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Rather than bog down Mo7838's talk page further I'm going to continue the discussion regarding fleet here. In order to get a complete picture of the fleet that Transdev Melbourne will operate we are sorting the photographs on the commons into model, with the aim of building a fleet table for the article. What we have so far (sourced from the tender document, which may be out of date, and identified by Mo7838 here):
It seems we have a large amount of the fleet, but are also missing huge swaths. NBC:
MBL:
SmartBus:
I'm not to sure how accurate the Government list is, or if Bus Australia's is better, but I'll leave that up to someone more knowledgeable than I to work out. More work has to be done, but we have a start. Liamdavies ( talk) 14:00, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
The Bus Austrlia Fleet Lists, would be best list to use,a s there up to date, and as said elsewhere all MBL and National buses got to Transdev, as well as most Smartbuses. But I've just update fleet details anyway. MAN 16.242 ( talk)
Actually all bus operators who got route service in Melbourne are operating under government contracts. But MBL, NBC, and Smartbus Contracts are only ones that can be put to tender.
I'll re add the information I put on the main page. As Transdev, take over wants in the contract, simple as that. A read of the online tender will tell you that. And plus there is no fleet replacements happening at the moment, so there is going be no changes. MAN 16.242 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:18, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
The contract states on page 14 "Combined, the Franchise includes 49 local service routes, 122 school only service routes and the three SmartBus Orbitals routes." It then breaks down the east and west groups and states: "The Eastern Area includes 107 fare paying services for school students within metropolitan Melbourne." (page 17) and "The Western Area includes 15 fare paying services for school students within metropolitan Melbourne." (page 19) that totals 122. Liamdavies ( talk) 20:36, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
There are a lot of companies mentioned in this article. There's no description of the route network, and new routes and companies just keep getting added to the description taking over this part or that, with the parts not described. So here's some questions that I think the History section might want to address...
I know this sounds like a laundry list, and I suspect the answer is basically "some of the routes operated by National and Bus Link are being moved to a new company, because..." But the article doesn't come out and actually say that, and offers no explanation of that "because". For someone like myself in a city with a single operator, all of this is very confusing and appears to be in-universe. I think a short description of the entire network would also be very useful.
Maury Markowitz ( talk) 14:19, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
I have answered inline to make it a bit easier, but as I said earlier, Melbourne is a complicated situation. The bus routes are grandfathered to their operators (and 'owned'), this is a grouping together of the routes that can be put to public tender, and then letting them out to public tender as one group of routes, to one operator. Having said that, all the private routes use the one integrated ticketing system (one ticket is valid on all modes of transport) and all bus services are run under government contract, just a government contract that can only be renewed, or cancelled, not reassigned. Liamdavies ( talk) 16:42, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Wow, ok, that is complex. I though we had it bad because of Rob Ford! :-) But I think I understand it now. I'm going to think about this for a while and then post a version of what I think you said. If I get close, perhaps we can copy that into the body. Maury Markowitz ( talk) 17:14, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
There needs to be a mention of the other 3 depots Transdev are using, for least the short term Which are Airport West(Tullamrine Bus lines) Reservoir(Dysons) Keysbrough(Ventura) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 123.243.114.7 ( talk) 06:34, 14 August 2013 (UTC)
They do use such depots, the Drivrer handbook. Guide to Corporate Policy for Transdev Melbourne lists all depot locations. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MAN 16.242 ( talk • contribs) 05:07, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
Yes I can, I'll get around to doing it sometime this week MAN 16.242 —Preceding undated comment added 06:36, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
Just a FYI for the first comment, Keysborough isn't a short term depot, it is one of the main Transdev depots, which PTV has purchased from Ventura (or is in the process of purchasing), and is where the orbital fleet is based out of. The fleet while being based there rotates through the other smart bus depots depending on how the shifts end up. I didn't cite it (or the other depot changes) because I don't know how to cite something that isn't posted online. 122.108.113.88 ( talk) 07:19, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
What sections of WP:NOT does the list of routes violate? Quote, with supporting text from said document, and support your argument. Liamdavies ( talk) 13:26, 19 November 2013 (UTC)
An article on Paris should mention landmarks, such as the Eiffel Tower and the Louvre, but not the telephone number or street address of the "best" restaurants, nor the current price of a café au lait on the Champs-Élysées. Wikipedia is not the place to recreate content more suited to entries in hotel or culinary guides, travelogues, and the like. Notable locations may meet the inclusion criteria, but the resulting articles need not include every tourist attraction, restaurant, hotel or venue, etc. While travel guides for a city will often mention distant attractions, a Wikipedia article for a city should only list those that are actually in the city. Such details may be welcome at Wikivoyage instead.
