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Text and/or other creative content from this version of Philosophy was copied or moved into History of philosophy with this edit. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
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Please see Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Philosophy#Proper_article_for_"History_of_philosophy". fgnievinski ( talk) 01:46, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
Okay, I've given the section on Western philosophy a quick once-over. I did my best to explain edits in the description fields, but please just tag me if anything is unclear or seems wrong.
You're not consistent between "pre-Socratics" and "Presocratics." I'd incline towards the former, but I don't know which (if either) is best practice. Whatever you decide, just Cnt-A and standardize.
It would also be nice to have something on how the analytic-Continental distinction largely fell apart in the late 20th century and is no longer operative in most circles today. But that can, of course, be added later. Patrick J. Welsh ( talk) 17:48, 20 June 2023 (UTC)
Plato’s Academy (the ‘School of Athens’) was closed by the Emperor Justinian in 529 CE, along with a general ban on the teaching of philosophy because it conflicted with Christianity.; From Blackson 2011:
By convention ancient philosophy ends in 529 when the Christian Emperor Justinian prohibited pagans from teaching in the schools)
unifying principle ... For Hegel, it was the notion of Spirit; from Kenny 2006:
Cosmic history, according to Hegel, consists in the life story of spirit(Geist). The internal development of spirit manifests itself in concrete reality.) But you are probably better versed in Hegel so I'm open to other suggestions.
philosophy, the aim of which, he claimed, is a self-transparent knowing of what knowledge isunless we can determine what supports this. According to Illetterati & Miolli 2021, maybe we could use something like the following:
philosophy, the aim of which, he claimed, is a form of self-knowledge characterized by the identity of subject and object. Phlsph7 ( talk) 18:06, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
The result was: promoted by
BorgQueen (
talk) 17:00, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
References
Sources
Created by Phlsph7 ( talk). Self-nominated at 07:55, 25 June 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/History of philosophy; consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.
Hi @ Phlsph7,
I think the lead needs to be pared back rather aggressively. It's good to remember that lots of people will be reading this on their phones and also, more importantly, that a good TOC does a lot of this work on its own.
Oh, and I see above @ chankal suggesting four paragraphs. But I think it is not appropriate to combine Indian and Chinese thought just to meet the suggest paragraph count. Moreover, merely combining paragraphs undermines the purpose of the policy, which is to keep things short and to the point.
Here's a draft for consideration:
The history of philosophy is the systematic study of the development of
philosophical thought. It is usually understood as a rational inquiry based on argumentation. Some theorists, however, define it in a wider sense to also include
myths,
religious traditions, and proverbial lore.
Western philosophy originated with inquiry into the fundamental nature of the cosmos in Ancient Greece. Subsequent philosophical developments cover a wide range of topics including the nature of reality and the mind, how people should act, and how to arrive at knowledge. The subsequent medieval period is focused on more on theology. The Renaissance period saw a renewed interest in Ancient Greek philosophy and the emergence of humanism. The modern period was characterized by an increased focus on how philosophical and scientific knowledge is created.
Arabic-Persian philosophy was strongly influenced by Ancient Greek philosophers. It had its peak period during the Islamic Golden Age. One of its topics was the relation between reason and revelation as two compatible ways of arriving at the truth. Avicenna developed a comprehensive philosophical system that synthesized Islamic faith and Greek philosophy. After the Islamic Golden Age, the influence of philosophical inquiry waned, partly due to Al-Ghazali's critique of philosophy.
Indian philosophy is characterized by its combined interest in the nature of reality, the ways of arriving at knowledge, and the spiritual question of how to reach enlightenment. Its roots are the religious scriptures known as the Vedas. In the modern period, the exchange between Indian and Western thought led various Indian philosophers to develop comprehensive systems. They aimed to unite and harmonize diverse philosophical and religious schools of thought.
Chinese philosophy was more interested in right social conduct and government than in ultimate reality. Confucianism explored moral virtues and how they lead to harmony in society. Daoism focused on the relation between humans and nature. The modern period in Chinese philosophy was characterized by its encounter with Western philosophy—as well as Japanese philosophy, Latin American philosophy, and African philosophy.
