This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Wilhelm II article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives:
1,
2Auto-archiving period: 100 days
![]() |
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | Page history | ||||
|
The section entitled Life in Exile shows completely contradictory information about Wilhelm's attitude and statements about Hitler, antisemitism and the war, without any attempt at reconciliation. It appears that some of the references are revisionist and dubious, and should probably be removed, but if they are reputable attributions they should certainly be explained as the current narrative makes essentially no sense.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.116.122.51 ( talk • contribs) 20:01, 9 August 2023 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: NOT MOVED. Hadal ( talk) 14:58, 6 April 2023 (UTC)
– Please keep consistency with other Prussian monarchs and German Emperors by their anglicized regnal names.-- Joker Twins ( talk) 08:47, 30 March 2023 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. The supporters generally argued that the proposed title would be more concise, commonly used, and the primary topic. The opposers generally said that the proposed title was not the common name and primary topic, or was ambiguous. Overall, it appears that the supporters generally had stronger arguments than the opposers, saying that the proposed title was unambiguous and was the primary topic, because the term Wilhelm II already redirected to the German Emperor. Since there was no uniform grounds in the opposes saying why the German emperor was not the primary topic, and evidence suggesting that the proposed title was not completely ambiguous, I see a consensus that the page should be moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) The Night Watch (talk) 18:29, 4 November 2023 (UTC)
There is not any other person titled "Wilhelm II" except for this German emperor. Thus the comma is unnecessary. "William II" is arguable but "Wilhelm II" clearly refers to this German emperor/Prussian king and no other royal. Toptanazikov ( talk) 02:39, 20 October 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. ASUKITE 15:06, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
He wasn't even the only King Wilhelm II in Germany in his own time. See de:Wilhelm II. (Württemberg); surely nobody could argue that the existence of the King of Württemberg by the same name ruled the Kaiser out as primary topic unless they disagreed with the whole concept of primary topic). No, because Oprah Winfrey and Barack Obama are very commonly seen. But who says "Wilhelm II, German Emperor"? They say "Wilhelm II", "Kaiser Wilhelm" or "the Kaiser". Probably it should be moved, yes. I'd certainly support it. Using Anglicised versions of names for German monarchs is very old-fashioned. -- Necrothesp ( talk) 11:46, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
The kaiser can be the primary topic for "Wilhelm II" for all I care.In other words, I do not believe that establishing that the kaiser is the primary topic for "Wilhelm II" resolves the issue any more than esablishing that Ms Winfrey is the primary topic for "Oprah" tells us how to title her article. There are other considerations, like consistency and recognizability. The general principle you are appealing to leads to titles like Valdemar II, Pedro VI, Alfonso VI, Christian V, Louis VII, Ferdinand VI, Olaf III and George XI, which I do not think are obvious improvements. They are just common names with numerals and the numerals are meaningless apart from the country. Srnec ( talk) 01:29, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please add the following template, consistent with the other Prussian monarchs having that template on their page due to being listed there:
2601:249:9301:D570:CC87:39C7:E038:494B ( talk) 00:55, 21 November 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please add the following template to the bottom of the article:
2601:249:9301:D570:AD6E:66B3:8CCE:2900 ( talk) 02:55, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Wilhelm II article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives:
1,
2Auto-archiving period: 100 days
![]() |
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | Page history | ||||
|
The section entitled Life in Exile shows completely contradictory information about Wilhelm's attitude and statements about Hitler, antisemitism and the war, without any attempt at reconciliation. It appears that some of the references are revisionist and dubious, and should probably be removed, but if they are reputable attributions they should certainly be explained as the current narrative makes essentially no sense.
— Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.116.122.51 ( talk • contribs) 20:01, 9 August 2023 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: NOT MOVED. Hadal ( talk) 14:58, 6 April 2023 (UTC)
– Please keep consistency with other Prussian monarchs and German Emperors by their anglicized regnal names.-- Joker Twins ( talk) 08:47, 30 March 2023 (UTC)
The result of the move request was: moved. The supporters generally argued that the proposed title would be more concise, commonly used, and the primary topic. The opposers generally said that the proposed title was not the common name and primary topic, or was ambiguous. Overall, it appears that the supporters generally had stronger arguments than the opposers, saying that the proposed title was unambiguous and was the primary topic, because the term Wilhelm II already redirected to the German Emperor. Since there was no uniform grounds in the opposes saying why the German emperor was not the primary topic, and evidence suggesting that the proposed title was not completely ambiguous, I see a consensus that the page should be moved. ( closed by non-admin page mover) The Night Watch (talk) 18:29, 4 November 2023 (UTC)
There is not any other person titled "Wilhelm II" except for this German emperor. Thus the comma is unnecessary. "William II" is arguable but "Wilhelm II" clearly refers to this German emperor/Prussian king and no other royal. Toptanazikov ( talk) 02:39, 20 October 2023 (UTC) — Relisting. ASUKITE 15:06, 28 October 2023 (UTC)
He wasn't even the only King Wilhelm II in Germany in his own time. See de:Wilhelm II. (Württemberg); surely nobody could argue that the existence of the King of Württemberg by the same name ruled the Kaiser out as primary topic unless they disagreed with the whole concept of primary topic). No, because Oprah Winfrey and Barack Obama are very commonly seen. But who says "Wilhelm II, German Emperor"? They say "Wilhelm II", "Kaiser Wilhelm" or "the Kaiser". Probably it should be moved, yes. I'd certainly support it. Using Anglicised versions of names for German monarchs is very old-fashioned. -- Necrothesp ( talk) 11:46, 1 November 2023 (UTC)
The kaiser can be the primary topic for "Wilhelm II" for all I care.In other words, I do not believe that establishing that the kaiser is the primary topic for "Wilhelm II" resolves the issue any more than esablishing that Ms Winfrey is the primary topic for "Oprah" tells us how to title her article. There are other considerations, like consistency and recognizability. The general principle you are appealing to leads to titles like Valdemar II, Pedro VI, Alfonso VI, Christian V, Louis VII, Ferdinand VI, Olaf III and George XI, which I do not think are obvious improvements. They are just common names with numerals and the numerals are meaningless apart from the country. Srnec ( talk) 01:29, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please add the following template, consistent with the other Prussian monarchs having that template on their page due to being listed there:
2601:249:9301:D570:CC87:39C7:E038:494B ( talk) 00:55, 21 November 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please add the following template to the bottom of the article:
2601:249:9301:D570:AD6E:66B3:8CCE:2900 ( talk) 02:55, 1 March 2024 (UTC)