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Individuals with a conflict of interest, particularly those representing the subject of the article, are strongly advised not to directly edit the article. See Wikipedia:Conflict of interest. You may request corrections or suggest content here on the Talk page for independent editors to review, or contact us if the issue is urgent. |
The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Major League Lacrosse/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
==Rating==
Reasons I rated this article as Start class:
|
Last edited at 18:22, 28 February 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 22:52, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
The article MLL Team Capsules is out of date, poorly maintained, and orphaned. Perhaps it might get more attention if it was merged here. Powers T 20:19, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
I believe all the info on that page was taken from other pages already est. I redirected that page to the main one Smith03 ( talk) 17:15, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
I don't care one way or the other,but would like to know how the MLL treats the Chicago Machine and the Ohio Machine. Does the MLL consider them one franchise two cities or two different franchise. any info or sources from the team or league would be great. Smith03 ( talk) 20:03, 16 January 2013 (UTC)
There has been an edit war going on for a few months now on the correct description for MLL. The reliable sources in favor of the "semi-pro" label include the 2013 Wall Street Journal story cited in the article, which describes the players as part time players with other jobs. Merriam-Webster defines semi-pro as "paid to participate in a sport or activity but not doing it as a full-time job." That seems pretty clear cut that MLL is semi-pro. I am not aware of any independent secondary reliable sources provided by the editors who keep deleting the "semi-pro" description and the sourced salary info. Barryjjoyce ( talk) 04:05, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
@ Cakeane: Please discuss here before making further changes. Be careful you do not blow the 3 revert rule by changing it back before consensus is garnered by the editing community. The reason that the term "Semi-Professional" is used is because of the definition of Semi-Professionalism is that a sport does not usually pay enough to be a fulltime job without side jobs. The 2013 WSJ (Not 5 years ago, 2) stated that they are semi-professionals. All of the sources you provided were unreliable and many were not even sources. Even then, they did not establish that lacrosse players in general make enough money to work full time. It is not a disparaging term to be semi-professional. Jcmcc ( Talk) 23:01, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
Major League Lacrosse is considered a professional lacrosse league amongst many sources, the players, fans, and the League itself. It is not considered semi-professional so by deeming it one on wikipedia is inaccurate. The salary information is also no longer accurate per League sources, that information is not given to the public and I know the amounts listed are not accurate. It can be called the premier outdoor lacrosse league but not semi-professional as that is not what it is. If you look at any source online in recent years, it is considered a professional lacrosse league. A lot of players make a living off of playing in major league lacrosse with outside sponsors including Paul Rabil who makes over $1,000,000.00 per year now. These Players play lacrosse year round and are under contract for the entire year. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cakeane ( talk • contribs) 00:05, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
All I am trying to get across is that the source your are citing is inaccurate. The salaries have never been made public first of all which is why there are no newer articles stating anything contradicting the article you cited, however, the salaries listed are not accurate to today's standards which is why it should be omitted. As for the semi-professional/professional/premier, I don't know what constitutes as a "reliable" source to wikipedia standards. There are business journals calling it professional lacrosse, newspapers calling it professional lacrosse, etc. The NCAA (whom I deem to be reliable) recognizes it as professional lacrosse, which is why per NCAA bylaw 12.2.2.4 Draft List; "An individual loses amateur status in a particular sport when the individual asks to be placed on the draft list or supplemental draft list of a professional league in that sport..." It is noted that Collegiate players will lose all NCAA eligibility if registering for any draft prior to their Collegiate career being over in Major League Lacrosse. I do believe the community would consider Major League Lacrosse a professional league, and as I saw in previous edits, I am not the only one in the past who has tried to adjust it as so. Let me know what can be done so we can have the outdated source removed and add a definition that is accurate. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.166.109.66 ( talk) 11:57, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
How about someone from the League Office who handles all of that stating that the article you are referring to is inaccurate. I believe that would be a bit more reliable than something from three years ago. The NCAA explicitly considers it a "professional" league as per their bylaws stated above. Again, there is no new articles because that information is not made public so the numbers you are quoting are inaccurate. If your job is to find accuracy in posts, then that should be taken down. Also, while we are on the subject, is woman's soccer considered professional? According to the wiki page it is yet the salaries range to no more than $30,000.00 per business insider (reliable source). Can that be explained????
/info/en/?search=Women%27s_Professional_Soccer http://www.businessinsider.com/womens-small-soccer-salaries-are-fair-2015-7 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.166.109.66 ( talk) 12:19, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
/info/en/?search=National_Women%27s_Soccer_League — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cakeane ( talk • contribs) 12:24, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
And here you go - Wall Street Journal (Reliable Source) stating it as professional lacrosse in a more recent article, 2014. Please adjust now. http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887323716304578483290272596484 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cakeane ( talk • contribs) 12:29, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
I have reverted changes that were made without discussion here and without explanation in edit summaries. I removed the descriptor from the first sentence in the hope that will reduce edit warring, but left the descriptor in the second paragraph where more context is given (I.e., facts and cites re limited compensation and holding other jobs). CUA 27 ( talk) 13:15, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
Not suggesting this be added but just posting this here for information Newyearbaby ( talk) 02:51, 13 August 2018 (UTC)
This
level-5 vital article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Individuals with a conflict of interest, particularly those representing the subject of the article, are strongly advised not to directly edit the article. See Wikipedia:Conflict of interest. You may request corrections or suggest content here on the Talk page for independent editors to review, or contact us if the issue is urgent. |
The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Major League Lacrosse/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.
