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The information about this song being written after Mariah was signed to Columbia is incorrect. She and Ben wrote it before that; it was one of the ones on the demo she gave Tommy. 68.174.98.216 ( talk) 01:51, 15 May 2010 (UTC) Nick
The same changes keep being returned, and I keep reverting them, because they're almost entirely in strange English or non-Wikipedia style. For exaple:
There are other points, but these are indicative. It doesn't help that no-one uses edit summaries, though these are Wikipedia policy. -- OmegaWikipedia 10:11, 22 July 2005 (UTC) Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 09:20, 22 July 2005 (UTC)
Te text read like descriptions; you seem to be saying that we're dealing with actual titles — is that right? "(album version)", for example, doesn't look like a title, but like a description. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 18:26, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
No, it describes it; it's like "first edition" or "illustrated edition" of a book. Publishers might capitalise such terms in their punlicity material or packaging, but in English it's not a title. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 20:13, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
No, it isn't. That's a simple fact. If you want to take this and the other articles to RfC, do so; you'll find that your understanding of English usage (such as the meaning of "title") isn't supported by others.
On another point (with regard to List of number-one hits (United States)), don't move articles by cutting and pasting; that's explicitly against Wikipedia policy. If you think that the article should be moved, and you can't do it yourself, place it on Wikipedia:Requested moves, giving the grounds for the request. I doubt that you'll have any success, as you're trying to move it in opposition to Wikipedia naming conventions, but I might be wrong, so give it a try. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 08:23, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
Why do you think that the citation needs to go into the text in this case? Aside from the general deprecation of embedded external links, the pop-music articles are full of references to records going gold, platinum, etc., but this is the only one to be given a citation; is there some special rason? If so, couldn't it go at the end 9as usual for external links)? -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 21:34, 1 August 2005 (UTC)
I think we need a section for this how this song has influenced so many singers. Here are some examples: Christina Aguilera (AOL) - "When I discovered Mariah Carey and 'Vision of Love,' that was a breath of fresh air. And I adored her from that moment on and idolized her."
Beyonce (MTV Europe) - "'Vision Of Love,' when I first heard that song, I knew it, my mind was made up - I had to be a singer."
Snoop Dogg (MTV) - "I always tell her this story: When I was locked up in jail, that song 'Vision of Love' was the hottest song in the world."
Nivea (Launch) - "I was watching `The Arsenio Hall Show,' and Mariah was performing `Vision of Love,'" the singer recalls. "The way she projected her voice, she just had so much power. I knew then that I wanted to make people feel the way she made me feel. I bought all her albums and learned all the songs. That's all I would do all day long sing Mariah Carey songs..."
An RfC has been posted stating that there are revert and edit issues. Can the principal disputants please try to summarize the issues?
Since this article had a peer review, have the disputants referred to the archived peer review, which presumably would have established consensus? Robert McClenon 11:41, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
It isn't a question of what's normal for popular music; music journalists have all sorts of stylistic quirks, codes, customs, etc., but we don't follow them. We don't follow such things in other areas, either. Encyclopædias have one style, music magazines another. OmegaWikipedia insists on keeping Wikipedia articles in the style of a music magazine.
But it's in fact not just that; his insistence on keeping incorrect links and capitalisation (just one example: he insists on changing my 7" single to 7" Single; his version goes to a redirect, and is incorrectly capitalised. See also [2].) suggests that it's not about popular-music style versus Wikipedia, but his chosen style over other people's.
The Manual of style isn't topic-specific; it aims to provide a uniform style for Wikipedia articles, so that we don't have numbers or units or headers written one way in one article and another way in another.
