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IMPORTANT NOTE
This article, and this talk page, is about the life and general biography of Vince Foster.
Theories of Foster's death go into Death of Vince Foster, and discussion of their editing into Talk:Death of Vince Foster.
An archive of this talk page's discussions on his death, before the split was done, is here.
I accidentally created a Vincent Foster article, which overlaps with Vince Foster. I suggest the 2 articles be consolidated into one article with a REDIRECT from the other.
Which form of his name is better for the article, Vincent or Vince? Ed Poor [09:13, 1 May 2002]
I don't think I've ever seen "Vincent" in any newspaper headline I remember. I clearly remember the news anchors calling him "Vince" pretty exclusively. --LDC [09:49, 1 May 2002 Lee Daniel Crocker]
Is there any way of getting a hold of Vince Foster's bar exam, now that he's dead? Surely the results still exist, unless passing the bar is mostly a matter of getting a pat on the shoulder, and then any evidence to the contrary, or that he was unfit to practice law, is immediately destroyed?
Set up an "Early Life" section stating Foster acheived the highest bar exam results of his class. Because the reference material is so vague, I cannot say for certain whether or not the bar exam results reflected the highest in AR history or just his class so I have elected to go with the latter. The section will be expanded as I add more information on Foster's relationship with his mother, wife and children, as well as his initial meeting with Bill Clinton and later dealings with Hillary Clinton at the Rose Law Firm in Little Rock. -- BadMojoDE 01:07, 17 November 2005 (UTC)
In reference to his bar exam score, the reference is a congressional speech, reading from a newspaper account. While the accuracy of the reading could be questioned (we all make mistakes when reading aloud), but what was recorded is this:
...He graduated first in his class in law school at Fayetteville. He made the highest score on the Arkansas bar exam...
I wonder if the statement means that he made a perfect score (highest score possible). Is this even possible/plausible? -- Leatherwing 19:42, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
Although the article generally is pretty good, and remarkably fair for one of a political figure, somebody could delve into the question of avoiding the draft by slipping into a reserve component (which generally you had to have some influence to do because so many boys were doing that) as a departure to what is later described as Foster's ultra-high ethics. Would a person with extremely high ethics dodge the draft while knowing some other boy, with less money and less brainpower than Foster had, would have to serve in his stead? In other words, the article sets out a sort of internal ethical dichotomy which it doesn't resolve. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.44.233.118 ( talk) 23:37, 21 May 2017 (UTC)
This is an excerpt from Carl Bernstein's new book on Hillary, printed in the Sunday Times. This piece deals specifically with Foster.
{{
cite news}}
: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors=
(
help)- Crockspot 17:12, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
This article is badly out of balance, with little on Foster's life and accomplishments and much on speculation about his death. The latter material should be split into a separate article, Death of Vince Foster, similar to some of the other articles that are found in Category:Deaths by person. Then more can be done on Foster himself, without getting caught up in edit battles among theorists. Wasted Time R 19:14, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
Thanks, Wasted Time. I think that's a great improvement. Along those lines, is it POV to say in the opening lines of the article, "Foster committed suicide in Fort Marcy Park in Virginia" or something of that nature instead of the cryptic line that's there now (his death was ruled a suicide, but...)? 149.175.22.189 ( talk) 02:43, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
"He was the target of several hostile Wall Street Journal editorials."
A reference to such an accessible primary source should have a citation.
Wasted Time, your idea to split the articles was brilliant. You are a Wiki-visionary, but will you do the grunt work of digging up an old citation? The Wiki community depends on it.
User:Cuong:Cuong 12:49, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
I've removed 3 references to a rotten.com article. Rotten.com is not a reliable source, and while it may belong in the external links section of articles, it can't be used to source our articles. -- Xyzzyplugh ( talk) 19:31, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
<death theories elided> Erectile Dysfunctional ( talk) 13:39, 3 May 2008 (UTC)
No, the most significant aspect is how the pressures of the Washington political arena got to an Arkansas lawyer and caused him to fall into depression and suicide. Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
--In any case, to avoid this article getting overwhelmed by theories about his death, we have the Death of Vince Foster article (which subsequently got renamed by others to Suicide of Vince Foster). Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC).
