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I think I recall that the word 'turncoat' originates from a ruse de guerre wherby soldiers are issued with uniforms that are their own country's on the inside and the enemy's uniform on the outside, for the purpose of deception. The expression turn coat comes from the act of physically turning the uniform inside out (once the soldiers have gotten to within point blank range and before opening fire). James500 ( talk) 04:35, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
I know that someone has incorporated this into the article, but I do not know for a fact that it is true. James500 ( talk) 14:16, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
I was under the impression that the term was used mostly to describe the Americans who went to the side of the British and wore their "red coats" and fought against us. MPA 00:05, 1 February 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by MPA ( talk • contribs)
Your Dictionary.com says that it is "from the notion of a coat worn right side out or inside out, according to circumstances". [5] I am not in a position to vouch for the reliability or otherwise of that site though. James500 ( talk) 04:45, 5 February 2009 (UTC)
The source that I couldn't remember was Nicholas Hobbes, Essential Militaria, Atlantic Books, 2003, ISBN 1-84354-229-3 at pp. 58 - 59:
"Words and phrases of warfare ... 'turncoat': a duke of Saxony whose lands bordered on France supposedly once dressed his men in blue coats that had a white interior, one to which they could switch when he wanted them to be thought to be acting in the French interest."
I concede that this story does sound apocryphal. James500 ( talk) 14:15, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
Surely the English Civil War example isn't proper turncoat behaviour, just trickery. The Parliamentarian soldiers had the same true allegiance all along, they just lied about it. A turncoat is surely someone who genuinely swaps sides. Tdf4638 ( talk) 23:21, 27 March 2018 (UTC)
Loyalists during the American revolution were not turncoats. They were consistently loyal to the established government. If anything, it was the patriots who were the turncoats! In any case, the United Empire Loyalists left the US in the 18th century, not during the War of 1812. Humphrey Tribble ( talk) 04:48, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
This article was nominated for deletion on 21 August 2021. The result of the discussion was keep. |
This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||
|
I think I recall that the word 'turncoat' originates from a ruse de guerre wherby soldiers are issued with uniforms that are their own country's on the inside and the enemy's uniform on the outside, for the purpose of deception. The expression turn coat comes from the act of physically turning the uniform inside out (once the soldiers have gotten to within point blank range and before opening fire). James500 ( talk) 04:35, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
I know that someone has incorporated this into the article, but I do not know for a fact that it is true. James500 ( talk) 14:16, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
I was under the impression that the term was used mostly to describe the Americans who went to the side of the British and wore their "red coats" and fought against us. MPA 00:05, 1 February 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by MPA ( talk • contribs)
Your Dictionary.com says that it is "from the notion of a coat worn right side out or inside out, according to circumstances". [5] I am not in a position to vouch for the reliability or otherwise of that site though. James500 ( talk) 04:45, 5 February 2009 (UTC)
The source that I couldn't remember was Nicholas Hobbes, Essential Militaria, Atlantic Books, 2003, ISBN 1-84354-229-3 at pp. 58 - 59:
"Words and phrases of warfare ... 'turncoat': a duke of Saxony whose lands bordered on France supposedly once dressed his men in blue coats that had a white interior, one to which they could switch when he wanted them to be thought to be acting in the French interest."
I concede that this story does sound apocryphal. James500 ( talk) 14:15, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
Surely the English Civil War example isn't proper turncoat behaviour, just trickery. The Parliamentarian soldiers had the same true allegiance all along, they just lied about it. A turncoat is surely someone who genuinely swaps sides. Tdf4638 ( talk) 23:21, 27 March 2018 (UTC)
Loyalists during the American revolution were not turncoats. They were consistently loyal to the established government. If anything, it was the patriots who were the turncoats! In any case, the United Empire Loyalists left the US in the 18th century, not during the War of 1812. Humphrey Tribble ( talk) 04:48, 17 August 2021 (UTC)