The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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Reviewer: SusunW ( talk · contribs) 18:40, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
- I've taken a look at this. Thanks for creating an interesting article on a Bolivian woman. For the most part, although the article is short, it is well-written and covers the important details, filling a gap in our coverage of South American women. A review of all source material verifies the information in the article is supported by the sources, except as noted below, i.e.:
- Gonzales Salas, p 50 does not mention anything about school before Canadian Baptist, but Vargas & Villavicencio, p 151 says she attended the San Ignacio de Moxos Indigenous School and Sócrates Parada Egüez School. Move cite for Gonzales Sales to follow
found employment in the city
and insert cite for Vargas & Villavicencio after San Martín de Porres Institute.- Corrected. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Nothing in Vargas & Villavicencio talks about size. So perhaps "small" is not the correct word. Perhaps "For primary and secondary school she attended", or just call them "local" schools.
- Changed to "local". Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- At
Returning to San Ignacio
Gonzales Salas, p 51 says she returned at seventeen (not necessary, but gives context, IMO) and married. (I think it is important to say she got married because even though she did, she returned to school and finished her education. Besides which, later you say she worked in a transport business with her husband, but you've never said she was married).- Integrated stated information into the second paragraph. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Perhaps you should show Trinidad, Bolivia at the first mention to avoid confusion with the country Trinidad and Tobago, usually styled as simply Trinidad.
- Noted as "the departmental capital".
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- That works fine, avoids the confusion. But, it also occurs to me re-reading this that department can be a confusing word for English speakers. It is typically a division of an organization and in government a subsection of an agency. In this case, department is the equivalent of a state or province. So to avoid confusion you should probably link that "departmental capital" to
Departments of Bolivia.
SusunW (
talk) 16:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- That checks out. Done. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 19:24, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- That works fine, avoids the confusion. But, it also occurs to me re-reading this that department can be a confusing word for English speakers. It is typically a division of an organization and in government a subsection of an agency. In this case, department is the equivalent of a state or province. So to avoid confusion you should probably link that "departmental capital" to
Departments of Bolivia.
SusunW (
talk) 16:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Noted as "the departmental capital".
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Insert
Technical University of Beni (I got distracted by the nomination of a university for deletion, I mean what?????)
- Done. And, yeah, quite the odd discussion going on over there. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- link circumscription to
Electoral district
- Added "an electoral district encompassing" immediately after. Apologies for not directly placing the link on the word "circumscription" but I've dug myself into a hole where my borderline OCD would force me to add the link to all the other articles I've created, ha, ha. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Her appointments and proposed legislation during her tenure should be stated. See bottom of Vargas & Villavicencio p 151
- Added info on committee and other parliamentary positions. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- "Upon the conclusion of her tenure", when was that?
- Now mentioned under the "Tenure" section. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Starting at
Nonetheless, the election of MTS candidate Alejandro Unzueta
… The sources confirm that she was departmental director of education and secretary of human development but not that she was appointed by Unzueta or that his election was responsible for her continuance in politics. Need sources to confirm text.- I have sources that state he was the elected governor, but none that directly state he appointed her. Would that be sufficient?
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Drawing a conclusion that he appointed her would run afoul of OR or synth. You can separately state he was elected Governor in some year (cite). In 2021, she was serving as departmental director of Education and Culture ("Premiaron a ganadores") and the following year as secretary for Human Development("Rotarios donan equipo").
SusunW (
talk) 16:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- There is
this (pretty crude) government pamphlet that directly lists her as a member of his cabinet. Beyond that, I might have to get a bit creative with the wording. Somewhat infuriatingly, La Palabra del Beni, the main source for the region, periodically REMOVES older news articles from it's site, which complicates things.
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 19:13, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Okay, so I get that it isn't ideal, but I also totally get that in non-major markets, google hits aren't good and news coverage is done differently. (Very familiar with the problem as it is the same in southern Mexico and the Caribbean.) But, what about video?
this link clearly shows he installed her. If you could find another for education and culture I think with the other links you are fine and no OR or synth. Wish they weren't on Facebook links, but I couldn't find direct links to the creators. Maybe you can? Use {{
Cite AV media}}
SusunW (
talk) 20:21, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Oh, wow, you found that surprisingly quickly. Yeah, I think that could work. Not sure I'd be able to find one for the other post, so I've reworded it to be less assertive. I used "was made", not specifically noting who specifically appointed her to the position. You think that works?
