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In the text it says the following
As a source it lists Edward Grant (1981), but does not list a page. However, when I checked pages 108–109 of said source, it points out that, after 1277, Christian scholars came to believe that "God could create or allow a vacuum beyond the world". Reading further, it appears that what the church found abhorrent was the idea of a pre-creation void, rather than the existence of a vacuum itself. I.e. their qualm was with a void that existed without a God; not with the idea that a void implied that God didn't exist. I know it's a nuance of interpretation, but the current wording in the article just makes the scholars of the time seem completely ignorant. Regards, RJH ( talk) 15:11, 24 March 2012 (UTC)
Should this just be tossed?? (see gauge pressure under "pressure measurement)
Vacuum is measured in absolute terms with the "highest vacuum pressure" = 1 atm BY DEFINITION. On Jupiter, a new definition of atm pressure could be used. Any pressure below the defined "atm" on Jupiter might be considered a vacuum. This is not the same as "relative versus absolute" which is normally associated with systems where vacuum is measured as a negative pressure (relative to atm or "gauge pressure" see pressure measurement).
Bubsir ( talk) 04:01, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
Hi All, I just removed a poorly phrased reference to the Casimir effect in the quantum mechanics section. Although it is indeed often described as related to vacuum energy etc., there are also other ideas such as relativistic van der Waals forces. I am by no means an export on this, so perhaps someone can shed light on whtehter it's ipmortant to refer to the Casimir effiect here. At least it should then be properly phrased including caveats. WijzeWillem ( talk) 09:42, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
What is the temperature of a perfect vacuum? I assume it would be zero. 70.247.161.12 ( talk) 02:35, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
At one time, water aspirators were quite common so people have a "feel" for how strong the vacuum is. Can someone add that to the table on the main page? It can be debated, but I'd put the useful working range at from 50 torr down to around 15 torr or even 12 torr (vapor pressure of cold tap water in the winter).
Come to think of it, there is no mention of water aspirator anywhere in the main article. Add a cross-reference someplace? AdderUser ( talk) 11:18, 5 June 2014 (UTC)
This statement seems to leap out of nowhere, and not be related to the surrounding paragraphs:
What does the explanation of a clepsydra have to do with defining a vacuum? Following the link to the water clock article fails to answer this question -- the word vacuum does not appear anywhere in that otherwise interesting article. Nor does the term wine skin. Nor does the article say anything whatsoever about any kind of "suction pumps" being in any way connected with water clocks.
Either this statement requires more detail, explaining what the water clock has to do with the historical interpretation of "vacuum", or a better, more explanatory link needs to be provided, or else the statement needs to be removed from the article. As it stands now, it appears to be a non sequitur. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.95.43.249 ( talk) 20:36, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
The final sentence of this section is highly misleading, if not plain wrong. I've tagged it as Citation needed. It states:
Virtual particles by definition are not detectable by any experiment, so in what sense have they been confirmed? The end of the introduction on the Virtual particle page states explicitly that their interpretation is debated and "...it is believed virtual particles are simply a mathematical tool."
In engineering and applied physics vacuum refers to any pressure lower than atmospheric. I just added a sentence about this in the lead, but would propose to also change the first sentence to something like "Vacuum can refer to space completely devoid of mater or space with a pressure lower than atmospheric pressure.". I argue that the engineering definition is the most important one since this is the field where vacuum is used the most. I think that all books about vacuum use the low pressure definition, and I'm sure all books I have read does. Ulflund ( talk) 03:55, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
In the first paragraph there is an appropriate statement referring to the arse of a Mr. Phil England. This needs to be removed.
" Most artificial satellites operate in this region called low Earth orbit and must fire their engines every few days to maintain orbit." I find this sentence to be dubious and think it should be removed. Asgrrr ( talk) 16:03, 12 June 2016 (UTC)
The vacuum from quantum field theory is a very distinct concept from the gas vacuums discussed in the rest of the article. Obviously they are related by the idea of absence of matter, but the "quantum mechanics" section leans much too heavily on the fact that they share the same name without actually explaining how they differ. Jess ( talk) 12:35, 2 July 2016 (UTC)
How is Torr still the first column of the tables? SI units should be used as a priority. 130.83.66.46 ( talk) 09:47, 14 February 2017 (UTC)
This article is clearly going it two different directions, one for the practical considerations of a partial vacuum, and one for the theoretical concerns of a pure vacuum. The article sucks because it's so conflicted. I added a split tag, because I thought it would be taken seriously, but it's been undone with no discussion, so so much for trying to offer constructive input.
It couldn't possibly be split into two articles, both titled vacuum, with a disambiguation page? No other constructive ideas? Just revert and forget I brought the idea up? Whatever. Why bother? Let's all take a good hard look at our navels. I'll be going now. 47.32.217.164 ( talk) 03:26, 22 May 2017 (UTC)
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Vacuum is not a void. Information can not be separated from the material carrier. Transmission of information using waves in a vacuum means that a vacuum is a kind of matter. If the vacuum is not matter, it means that information can be separated from material carriers. Physics has a good experience in the study of matter, but there are certain problems in the study of information. Vacuum is a kind of matter, devoid of substance. 212.115.245.17 ( talk) 08:34, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
This section has a few issues, such as its reference to Torricelli as if he hadn't been mentioned in the article yet, questionable grammar in the second paragraph, and no references given for assertions made. I thought asking for others to take a look might be a better idea than making changes. 2603:8000:BA00:4B00:7113:D829:1CAB:41E1 ( talk) 04:16, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Vacuum article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2, 3 |
![]() | Vacuum is a former featured article candidate. Please view the links under Article milestones below to see why the nomination failed. For older candidates, please check the archive. | ||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||
Current status: Former featured article candidate |
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||
|
Priority 1 (top)
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In the text it says the following
As a source it lists Edward Grant (1981), but does not list a page. However, when I checked pages 108–109 of said source, it points out that, after 1277, Christian scholars came to believe that "God could create or allow a vacuum beyond the world". Reading further, it appears that what the church found abhorrent was the idea of a pre-creation void, rather than the existence of a vacuum itself. I.e. their qualm was with a void that existed without a God; not with the idea that a void implied that God didn't exist. I know it's a nuance of interpretation, but the current wording in the article just makes the scholars of the time seem completely ignorant. Regards, RJH ( talk) 15:11, 24 March 2012 (UTC)
Should this just be tossed?? (see gauge pressure under "pressure measurement)
Vacuum is measured in absolute terms with the "highest vacuum pressure" = 1 atm BY DEFINITION. On Jupiter, a new definition of atm pressure could be used. Any pressure below the defined "atm" on Jupiter might be considered a vacuum. This is not the same as "relative versus absolute" which is normally associated with systems where vacuum is measured as a negative pressure (relative to atm or "gauge pressure" see pressure measurement).