This article is about his life. Consider it the answer to the famous Wall Street Journal question, "Who is Vincent Foster?" Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
More importantly, this is how Wikipedia generally treats this kind of thing. Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
For example, the September 11 attacks article is written stating as fact, as confirmed by multiple official government investigations, that al-Qaeda perpetuated the attacks. There is only a brief mention of conspiracy theories and a link to the 9/11 conspiracy theories articles. Those theories are restricted to being described there, and people who try to introduce them into the main September 11 article are reverted. The same principle is being used here. You object to use of the term "conspiracy theory" in this case, but when multiple official investigations all reach the same conclusion, especially one in which it would have been politically convenient for the investigator (Starr) to do otherwise, and opponents to the conclusion allege "a widespread cover-up" (your words re Rodriguez), Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
...that's pretty much the definition of a conspiracy theory. Accordingly, I'm reverting back your changes here. Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
Regarding continual attempts to expunge any and all references to a very large mass of opposition the Fiske and Starr conclusions with a single throw-away "conspiracy theorists" line, I relay the following from my talk page:
For instance that there was no blood on his hand and the gun, so it could not really have been a suicide. http://whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/POLITICS/FOSTER_COVERUP/foster.php —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.16.97.247 ( talk) 16:16, 17 April 2011 (UTC)
I'm no expert on this case but the term "clinical depression" has a specific definition. Can anybody produce information proving that Foster was diagnosed with depression? If not then this statement needs to be removed. BoyintheMachine ( talk) 01:08, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
This section list five investigations but says "three". Were two of them unofficial in some sense, or should the "three" be changed to a "five"? 71.197.166.72 ( talk) 09:02, 4 April 2016 (UTC)
It seems to me that the following sentences in the lead strongly imply that there was a cover up about his suicide:
'At the White House he was unhappy with work in politics and spiraled into depression. According to official sources he committed suicide. However, his suicide remains disputed by several theories.'
This seems to be placing undue weight on dubious conspiracy theories when there are a large number of reliable sources stating he commited suicide. I suggest the above sentences are replaced with the following:
'At the White House he was unhappy with work in politics and spiralled into depression, which subsequently ended in his suicide.'
-- Wgsimon ( talk) 15:57, 24 May 2016 (UTC)
The lead right now reads like "Vince committed suicide AND FIVE GOVERNMENT INVESTIGATIONS CONFIRMED IT." This is an oviously poor scrubbing of an strong controversy. Why did five investigations need to be done? -- Nanite ( talk) 13:57, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
Hillarious Style - Are all these just coincidence? From Vince Foster to the recent Dr. Dean Lorich? Easeltine ( talk) 16:57, 23 February 2018 (UTC)
Since Bill Clinton was 1.5 years his junior, and moved away sometime in 1950 (per Bill Clinton's page), Foster could only have known Clinton for approx. 4 of his first five years. if you can ascertain exactly when Clinton moved, you can make a more accurate statement of how long they knew each other, but eight is certainly wrong. Login54321 ( talk) 21:28, 18 July 2017 (UTC)
I have removed discussion of a conspiracy theory about his death from this article; by consensus, discussion of those conspiracy theories belong over at Suicide of Vince Foster. NorthBySouthBaranof ( talk) 02:21, 2 July 2018 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 22:53, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
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Why does it call his death a suicide in the article??? Someone should fix this! He was murdered by Bill Clinton! WTF people!? 79.106.203.59 ( talk) 10:34, 31 October 2023 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
IMPORTANT NOTE
This article, and this talk page, is about the life and general biography of Vince Foster.
