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Why? First of all, neither author has any right to judge the relevancy of sources. Read the WP rules before deleting original work. Secondly, there is quite clearly an organisation called the WSS - it has a website. If we follow the money, it leads us directly to the doors of the NKT. It's not rocket science.
Moreover, there is literal evidence that Kelsang Gyatso authorised the instantiation of the organisation by one or more of his students. His email is in the public domain.
There is a gigantic difference between identity of two organisations - something which no-one has brought into dispute, and I am tired of straw man arguments being used to dissemble the foundations of these things.
There are plenty of eye-witnesses who talked with the demonstrators across the UK this year - including media representatives. BY all accounts, every demonstrator was a member of the NKT. So, we see clearly that there is a strong tie between the WSS and the NKT - there is no point in us denying this.
What is also clear is that the DSS wishes to anonymise itself. How can I say this? There is a well presented, designed website, which must have been funded, constructed, authored, and kept up to date by a team on individuals - not an ad hoc group, but a dedicated team. Websites do not appear in a self-generated manner. Secondly, the organisation and transport arrangements, as well as the placard printing, etc. of the demonstrations across the UK this year was managed centrally - there was nothing random or ad hoc about the demonstrations.
There are possibly some things worth arguing about - but the affiliations between the NKT and the DSS is one that cannot be argued, unless you wish to appear like foolish, bigoted idiots.
Lastly, if there really is any doubt, one only needs to see the relationship that both the WSS and the NKT have with Shugden. The sole bone of contention on this issue is that back in 1998 or so, KG said that he was not going to protest about Shudgen, because it was a Tibetan political affair, and he has decided not to deal with Tibetan politics from Oct 1998. - "However in October 1998 we decided to completely stop being involved in this Shugden issue because we realized that in reality this is a Tibetan political problem and not the problem of Buddhism in general or the NKT." ( OPEN LETTER from Geshe Kelsang Nov 2002.)
Chryssides says the dispute is between Kelsang Gyatso and the Dalai Lama. And Ardley says the dispute is used by Beijing. VictoriaGrayson Talk 23:19, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
@ VictoriaGrayson: Eh I think you are right about this one. I guess it depends on how stringent of the qualifications are for material for an article. If we include everything relating to the SSC and ISC, like news articles, etc, then this could be a sizeable article and would be valuable. But if not, it seems to not fit the qualifications that we need for it to be notable. What I do envision, though, is a new article "Demonstrations at The Dalai Lama's Teachings" similar to /info/en/?search=2014_Ferguson_unrest . But in time... Prasangika37 ( talk) 21:03, 5 October 2014 (UTC)
Here is an interview with Robert Barnett. I linked it as an external link. I lack time to use it to improve the article. But maybe better we leave it with this external link reference?
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Western Shugden Society article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1Auto-archiving period: 90 days |
The subject of this article is controversial and content may be in dispute. When updating the article, be bold, but not reckless. Feel free to try to improve the article, but don't take it personally if your changes are reversed; instead, come here to the talk page to discuss them. Content must be written from a neutral point of view. Include citations when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information. |
This article is rated Stub-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
The following Wikipedia contributors may be personally or professionally connected to the subject of this article. Relevant policies and guidelines may include conflict of interest, autobiography, and neutral point of view. |
Why? First of all, neither author has any right to judge the relevancy of sources. Read the WP rules before deleting original work. Secondly, there is quite clearly an organisation called the WSS - it has a website. If we follow the money, it leads us directly to the doors of the NKT. It's not rocket science.
Moreover, there is literal evidence that Kelsang Gyatso authorised the instantiation of the organisation by one or more of his students. His email is in the public domain.
There is a gigantic difference between identity of two organisations - something which no-one has brought into dispute, and I am tired of straw man arguments being used to dissemble the foundations of these things.
There are plenty of eye-witnesses who talked with the demonstrators across the UK this year - including media representatives. BY all accounts, every demonstrator was a member of the NKT. So, we see clearly that there is a strong tie between the WSS and the NKT - there is no point in us denying this.
What is also clear is that the DSS wishes to anonymise itself. How can I say this? There is a well presented, designed website, which must have been funded, constructed, authored, and kept up to date by a team on individuals - not an ad hoc group, but a dedicated team. Websites do not appear in a self-generated manner. Secondly, the organisation and transport arrangements, as well as the placard printing, etc. of the demonstrations across the UK this year was managed centrally - there was nothing random or ad hoc about the demonstrations.
There are possibly some things worth arguing about - but the affiliations between the NKT and the DSS is one that cannot be argued, unless you wish to appear like foolish, bigoted idiots.
Lastly, if there really is any doubt, one only needs to see the relationship that both the WSS and the NKT have with Shugden. The sole bone of contention on this issue is that back in 1998 or so, KG said that he was not going to protest about Shudgen, because it was a Tibetan political affair, and he has decided not to deal with Tibetan politics from Oct 1998. - "However in October 1998 we decided to completely stop being involved in this Shugden issue because we realized that in reality this is a Tibetan political problem and not the problem of Buddhism in general or the NKT." ( OPEN LETTER from Geshe Kelsang Nov 2002.)
Chryssides says the dispute is between Kelsang Gyatso and the Dalai Lama. And Ardley says the dispute is used by Beijing. VictoriaGrayson Talk 23:19, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
@ VictoriaGrayson: Eh I think you are right about this one. I guess it depends on how stringent of the qualifications are for material for an article. If we include everything relating to the SSC and ISC, like news articles, etc, then this could be a sizeable article and would be valuable. But if not, it seems to not fit the qualifications that we need for it to be notable. What I do envision, though, is a new article "Demonstrations at The Dalai Lama's Teachings" similar to /info/en/?search=2014_Ferguson_unrest . But in time... Prasangika37 ( talk) 21:03, 5 October 2014 (UTC)
Here is an interview with Robert Barnett. I linked it as an external link. I lack time to use it to improve the article. But maybe better we leave it with this external link reference?