Part of the problem, I suspect, is that a few editors with a special interest in one area of pop music have been beavering away for a while, generally unnoticed by other editors, and thus uncorrected. I've happened on the articles, started to do the normal editor's job of tidying and wikifying their style, and they've overreacted. (Actually I'm not the first; their Talk pages indicate that other editors have had the same experience with them, but were perhaps less determined not to be browbeaten and bullied away. Wikipedia doesn't have private fiefdoms, no-go areas for other editors, though, and I'm doing my best to make sure that this doesn't become (or stay) one. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 20:15, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
Just wondering: Why is it important to keep the certification level wikilinked to an article on a chemical element? --
Carnildo 21:03, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
I think that I have seen enough revert wars about popular music articles, often making differing claims about standards, that style guidelines are needed. Robert McClenon 23:29, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
There's also clearly a personal element here. For example, one of the first issues concerned the use of sections, and especially a separate section for what these two editors called "The song". I argued against (especially for very short articles), but ofered a compromise of "Song information", which other pop-music articles used. That held for a while, but they've now begun removing the heading altogether, with no explanation. Unless it's simple irrationality, the only reason would seem to be that I put the heading there. Other pages (such as List of number-one hits (United States) and Talk:List of artists who reached number one on the Hot 100 (US) provide more evidence of this. I'm beginning to think that an RfC on the pair is the only way forward. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 13:31, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
Before you throw a tantrum and cause drama, I went through each edit since the unprotection and kept most of your prose and grammer fixes and wikilinking and all that stuff. The chart section was lacking a lot of detail so I added that back in and Ultimate Star Wars Fans had a better lead than you. But other than that, I didnt touch the grammar, so dont you dare accuse me of that. And I deconverted the conversion. OmegaWikipedia 06:58, 16 September 2005 (UTC)
This article has been protected forever and ever, and there's no discussion for ages and ages and ages, so I unprotected. Be nice. -- Tony Sidaway Talk 23:03, 27 September 2005 (UTC)
It should say "bikini" rather than swimsuit because of her nickname, Bikini Girl. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Labellesanslebete ( talk • contribs) 23:03, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
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Reviewing |
Reviewer: Blackjacks101 ( talk) 13:49, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
Since I see that there was a miscommunication, I'll gladly step in to review it.-- Blackjacks101 ( talk) 13:49, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
Wow great article to easily read through! It was terrific! Just one problem, the image of Carey performing Someday is being nominated for deletion, you may want to remove it. (Which sucks since it fits in perfectly). Yet other than that everything looks good!-- Blackjacks101 ( talk) 13:34, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
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There's no section on Covers of this song. I know Mariah Carey has done numerous live versions herself but its interesting to see and hear other artists' interpretations/renditions. It could be thats it's not a heavily covered song but it would be nice to catalog the ones out there. For example recently in or around December 2023, Jennifer Hudson did a gospel tinged cover of the song during the Grio? awards. 71.178.185.35 ( talk) 20:34, 7 December 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Vision of Love article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Vision of Love has been listed as one of the Music good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it. | |||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||
Current status: Good article |
This article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
The following references may be useful when improving this article in the future: |
The information about this song being written after Mariah was signed to Columbia is incorrect. She and Ben wrote it before that; it was one of the ones on the demo she gave Tommy. 68.174.98.216 ( talk) 01:51, 15 May 2010 (UTC) Nick
The same changes keep being returned, and I keep reverting them, because they're almost entirely in strange English or non-Wikipedia style. For exaple:
There are other points, but these are indicative. It doesn't help that no-one uses edit summaries, though these are Wikipedia policy. -- OmegaWikipedia 10:11, 22 July 2005 (UTC) Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 09:20, 22 July 2005 (UTC)
Te text read like descriptions; you seem to be saying that we're dealing with actual titles — is that right? "(album version)", for example, doesn't look like a title, but like a description. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 18:26, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
No, it describes it; it's like "first edition" or "illustrated edition" of a book. Publishers might capitalise such terms in their punlicity material or packaging, but in English it's not a title. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 20:13, 25 July 2005 (UTC)
No, it isn't. That's a simple fact. If you want to take this and the other articles to RfC, do so; you'll find that your understanding of English usage (such as the meaning of "title") isn't supported by others.
On another point (with regard to List of number-one hits (United States)), don't move articles by cutting and pasting; that's explicitly against Wikipedia policy. If you think that the article should be moved, and you can't do it yourself, place it on Wikipedia:Requested moves, giving the grounds for the request. I doubt that you'll have any success, as you're trying to move it in opposition to Wikipedia naming conventions, but I might be wrong, so give it a try. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 08:23, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
Why do you think that the citation needs to go into the text in this case? Aside from the general deprecation of embedded external links, the pop-music articles are full of references to records going gold, platinum, etc., but this is the only one to be given a citation; is there some special rason? If so, couldn't it go at the end 9as usual for external links)? -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 21:34, 1 August 2005 (UTC)
I think we need a section for this how this song has influenced so many singers. Here are some examples: Christina Aguilera (AOL) - "When I discovered Mariah Carey and 'Vision of Love,' that was a breath of fresh air. And I adored her from that moment on and idolized her."
Beyonce (MTV Europe) - "'Vision Of Love,' when I first heard that song, I knew it, my mind was made up - I had to be a singer."
Snoop Dogg (MTV) - "I always tell her this story: When I was locked up in jail, that song 'Vision of Love' was the hottest song in the world."