Theories of Foster's death go into Death of Vince Foster, and discussion of their editing into Talk:Death of Vince Foster.
An archive of this talk page's discussions on his death, before the split was done, is here.
I accidentally created a Vincent Foster article, which overlaps with Vince Foster. I suggest the 2 articles be consolidated into one article with a REDIRECT from the other.
Which form of his name is better for the article, Vincent or Vince? Ed Poor [09:13, 1 May 2002]
I don't think I've ever seen "Vincent" in any newspaper headline I remember. I clearly remember the news anchors calling him "Vince" pretty exclusively. --LDC [09:49, 1 May 2002 Lee Daniel Crocker]
Is there any way of getting a hold of Vince Foster's bar exam, now that he's dead? Surely the results still exist, unless passing the bar is mostly a matter of getting a pat on the shoulder, and then any evidence to the contrary, or that he was unfit to practice law, is immediately destroyed?
Set up an "Early Life" section stating Foster acheived the highest bar exam results of his class. Because the reference material is so vague, I cannot say for certain whether or not the bar exam results reflected the highest in AR history or just his class so I have elected to go with the latter. The section will be expanded as I add more information on Foster's relationship with his mother, wife and children, as well as his initial meeting with Bill Clinton and later dealings with Hillary Clinton at the Rose Law Firm in Little Rock. -- BadMojoDE 01:07, 17 November 2005 (UTC)
In reference to his bar exam score, the reference is a congressional speech, reading from a newspaper account. While the accuracy of the reading could be questioned (we all make mistakes when reading aloud), but what was recorded is this:
...He graduated first in his class in law school at Fayetteville. He made the highest score on the Arkansas bar exam...
I wonder if the statement means that he made a perfect score (highest score possible). Is this even possible/plausible? -- Leatherwing 19:42, 6 November 2007 (UTC)
Although the article generally is pretty good, and remarkably fair for one of a political figure, somebody could delve into the question of avoiding the draft by slipping into a reserve component (which generally you had to have some influence to do because so many boys were doing that) as a departure to what is later described as Foster's ultra-high ethics. Would a person with extremely high ethics dodge the draft while knowing some other boy, with less money and less brainpower than Foster had, would have to serve in his stead? In other words, the article sets out a sort of internal ethical dichotomy which it doesn't resolve. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.44.233.118 ( talk) 23:37, 21 May 2017 (UTC)
This is an excerpt from Carl Bernstein's new book on Hillary, printed in the Sunday Times. This piece deals specifically with Foster.
{{
cite news}}
: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors=
(
help)- Crockspot 17:12, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
This article is badly out of balance, with little on Foster's life and accomplishments and much on speculation about his death. The latter material should be split into a separate article, Death of Vince Foster, similar to some of the other articles that are found in Category:Deaths by person. Then more can be done on Foster himself, without getting caught up in edit battles among theorists. Wasted Time R 19:14, 22 July 2007 (UTC)
Thanks, Wasted Time. I think that's a great improvement. Along those lines, is it POV to say in the opening lines of the article, "Foster committed suicide in Fort Marcy Park in Virginia" or something of that nature instead of the cryptic line that's there now (his death was ruled a suicide, but...)? 149.175.22.189 ( talk) 02:43, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
"He was the target of several hostile Wall Street Journal editorials."
A reference to such an accessible primary source should have a citation.
Wasted Time, your idea to split the articles was brilliant. You are a Wiki-visionary, but will you do the grunt work of digging up an old citation? The Wiki community depends on it.
User:Cuong:Cuong 12:49, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
I've removed 3 references to a rotten.com article. Rotten.com is not a reliable source, and while it may belong in the external links section of articles, it can't be used to source our articles. -- Xyzzyplugh ( talk) 19:31, 15 March 2008 (UTC)
<death theories elided> Erectile Dysfunctional ( talk) 13:39, 3 May 2008 (UTC)
No, the most significant aspect is how the pressures of the Washington political arena got to an Arkansas lawyer and caused him to fall into depression and suicide. Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
--In any case, to avoid this article getting overwhelmed by theories about his death, we have the Death of Vince Foster article (which subsequently got renamed by others to Suicide of Vince Foster). Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC).