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I responded to the 3O request made on the Eastrans page, and this was also cited in the request, so I'm putting my thoughts on both as they're similar requests. As I said over there, I don't think a bug table is necessary - listing it in prose, as it is done on the Eastrans page, makes it more readable and (in my opinion) looks better. If there is more information on the fleet, expanding that section might be helpful as well. Feel free to follow-up on my talk page if you need me. Thanks! GRUcrule ( talk) 16:46, 26 November 2013 (UTC) |
![]() | A fact from Transdev Melbourne appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 15 June 2013 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
| ![]() |
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Rather than bog down Mo7838's talk page further I'm going to continue the discussion regarding fleet here. In order to get a complete picture of the fleet that Transdev Melbourne will operate we are sorting the photographs on the commons into model, with the aim of building a fleet table for the article. What we have so far (sourced from the tender document, which may be out of date, and identified by Mo7838 here):
It seems we have a large amount of the fleet, but are also missing huge swaths. NBC:
MBL:
SmartBus:
I'm not to sure how accurate the Government list is, or if Bus Australia's is better, but I'll leave that up to someone more knowledgeable than I to work out. More work has to be done, but we have a start. Liamdavies ( talk) 14:00, 22 May 2013 (UTC)
The Bus Austrlia Fleet Lists, would be best list to use,a s there up to date, and as said elsewhere all MBL and National buses got to Transdev, as well as most Smartbuses. But I've just update fleet details anyway. MAN 16.242 ( talk)
Actually all bus operators who got route service in Melbourne are operating under government contracts. But MBL, NBC, and Smartbus Contracts are only ones that can be put to tender.
I'll re add the information I put on the main page. As Transdev, take over wants in the contract, simple as that. A read of the online tender will tell you that. And plus there is no fleet replacements happening at the moment, so there is going be no changes. MAN 16.242 ( talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:18, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
The contract states on page 14 "Combined, the Franchise includes 49 local service routes, 122 school only service routes and the three SmartBus Orbitals routes." It then breaks down the east and west groups and states: "The Eastern Area includes 107 fare paying services for school students within metropolitan Melbourne." (page 17) and "The Western Area includes 15 fare paying services for school students within metropolitan Melbourne." (page 19) that totals 122. Liamdavies ( talk) 20:36, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
There are a lot of companies mentioned in this article. There's no description of the route network, and new routes and companies just keep getting added to the description taking over this part or that, with the parts not described. So here's some questions that I think the History section might want to address...
I know this sounds like a laundry list, and I suspect the answer is basically "some of the routes operated by National and Bus Link are being moved to a new company, because..." But the article doesn't come out and actually say that, and offers no explanation of that "because". For someone like myself in a city with a single operator, all of this is very confusing and appears to be in-universe. I think a short description of the entire network would also be very useful.
Maury Markowitz ( talk) 14:19, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
I have answered inline to make it a bit easier, but as I said earlier, Melbourne is a complicated situation. The bus routes are grandfathered to their operators (and 'owned'), this is a grouping together of the routes that can be put to public tender, and then letting them out to public tender as one group of routes, to one operator. Having said that, all the private routes use the one integrated ticketing system (one ticket is valid on all modes of transport) and all bus services are run under government contract, just a government contract that can only be renewed, or cancelled, not reassigned. Liamdavies ( talk) 16:42, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
Wow, ok, that is complex. I though we had it bad because of Rob Ford! :-) But I think I understand it now. I'm going to think about this for a while and then post a version of what I think you said. If I get close, perhaps we can copy that into the body. Maury Markowitz ( talk) 17:14, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
There needs to be a mention of the other 3 depots Transdev are using, for least the short term Which are Airport West(Tullamrine Bus lines) Reservoir(Dysons) Keysbrough(Ventura) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 123.243.114.7 ( talk) 06:34, 14 August 2013 (UTC)
They do use such depots, the Drivrer handbook. Guide to Corporate Policy for Transdev Melbourne lists all depot locations. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MAN 16.242 ( talk • contribs) 05:07, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
Yes I can, I'll get around to doing it sometime this week MAN 16.242 —Preceding undated comment added 06:36, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
Just a FYI for the first comment, Keysborough isn't a short term depot, it is one of the main Transdev depots, which PTV has purchased from Ventura (or is in the process of purchasing), and is where the orbital fleet is based out of. The fleet while being based there rotates through the other smart bus depots depending on how the shifts end up. I didn't cite it (or the other depot changes) because I don't know how to cite something that isn't posted online. 122.108.113.88 ( talk) 07:19, 4 September 2013 (UTC)
What sections of WP:NOT does the list of routes violate? Quote, with supporting text from said document, and support your argument. Liamdavies ( talk) 13:26, 19 November 2013 (UTC)
An article on Paris should mention landmarks, such as the Eiffel Tower and the Louvre, but not the telephone number or street address of the "best" restaurants, nor the current price of a café au lait on the Champs-Élysées. Wikipedia is not the place to recreate content more suited to entries in hotel or culinary guides, travelogues, and the like. Notable locations may meet the inclusion criteria, but the resulting articles need not include every tourist attraction, restaurant, hotel or venue, etc. While travel guides for a city will often mention distant attractions, a Wikipedia article for a city should only list those that are actually in the city. Such details may be welcome at Wikivoyage instead.
![]() |
I responded to the 3O request made on the Eastrans page, and this was also cited in the request, so I'm putting my thoughts on both as they're similar requests. As I said over there, I don't think a bug table is necessary - listing it in prose, as it is done on the Eastrans page, makes it more readable and (in my opinion) looks better. If there is more information on the fleet, expanding that section might be helpful as well. Feel free to follow-up on my talk page if you need me. Thanks! GRUcrule ( talk) 16:46, 26 November 2013 (UTC) |