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 21:03, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- I think we're good now. Give me a few minutes and I'll pass it. (Note for FYI, repeated searches change the google algorithms and more hits start showing up. You also get different hits from google.com, google.com.mx, google.com.bo, so I just play around with different combinations to see what comes up ;).
- Didn't know one could do that, I'll keep it in mind, thanks for the tip! Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 21:39, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- I think we're good now. Give me a few minutes and I'll pass it. (Note for FYI, repeated searches change the google algorithms and more hits start showing up. You also get different hits from google.com, google.com.mx, google.com.bo, so I just play around with different combinations to see what comes up ;).
- Oh, wow, you found that surprisingly quickly. Yeah, I think that could work. Not sure I'd be able to find one for the other post, so I've reworded it to be less assertive. I used "was made", not specifically noting who specifically appointed her to the position. You think that works?
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 21:03, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Okay, so I get that it isn't ideal, but I also totally get that in non-major markets, google hits aren't good and news coverage is done differently. (Very familiar with the problem as it is the same in southern Mexico and the Caribbean.) But, what about video?
this link clearly shows he installed her. If you could find another for education and culture I think with the other links you are fine and no OR or synth. Wish they weren't on Facebook links, but I couldn't find direct links to the creators. Maybe you can? Use {{
Cite AV media}}
SusunW (
talk) 20:21, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- There is
this (pretty crude) government pamphlet that directly lists her as a member of his cabinet. Beyond that, I might have to get a bit creative with the wording. Somewhat infuriatingly, La Palabra del Beni, the main source for the region, periodically REMOVES older news articles from it's site, which complicates things.
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 19:13, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Drawing a conclusion that he appointed her would run afoul of OR or synth. You can separately state he was elected Governor in some year (cite). In 2021, she was serving as departmental director of Education and Culture ("Premiaron a ganadores") and the following year as secretary for Human Development("Rotarios donan equipo").
SusunW (
talk) 16:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- I have sources that state he was the elected governor, but none that directly state he appointed her. Would that be sufficient?
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- In the lede, you state
After finishing her term in the legislature, Vaca moved on to local government
, but local government is part of a city council, school board, etc. She was part of the departmental government and possibly (see notes above about departmental) the way to introduce it in the lede is to say "After finishing her term in the national legislature, Vaca moved on to departmental (state/provincial) government…"- Changed to "regional". "Provincial" is more low down, we don't really have "states", and as you pointed out, "departmental" may be confusing to unfamiliar readers. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 19:24, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- It is reasonably well written.
- It is factually accurate and
verifiable.
- a (
reference section):
b (citations to
reliable sources): c (
OR): d (
copyvio and
plagiarism):
- a (
reference section):
- It is broad in its coverage.
- a (
major aspects): b (
focused):
- a (
major aspects):
- It follows the
neutral point of view policy.
- Fair representation without bias:
- Fair representation without bias:
- It is stable.
- No edit wars, etc.:
- No edit wars, etc.:
- It is illustrated by
images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
- a (images are tagged and non-free content have
non-free use rationales): b (
appropriate use with
suitable captions):
- a (images are tagged and non-free content have
non-free use rationales):
- Overall:
- Pass/Fail:
- Pass/Fail:
- Definitely ping me when you have had time to address the queries. Please feel free to disagree with any of my comments. Happy to discuss.
