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Something needs to be added here about the fact that it was a sham match. Korchnoi lost (threw?) the first game, then the rest are dull draws. This stinks, even taking "Iron Tigran" into account.
The match was rigged. The story seems to be that there had been a private discussion among the players and Soviet chess authorities in which each of them was asked about their chances against Fischer. Korchnoi, the more honest and objective of the pair, expressed doubt while Petrosion expressed unjustified (in view of the USSR vs The Rest of the World result, showing that Fischer had his number) and self-serving confidence. The decision was made that Korchnoi would throw the match to advance Petrosion to meet Fischer. Korchnoi took the obligatory loss followed by meaningless draws and it is no surprise that it was "dull". This unjustified confidence was fully exposed in the subsequent challengers final when but for a single loss followed by three draws while Fischer recovered from a cold, Petrosian went down almost as dramatically as the two prior 6-0 matches. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jszigeti ( talk • contribs) 13:45, 21 November 2021 (UTC)
I'm afraid I can't make sense of this sentence:
Petrosian played Spassky for the world championship in 1966 (as the article says), three years after he played Botvinnik, so I'm not sure where "6 years" comes from. It's true that Botvinnik didn't claim his right to a rematch the year after he lost, but that's not what this says, of course. -- Camembert
" This led many to call his style boring, but this criticism is unfair." A rather weak comeback? -- CJWilly
I've read somewhere that Petrosian's defensive skills may have made him the hardest chessplayer to beat to date. But I don't have a reference for this. Does anyone have a reference? Bubba73 (talk), 06:45, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
Folks, This isn't about percentages of games lost but about a defensive playing style versus other playing styles. Trifunovic was also very difficult to beat. Petrosian and Trifunovic were two of the game's ablest defensive players. Playing defensively doesn't mean the opponent will win; Petrosian drew more than half his total games, a higher fraction than any other world champion. Between 1968 and 1975, Petrosian never lost more than a single game in any tournament he played in, but he drew a lot. (source: http://www.billwallchess.com/articles/petrosian_tigran.htm). Like many -- but not all -- Soviet players of his era, he would rather draw than risk a loss.
Tpkatsa ( talk) 16:25, 18 January 2021 (UTC)
Here are just three of the many references to "Iron Tiger" and "Iron Tigran": [1] [2] [3]
Botvinnik was also sometimes called "Iron" [4] but that doesn't mean that Petrosian wasn't. There are many references (409) to "Iron Tigran" in a google search. Bubba73 (talk), 23:44, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
Bubba73 (talk), 18:11, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
I have never seen the Nd7 caro kann referred to as the Petrosian-Smyslov system. I have only seen it referred to as the Smyslov, or occasionally the Karpov system. Any source on this? Perhaps its nomenclature in countries other than the US?
The article states "while trailing 3.5-1.5 (+3−1=1)" This is a bit confusing: three wins, one loss and one draw makes 3.5 points which presumably was Korchnoi's score. Better to state "while trailing 1.5-3.5" and give wins/losses/draws in brackets for BOTH players.
