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Trying to anticipate forthcoming objections to GA status for this article, I've identified the following challenges pertaining to layout only:
This isn't the review as such, I just thought I'd offer some commentary. Hope that helps for now, -- Jza84 · ( talk) 17:23, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
Is there anywhere else where this could go? Pafcool2 ( talk) 18:07, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
{{ Croydon and Gatwick weatherbox}}
The image Image:Cherryorchard.JPG is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check
The following images also have this problem:
This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --22:00, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
I believe I have found a copyright violation under the Education sub-heading on the article:
The Croydon Playcare Company (aka Gingerbread Corner) was the first Latchkey sceme in England set up in 1976 and was then called Croydon Gingerbread Charities. Its main aim was to provide quality childcare for single parents of children aged between 5 and 11 during school holidays and after school. Now almost 30 years later Playcare has grown and now caters for children up to age 16 and includes school pick up and drop off, a nursery and 11 Plus youth club.
It seems to have been taken directly from the opening page of the website Croydon Playcare with a few changes to words. To be on the safe side I have deleted it and doubt that it is notable enough to go back on this page anyway. Pafcool2 ( talk) 14:40, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
reason it will be removed is non-notable company (no article) and POV description. ninety: one 18:20, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
The reason I put Real Digital was because it is notable enough. IOts a large multinational company which has headquarters in Croydon. Of course we can't add every single company to the economy section (don't just add random shops), but if there is a multinational company with influence in Croydon, why not? Pafcool2 ( talk) 16:13, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
Shouldn't dubstep be mentioned in the culture section of the page? After all, dubstep was created there, and it is still one of the best sources of creativity in this music (primarily through Skream and Benga, both residents of Croydon, but also through other artists such as Breakage)? 188.26.163.195 ( talk) 10:46, 13 September 2009 (UTC) Alex
-- Dubbytantor ( talk) 16:08, 17 October 2009 (UTC)It should be mentioned. Dubstep is one of the most remarkable musical genres of 2000's.-- Dubbytantor ( talk) 16:08, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
I'm beginning preparations for another GA Review. Beginning with a peer review. Nothing has been submitted yet - but I'm getting the article into order once again. So, in accordance with the GA Review back in 2007 and 2008, I have extended the lead section and have gotten rid of the lists of schools and additionally the bishops. Both can be found on their respective articles. Help on updating some information would be appreciated. Lots of the economic stuff is back form 2007, so check if there have been any reports since then. Let's hope this time will be a winner! I'll update this section when any more info regarding a GA review comes to light. Thanks, Pafcool2 ( talk) 23:13, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
I am not a Wikipedia editor so sorry if this comment is out of place.
According to london.gov.uk Barnet became London's most populous borough in 2009. http://data.london.gov.uk/datastore/applications/population-estimates-1961-2009 This may have since changed but at a training course held by Croydon Council last week they referred to Croydon as the second most populated London borough. Please look into this and adjust if necessary. 188.222.127.231 ( talk) 18:46, 28 December 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.222.127.231 ( talk) 18:42, 28 December 2011 (UTC)
Greenwich is in Outer London, it is part of the old county of Kent and was not part of the County of London before the changes in 1965. Haringey was an amalgam of two Municipal Boroughs of the former county of Middlesex and were therefore not in the County of London either. Normally the definition of inner and outer London was there former inclusion in the old County of London set up in the 1880s and which was divided into Metropolitan Boroughs. Newham is a bit odd, since it straddles the old County boundary. West Ham was, like Croydon, a County Borough and therefore not a part of its nominal county; Newham also has other municipal boroughs from Middlesex within its modern boundaries and one of the old Metropolitan Boroughs - arguably an Inner London Borough! When the Greater London Council was established under the 1963 Act there was also another new authority born with it, the Inner London Education Authority (ILEA), which took over the educational services from the old County of London (LCC) meaning that, unlike Croydon and the other outer London Boroughs, the Inner London Boroughs did not have an education committee or any schools of their own. Moonraker55 ( talk) 02:44, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