Patrick J. Welsh ( talk) 21:41, 25 June 2023 (UTC)
There should be a section on this, probably at the end of the current version of Western. (I would be surprised if the other traditions would not benefit from similar discussions, but I don't know enough about them to say.)
The article on women in philosophy looks to be well sourced and probably has everything necessary to write a couple good paragraphs. I would do maybe one on the (rather obvious) reasons for their social exclusion from academic life under patriarchial social structures, noting also a few important exceptions. Then a paragraph on how this has been changing in the 20th and 21st centuries, but that the discipline still skews male and there is more work to be done. Patrick J. Welsh ( talk) 15:29, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
Title between this article's 'introduction' and 'Western philosophy'... limiting scope of the article ... Arnbiology ( talk) 15:46, 31 August 2023 (UTC) Arnbiology
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: SilverTiger12 ( talk · contribs) 00:00, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Heyla! I'll take this one.
SilverTiger12 (
talk) 00:00, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Sorry for the wait, real life happens. Beginning with the lede:
Good Article review progress box
|
Here is the paragraph at this time:
The history of philosophy has both a historical and a philosophical component. The historical component is concerned with how philosophical thought unfolded throughout the ages. It asks which philosophers held what views and how they were influenced by their social and cultural context. The philosophical component concerns whether the studied theories are true. It reflects on the arguments presented for the positions and assesses their validity and hidden assumptions. It makes the philosophical heritage accessible to a contemporary audience and evaluates its continued relevance today. Some historians of philosophy focus primarily on the historical component. They hold that the history of philosophy is part of the wider discipline known as intellectual history. Other theorists put more emphasis on the philosophical component. They tend to claim that the history of philosophy goes beyond intellectual history because its interest is not exclusively historical. [1]
I read quickly all the sources provided except Verene 2008 , because I could not find a copy of it yet. I did not find that it was representative of the sources. In particular, more than one of them presented criticisms of the use of history or lack thereof in modern analytic philosophy. Here is an excerpt from ( Beaney 2013) :
As we have seen, from its origins in the work of Frege and Russell, analytic philosophy has had ahistorical tendencies. Analytic philosophers have engaged in history of philosophy, but often only to the extent of offering—or sometimes simply borrowing—rational reconstructions to further their own projects.
Being neutral does not mean avoiding presenting notorious criticisms found in sources. In simple terms, accessible to a large audience, the issue is that some modern philosophers use history to present their modern philosophy, that is, their purpose is to see their modern philosophy in ancient philosophies, and often they ignore essential aspects of the history in doing so and thus misrepresent it. How do you relate this to the above paragraph taken from the article? Is the idea that looking at the modern philosophy within the ancient philosophies is a way "to assess their validity, and hidden assumptions ..." to make "the philosophical heritage accessible to a contemporary audience and evaluates its continued relevance today"? That might be a view point expressed somewhere in the sources (though I did not see it). In any case, there is a total lack of neutrality if only that viewpoint is expressed.
References
Dominic Mayers ( talk) 16:01, 21 March 2024 (UTC)
I removed the paragraph, because nothing has been done to improve it. The role of history in philosophy is a big big issue. There are those who think that history in a philosophical perspective is only a tool that can be used to illustrate the modern view, which hold independently of history and is at the top of history in the same way that modern science is way above ancient science. There are those who, on the contrary, think that philosophy without history is wrong philosophy. The paragraph that I removed was a support for the first view point and it completely ignored the debate. The paragraph claimed that those who emphasize history are are simply doing history, not philosophy, but that is one of the two view points. The other view point is that those who think they can do philosophy that is not also history are doing bad philosophy (and usually a horrible history also). The fact that one of these views can be verified as shown by the bullet points above is besides the point. Of course, it is a view that is very often maintained by philosophers, especially in the last decades in American universities. Dominic Mayers ( talk) 06:40, 1 April 2024 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
History of philosophy article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1 |
History of philosophy has been listed as one of the
Philosophy and religion good articles under the
good article criteria. If you can improve it further,
please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can
reassess it. Review: April 1, 2024. ( Reviewed version). |
This
level-4 vital article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||
|
Text and/or other creative content from this version of Philosophy was copied or moved into History of philosophy with this edit. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
A fact from History of philosophy appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 14 July 2023 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
|
Please see Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Philosophy#Proper_article_for_"History_of_philosophy". fgnievinski ( talk) 01:46, 1 June 2023 (UTC)
Okay, I've given the section on Western philosophy a quick once-over. I did my best to explain edits in the description fields, but please just tag me if anything is unclear or seems wrong.