The article says "born in Georgia" and "lived there until the age of 9". But it described him as "Armenian", which is line with the chess mags of the 1960s and 1970s. The "-ian" ending of his surname is generally regarded as typically Armenian, e.g. Gulbenkian; likewise "-yan", e.g. Mikoyan (disambiguation). OTOH von Karajan seems to have been a descendant of one of the many Balkan-Caspian tribes, so names are not great evidence of ancestry in that region. Is there any material about Petrosian's genealogy? -- Philcha ( talk) 11:51, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
You guys crack me up. Here is a source. [6]. You can find more here. Also, His middle name, Vartanovich, means that his fathers name was Vartan. I would expect the Armenian or not discussions to be on Kasparovs entry, but not here. Good day. VartanM ( talk) 07:38, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
What exactly is the question here though? He was an Armenian born in the Georgian SSR ( Armenians in Georgia), part of the USSR. What's not clear?-- Ευπάτωρ Talk!! 23:35, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Here are some reputable newspaper references which should settle it:
Peter Ballard ( talk) 01:13, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Maybe I missed something, but it seems that this article is without appropriate attribution used in the Citizendium. The basics of the article there was founded November 2006 as a simple copy-paste from then version of this article here. I do not know where the problems like this are solved. Thanks. Okino ( talk) 17:48, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
Summing up a game between Petrosian and Spassky, Cozens makes this observation, “One watches Spassky take the initiative and mount lordly attacks on both wings. Nothing decisive emerges, and around moves 25-30 it begins to dawn that most of the good squares on the board are occupied by Petrosian’s pieces. A few more moves and Spassky can see nothing for it but to resign." -- Irving Chernev, The Chess Companion (1968)
I didn't want risk messing up the formatting syntax by trying to add it myself. One could render the name as [W.H.] Cozens, as that's probably who it was. WHPratt ( talk) 18:39, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
It certainly was WH Cozens, from his book Boris Spassky's Road to the Summit (1969); Chernev has the quote correct https://books.google.co.uk/books?redir_esc=y&id=seKBAAAAMAAJ&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=lordly DrDaveExeter ( talk) 12:30, 10 September 2021 (UTC)
Gonna add things here as I think of them, feel free to add to the list. Sasata ( talk) 05:57, 25 June 2010 (UTC)
"He seemed content drawing against weaker players and maintaining his title of Grandmaster rather than improving his chess or making an attempt at becoming World Champion."
Firstly, there is no need to maintain a GM title. Secondly, who felt that he "seemed content"?-- Jrm2007 ( talk) 22:41, 27 June 2010 (UTC)
Many years ago I read a Petrosian biography somewhere, where it was mentioned that he was deaf and wore a hearing aid, which occasionally led to strange situations during his games. E.g. I remember a story, when he offered a draw to his opponent, who quickly refused in surprise, but then changed his mind in seconds and re-offered the draw to Petrosian - however Petrosian already switched off his hearing aid in the meantime, and did not react at all, instead went ahead and won the game
I now looked around briefly, and e.g.
this article seems to indicate that Hubner once even withdrew from his candidates match against Petrosian because the location was too noisy, which bothered him, but not the deaf Petrosian
I suppose this fact would worth mentioning in the article?
Gruen (
talk) 15:08, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
Defending the title in 1966 is mentioned but a section about losing the title in 1969 should be clearly marked since it's almost not mentioned or at least appended to the section title "Reigning World Champion (1963–1969)" comon losing the title to Spassky is not worth mentioned? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.3.241.146 ( talk) 18:15, 18 January 2011 (UTC)
I don't have access to references about him, can you recommend one? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.3.241.146 ( talk) 04:05, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
At the time Tigran was active Armwenia has no sovereignty and was part of USSR therefore he was soviet-armenian world chess champion. For comparison, Tal was born to jewish parents in independent latvia in 1936 and still he is rightfully called "soveit -latvian grandmaster" by wiki.Tigran was born in USSR to armenian parents. Why I say this is because all attempts at retrospective change of history do no good as to objective understanding of truth. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.254.230.163 ( talk) 15:20, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
No mention of his being a KGB agent and how he spied on and manipulated his fellow Russian players, even to the petty extent of stealing an airline ticket off Korchnoi. I will write this up further and amend the main article when i have time. Pdcoates ( talk) 23:09, 12 October 2016 (UTC)
I don't see anything in the main article about Tigran Petrosian being banned for life from playing on the Chess.com server for using computer assistance in the final so here are a few references:
The final of the Chess.com Pro Chess League was overshadowed by a cheating incident. The Chess.com Fair Play Team came to the conclusion that the Armenian Grandmaster Tigran Petrosian, who played for the Armenian Eagles, the team that had won the finals and the tournament, had used computer assistance in the final. The Armenian Eagles were deprived of victory, and Tigran Petrosian was banned for life from playing on the Chess.com server.
Chess.com investigated the allegations and came to the conclusion that Petrosian had violated the fair play rules. Some of this games are conspicuously flawless and his moves are consistent with engine suggestions. The players were monitored by webcams during the games, but during the games Petrosian often looked down, allegedly to get access to computer assistance. Chess.com also came to the conclusion that Petrosian had used computer assistance during the semi-final matches.