In the introductory article there is the following statement: "The borough has a long history which is based mainly around the economy of the area. The economic strength of Croydon dates back mainly to Croydon Airport which was a major factor in the development of Croydon as a business centre." My comments are that it is true that Croydon has a long history and was, like any town or city, built on its economic strengths. The following sentence is however, pure twaddle! Croydon airport was in operation from around 1910 (I personally knew a worker there working in 1911) and its life ended in 1954 - a mere forty odd years. Croydon owes its economic strengths to a number of factors, none of which includes the aerodrome (as it was actually called contemporaneously). Croydon was a manor belonging to the Archbishops of Canterbury - that in itself would attract trade. The Church Street area, the original 'high street' developed because of the Archbishop's palace there. The recorded history of Croydon reaches back at least to the ninth century, when a Synod of the Church was held there - emphasizing the importance of that connection. The physical geography is the dominant factor - the town sits on the edge of the Wandle Valley and with the Southbourne they occupy the valley bottom that runs roughly north-south and which pierces the North Downs. Croydon, because of the Archbishops was granted fairs and markets making it for most of the history of Surrey the largest and most important town in Surrey after Southwark. The Parish Church was a Minster Church which meant that throughout the mediaeval period every parishioner of every subsidiary parish in the Archdeaconry - Merstham, Warlingham, Caterham, Shirley, Addington, and all the other places nearby, would come to Croydon to celebrate the great Holy Days of the Church calendar. The parish of Croydon was large and it provided a great deal of potential for produce. The trade in Walnuts, the fruit and the wood, were huge for a very long period, as an example. The trade in clays, for bricks, in gravels and in other minerals were also quite large. Croydon was host to a canal which was served by two horse drawn railways, the first and third public railways in the country, indeed the world. The later one linked Merstham and Godstone (with their quarries) to the canal side near Reeves' Corner and the other linked from the same place to the Thames at Wandsworth (The Surrey Iron Railway). Church Road and Tamworth Road owe their existence to the line of tracks serving the old railways and West Croydon station was part of the canal. I remember as a boy in West Croydon digging up 'navvies' clay pipes alongside the old canal bed near Spurgeon's Bridge. These things were really active and for many years profitable transport services. Then came steam - the area that is the Borough of Croydon today boasted two dozen railway stations! I think what I am trying to illustrate is that the economic wealth of Croydon pre-dated the airport by many hundreds of years - the fact that the town boasted three department stores (Allder's, Grant's and Kennard's) speaks volumes for the relative prosperity of the town and all established before the aerodrome was even a possibility (that is before heavier than air flight had been achieved!). Then there is the fact that the town was also host to such items as one of the two officer cadet training colleges for the Honorable East India Company.
I have transcribed much of the 1871 census and have compared with the 1881 census, the population exploded around this time with, anecdotally, just 10% of the 1881 population being native Croydonians , and that includes a great number of children born to incomers in the previous decade. Croydon was becoming home to the commuting professionals of London - stock-brokers, solicitors and barristers, even the editor of the 'Sporting Life' lived here. Why not - perhaps it was the attraction of the riotous fairs on the old Fair Field? Perhaps the attraction of the races at Epsom or Woodside? Croydon's economic past is manifestly not based on a forty year episode late on in its very long history. It is based on its geographic position above the gap in the North Downs (the attraction of Brighton to the Prince regent would have been much less had the road through the downs not have existed)the fact of the manor being in the hands of an important person in the shape of the Archbishop (these were political figures as well as religious); that it was a large area that supported a range of potential economic outputs - minerals, wood, charcoal, cherries, walnuts, and the town also had the Minster Church. I have probably labored the point long enough. Moonraker55 ( talk) 02:24, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
reading the article there are factual errors that ought to have been avoided. The 'original' Whitgift school, for example, was not demolished to make way for the Whitgift Centre. Part of the original Whitgift school ,a small affair, is still extant adjacent to the Hospital of the Holy Trinity in George Street. The school occupying the grand old school that was once pride of place behind North End and facing across the lawns and the railings onto Wellesley Road was the Whitgift Middle School that had occupied the buildings vacated by Whitgift School in the 1930s when they took over the old manorial estate of Haling Manor in South Croydon. This old school was not Tudor in origins! The Middle School removed to Shirley Park where their name was changed to the Trinity School of John Whitgift. However, between the occupation of the old school in George Street and the grand old school where the shopping centre now stands, there were other schools along the way. The immediate predecessor to the Middle School was on Church Road almost opposite the bottom of Scarbrook Hill.
