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![]() | Text and/or other creative content from this version of Thomas Bridges (Anglican missionary) was copied or moved into Missions to Patagonia with this edit on 17:59, 11 July 2011 (UTC). The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
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I query whether Thomas Bridges' birthplace is correct. I do not believe that Lucas reported Thomas' birthplace in his book. I have read another report which puts his birthplace as near Bristol. I no longer have the reference to that source.
However, the UK census returns for the years 1841 to 1881 inclusive do not have a Thomas Bridges, nor anyone with the surname Despard in Lenton or Nottingham. There is however a concentration of Despards in Clifton, Bristol but no Thomas or George Despard.
Thomas Bridges' marriage certificate gives his residence as Bristol but that would only have related to his residence during the period of the banns i.e. on return from south America.
There were 5 children. Despard is missing from this list.
The first building was known as the Mission rather than the church and was built in 1869 whilst Thomas's wife Mary was still in the Falklands. The area where the mission stood is still known in Ushuaia as The Mission. No trace of the original building remains. FHBridges ( talk) 16:11, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
To help confirm the location I have searched the UK bmd register for the marriage of George DESPARD. The only hit is the marriage of George Pakenham DESPARD to Emily COFFIN at Westbury-on-Trym Glos. 31st May 1841 (Source BMD register Clifton Vol 11 Page 350). Westbury-on-Trym and Clifton are adjacent areas and today are suburbs of Bristol. Have ordered a copy of the cert. FHBridges
George Pakenham DESPARD was curate at Lenton (Source: Lenton Times Issue 7). FHBridges ( talk) 14:22, 2 February 2009 (UTC)
The Lenton Times article states the GPD was curate in the 1850s. I note that Lucas refers to GPD as pastor. Pastor is a generic term, curate is more specific.
GPD lived at Westbury-on-Trym (Bristol) at least from 1841 until 1849. He was married there in 1841 and six of his children were christened there viz. John Coffin D. 1842, Emilia Georgina D. 1844, Bertha Frobisher D. 1845, Florence Elizabeth Martland D. 1847, Harriet Emma Osborne D. 1848 and Emilius Pakenham D. 1849. (Source BMD register eg Clifton Vol xi Page 296). I think this confirms, as the article now states, that Thos. joined the family in Bristol not Lenton.
(Pakenham is the name of a village in Suffolk and also the family name of the Earls of Longford.)
Lucas records that GPD had 3 daughters and a son. Possibly one boy and one girl died young so that Thos. had no recollection of them.
Lucas states on p40 that Thos. was adopted by GPD, but on p47 he refers to the Despards as his foster-parents. I think the second reference is probably the more precise. In the UK it is customary for adoptees to take the name of the family which adopts them; whereas fostered children normally retain their own names. FHBridges ( talk) 15:15, 3 February 2009 (UTC)
Jimmy Burns in 'Beyond the Silver River: South American Encounters' states 'In 1851 GPD found a baby boy ... abandoned on a small footbridge in Bristol. There were no messages or documents on the child but he was dressed in an immaculate frock and around his neck was a locket engraved with the letter T. GPD decided that the child was a catholic and from a rich family and adopted him. He christened him Thomas. The boy was eventually told the circumstances of his adoption and chose for himself the surname Bridges in memory of the meeting that had saved his life'. There are some obviously questionable items in this report. Firstly the date must have been about 1842 not 1851. Why did GPD conclude that the boy was a catholic (GPD was Anglican)and what is the relevance? Was Thomas christened or simply named? I find records of the christenings of GPD's natural children but not Thomas. 92.7.46.104 ( talk) 16:20, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
To confirm that GPD's children John Coffin D. died in 1842 and Emilia Georgina D. died in 1849, ie before GPD's expedition to South America. FHBridges ( talk) 16:36, 9 February 2009 (UTC)
Correction: It was not daughter Emilia who died in 1849 it was GPD's wife Emily. FHBridges ( talk) 16:08, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
The 1851 UK census has GPD as head of household and Chaplain to the Christian Union, Redland, Bristol. That must surely be an orphanage not a private school. There are 5 of his children in the household viz: daughters Elilia, Bertha, Florence, Harriet and son Emilius. Also various pupils and staff. There is no Thomas Bridges or Thomas anybody. BUT there IS a pupil George H Bridges aged 11, so born about 1840. Interestingly the name above George H Bridges is George H Pope. Did the person taking the census get it wrong? Is that Thomas? FHBridges ( talk) 16:08, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
Correction: GPD was Chaplain of the Clifton Union not the Christian Union. The Clifton Union was the workhouse but was not at Redland. GPD appears also to have been running a private school at home where George H Bridges (or was it Thomas Bridges) was a pupil. FHBridges ( talk) 16:35, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
GPD remarried in 1854 at Keynsham (source: UK BMD Register Keynsham 5c p 1101). Presumably it was his second wife who accompanied him to the Falkland Islands in 1856. FHBridges ( talk) 16:51, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
Lucas records the ship carrying his parents to the Falklands after their marriage as S.S. Onega whereas the display board in Harberton church records it as the S.S. Oneida. FHBridges ( talk) 17:13, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
I am making major changes to this article at my sandbox. Ryan Vesey ( talk) 15:07, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
I have been asked to provide a review of the article and assist with thoughts on writing the lead.