Chess.com then deprived the Armenian Eagles of their victory, and declared the Saint Louis Arch Bishops the winners of the final. Tigran Petrosian's server access was deleted and he was banned for life from playing on the Chess.com server. [1]
Here is another reference:
The Eagles’ victory rested on the performance of Tigran Petrosian, an Armenian grandmaster and the world No 260, who stunned commentators with his victory over Fabiano Caruana, ranked second in the world.
Petrosian attributed his play to the gin he sipped during the game. But suspicious observers suggested he seemed to be glancing away from his screen frequently, and chess.com later overturned the team’s wins and banned him for life.
Petrosian later called the claims “idiotic, invented allegations”. He posted a lengthy rant addressed to another opponent, the world No 8 Wesley So: “You are a biggest looser [sic] I ever seen in my life! You was doing PiPi in your pampers when I was beating players much more stronger than you!… you are like a girl crying after I beat you!”
So, for his part, told the Guardian in an email that he felt sorry for Petrosian. Perhaps thinking of Lance Armstrong, he added: “I was a big fan of a certain cyclist and a part of me understands the pressure to succeed at all costs. At the same time I feel pain for other competitors ... Who will restore what was taken from them?” [2]
I will leave it to others to decide how to incorporate this information into the main article.
2600:1700:DC50:5560:107:C1C:721B:CAB0 ( talk) 03:16, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
Sorry, I did not realize when I made the post that the cheating referred to Tigran L. Petrosian. I guess the fact that Tigran Petrosian died in 1984 should have been the tip-off. LOL
2600:1700:DC50:5560:107:C1C:721B:CAB0 ( talk) 03:22, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This article is rated B-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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A graph should have been displayed here but
graphs are temporarily disabled. Until they are enabled again, visit the interactive graph at
pageviews.wmcloud.org |
![]() | A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on August 13, 2017, August 13, 2019, and August 13, 2022. |
Something needs to be added here about the fact that it was a sham match. Korchnoi lost (threw?) the first game, then the rest are dull draws. This stinks, even taking "Iron Tigran" into account.
The match was rigged. The story seems to be that there had been a private discussion among the players and Soviet chess authorities in which each of them was asked about their chances against Fischer. Korchnoi, the more honest and objective of the pair, expressed doubt while Petrosion expressed unjustified (in view of the USSR vs The Rest of the World result, showing that Fischer had his number) and self-serving confidence. The decision was made that Korchnoi would throw the match to advance Petrosion to meet Fischer. Korchnoi took the obligatory loss followed by meaningless draws and it is no surprise that it was "dull". This unjustified confidence was fully exposed in the subsequent challengers final when but for a single loss followed by three draws while Fischer recovered from a cold, Petrosian went down almost as dramatically as the two prior 6-0 matches. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jszigeti ( talk • contribs) 13:45, 21 November 2021 (UTC)
I'm afraid I can't make sense of this sentence:
Petrosian played Spassky for the world championship in 1966 (as the article says), three years after he played Botvinnik, so I'm not sure where "6 years" comes from. It's true that Botvinnik didn't claim his right to a rematch the year after he lost, but that's not what this says, of course. -- Camembert
" This led many to call his style boring, but this criticism is unfair." A rather weak comeback? -- CJWilly
I've read somewhere that Petrosian's defensive skills may have made him the hardest chessplayer to beat to date. But I don't have a reference for this. Does anyone have a reference? Bubba73 (talk), 06:45, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
Folks, This isn't about percentages of games lost but about a defensive playing style versus other playing styles. Trifunovic was also very difficult to beat. Petrosian and Trifunovic were two of the game's ablest defensive players. Playing defensively doesn't mean the opponent will win; Petrosian drew more than half his total games, a higher fraction than any other world champion. Between 1968 and 1975, Petrosian never lost more than a single game in any tournament he played in, but he drew a lot. (source: http://www.billwallchess.com/articles/petrosian_tigran.htm). Like many -- but not all -- Soviet players of his era, he would rather draw than risk a loss.