Bubsir ( talk) 04:01, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
Hi All, I just removed a poorly phrased reference to the Casimir effect in the quantum mechanics section. Although it is indeed often described as related to vacuum energy etc., there are also other ideas such as relativistic van der Waals forces. I am by no means an export on this, so perhaps someone can shed light on whtehter it's ipmortant to refer to the Casimir effiect here. At least it should then be properly phrased including caveats. WijzeWillem ( talk) 09:42, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
What is the temperature of a perfect vacuum? I assume it would be zero. 70.247.161.12 ( talk) 02:35, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
At one time, water aspirators were quite common so people have a "feel" for how strong the vacuum is. Can someone add that to the table on the main page? It can be debated, but I'd put the useful working range at from 50 torr down to around 15 torr or even 12 torr (vapor pressure of cold tap water in the winter).
Come to think of it, there is no mention of water aspirator anywhere in the main article. Add a cross-reference someplace? AdderUser ( talk) 11:18, 5 June 2014 (UTC)
This statement seems to leap out of nowhere, and not be related to the surrounding paragraphs:
What does the explanation of a clepsydra have to do with defining a vacuum? Following the link to the water clock article fails to answer this question -- the word vacuum does not appear anywhere in that otherwise interesting article. Nor does the term wine skin. Nor does the article say anything whatsoever about any kind of "suction pumps" being in any way connected with water clocks.
Either this statement requires more detail, explaining what the water clock has to do with the historical interpretation of "vacuum", or a better, more explanatory link needs to be provided, or else the statement needs to be removed from the article. As it stands now, it appears to be a non sequitur. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.95.43.249 ( talk) 20:36, 30 September 2014 (UTC)
The final sentence of this section is highly misleading, if not plain wrong. I've tagged it as Citation needed. It states:
Virtual particles by definition are not detectable by any experiment, so in what sense have they been confirmed? The end of the introduction on the Virtual particle page states explicitly that their interpretation is debated and "...it is believed virtual particles are simply a mathematical tool."
In engineering and applied physics vacuum refers to any pressure lower than atmospheric. I just added a sentence about this in the lead, but would propose to also change the first sentence to something like "Vacuum can refer to space completely devoid of mater or space with a pressure lower than atmospheric pressure.". I argue that the engineering definition is the most important one since this is the field where vacuum is used the most. I think that all books about vacuum use the low pressure definition, and I'm sure all books I have read does. Ulflund ( talk) 03:55, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
In the first paragraph there is an appropriate statement referring to the arse of a Mr. Phil England. This needs to be removed.
" Most artificial satellites operate in this region called low Earth orbit and must fire their engines every few days to maintain orbit." I find this sentence to be dubious and think it should be removed. Asgrrr ( talk) 16:03, 12 June 2016 (UTC)
The vacuum from quantum field theory is a very distinct concept from the gas vacuums discussed in the rest of the article. Obviously they are related by the idea of absence of matter, but the "quantum mechanics" section leans much too heavily on the fact that they share the same name without actually explaining how they differ. Jess ( talk) 12:35, 2 July 2016 (UTC)
How is Torr still the first column of the tables? SI units should be used as a priority. 130.83.66.46 ( talk) 09:47, 14 February 2017 (UTC)
This article is clearly going it two different directions, one for the practical considerations of a partial vacuum, and one for the theoretical concerns of a pure vacuum. The article sucks because it's so conflicted. I added a split tag, because I thought it would be taken seriously, but it's been undone with no discussion, so so much for trying to offer constructive input.
It couldn't possibly be split into two articles, both titled vacuum, with a disambiguation page? No other constructive ideas? Just revert and forget I brought the idea up? Whatever. Why bother? Let's all take a good hard look at our navels. I'll be going now. 47.32.217.164 ( talk) 03:26, 22 May 2017 (UTC)
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Vacuum is not a void. Information can not be separated from the material carrier. Transmission of information using waves in a vacuum means that a vacuum is a kind of matter. If the vacuum is not matter, it means that information can be separated from material carriers. Physics has a good experience in the study of matter, but there are certain problems in the study of information. Vacuum is a kind of matter, devoid of substance. 212.115.245.17 ( talk) 08:34, 24 November 2018 (UTC)
This section has a few issues, such as its reference to Torricelli as if he hadn't been mentioned in the article yet, questionable grammar in the second paragraph, and no references given for assertions made. I thought asking for others to take a look might be a better idea than making changes. 2603:8000:BA00:4B00:7113:D829:1CAB:41E1 ( talk) 04:16, 4 March 2023 (UTC)