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The articles says "On June 18, 2023, OceanGate lost contact with Titan during its dive in 2023 to the Titanic." That is redundant. Please remove the second reference to "in 2023". 73.109.121.55 ( talk) 16:46, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
My understanding is that OceanGate seems to have shut down all operations, thus the companny has shut down. Hence, my suggestion. NW1223< Howl at me• My hunts> 22:14, 15 July 2023 (UTC)
Recently, the OceanGate website has been taken down, now displaying the message "OceanGate has suspended all exploration and commercial operations." Should a short comment be made on the article? Cobaj Thaite ( talk) 02:56, 16 July 2023 (UTC)
The Titan incident section is way too short. It is WP:UNDUE to include so little information about the main thing the company is known for. Schierbecker ( talk) 03:09, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
I've just removed elements of the infobox that refer to the company as "defunct", "closed" and having 0 employees. It is known that the company has suspended operations (their words). That is not the same thing as being out of business. While it is highly likely they will be out of business, it's speculation at this point. If you're going to reinclude this information, please provide citations to reliable sources that support the claim. This citation which was used only supports how many they did employ, not how many they currently employ. -- Hammersoft ( talk) 17:30, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
@ KimberlyScott11: Please join the conversation here. As noted above, "suspended" doesn't mean out of business. We're well aware of what the company's website says. -- Hammersoft ( talk) 01:17, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
this link provides info on why the CEO did not want to hire males. The engineering team was comprised of all females. https://www.businessinsider.com/stockton-rush-oceangate-titanic-submersible-avoided-veteran-pilots-younger-inspirational-2023-7 142.184.118.145 ( talk) 18:56, 12 February 2024 (UTC)
"Ah yes, when I started the business, one of the things you'll find is there are other sub operators out there, but they typically have gentlemen who are ex-military submariners, and you'll see a whole bunch of 50-year-old white guys," he said. "I wanted our team to be younger, be inspirational."What Rush was saying is that he wanted younger employees/workers to be pilots and engineers. It even says this in the first paragraph of the article,
OceanGate CEO Stockton Rush said [...] that he preferred not to hire veteran submarine pilots or technicians to keep his team "younger" and "inspirational."While I personally don't buy the 'younger and inspirational' part of what he said, the meaning is that he wanted younger pilots rather than just female pilots. -- Super Goku V ( talk) 07:32, 13 February 2024 (UTC)
I've added a source from October saying that they were closing, added back the Guardian/Associated Press article saying that OG was "out of business" (why was that removed?). Well back in October it seems somebody said that the BBC (only) said that OG had suspended operations, so the logic(?) of removing the more specific source was what? That it wasn't confirmed? Saying that OG had suspended operations obviously doesn't prove that they are still open. In the meantime OG hasn't issued any statements of any kind for 8 months. Is that another proof that they are still open? I'm putting the two sources back in. If you want to say that OG is not "out of business" despite the Guardian/AP article, then I suggest you start an RfC. Smallbones( smalltalk) 22:43, 16 February 2024 (UTC)
An unnamed CEO will lead the company until official investigations and the company's shutdown is completed and the company is "out of business".If we need that line, then fine, but it comes across more as speculation or of future events, than fact. (Probably because we used HistoryLink as a source. Generally better to find what HistoryLink is sourcing from than to use HistoryLink themselves. In any case, the HistoryLink article relied too much on speculation when they could have relied on fact: Gordon Gardiner was appointed CEO of OceanGate three whole months before the HistoryLink article was published: 1, 2.)
@ Hemiauchenia: @ Moons of Io: @ Davidships: - Since you were involved in the discussion a few months ago, I'm pinging you to this discussion. Your opinion, please. Thank you, -- Hammersoft ( talk) 00:12, 17 February 2024 (UTC)
As of August 2023, Gordon Gardiner (is leading / has lead) the company as CEO.If we still need the
until official investigations and the company's shutdown is completed and the company is "out of business"part at the end of that, then it should fit. (Though, hopefully without the HistoryLink essay.) -- Super Goku V ( talk) 06:21, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
As seen with varying comments on this talk page, this isn't consensus. -- Hammersoft ( talk) 20:12, 10 March 2024 (UTC)
None of the terminology above is legal terminology as far as I know. Furthermore, none of the legal terminology is likely to make sense to most non-lawyers, and the "magic words" some people seem to be looking for here don't need to be said to understand that the company is defunct, and may not be said for several years, several decades, or indeed ever. The company could, if it wanted to, come to an agreement with everybody involved (probably excepting the people involved in the Coast Guard investigation) in a ten minute meeting, maybe each sign a one page document and then never bother to tell anybody. They are probably waiting for the investigation results to be announced, at which time they will say very little and everybody will understand that they are still "out of business". This is all a very informal version of what people informally call "an informal bankruptcy". It happens all the time. In many cases, there are no magic words needed to go out of business.
Let me give you two cases on how difficult - and how fruitless - it is to try to determine an exact death date for a company.
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
OceanGate article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1Auto-archiving period: 14 days |
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Article history | |||||||||
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It is requested that a photograph of Headquarters building: 1205 Craftsman Way, Everett, WA 98201 be
included in this article to
improve its quality.
