to fix it, and so am inclined to just lose the table in the article if these data cannot be sourced. (or lose the data that are unsourced). How can we improve the article so that encyclopedic statements (data) in this table are verifiable? N2e ( talk) 15:25, 26 September 2023 (UTC)
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
SpaceX increased their price per kilogram to $5,500. (see: https://www.spacex.com/rideshare/)
This article doesn't discuss Space launch market competition but rather only competition after 2010. Commercial space launch market exists since 1980s (or 70s, depending how you look at it) and a competition on it can be dated back to '90s (Eurockot, Starsem, Arianespace, Sea Launch, cosmos, etc.) This article seems to focus only on a competition that relates to private spaceflight, in which case it'd be appropriate to rename the article. Or add content filling huge time gap of all the events before last 5 years. SkywalkerPL ( talk) 10:35, 4 June 2015 (UTC)
After Challenger disaster in 1986 Reagan ended commercial satellite launches on Space Shuttle. Could say how many the shuttle actually did and when. - Rod57 ( talk) 11:17, 27 July 2018 (UTC)
Businessweek has a cover on the topic now: The New Space Age : Welcome to the next economic frontier, Bloomberg Businessweek, July 2018.
... and here is the lead article: Space is about to get a whole lot more accessible—and potentially profitable. Others in this issue as well.
I don't have time just now to parse the Bizweek articles to improve the WP article, but others feel free if you wish. Cheers. N2e ( talk) 06:14, 29 July 2018 (UTC)
With more and more commercial launches of smallsats, mostly by Rocket Lab to date, but several more are coming, we probably ought to discuss what to do with the number of commercial launches graph as these quite small launches heat up. Rocket Lab alone has done four launches in the past six months. What do other editors think would be the best solution. Add them to the main graph of the larger sat launches, or separate graph, or no graph, or what? Cheers. N2e ( talk) 23:39, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
This article describes an ongoing sort of competition in the US market, not on price, but on the regulatory burden that is placed on launch providers and new entrants into the space launch industry. ULA and its launch industry competitors in pitched fight over regulations, SpaceNews, 3 August 2019. Not really sure how this sort of regulatory competition might be covered in this article on space launch competition. N2e ( talk) 00:55, 9 August 2019 (UTC)
It has been brought to my attention that there are multiple issues with the graph on the page. First, it ostensibly counts number of rocket launches, but one of my edits was reverted under the logic that the graph actually depicts payloads launched. I feel as though that's confusing measurement, and it will grown even more confusing with the rise of LEO constellations. I think we should either standardize around rocket launches, or at the very least, re-label the graph.– Jadebenn ( talk · contribs · subpages) 22:00, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
(Note: This was written in parallel to the comment above) I can see a point for counting Ariane's rideshares twice, but if we count strictly by satellite then Falcon 9 has launched way more. It launched 64 satellites with a rideshare mission in December 2018 alone, and I expect no one wants to check each satellite if they were commercial enough to be included. Iridium satellites were 10 each batch and clearly commercial. What is the justification for counting every satellite for Ariane 5 but not for Falcon 9? Do we only count above some arbitrary mass threshold? Only GTO launches? We could sum the masses of the payloads, that would favor LEO deployments but overall it might give a fairer representation of the market. Ping: User:Jadebenn. -- mfb ( talk) 22:03, 11 January 2020 (UTC)
Here's a link to a report that attempts to summarize 2019 launches globally. "102 Total Orbital Launches ... 492 Total Spacecraft ... 16 Commercial Launches" (in a graphic) and "Of all orbital launches in 2019, 34 came from China, 27 from the U.S., and 22 from Russia." More at the link, and in the report. Attn: JFG and mfb Cheers. N2e ( talk) 22:20, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
The editing comments in the state that the totals should NOT include non-commercial launches. However, I noticed that, for example, Falcon 9 in 2019 had a TOTAL of 13 launches (the same number cited in both the graphic and matrix for this article), which included launches for NASA's Commercial Resupply Services as well as test fights of Dragon-2. I suggest that the numbers be updated to reflect commercial launches only to stay with the guidelines outlined in the article.
user:mnw2000 10:37, 13 June 2020 (UTC)
A source I just ran into: The Recent Large Reduction in Space Launch Cost. Don't have the time to read it now; but could be useful for improving the article. Cheers. N2e ( talk) 03:14, 10 July 2020 (UTC)
"In a restricted market, lower costs might not have much impact. None the less, “Satellite design and manufacturing is beginning to take advantage of these lower-cost options for space launch services.” And, “(T)he satellite manufacturing industry may ‘experience a shock similar to what the launcher industry is experiencing’” (Wikipedia, Space launch market competition)"
Looks like we are finally seeing, in 2021, fuller European initiatives to design/fund/build reusable first stage boosters, along the path that SpaceX began investigating over a decade ago/achieved in 2015/2016, and then made regular and operational (89 landings to date) in 2018-2020.