Writing the lead
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer:
Quadell (
talk ·
contribs)
19:33, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
Nominator:
Ryan Vesey
Rate | Attribute | Review Comment |
---|---|---|
1. Well-written: | ||
![]() |
1a. the prose is clear, concise, and understandable to an appropriately broad audience; spelling and grammar are correct. | Issues identified below. |
![]() |
1b. it complies with the Manual of Style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation. | Issues identified below. |
2. Verifiable with no original research: | ||
![]() |
2a. it contains a list of all references (sources of information), presented in accordance with the layout style guideline. | The "References" section is fine. |
![]() |
2b. reliable sources are cited inline. All content that could reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose). | Issues identified below. This is the biggest problem with the article. |
![]() |
2c. it contains no original research. | Since so much is unsourced, I can't tell. |
3. Broad in its coverage: | ||
![]() |
3a. it addresses the main aspects of the topic. | Not a problem. |
![]() |
3b. it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style). | Not a problem. |
![]() |
4. Neutral: it represents viewpoints fairly and without editorial bias, giving due weight to each. | Not a problem. |
![]() |
5. Stable: it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute. | Not a problem. |
6. Illustrated, if possible, by media such as images, video, or audio: | ||
![]() |
6a. media are tagged with their copyright statuses, and valid non-free use rationales are provided for non-free content. | Issue identified below. |
![]() |
6b. media are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions. | Not a problem. |
![]() |
7. Overall assessment. |
{{
PD-old-70}}
would be fine though.I understand the nominator is on Wikibreak. I'm going to close this as a non-successful nomination at this time. If you later fix these problems, feel free to renominate. – Quadell ( talk) 13:08, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
This source seems great. Ryan Vesey 15:25, 5 August 2012 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Thomas Bridges (missionary) article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | Thomas Bridges (missionary) was a Philosophy and religion good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. | |||||||||
|
![]() | Text and/or other creative content from this version of Thomas Bridges (Anglican missionary) was copied or moved into Missions to Patagonia with this edit on 17:59, 11 July 2011 (UTC). The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
I query whether Thomas Bridges' birthplace is correct. I do not believe that Lucas reported Thomas' birthplace in his book. I have read another report which puts his birthplace as near Bristol. I no longer have the reference to that source.
However, the UK census returns for the years 1841 to 1881 inclusive do not have a Thomas Bridges, nor anyone with the surname Despard in Lenton or Nottingham. There is however a concentration of Despards in Clifton, Bristol but no Thomas or George Despard.
Thomas Bridges' marriage certificate gives his residence as Bristol but that would only have related to his residence during the period of the banns i.e. on return from south America.
There were 5 children. Despard is missing from this list.
The first building was known as the Mission rather than the church and was built in 1869 whilst Thomas's wife Mary was still in the Falklands. The area where the mission stood is still known in Ushuaia as The Mission. No trace of the original building remains. FHBridges ( talk) 16:11, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
To help confirm the location I have searched the UK bmd register for the marriage of George DESPARD. The only hit is the marriage of George Pakenham DESPARD to Emily COFFIN at Westbury-on-Trym Glos. 31st May 1841 (Source BMD register Clifton Vol 11 Page 350). Westbury-on-Trym and Clifton are adjacent areas and today are suburbs of Bristol. Have ordered a copy of the cert. FHBridges
George Pakenham DESPARD was curate at Lenton (Source: Lenton Times Issue 7). FHBridges ( talk) 14:22, 2 February 2009 (UTC)
The Lenton Times article states the GPD was curate in the 1850s. I note that Lucas refers to GPD as pastor. Pastor is a generic term, curate is more specific.
GPD lived at Westbury-on-Trym (Bristol) at least from 1841 until 1849. He was married there in 1841 and six of his children were christened there viz. John Coffin D. 1842, Emilia Georgina D. 1844, Bertha Frobisher D. 1845, Florence Elizabeth Martland D. 1847, Harriet Emma Osborne D. 1848 and Emilius Pakenham D. 1849. (Source BMD register eg Clifton Vol xi Page 296). I think this confirms, as the article now states, that Thos. joined the family in Bristol not Lenton.
(Pakenham is the name of a village in Suffolk and also the family name of the Earls of Longford.)
Lucas records that GPD had 3 daughters and a son. Possibly one boy and one girl died young so that Thos. had no recollection of them.
