![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||
|
The University of Notre Dame just announced it will be closing the dorm and kicking its current residents out. At Notre Dame, it's common to live in the same dorm for all four years, and social media reports indicate that students are rather angry. This has led to vandalism already and will probably going to lead to significant vandalism from IPs and/or new users in the coming hours and days if the page is not protected. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 02:15, 16 March 2021 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: No consensus to move at this time. The name "Zahm House" is a newer and more unofficial name and it may become the common name in the future, but there is no consensus that it is currently the common name. ( non-admin closure) ( t · c) buidhe 19:06, 11 April 2021 (UTC)
Zahm Hall →
Zahm House – Per
WP:COMMONNAME,"Wikipedia does not necessarily use the subject's "official" name as an article title; it generally prefers the name that is most commonly used
." The official name of the building is "Zahm Hall", which Notre Dame generally uses when referring to the building on its own websites, though in recent years it appears to be the case that both independent student newspapers (
The Observer and
The Irish Rover) refer to the dorm by the name of Zahm House, as does the building's
official website.
WNDU has referred to the dorm both as "Zahm Hall" and "Zahm House" in its recent
reporting (its video report uses "Zahm House" while its text description uses "Zahm Hall"), while
WSBT-TV has recently referred to the building exclusively as
Zahm House. Since we should generally prefer to refer to the dorm by the name that is most commonly used, and the name that is most commonly used by reliable, independent sources is "Zahm House", I believe that the title of this article should be changed to
Zahm House and that the page should be moved. —
Mikehawk10 (
talk)
07:04, 22 March 2021 (UTC)
are considered generally reliable sources for news on their school and local community. Reputable student media outlets should not be discounted in determining the common name that is used to refer to the article's subject. And, it very well might be the case that student media is the type of media that most commonly reports on the Hall itself. There are national sources, such as the National Catholic Reporter, that have referred to the rector of the dorm as the rector of "Zahm House". — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 07:20, 22 March 2021 (UTC)
@ Eccekevin: I don't understand why you're removing the alternative name of the building from the lead. If it's a historical name (and I'd like to see a source that affirmatively says that the name is historical), then I believe it should still be kept in the lead and marked as a historical name. I don't think removing it altogether is in line with the manual of style, nor in line with how public reporting continues to refer to the dorm. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 04:41, 20 September 2021 (UTC)
until 2021, its residents referred to it as Zahm House? I'd be totally OK with something like ("also historically referred to as Zahm House") if there's a reliable source that backs it up, but the continued use of the Moniker by The Observer would appear to cut against that. After all, all material added to articles must be attributable to a reliable, published source. In the absence of such a published source, which you haven't provided thus far, I'd have a problem with omitting the alternative name that our the Manual of Style would have us include. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 22:45, 20 September 2021 (UTC)
How should the lead of this article begin?
— Mikehawk10 ( talk) 01:48, 21 September 2021 (UTC)
Zahm House. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 01:48, 21 September 2021 (UTC)
significant alternative names for the topic should be mentioned in the article, usually in the first sentence or paragraph. There is a wide range of sourcing, both from the University of Notre Dame and from external sources, that use the name "Zahm House" to refer to the dorm. These include The New York Daily News, the building's official website, The Daily Domer, an alumni profile by the Notre Dame Club of Austin, television news station WSBT, student newspaper The Irish Rover, a profile of the dorm's former rector in the National Catholic Reporter, and an August article from the other student newspaper The Observer (also see: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 etc.), official student magazine Scholastic, and a chapter in Black Domers: African-American Students at Notre Dame in Their Own Words. Even the current photograph that we use in the article has a nicely made wooden sign outside the building that says, "Zahm House", for Pete's sake. Zahm House is a significant alternate name, and it belongs in the lead as such. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 01:48, 21 September 2021 (UTC)
References
{{
cite web}}
: Missing or empty |title=
(
help)
![]() | This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||
|
The University of Notre Dame just announced it will be closing the dorm and kicking its current residents out. At Notre Dame, it's common to live in the same dorm for all four years, and social media reports indicate that students are rather angry. This has led to vandalism already and will probably going to lead to significant vandalism from IPs and/or new users in the coming hours and days if the page is not protected. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 02:15, 16 March 2021 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: No consensus to move at this time. The name "Zahm House" is a newer and more unofficial name and it may become the common name in the future, but there is no consensus that it is currently the common name. ( non-admin closure) ( t · c) buidhe 19:06, 11 April 2021 (UTC)
Zahm Hall →
Zahm House – Per
WP:COMMONNAME,"Wikipedia does not necessarily use the subject's "official" name as an article title; it generally prefers the name that is most commonly used
." The official name of the building is "Zahm Hall", which Notre Dame generally uses when referring to the building on its own websites, though in recent years it appears to be the case that both independent student newspapers (
The Observer and
The Irish Rover) refer to the dorm by the name of Zahm House, as does the building's
official website.