SusunW (
talk) 18:40, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
- @ SusunW: Already most of the way through but I just realized I forgot to thank you for taking the time to review this, so yeah, thanks! Anyway, I've addressed some of the last points, I think there's just the one still left to go. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 19:24, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
| GA toolbox |
|---|
| Reviewing |
Article (
|
visual edit |
history) ·
Article talk (
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history) ·
Watch
Reviewer: SusunW ( talk · contribs) 18:40, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
- I've taken a look at this. Thanks for creating an interesting article on a Bolivian woman. For the most part, although the article is short, it is well-written and covers the important details, filling a gap in our coverage of South American women. A review of all source material verifies the information in the article is supported by the sources, except as noted below, i.e.:
- Gonzales Salas, p 50 does not mention anything about school before Canadian Baptist, but Vargas & Villavicencio, p 151 says she attended the San Ignacio de Moxos Indigenous School and Sócrates Parada Egüez School. Move cite for Gonzales Sales to follow
found employment in the city
and insert cite for Vargas & Villavicencio after San Martín de Porres Institute.- Corrected. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Nothing in Vargas & Villavicencio talks about size. So perhaps "small" is not the correct word. Perhaps "For primary and secondary school she attended", or just call them "local" schools.
- Changed to "local". Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- At
Returning to San Ignacio
Gonzales Salas, p 51 says she returned at seventeen (not necessary, but gives context, IMO) and married. (I think it is important to say she got married because even though she did, she returned to school and finished her education. Besides which, later you say she worked in a transport business with her husband, but you've never said she was married).- Integrated stated information into the second paragraph. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Perhaps you should show Trinidad, Bolivia at the first mention to avoid confusion with the country Trinidad and Tobago, usually styled as simply Trinidad.
- Noted as "the departmental capital".
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- That works fine, avoids the confusion. But, it also occurs to me re-reading this that department can be a confusing word for English speakers. It is typically a division of an organization and in government a subsection of an agency. In this case, department is the equivalent of a state or province. So to avoid confusion you should probably link that "departmental capital" to
Departments of Bolivia.
SusunW (
talk) 16:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- That checks out. Done. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 19:24, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- That works fine, avoids the confusion. But, it also occurs to me re-reading this that department can be a confusing word for English speakers. It is typically a division of an organization and in government a subsection of an agency. In this case, department is the equivalent of a state or province. So to avoid confusion you should probably link that "departmental capital" to
Departments of Bolivia.
SusunW (
talk) 16:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Noted as "the departmental capital".
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Insert
Technical University of Beni (I got distracted by the nomination of a university for deletion, I mean what?????)
- Done. And, yeah, quite the odd discussion going on over there. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- link circumscription to
Electoral district
- Added "an electoral district encompassing" immediately after. Apologies for not directly placing the link on the word "circumscription" but I've dug myself into a hole where my borderline OCD would force me to add the link to all the other articles I've created, ha, ha. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Her appointments and proposed legislation during her tenure should be stated. See bottom of Vargas & Villavicencio p 151
- Added info on committee and other parliamentary positions. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- "Upon the conclusion of her tenure", when was that?
- Now mentioned under the "Tenure" section. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Starting at
Nonetheless, the election of MTS candidate Alejandro Unzueta
… The sources confirm that she was departmental director of education and secretary of human development but not that she was appointed by Unzueta or that his election was responsible for her continuance in politics. Need sources to confirm text.- I have sources that state he was the elected governor, but none that directly state he appointed her. Would that be sufficient?
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Drawing a conclusion that he appointed her would run afoul of OR or synth. You can separately state he was elected Governor in some year (cite). In 2021, she was serving as departmental director of Education and Culture ("Premiaron a ganadores") and the following year as secretary for Human Development("Rotarios donan equipo").
SusunW (
talk) 16:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- There is
this (pretty crude) government pamphlet that directly lists her as a member of his cabinet. Beyond that, I might have to get a bit creative with the wording. Somewhat infuriatingly, La Palabra del Beni, the main source for the region, periodically REMOVES older news articles from it's site, which complicates things.
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 19:13, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Okay, so I get that it isn't ideal, but I also totally get that in non-major markets, google hits aren't good and news coverage is done differently. (Very familiar with the problem as it is the same in southern Mexico and the Caribbean.) But, what about video?
this link clearly shows he installed her. If you could find another for education and culture I think with the other links you are fine and no OR or synth. Wish they weren't on Facebook links, but I couldn't find direct links to the creators. Maybe you can? Use {{
Cite AV media}}
SusunW (
talk) 20:21, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Oh, wow, you found that surprisingly quickly. Yeah, I think that could work. Not sure I'd be able to find one for the other post, so I've reworded it to be less assertive. I used "was made", not specifically noting who specifically appointed her to the position. You think that works?