Nivea (Launch) - "I was watching `The Arsenio Hall Show,' and Mariah was performing `Vision of Love,'" the singer recalls. "The way she projected her voice, she just had so much power. I knew then that I wanted to make people feel the way she made me feel. I bought all her albums and learned all the songs. That's all I would do all day long sing Mariah Carey songs..."
An RfC has been posted stating that there are revert and edit issues. Can the principal disputants please try to summarize the issues?
Since this article had a peer review, have the disputants referred to the archived peer review, which presumably would have established consensus? Robert McClenon 11:41, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
It isn't a question of what's normal for popular music; music journalists have all sorts of stylistic quirks, codes, customs, etc., but we don't follow them. We don't follow such things in other areas, either. Encyclopædias have one style, music magazines another. OmegaWikipedia insists on keeping Wikipedia articles in the style of a music magazine.
But it's in fact not just that; his insistence on keeping incorrect links and capitalisation (just one example: he insists on changing my 7" single to 7" Single; his version goes to a redirect, and is incorrectly capitalised. See also [2].) suggests that it's not about popular-music style versus Wikipedia, but his chosen style over other people's.
The Manual of style isn't topic-specific; it aims to provide a uniform style for Wikipedia articles, so that we don't have numbers or units or headers written one way in one article and another way in another.
Part of the problem, I suspect, is that a few editors with a special interest in one area of pop music have been beavering away for a while, generally unnoticed by other editors, and thus uncorrected. I've happened on the articles, started to do the normal editor's job of tidying and wikifying their style, and they've overreacted. (Actually I'm not the first; their Talk pages indicate that other editors have had the same experience with them, but were perhaps less determined not to be browbeaten and bullied away. Wikipedia doesn't have private fiefdoms, no-go areas for other editors, though, and I'm doing my best to make sure that this doesn't become (or stay) one. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 20:15, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
Just wondering: Why is it important to keep the certification level wikilinked to an article on a chemical element? --
Carnildo 21:03, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
I think that I have seen enough revert wars about popular music articles, often making differing claims about standards, that style guidelines are needed. Robert McClenon 23:29, 2 August 2005 (UTC)
There's also clearly a personal element here. For example, one of the first issues concerned the use of sections, and especially a separate section for what these two editors called "The song". I argued against (especially for very short articles), but ofered a compromise of "Song information", which other pop-music articles used. That held for a while, but they've now begun removing the heading altogether, with no explanation. Unless it's simple irrationality, the only reason would seem to be that I put the heading there. Other pages (such as List of number-one hits (United States) and Talk:List of artists who reached number one on the Hot 100 (US) provide more evidence of this. I'm beginning to think that an RfC on the pair is the only way forward. -- Mel Etitis ( Μελ Ετητης) 13:31, 4 August 2005 (UTC)
Before you throw a tantrum and cause drama, I went through each edit since the unprotection and kept most of your prose and grammer fixes and wikilinking and all that stuff. The chart section was lacking a lot of detail so I added that back in and Ultimate Star Wars Fans had a better lead than you. But other than that, I didnt touch the grammar, so dont you dare accuse me of that. And I deconverted the conversion. OmegaWikipedia 06:58, 16 September 2005 (UTC)
This article has been protected forever and ever, and there's no discussion for ages and ages and ages, so I unprotected. Be nice. -- Tony Sidaway Talk 23:03, 27 September 2005 (UTC)
It should say "bikini" rather than swimsuit because of her nickname, Bikini Girl. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Labellesanslebete ( talk • contribs) 23:03, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Blackjacks101 ( talk) 13:49, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
Since I see that there was a miscommunication, I'll gladly step in to review it.-- Blackjacks101 ( talk) 13:49, 13 March 2011 (UTC)
Wow great article to easily read through! It was terrific! Just one problem, the image of Carey performing Someday is being nominated for deletion, you may want to remove it. (Which sucks since it fits in perfectly). Yet other than that everything looks good!-- Blackjacks101 ( talk) 13:34, 14 March 2011 (UTC)
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Cheers.— cyberbot II Talk to my owner:Online 05:00, 11 January 2016 (UTC)
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 19:51, 31 December 2017 (UTC)
There's no section on Covers of this song. I know Mariah Carey has done numerous live versions herself but its interesting to see and hear other artists' interpretations/renditions. It could be thats it's not a heavily covered song but it would be nice to catalog the ones out there. For example recently in or around December 2023, Jennifer Hudson did a gospel tinged cover of the song during the Grio? awards. 71.178.185.35 ( talk) 20:34, 7 December 2023 (UTC)