You're not consistent between "pre-Socratics" and "Presocratics." I'd incline towards the former, but I don't know which (if either) is best practice. Whatever you decide, just Cnt-A and standardize.
It would also be nice to have something on how the analytic-Continental distinction largely fell apart in the late 20th century and is no longer operative in most circles today. But that can, of course, be added later. Patrick J. Welsh ( talk) 17:48, 20 June 2023 (UTC)
Plato’s Academy (the ‘School of Athens’) was closed by the Emperor Justinian in 529 CE, along with a general ban on the teaching of philosophy because it conflicted with Christianity.; From Blackson 2011:
By convention ancient philosophy ends in 529 when the Christian Emperor Justinian prohibited pagans from teaching in the schools)
unifying principle ... For Hegel, it was the notion of Spirit; from Kenny 2006:
Cosmic history, according to Hegel, consists in the life story of spirit(Geist). The internal development of spirit manifests itself in concrete reality.) But you are probably better versed in Hegel so I'm open to other suggestions.
philosophy, the aim of which, he claimed, is a self-transparent knowing of what knowledge isunless we can determine what supports this. According to Illetterati & Miolli 2021, maybe we could use something like the following:
philosophy, the aim of which, he claimed, is a form of self-knowledge characterized by the identity of subject and object. Phlsph7 ( talk) 18:06, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
The result was: promoted by
BorgQueen (
talk) 17:00, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
References
Sources
Created by Phlsph7 ( talk). Self-nominated at 07:55, 25 June 2023 (UTC). Post-promotion hook changes for this nom will be logged at Template talk:Did you know nominations/History of philosophy; consider watching this nomination, if it is successful, until the hook appears on the Main Page.
Hi @ Phlsph7,
I think the lead needs to be pared back rather aggressively. It's good to remember that lots of people will be reading this on their phones and also, more importantly, that a good TOC does a lot of this work on its own.
Oh, and I see above @ chankal suggesting four paragraphs. But I think it is not appropriate to combine Indian and Chinese thought just to meet the suggest paragraph count. Moreover, merely combining paragraphs undermines the purpose of the policy, which is to keep things short and to the point.
Here's a draft for consideration:
The history of philosophy is the systematic study of the development of
philosophical thought. It is usually understood as a rational inquiry based on argumentation. Some theorists, however, define it in a wider sense to also include
myths,
religious traditions, and proverbial lore.
Western philosophy originated with inquiry into the fundamental nature of the cosmos in Ancient Greece. Subsequent philosophical developments cover a wide range of topics including the nature of reality and the mind, how people should act, and how to arrive at knowledge. The subsequent medieval period is focused on more on theology. The Renaissance period saw a renewed interest in Ancient Greek philosophy and the emergence of humanism. The modern period was characterized by an increased focus on how philosophical and scientific knowledge is created.
Arabic-Persian philosophy was strongly influenced by Ancient Greek philosophers. It had its peak period during the Islamic Golden Age. One of its topics was the relation between reason and revelation as two compatible ways of arriving at the truth. Avicenna developed a comprehensive philosophical system that synthesized Islamic faith and Greek philosophy. After the Islamic Golden Age, the influence of philosophical inquiry waned, partly due to Al-Ghazali's critique of philosophy.
Indian philosophy is characterized by its combined interest in the nature of reality, the ways of arriving at knowledge, and the spiritual question of how to reach enlightenment. Its roots are the religious scriptures known as the Vedas. In the modern period, the exchange between Indian and Western thought led various Indian philosophers to develop comprehensive systems. They aimed to unite and harmonize diverse philosophical and religious schools of thought.