Lucas states on p40 that Thos. was adopted by GPD, but on p47 he refers to the Despards as his foster-parents. I think the second reference is probably the more precise. In the UK it is customary for adoptees to take the name of the family which adopts them; whereas fostered children normally retain their own names. FHBridges ( talk) 15:15, 3 February 2009 (UTC)
Jimmy Burns in 'Beyond the Silver River: South American Encounters' states 'In 1851 GPD found a baby boy ... abandoned on a small footbridge in Bristol. There were no messages or documents on the child but he was dressed in an immaculate frock and around his neck was a locket engraved with the letter T. GPD decided that the child was a catholic and from a rich family and adopted him. He christened him Thomas. The boy was eventually told the circumstances of his adoption and chose for himself the surname Bridges in memory of the meeting that had saved his life'. There are some obviously questionable items in this report. Firstly the date must have been about 1842 not 1851. Why did GPD conclude that the boy was a catholic (GPD was Anglican)and what is the relevance? Was Thomas christened or simply named? I find records of the christenings of GPD's natural children but not Thomas. 92.7.46.104 ( talk) 16:20, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
To confirm that GPD's children John Coffin D. died in 1842 and Emilia Georgina D. died in 1849, ie before GPD's expedition to South America. FHBridges ( talk) 16:36, 9 February 2009 (UTC)
Correction: It was not daughter Emilia who died in 1849 it was GPD's wife Emily. FHBridges ( talk) 16:08, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
The 1851 UK census has GPD as head of household and Chaplain to the Christian Union, Redland, Bristol. That must surely be an orphanage not a private school. There are 5 of his children in the household viz: daughters Elilia, Bertha, Florence, Harriet and son Emilius. Also various pupils and staff. There is no Thomas Bridges or Thomas anybody. BUT there IS a pupil George H Bridges aged 11, so born about 1840. Interestingly the name above George H Bridges is George H Pope. Did the person taking the census get it wrong? Is that Thomas? FHBridges ( talk) 16:08, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
Correction: GPD was Chaplain of the Clifton Union not the Christian Union. The Clifton Union was the workhouse but was not at Redland. GPD appears also to have been running a private school at home where George H Bridges (or was it Thomas Bridges) was a pupil. FHBridges ( talk) 16:35, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
GPD remarried in 1854 at Keynsham (source: UK BMD Register Keynsham 5c p 1101). Presumably it was his second wife who accompanied him to the Falkland Islands in 1856. FHBridges ( talk) 16:51, 3 March 2009 (UTC)
Lucas records the ship carrying his parents to the Falklands after their marriage as S.S. Onega whereas the display board in Harberton church records it as the S.S. Oneida. FHBridges ( talk) 17:13, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
I am making major changes to this article at my sandbox. Ryan Vesey ( talk) 15:07, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
I have been asked to provide a review of the article and assist with thoughts on writing the lead.
Writing the lead
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer:
Quadell (
talk ·
contribs)
19:33, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
Nominator:
Ryan Vesey
Rate | Attribute | Review Comment |
---|---|---|
1. Well-written: | ||
![]() |
1a. the prose is clear, concise, and understandable to an appropriately broad audience; spelling and grammar are correct. | Issues identified below. |
![]() |
1b. it complies with the Manual of Style guidelines for lead sections, layout, words to watch, fiction, and list incorporation. | Issues identified below. |
2. Verifiable with no original research: | ||
![]() |
2a. it contains a list of all references (sources of information), presented in accordance with the layout style guideline. | The "References" section is fine. |
![]() |
2b. reliable sources are cited inline. All content that could reasonably be challenged, except for plot summaries and that which summarizes cited content elsewhere in the article, must be cited no later than the end of the paragraph (or line if the content is not in prose). | Issues identified below. This is the biggest problem with the article. |
![]() |
2c. it contains no original research. | Since so much is unsourced, I can't tell. |
3. Broad in its coverage: | ||
![]() |
3a. it addresses the main aspects of the topic. | Not a problem. |
![]() |
3b. it stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail (see summary style). | Not a problem. |
![]() |
4. Neutral: it represents viewpoints fairly and without editorial bias, giving due weight to each. | Not a problem. |
![]() |
5. Stable: it does not change significantly from day to day because of an ongoing edit war or content dispute. | Not a problem. |
6. Illustrated, if possible, by media such as images, video, or audio: | ||
![]() |
6a. media are tagged with their copyright statuses, and valid non-free use rationales are provided for non-free content. | Issue identified below. |
![]() |
6b. media are relevant to the topic, and have suitable captions. | Not a problem. |
![]() |
7. Overall assessment. |
{{
PD-old-70}}
would be fine though.I understand the nominator is on Wikibreak. I'm going to close this as a non-successful nomination at this time. If you later fix these problems, feel free to renominate. – Quadell ( talk) 13:08, 19 October 2011 (UTC)
This source seems great. Ryan Vesey 15:25, 5 August 2012 (UTC)