Tpkatsa ( talk) 16:25, 18 January 2021 (UTC)
Here are just three of the many references to "Iron Tiger" and "Iron Tigran": [1] [2] [3]
Botvinnik was also sometimes called "Iron" [4] but that doesn't mean that Petrosian wasn't. There are many references (409) to "Iron Tigran" in a google search. Bubba73 (talk), 23:44, 15 February 2006 (UTC)
Bubba73 (talk), 18:11, 21 February 2006 (UTC)
I have never seen the Nd7 caro kann referred to as the Petrosian-Smyslov system. I have only seen it referred to as the Smyslov, or occasionally the Karpov system. Any source on this? Perhaps its nomenclature in countries other than the US?
The article states "while trailing 3.5-1.5 (+3−1=1)" This is a bit confusing: three wins, one loss and one draw makes 3.5 points which presumably was Korchnoi's score. Better to state "while trailing 1.5-3.5" and give wins/losses/draws in brackets for BOTH players.
The article says "born in Georgia" and "lived there until the age of 9". But it described him as "Armenian", which is line with the chess mags of the 1960s and 1970s. The "-ian" ending of his surname is generally regarded as typically Armenian, e.g. Gulbenkian; likewise "-yan", e.g. Mikoyan (disambiguation). OTOH von Karajan seems to have been a descendant of one of the many Balkan-Caspian tribes, so names are not great evidence of ancestry in that region. Is there any material about Petrosian's genealogy? -- Philcha ( talk) 11:51, 22 September 2008 (UTC)
You guys crack me up. Here is a source. [6]. You can find more here. Also, His middle name, Vartanovich, means that his fathers name was Vartan. I would expect the Armenian or not discussions to be on Kasparovs entry, but not here. Good day. VartanM ( talk) 07:38, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
What exactly is the question here though? He was an Armenian born in the Georgian SSR ( Armenians in Georgia), part of the USSR. What's not clear?-- Ευπάτωρ Talk!! 23:35, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
Here are some reputable newspaper references which should settle it:
Peter Ballard ( talk) 01:13, 26 September 2008 (UTC)
Maybe I missed something, but it seems that this article is without appropriate attribution used in the Citizendium. The basics of the article there was founded November 2006 as a simple copy-paste from then version of this article here. I do not know where the problems like this are solved. Thanks. Okino ( talk) 17:48, 25 June 2009 (UTC)
Summing up a game between Petrosian and Spassky, Cozens makes this observation, “One watches Spassky take the initiative and mount lordly attacks on both wings. Nothing decisive emerges, and around moves 25-30 it begins to dawn that most of the good squares on the board are occupied by Petrosian’s pieces. A few more moves and Spassky can see nothing for it but to resign." -- Irving Chernev, The Chess Companion (1968)
I didn't want risk messing up the formatting syntax by trying to add it myself. One could render the name as [W.H.] Cozens, as that's probably who it was. WHPratt ( talk) 18:39, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
It certainly was WH Cozens, from his book Boris Spassky's Road to the Summit (1969); Chernev has the quote correct https://books.google.co.uk/books?redir_esc=y&id=seKBAAAAMAAJ&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=lordly DrDaveExeter ( talk) 12:30, 10 September 2021 (UTC)
Gonna add things here as I think of them, feel free to add to the list. Sasata ( talk) 05:57, 25 June 2010 (UTC)
"He seemed content drawing against weaker players and maintaining his title of Grandmaster rather than improving his chess or making an attempt at becoming World Champion."
Firstly, there is no need to maintain a GM title. Secondly, who felt that he "seemed content"?-- Jrm2007 ( talk) 22:41, 27 June 2010 (UTC)
Many years ago I read a Petrosian biography somewhere, where it was mentioned that he was deaf and wore a hearing aid, which occasionally led to strange situations during his games. E.g. I remember a story, when he offered a draw to his opponent, who quickly refused in surprise, but then changed his mind in seconds and re-offered the draw to Petrosian - however Petrosian already switched off his hearing aid in the meantime, and did not react at all, instead went ahead and won the game
I now looked around briefly, and e.g.
this article seems to indicate that Hubner once even withdrew from his candidates match against Petrosian because the location was too noisy, which bothered him, but not the deaf Petrosian
I suppose this fact would worth mentioning in the article?