Chinese philosophy was more interested in right social conduct and government than in ultimate reality. Confucianism explored moral virtues and how they lead to harmony in society. Daoism focused on the relation between humans and nature. The modern period in Chinese philosophy was characterized by its encounter with Western philosophy—as well as Japanese philosophy, Latin American philosophy, and African philosophy.
Patrick J. Welsh ( talk) 21:41, 25 June 2023 (UTC)
There should be a section on this, probably at the end of the current version of Western. (I would be surprised if the other traditions would not benefit from similar discussions, but I don't know enough about them to say.)
The article on women in philosophy looks to be well sourced and probably has everything necessary to write a couple good paragraphs. I would do maybe one on the (rather obvious) reasons for their social exclusion from academic life under patriarchial social structures, noting also a few important exceptions. Then a paragraph on how this has been changing in the 20th and 21st centuries, but that the discipline still skews male and there is more work to be done. Patrick J. Welsh ( talk) 15:29, 26 June 2023 (UTC)
Title between this article's 'introduction' and 'Western philosophy'... limiting scope of the article ... Arnbiology ( talk) 15:46, 31 August 2023 (UTC) Arnbiology
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: SilverTiger12 ( talk · contribs) 00:00, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Heyla! I'll take this one.
SilverTiger12 (
talk) 00:00, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Sorry for the wait, real life happens. Beginning with the lede:
Good Article review progress box
|
Here is the paragraph at this time:
The history of philosophy has both a historical and a philosophical component. The historical component is concerned with how philosophical thought unfolded throughout the ages. It asks which philosophers held what views and how they were influenced by their social and cultural context. The philosophical component concerns whether the studied theories are true. It reflects on the arguments presented for the positions and assesses their validity and hidden assumptions. It makes the philosophical heritage accessible to a contemporary audience and evaluates its continued relevance today. Some historians of philosophy focus primarily on the historical component. They hold that the history of philosophy is part of the wider discipline known as intellectual history. Other theorists put more emphasis on the philosophical component. They tend to claim that the history of philosophy goes beyond intellectual history because its interest is not exclusively historical. [1]
I read quickly all the sources provided except Verene 2008 , because I could not find a copy of it yet. I did not find that it was representative of the sources. In particular, more than one of them presented criticisms of the use of history or lack thereof in modern analytic philosophy. Here is an excerpt from ( Beaney 2013) :
As we have seen, from its origins in the work of Frege and Russell, analytic philosophy has had ahistorical tendencies. Analytic philosophers have engaged in history of philosophy, but often only to the extent of offering—or sometimes simply borrowing—rational reconstructions to further their own projects.
Being neutral does not mean avoiding presenting notorious criticisms found in sources. In simple terms, accessible to a large audience, the issue is that some modern philosophers use history to present their modern philosophy, that is, their purpose is to see their modern philosophy in ancient philosophies, and often they ignore essential aspects of the history in doing so and thus misrepresent it. How do you relate this to the above paragraph taken from the article? Is the idea that looking at the modern philosophy within the ancient philosophies is a way "to assess their validity, and hidden assumptions ..." to make "the philosophical heritage accessible to a contemporary audience and evaluates its continued relevance today"? That might be a view point expressed somewhere in the sources (though I did not see it). In any case, there is a total lack of neutrality if only that viewpoint is expressed.
References
Dominic Mayers ( talk) 16:01, 21 March 2024 (UTC)
I removed the paragraph, because nothing has been done to improve it. The role of history in philosophy is a big big issue. There are those who think that history in a philosophical perspective is only a tool that can be used to illustrate the modern view, which hold independently of history and is at the top of history in the same way that modern science is way above ancient science. There are those who, on the contrary, think that philosophy without history is wrong philosophy. The paragraph that I removed was a support for the first view point and it completely ignored the debate. The paragraph claimed that those who emphasize history are are simply doing history, not philosophy, but that is one of the two view points. The other view point is that those who think they can do philosophy that is not also history are doing bad philosophy (and usually a horrible history also). The fact that one of these views can be verified as shown by the bullet points above is besides the point. Of course, it is a view that is very often maintained by philosophers, especially in the last decades in American universities. Dominic Mayers ( talk) 06:40, 1 April 2024 (UTC)