==Rating==
Reasons I rated this article as Start class:
|
Last edited at 18:22, 28 February 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 22:52, 29 April 2016 (UTC)
The article MLL Team Capsules is out of date, poorly maintained, and orphaned. Perhaps it might get more attention if it was merged here. Powers T 20:19, 24 May 2009 (UTC)
I believe all the info on that page was taken from other pages already est. I redirected that page to the main one Smith03 ( talk) 17:15, 24 June 2009 (UTC)
I don't care one way or the other,but would like to know how the MLL treats the Chicago Machine and the Ohio Machine. Does the MLL consider them one franchise two cities or two different franchise. any info or sources from the team or league would be great. Smith03 ( talk) 20:03, 16 January 2013 (UTC)
There has been an edit war going on for a few months now on the correct description for MLL. The reliable sources in favor of the "semi-pro" label include the 2013 Wall Street Journal story cited in the article, which describes the players as part time players with other jobs. Merriam-Webster defines semi-pro as "paid to participate in a sport or activity but not doing it as a full-time job." That seems pretty clear cut that MLL is semi-pro. I am not aware of any independent secondary reliable sources provided by the editors who keep deleting the "semi-pro" description and the sourced salary info. Barryjjoyce ( talk) 04:05, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
@ Cakeane: Please discuss here before making further changes. Be careful you do not blow the 3 revert rule by changing it back before consensus is garnered by the editing community. The reason that the term "Semi-Professional" is used is because of the definition of Semi-Professionalism is that a sport does not usually pay enough to be a fulltime job without side jobs. The 2013 WSJ (Not 5 years ago, 2) stated that they are semi-professionals. All of the sources you provided were unreliable and many were not even sources. Even then, they did not establish that lacrosse players in general make enough money to work full time. It is not a disparaging term to be semi-professional. Jcmcc ( Talk) 23:01, 26 August 2015 (UTC)
Major League Lacrosse is considered a professional lacrosse league amongst many sources, the players, fans, and the League itself. It is not considered semi-professional so by deeming it one on wikipedia is inaccurate. The salary information is also no longer accurate per League sources, that information is not given to the public and I know the amounts listed are not accurate. It can be called the premier outdoor lacrosse league but not semi-professional as that is not what it is. If you look at any source online in recent years, it is considered a professional lacrosse league. A lot of players make a living off of playing in major league lacrosse with outside sponsors including Paul Rabil who makes over $1,000,000.00 per year now. These Players play lacrosse year round and are under contract for the entire year. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cakeane ( talk • contribs) 00:05, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
All I am trying to get across is that the source your are citing is inaccurate. The salaries have never been made public first of all which is why there are no newer articles stating anything contradicting the article you cited, however, the salaries listed are not accurate to today's standards which is why it should be omitted. As for the semi-professional/professional/premier, I don't know what constitutes as a "reliable" source to wikipedia standards. There are business journals calling it professional lacrosse, newspapers calling it professional lacrosse, etc. The NCAA (whom I deem to be reliable) recognizes it as professional lacrosse, which is why per NCAA bylaw 12.2.2.4 Draft List; "An individual loses amateur status in a particular sport when the individual asks to be placed on the draft list or supplemental draft list of a professional league in that sport..." It is noted that Collegiate players will lose all NCAA eligibility if registering for any draft prior to their Collegiate career being over in Major League Lacrosse. I do believe the community would consider Major League Lacrosse a professional league, and as I saw in previous edits, I am not the only one in the past who has tried to adjust it as so. Let me know what can be done so we can have the outdated source removed and add a definition that is accurate. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.166.109.66 ( talk) 11:57, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
How about someone from the League Office who handles all of that stating that the article you are referring to is inaccurate. I believe that would be a bit more reliable than something from three years ago. The NCAA explicitly considers it a "professional" league as per their bylaws stated above. Again, there is no new articles because that information is not made public so the numbers you are quoting are inaccurate. If your job is to find accuracy in posts, then that should be taken down. Also, while we are on the subject, is woman's soccer considered professional? According to the wiki page it is yet the salaries range to no more than $30,000.00 per business insider (reliable source). Can that be explained????
/info/en/?search=Women%27s_Professional_Soccer http://www.businessinsider.com/womens-small-soccer-salaries-are-fair-2015-7 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.166.109.66 ( talk) 12:19, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
/info/en/?search=National_Women%27s_Soccer_League — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cakeane ( talk • contribs) 12:24, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
And here you go - Wall Street Journal (Reliable Source) stating it as professional lacrosse in a more recent article, 2014. Please adjust now. http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887323716304578483290272596484 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cakeane ( talk • contribs) 12:29, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
I have reverted changes that were made without discussion here and without explanation in edit summaries. I removed the descriptor from the first sentence in the hope that will reduce edit warring, but left the descriptor in the second paragraph where more context is given (I.e., facts and cites re limited compensation and holding other jobs). CUA 27 ( talk) 13:15, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
Not suggesting this be added but just posting this here for information Newyearbaby ( talk) 02:51, 13 August 2018 (UTC)