This article is about his life. Consider it the answer to the famous Wall Street Journal question, "Who is Vincent Foster?" Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
More importantly, this is how Wikipedia generally treats this kind of thing. Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
For example, the September 11 attacks article is written stating as fact, as confirmed by multiple official government investigations, that al-Qaeda perpetuated the attacks. There is only a brief mention of conspiracy theories and a link to the 9/11 conspiracy theories articles. Those theories are restricted to being described there, and people who try to introduce them into the main September 11 article are reverted. The same principle is being used here. You object to use of the term "conspiracy theory" in this case, but when multiple official investigations all reach the same conclusion, especially one in which it would have been politically convenient for the investigator (Starr) to do otherwise, and opponents to the conclusion allege "a widespread cover-up" (your words re Rodriguez), Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
...that's pretty much the definition of a conspiracy theory. Accordingly, I'm reverting back your changes here. Wasted Time R ( talk) 11:13, 13 January 2011 (UTC)
Regarding continual attempts to expunge any and all references to a very large mass of opposition the Fiske and Starr conclusions with a single throw-away "conspiracy theorists" line, I relay the following from my talk page:
For instance that there was no blood on his hand and the gun, so it could not really have been a suicide. http://whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/POLITICS/FOSTER_COVERUP/foster.php —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.16.97.247 ( talk) 16:16, 17 April 2011 (UTC)
I'm no expert on this case but the term "clinical depression" has a specific definition. Can anybody produce information proving that Foster was diagnosed with depression? If not then this statement needs to be removed. BoyintheMachine ( talk) 01:08, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
This section list five investigations but says "three". Were two of them unofficial in some sense, or should the "three" be changed to a "five"? 71.197.166.72 ( talk) 09:02, 4 April 2016 (UTC)
It seems to me that the following sentences in the lead strongly imply that there was a cover up about his suicide:
'At the White House he was unhappy with work in politics and spiraled into depression. According to official sources he committed suicide. However, his suicide remains disputed by several theories.'
This seems to be placing undue weight on dubious conspiracy theories when there are a large number of reliable sources stating he commited suicide. I suggest the above sentences are replaced with the following:
'At the White House he was unhappy with work in politics and spiralled into depression, which subsequently ended in his suicide.'
-- Wgsimon ( talk) 15:57, 24 May 2016 (UTC)
The lead right now reads like "Vince committed suicide AND FIVE GOVERNMENT INVESTIGATIONS CONFIRMED IT." This is an oviously poor scrubbing of an strong controversy. Why did five investigations need to be done? -- Nanite ( talk) 13:57, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
Hillarious Style - Are all these just coincidence? From Vince Foster to the recent Dr. Dean Lorich? Easeltine ( talk) 16:57, 23 February 2018 (UTC)
Since Bill Clinton was 1.5 years his junior, and moved away sometime in 1950 (per Bill Clinton's page), Foster could only have known Clinton for approx. 4 of his first five years. if you can ascertain exactly when Clinton moved, you can make a more accurate statement of how long they knew each other, but eight is certainly wrong. Login54321 ( talk) 21:28, 18 July 2017 (UTC)
I have removed discussion of a conspiracy theory about his death from this article; by consensus, discussion of those conspiracy theories belong over at Suicide of Vince Foster. NorthBySouthBaranof ( talk) 02:21, 2 July 2018 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 22:53, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. — Community Tech bot ( talk) 05:09, 18 February 2021 (UTC)
Why does it call his death a suicide in the article??? Someone should fix this! He was murdered by Bill Clinton! WTF people!? 79.106.203.59 ( talk) 10:34, 31 October 2023 (UTC)