Wikipedians in Seattle may be able to help! The external tool WordPress Openverse may be able to locate suitable images on Flickr and other web sites. |
This article has been
mentioned by a media organization:
|
The articles says "On June 18, 2023, OceanGate lost contact with Titan during its dive in 2023 to the Titanic." That is redundant. Please remove the second reference to "in 2023". 73.109.121.55 ( talk) 16:46, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
My understanding is that OceanGate seems to have shut down all operations, thus the companny has shut down. Hence, my suggestion. NW1223< Howl at me• My hunts> 22:14, 15 July 2023 (UTC)
Recently, the OceanGate website has been taken down, now displaying the message "OceanGate has suspended all exploration and commercial operations." Should a short comment be made on the article? Cobaj Thaite ( talk) 02:56, 16 July 2023 (UTC)
The Titan incident section is way too short. It is WP:UNDUE to include so little information about the main thing the company is known for. Schierbecker ( talk) 03:09, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
I've just removed elements of the infobox that refer to the company as "defunct", "closed" and having 0 employees. It is known that the company has suspended operations (their words). That is not the same thing as being out of business. While it is highly likely they will be out of business, it's speculation at this point. If you're going to reinclude this information, please provide citations to reliable sources that support the claim. This citation which was used only supports how many they did employ, not how many they currently employ. -- Hammersoft ( talk) 17:30, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
@ KimberlyScott11: Please join the conversation here. As noted above, "suspended" doesn't mean out of business. We're well aware of what the company's website says. -- Hammersoft ( talk) 01:17, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
this link provides info on why the CEO did not want to hire males. The engineering team was comprised of all females. https://www.businessinsider.com/stockton-rush-oceangate-titanic-submersible-avoided-veteran-pilots-younger-inspirational-2023-7 142.184.118.145 ( talk) 18:56, 12 February 2024 (UTC)
"Ah yes, when I started the business, one of the things you'll find is there are other sub operators out there, but they typically have gentlemen who are ex-military submariners, and you'll see a whole bunch of 50-year-old white guys," he said. "I wanted our team to be younger, be inspirational."What Rush was saying is that he wanted younger employees/workers to be pilots and engineers. It even says this in the first paragraph of the article,
OceanGate CEO Stockton Rush said [...] that he preferred not to hire veteran submarine pilots or technicians to keep his team "younger" and "inspirational."While I personally don't buy the 'younger and inspirational' part of what he said, the meaning is that he wanted younger pilots rather than just female pilots. -- Super Goku V ( talk) 07:32, 13 February 2024 (UTC)
I've added a source from October saying that they were closing, added back the Guardian/Associated Press article saying that OG was "out of business" (why was that removed?). Well back in October it seems somebody said that the BBC (only) said that OG had suspended operations, so the logic(?) of removing the more specific source was what? That it wasn't confirmed? Saying that OG had suspended operations obviously doesn't prove that they are still open. In the meantime OG hasn't issued any statements of any kind for 8 months. Is that another proof that they are still open? I'm putting the two sources back in. If you want to say that OG is not "out of business" despite the Guardian/AP article, then I suggest you start an RfC. Smallbones( smalltalk) 22:43, 16 February 2024 (UTC)
An unnamed CEO will lead the company until official investigations and the company's shutdown is completed and the company is "out of business".If we need that line, then fine, but it comes across more as speculation or of future events, than fact. (Probably because we used HistoryLink as a source. Generally better to find what HistoryLink is sourcing from than to use HistoryLink themselves. In any case, the HistoryLink article relied too much on speculation when they could have relied on fact: Gordon Gardiner was appointed CEO of OceanGate three whole months before the HistoryLink article was published: 1, 2.)
@ Hemiauchenia: @ Moons of Io: @ Davidships: - Since you were involved in the discussion a few months ago, I'm pinging you to this discussion. Your opinion, please. Thank you, -- Hammersoft ( talk) 00:12, 17 February 2024 (UTC)
As of August 2023, Gordon Gardiner (is leading / has lead) the company as CEO.If we still need the
until official investigations and the company's shutdown is completed and the company is "out of business"part at the end of that, then it should fit. (Though, hopefully without the HistoryLink essay.) -- Super Goku V ( talk) 06:21, 18 February 2024 (UTC)
As seen with varying comments on this talk page, this isn't consensus. -- Hammersoft ( talk) 20:12, 10 March 2024 (UTC)
None of the terminology above is legal terminology as far as I know. Furthermore, none of the legal terminology is likely to make sense to most non-lawyers, and the "magic words" some people seem to be looking for here don't need to be said to understand that the company is defunct, and may not be said for several years, several decades, or indeed ever. The company could, if it wanted to, come to an agreement with everybody involved (probably excepting the people involved in the Coast Guard investigation) in a ten minute meeting, maybe each sign a one page document and then never bother to tell anybody. They are probably waiting for the investigation results to be announced, at which time they will say very little and everybody will understand that they are still "out of business". This is all a very informal version of what people informally call "an informal bankruptcy". It happens all the time. In many cases, there are no magic words needed to go out of business.
Let me give you two cases on how difficult - and how fruitless - it is to try to determine an exact death date for a company.