WNDU has referred to the dorm both as "Zahm Hall" and "Zahm House" in its recent
reporting (its video report uses "Zahm House" while its text description uses "Zahm Hall"), while
WSBT-TV has recently referred to the building exclusively as
Zahm House. Since we should generally prefer to refer to the dorm by the name that is most commonly used, and the name that is most commonly used by reliable, independent sources is "Zahm House", I believe that the title of this article should be changed to
Zahm House and that the page should be moved. —
Mikehawk10 (
talk)
07:04, 22 March 2021 (UTC)
are considered generally reliable sources for news on their school and local community. Reputable student media outlets should not be discounted in determining the common name that is used to refer to the article's subject. And, it very well might be the case that student media is the type of media that most commonly reports on the Hall itself. There are national sources, such as the National Catholic Reporter, that have referred to the rector of the dorm as the rector of "Zahm House". — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 07:20, 22 March 2021 (UTC)
@ Eccekevin: I don't understand why you're removing the alternative name of the building from the lead. If it's a historical name (and I'd like to see a source that affirmatively says that the name is historical), then I believe it should still be kept in the lead and marked as a historical name. I don't think removing it altogether is in line with the manual of style, nor in line with how public reporting continues to refer to the dorm. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 04:41, 20 September 2021 (UTC)
until 2021, its residents referred to it as Zahm House? I'd be totally OK with something like ("also historically referred to as Zahm House") if there's a reliable source that backs it up, but the continued use of the Moniker by The Observer would appear to cut against that. After all, all material added to articles must be attributable to a reliable, published source. In the absence of such a published source, which you haven't provided thus far, I'd have a problem with omitting the alternative name that our the Manual of Style would have us include. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 22:45, 20 September 2021 (UTC)
How should the lead of this article begin?
— Mikehawk10 ( talk) 01:48, 21 September 2021 (UTC)
Zahm House. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 01:48, 21 September 2021 (UTC)
significant alternative names for the topic should be mentioned in the article, usually in the first sentence or paragraph. There is a wide range of sourcing, both from the University of Notre Dame and from external sources, that use the name "Zahm House" to refer to the dorm. These include The New York Daily News, the building's official website, The Daily Domer, an alumni profile by the Notre Dame Club of Austin, television news station WSBT, student newspaper The Irish Rover, a profile of the dorm's former rector in the National Catholic Reporter, and an August article from the other student newspaper The Observer (also see: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 etc.), official student magazine Scholastic, and a chapter in Black Domers: African-American Students at Notre Dame in Their Own Words. Even the current photograph that we use in the article has a nicely made wooden sign outside the building that says, "Zahm House", for Pete's sake. Zahm House is a significant alternate name, and it belongs in the lead as such. — Mikehawk10 ( talk) 01:48, 21 September 2021 (UTC)
References
{{
cite web}}
: Missing or empty |title=
(
help)