This is from Peter de Selding, who does the best/deepest coverage of the European launch scene, but his stuff is mostly behind a paywall. ( link). I cannot tell from the link if this is pure-play nation state funded, as traditional in European space tech sector, or if private funds driven by economic incentives (rather than geopolitical incentives of the country-level actors). But interesting to see nonetheless. If we can find non-paywalled sources, we could use to improve the article on the European response(s) to this increased market competitiveness in spaceflight services. N2e ( talk) 11:09, 6 July 2021 (UTC)
Article in ArsTechnica, 13 Sep 2013 by long time space journalist Eric Berger has an interesting paragraph on the competitive losses the Russian government space program has experienced over the past decade as a result of competition from SpaceX.
At the same time, Rogozin has seen SpaceX largely destroy important revenue streams for Russia's space industry. Most notably, Crew Dragon has cut off the approximately $400 million NASA paid to Roscosmos every year for crew transport services to the International Space Station. Additionally, SpaceX lobbied for a congressional mandate preventing United Launch Alliance from buying RD-180 rocket engines from Russia. Finally, the low-cost Falcon 9 rocket has eroded the commercial launch business for the Russian Proton rocket, a former workhorse that now launches about once a year.
Might be useful to improve some part of the article, especially looking back after the result has been seen in the launch numbers and pricing. N2e ( talk) 17:49, 13 September 2021 (UTC)
Propose delete section ( Launch vehicle cost vs mass launch cost ) - It seems generic waffle - just plugging an old report - adds nothing to this article. Anyone think it's worth improving/keeping ? - Rod57 ( talk) 00:58, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
There have been some debate about the statistics section, which revolve around the necessity to either count rocket launches, satellites placed in orbit, or total launch mass. Given that the focus of this article is competition in the satellite launch market, I had earlier focused the graph on counting satellites rather than launches. Besides, if we truly want to reflect what happens in the launch market, we should in my opinion exclude all non-competitive launches, such as military payloads (e.g. NRO spysats). There are also questions around how many satellites should be counted for each multiple launch. Therefore I'd like to re-open the debate, and start with my suggestions for counting criteria:
The floor is yours. Hopefully we can reach a consensus and implement it shortly. — JFG talk 14:06, 24 June 2022 (UTC)
Maybe constellations could be split out from the other statistics? – Jadebenn ( talk · contribs · subpages) 15:39, 24 June 2022 (UTC)
Need to have more information about recent activity along side the updated SpaceX pricing: Most of the information in the article appears to be 2021 or prior, and does not capture recent changes within the last two years. In just the cost per rocket and the rockets being launched, there are many changes. I.e:
Another source for SpaceX pricing:
https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/23/spacex-raises-prices-for-launches-and-starlink-due-to-inflation.html
https://www.space.com/spacex-raises-prices-launch-starlink-inflation
Rocket Lab's Neutron rocket and pricing:
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/03/24/rocket-lab-neutron-launch-price-challenges-spacex.html
Astra's Rocket 4:
https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/08/as-losses-mount-astra-announces-a-radical-pivot-to-a-larger-launch-vehicle/ SynnerInChief ( talk) 04:31, 31 July 2023 (UTC)
Thanks for reading - — Preceding unsigned comment added by SynnerInChief ( talk • contribs) 04:32, 31 July 2023 (UTC)
The "Launch market" table has had a citation needed tag on it for over five years, since 2017. The table fails WP:V as there are no citations to support that these launches were a) made and b) actually "in the market" by being competitive launches and not launches restricted to particular nation state/country launchers.
It appears that this has gotten worse in recent years of the data in the table, where many editors can and have input/changed the data, but always without reliable source WP:CS citations. I don't know how to fix it, and so am inclined to just lose the table in the article if these data cannot be sourced. (or lose the data that are unsourced). How can we improve the article so that encyclopedic statements (data) in this table are verifiable? N2e ( talk) 15:25, 26 September 2023 (UTC)