There are other similar things that undermine the authenticity of the page as an authoritative statement of history. Moonraker55 ( talk) 03:07, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
Some old page history that used to be at the title "London Borough of Croydon" is now at Talk:London Borough of Croydon/Old history. Graham 87 12:34, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
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This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
London Borough of Croydon article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2, 3 |
London Borough of Croydon was a Geography and places good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
To-do list for London Borough of Croydon:
|
|
|||
Trying to anticipate forthcoming objections to GA status for this article, I've identified the following challenges pertaining to layout only:
This isn't the review as such, I just thought I'd offer some commentary. Hope that helps for now, -- Jza84 · ( talk) 17:23, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
Is there anywhere else where this could go? Pafcool2 ( talk) 18:07, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
{{ Croydon and Gatwick weatherbox}}
The image Image:Cherryorchard.JPG is used in this article under a claim of fair use, but it does not have an adequate explanation for why it meets the requirements for such images when used here. In particular, for each page the image is used on, it must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Please check
The following images also have this problem:
This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --22:00, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
I believe I have found a copyright violation under the Education sub-heading on the article:
The Croydon Playcare Company (aka Gingerbread Corner) was the first Latchkey sceme in England set up in 1976 and was then called Croydon Gingerbread Charities. Its main aim was to provide quality childcare for single parents of children aged between 5 and 11 during school holidays and after school. Now almost 30 years later Playcare has grown and now caters for children up to age 16 and includes school pick up and drop off, a nursery and 11 Plus youth club.
It seems to have been taken directly from the opening page of the website Croydon Playcare with a few changes to words. To be on the safe side I have deleted it and doubt that it is notable enough to go back on this page anyway. Pafcool2 ( talk) 14:40, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
reason it will be removed is non-notable company (no article) and POV description. ninety: one 18:20, 22 June 2008 (UTC)
The reason I put Real Digital was because it is notable enough. IOts a large multinational company which has headquarters in Croydon. Of course we can't add every single company to the economy section (don't just add random shops), but if there is a multinational company with influence in Croydon, why not? Pafcool2 ( talk) 16:13, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
Shouldn't dubstep be mentioned in the culture section of the page? After all, dubstep was created there, and it is still one of the best sources of creativity in this music (primarily through Skream and Benga, both residents of Croydon, but also through other artists such as Breakage)? 188.26.163.195 ( talk) 10:46, 13 September 2009 (UTC) Alex
-- Dubbytantor ( talk) 16:08, 17 October 2009 (UTC)It should be mentioned. Dubstep is one of the most remarkable musical genres of 2000's.-- Dubbytantor ( talk) 16:08, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
I'm beginning preparations for another GA Review. Beginning with a peer review. Nothing has been submitted yet - but I'm getting the article into order once again. So, in accordance with the GA Review back in 2007 and 2008, I have extended the lead section and have gotten rid of the lists of schools and additionally the bishops. Both can be found on their respective articles. Help on updating some information would be appreciated. Lots of the economic stuff is back form 2007, so check if there have been any reports since then. Let's hope this time will be a winner! I'll update this section when any more info regarding a GA review comes to light. Thanks, Pafcool2 ( talk) 23:13, 6 February 2011 (UTC)
I am not a Wikipedia editor so sorry if this comment is out of place.
According to london.gov.uk Barnet became London's most populous borough in 2009. http://data.london.gov.uk/datastore/applications/population-estimates-1961-2009 This may have since changed but at a training course held by Croydon Council last week they referred to Croydon as the second most populated London borough. Please look into this and adjust if necessary. 188.222.127.231 ( talk) 18:46, 28 December 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.222.127.231 ( talk) 18:42, 28 December 2011 (UTC)
Greenwich is in Outer London, it is part of the old county of Kent and was not part of the County of London before the changes in 1965. Haringey was an amalgam of two Municipal Boroughs of the former county of Middlesex and were therefore not in the County of London either. Normally the definition of inner and outer London was there former inclusion in the old County of London set up in the 1880s and which was divided into Metropolitan Boroughs. Newham is a bit odd, since it straddles the old County boundary. West Ham was, like Croydon, a County Borough and therefore not a part of its nominal county; Newham also has other municipal boroughs from Middlesex within its modern boundaries and one of the old Metropolitan Boroughs - arguably an Inner London Borough! When the Greater London Council was established under the 1963 Act there was also another new authority born with it, the Inner London Education Authority (ILEA), which took over the educational services from the old County of London (LCC) meaning that, unlike Croydon and the other outer London Boroughs, the Inner London Boroughs did not have an education committee or any schools of their own. Moonraker55 ( talk) 02:44, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