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 21:03, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- I think we're good now. Give me a few minutes and I'll pass it. (Note for FYI, repeated searches change the google algorithms and more hits start showing up. You also get different hits from google.com, google.com.mx, google.com.bo, so I just play around with different combinations to see what comes up ;).
- Didn't know one could do that, I'll keep it in mind, thanks for the tip! Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 21:39, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- I think we're good now. Give me a few minutes and I'll pass it. (Note for FYI, repeated searches change the google algorithms and more hits start showing up. You also get different hits from google.com, google.com.mx, google.com.bo, so I just play around with different combinations to see what comes up ;).
- Oh, wow, you found that surprisingly quickly. Yeah, I think that could work. Not sure I'd be able to find one for the other post, so I've reworded it to be less assertive. I used "was made", not specifically noting who specifically appointed her to the position. You think that works?
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 21:03, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Okay, so I get that it isn't ideal, but I also totally get that in non-major markets, google hits aren't good and news coverage is done differently. (Very familiar with the problem as it is the same in southern Mexico and the Caribbean.) But, what about video?
this link clearly shows he installed her. If you could find another for education and culture I think with the other links you are fine and no OR or synth. Wish they weren't on Facebook links, but I couldn't find direct links to the creators. Maybe you can? Use {{
Cite AV media}}
SusunW (
talk) 20:21, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- There is
this (pretty crude) government pamphlet that directly lists her as a member of his cabinet. Beyond that, I might have to get a bit creative with the wording. Somewhat infuriatingly, La Palabra del Beni, the main source for the region, periodically REMOVES older news articles from it's site, which complicates things.
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 19:13, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- Drawing a conclusion that he appointed her would run afoul of OR or synth. You can separately state he was elected Governor in some year (cite). In 2021, she was serving as departmental director of Education and Culture ("Premiaron a ganadores") and the following year as secretary for Human Development("Rotarios donan equipo").
SusunW (
talk) 16:52, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- I have sources that state he was the elected governor, but none that directly state he appointed her. Would that be sufficient?
Krisgabwoosh (
talk) 00:34, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- In the lede, you state
After finishing her term in the legislature, Vaca moved on to local government
, but local government is part of a city council, school board, etc. She was part of the departmental government and possibly (see notes above about departmental) the way to introduce it in the lede is to say "After finishing her term in the national legislature, Vaca moved on to departmental (state/provincial) government…"- Changed to "regional". "Provincial" is more low down, we don't really have "states", and as you pointed out, "departmental" may be confusing to unfamiliar readers. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 19:24, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
- It is reasonably well written.
- It is factually accurate and
verifiable.
- a (
reference section): b (citations to
reliable sources): c (
OR): d (
copyvio and
plagiarism):
- a (
reference section):
- It is broad in its coverage.
- a (
major aspects): b (
focused):
- a (
major aspects):
- It follows the
neutral point of view policy.
- Fair representation without bias:
- Fair representation without bias:
- It is stable.
- No edit wars, etc.:
- No edit wars, etc.:
- It is illustrated by
images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
- a (images are tagged and non-free content have
non-free use rationales): b (
appropriate use with
suitable captions):
- a (images are tagged and non-free content have
non-free use rationales):
- Overall:
- Pass/Fail:
- Pass/Fail:
- Definitely ping me when you have had time to address the queries. Please feel free to disagree with any of my comments. Happy to discuss.
SusunW (
talk) 18:40, 11 February 2023 (UTC)
- @ SusunW: Already most of the way through but I just realized I forgot to thank you for taking the time to review this, so yeah, thanks! Anyway, I've addressed some of the last points, I think there's just the one still left to go. Krisgabwoosh ( talk) 19:24, 12 February 2023 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.