Gruen (
talk) 15:08, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
Defending the title in 1966 is mentioned but a section about losing the title in 1969 should be clearly marked since it's almost not mentioned or at least appended to the section title "Reigning World Champion (1963–1969)" comon losing the title to Spassky is not worth mentioned? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.3.241.146 ( talk) 18:15, 18 January 2011 (UTC)
I don't have access to references about him, can you recommend one? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.3.241.146 ( talk) 04:05, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
At the time Tigran was active Armwenia has no sovereignty and was part of USSR therefore he was soviet-armenian world chess champion. For comparison, Tal was born to jewish parents in independent latvia in 1936 and still he is rightfully called "soveit -latvian grandmaster" by wiki.Tigran was born in USSR to armenian parents. Why I say this is because all attempts at retrospective change of history do no good as to objective understanding of truth. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.254.230.163 ( talk) 15:20, 15 February 2011 (UTC)
No mention of his being a KGB agent and how he spied on and manipulated his fellow Russian players, even to the petty extent of stealing an airline ticket off Korchnoi. I will write this up further and amend the main article when i have time. Pdcoates ( talk) 23:09, 12 October 2016 (UTC)
I don't see anything in the main article about Tigran Petrosian being banned for life from playing on the Chess.com server for using computer assistance in the final so here are a few references:
The final of the Chess.com Pro Chess League was overshadowed by a cheating incident. The Chess.com Fair Play Team came to the conclusion that the Armenian Grandmaster Tigran Petrosian, who played for the Armenian Eagles, the team that had won the finals and the tournament, had used computer assistance in the final. The Armenian Eagles were deprived of victory, and Tigran Petrosian was banned for life from playing on the Chess.com server.
Chess.com investigated the allegations and came to the conclusion that Petrosian had violated the fair play rules. Some of this games are conspicuously flawless and his moves are consistent with engine suggestions. The players were monitored by webcams during the games, but during the games Petrosian often looked down, allegedly to get access to computer assistance. Chess.com also came to the conclusion that Petrosian had used computer assistance during the semi-final matches.
Chess.com then deprived the Armenian Eagles of their victory, and declared the Saint Louis Arch Bishops the winners of the final. Tigran Petrosian's server access was deleted and he was banned for life from playing on the Chess.com server. [1]
Here is another reference:
The Eagles’ victory rested on the performance of Tigran Petrosian, an Armenian grandmaster and the world No 260, who stunned commentators with his victory over Fabiano Caruana, ranked second in the world.
Petrosian attributed his play to the gin he sipped during the game. But suspicious observers suggested he seemed to be glancing away from his screen frequently, and chess.com later overturned the team’s wins and banned him for life.
Petrosian later called the claims “idiotic, invented allegations”. He posted a lengthy rant addressed to another opponent, the world No 8 Wesley So: “You are a biggest looser [sic] I ever seen in my life! You was doing PiPi in your pampers when I was beating players much more stronger than you!… you are like a girl crying after I beat you!”
So, for his part, told the Guardian in an email that he felt sorry for Petrosian. Perhaps thinking of Lance Armstrong, he added: “I was a big fan of a certain cyclist and a part of me understands the pressure to succeed at all costs. At the same time I feel pain for other competitors ... Who will restore what was taken from them?” [2]
I will leave it to others to decide how to incorporate this information into the main article.
2600:1700:DC50:5560:107:C1C:721B:CAB0 ( talk) 03:16, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
Sorry, I did not realize when I made the post that the cheating referred to Tigran L. Petrosian. I guess the fact that Tigran Petrosian died in 1984 should have been the tip-off. LOL
2600:1700:DC50:5560:107:C1C:721B:CAB0 ( talk) 03:22, 21 October 2020 (UTC)