In the introductory article there is the following statement: "The borough has a long history which is based mainly around the economy of the area. The economic strength of Croydon dates back mainly to Croydon Airport which was a major factor in the development of Croydon as a business centre." My comments are that it is true that Croydon has a long history and was, like any town or city, built on its economic strengths. The following sentence is however, pure twaddle! Croydon airport was in operation from around 1910 (I personally knew a worker there working in 1911) and its life ended in 1954 - a mere forty odd years. Croydon owes its economic strengths to a number of factors, none of which includes the aerodrome (as it was actually called contemporaneously). Croydon was a manor belonging to the Archbishops of Canterbury - that in itself would attract trade. The Church Street area, the original 'high street' developed because of the Archbishop's palace there. The recorded history of Croydon reaches back at least to the ninth century, when a Synod of the Church was held there - emphasizing the importance of that connection. The physical geography is the dominant factor - the town sits on the edge of the Wandle Valley and with the Southbourne they occupy the valley bottom that runs roughly north-south and which pierces the North Downs. Croydon, because of the Archbishops was granted fairs and markets making it for most of the history of Surrey the largest and most important town in Surrey after Southwark. The Parish Church was a Minster Church which meant that throughout the mediaeval period every parishioner of every subsidiary parish in the Archdeaconry - Merstham, Warlingham, Caterham, Shirley, Addington, and all the other places nearby, would come to Croydon to celebrate the great Holy Days of the Church calendar. The parish of Croydon was large and it provided a great deal of potential for produce. The trade in Walnuts, the fruit and the wood, were huge for a very long period, as an example. The trade in clays, for bricks, in gravels and in other minerals were also quite large. Croydon was host to a canal which was served by two horse drawn railways, the first and third public railways in the country, indeed the world. The later one linked Merstham and Godstone (with their quarries) to the canal side near Reeves' Corner and the other linked from the same place to the Thames at Wandsworth (The Surrey Iron Railway). Church Road and Tamworth Road owe their existence to the line of tracks serving the old railways and West Croydon station was part of the canal. I remember as a boy in West Croydon digging up 'navvies' clay pipes alongside the old canal bed near Spurgeon's Bridge. These things were really active and for many years profitable transport services. Then came steam - the area that is the Borough of Croydon today boasted two dozen railway stations! I think what I am trying to illustrate is that the economic wealth of Croydon pre-dated the airport by many hundreds of years - the fact that the town boasted three department stores (Allder's, Grant's and Kennard's) speaks volumes for the relative prosperity of the town and all established before the aerodrome was even a possibility (that is before heavier than air flight had been achieved!). Then there is the fact that the town was also host to such items as one of the two officer cadet training colleges for the Honorable East India Company.
I have transcribed much of the 1871 census and have compared with the 1881 census, the population exploded around this time with, anecdotally, just 10% of the 1881 population being native Croydonians , and that includes a great number of children born to incomers in the previous decade. Croydon was becoming home to the commuting professionals of London - stock-brokers, solicitors and barristers, even the editor of the 'Sporting Life' lived here. Why not - perhaps it was the attraction of the riotous fairs on the old Fair Field? Perhaps the attraction of the races at Epsom or Woodside? Croydon's economic past is manifestly not based on a forty year episode late on in its very long history. It is based on its geographic position above the gap in the North Downs (the attraction of Brighton to the Prince regent would have been much less had the road through the downs not have existed)the fact of the manor being in the hands of an important person in the shape of the Archbishop (these were political figures as well as religious); that it was a large area that supported a range of potential economic outputs - minerals, wood, charcoal, cherries, walnuts, and the town also had the Minster Church. I have probably labored the point long enough. Moonraker55 ( talk) 02:24, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
reading the article there are factual errors that ought to have been avoided. The 'original' Whitgift school, for example, was not demolished to make way for the Whitgift Centre. Part of the original Whitgift school ,a small affair, is still extant adjacent to the Hospital of the Holy Trinity in George Street. The school occupying the grand old school that was once pride of place behind North End and facing across the lawns and the railings onto Wellesley Road was the Whitgift Middle School that had occupied the buildings vacated by Whitgift School in the 1930s when they took over the old manorial estate of Haling Manor in South Croydon. This old school was not Tudor in origins! The Middle School removed to Shirley Park where their name was changed to the Trinity School of John Whitgift. However, between the occupation of the old school in George Street and the grand old school where the shopping centre now stands, there were other schools along the way. The immediate predecessor to the Middle School was on Church Road almost opposite the bottom of Scarbrook Hill.
There are other similar things that undermine the authenticity of the page as an authoritative statement of history. Moonraker55 ( talk) 03:07, 26 June 2013 (UTC)
Some old page history that used to be at the title "London Borough of Croydon" is now at Talk:London Borough of Croydon/Old history. Graham 87 12:34, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 07:48, 26 July 2017 (UTC)
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I have just modified 13 external links on London Borough of Croydon. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 13:27, 5 January 2018 (UTC)