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A
fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the "
Did you know?" column on
July 14, 2015. The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that in his
tone poem
The Oceanides, Finnish composer
Jean Sibelius "applied the
impressionist method of scoring to the bass instruments, thereby achieving effects of sonority hitherto unknown"? | |||||||||||||
Current status: Featured article |
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Hello, fellow Sibelian and welcome to the wonderful world of the Sibelius tone poems! I am sure we are of one mind: the 13 Sibelius examples in this form represent, along with his seven symphonies and the violin concerto, the height of his orchestral powers. As such, I have taken the liberty over the last year of giving some of these tone poems (namely, The Wood Nymph and The Oceanides) the expanded treatment I think they deserve.
As part of this expansion project, I have added infoboxes onto each of the tone poem pages (save for Finlandia and Luonnotar and two that don't yet exist, The Dryad and Pan and Echo) to assist our readers in having the most important information about each piece at their fingertips. I feel that standardization of infobox information and form is something we should strive to maintain among these pieces, and as such, I suggest that any changes be agreed to by the community. If you're interested, I have the following opinions:
Okay, thanks for reading! If you are so inclined to add the infobox to the seven symphonies (or the four tone poems mentioned above) or some of his incidental music, please be my guest. My focus, for now, is on the tone poems.
Sgvrfjs ( talk) 18:22, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
Note: I have included this message on the talk pages of each of the existing tone poems that have infoboxes.
One of the most notable recodings of The Oceanides (all three versions of the work) is included in the 2003 album BIS-CD-1445 Rondo of the Waves [1] with Osmo Vänskä conducting the Lahti Symphony Orchestra. See, for example, the review by Andrew Clements of the Guardian who calls it the best album of the year as well as the very positive Gramophone magazine review. See also the Google translation of [2] which also mentions acclaim by Matthew Rye of the Daily Telegraph. I think it should be included in the table, perhaps with appropriate comments in the text.-- Ipigott ( talk) 09:13, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
Hi, Ipigott. In my haste, I think my writing has perhaps been less than clear, and if so, I apologize. Please allow me a second chance to explain the decisions I made when constructing the discography table. 1) In the table, all recording are of the final version of The Oceanides. So as to avoid confusion, the intermediate versions recorded by Vanska in 2003 are left out. The list is, to my knowledge (after extensive online research), more or less, complete. 2) The dates that appear in the third column are to the best of my knowledge all dates of first recording rather than dates of CD release. Why my preference for the former over the latter? In my mind, date of recording is more important because it shows when the recording first appeared, and thus, when this particular interpretation of The Oceanides first became a part of the 'discussion' (by which I mean was available for listeners and even subsequent conductors to hear). Even more importantly, consider the example of Sir Adrian Boult. The recording date is 1936 (first recording ever, and on a LP), whereas the CD that we can today purchase the recording on was released in 2007. To my mind, the more essential date is clearly 1936 rather than 2007. 3) Following this logic, then, and for consistency purposes in a table, I listed the dates of first recording for all conductors. 4) Vanska first recorded the final version of The Oceanides in 2000, and the CD was released that year. Later, in 2003, this recording was re-released on the Rondo of the Waves CD we have been focused on, as an accompaniment to the interminate version recordings from 2003. 5) You might disagree and think the release date is still more important, to which I would only counter with one other point that I'm sure you're obviously well aware of: release dates in classical music are in my mind pretty meaningless because a single recording might be reissued and reissued and reissued a handful of times. Thus, any release date listed in the table would be arbitrary. 6) Which leads me to my final point: perhaps you are on board with using the date of first recording in the table, but don't like how the links I provided to the CD sometimes doesn't contain this recording date. To this point I concede that I just sought to find a CD a given recording was on, rather than its first issue. I didn't have the time or the resources to dig that deep. 7) The AVAILABLE ON column, then, merely is designed to give the reader a CD upon which to find the recording, not necessarily its first. 8) Perhaps you'd rather me provide a link for the Vanska final version to the CD from 2000 rather than the 2003 release. If this would solve the problem, I am happy to do so. 9) For clarity purposes, I have altered the title of column three in the table from YEAR to RECORDED, so that it is obvious to readers that the years listed are not for the CD release. Again, I apologize if I still have not addressed your concerns; the weaknesses of comprehension are entirely my own fault, but please know that I have tried to be accommodating and a team-player. Happy editing! :) Sgvrfjs ( talk) 07:14, 16 July 2015 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Tim riley ( talk · contribs) 20:44, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
Starting first read-through. More in the next day or so.
Tim riley
talk
20:44, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
This is an impressive piece of work, resourcefully written to be useful to the lay person and the trained musician alike. A few suggestions that you might like to ponder:
Please consider these points, and we can then take the review forward. At your service if you have any questions. – Tim riley talk 17:24, 26 July 2015 (UTC)
We progress admirably. Everything above is now entirely satisfactory for GA. The resurrected (renewed apoologies!) discography table needs attention. You could either stop it being sortable, or you could make the conductors sortable by surname (rather than, as at present, by given name, which really won't do.) For GA an unsortable table will be perfectly adequate. If you want to go further then you'll need to add the necessary coding to sort by surname. I'm not the one to help you with this, being chronically inept with tables, but Gerda may be able to help, and if she can't I know a very friendly editor who is a whizz in this department. And that, I think, will do for GA. I look forward to cutting the ribbon very soon. Tim riley talk 20:46, 26 July 2015 (UTC)
As above, I'll offer further suggestions on the drafting on the talk page. For now it's my task to pronounce on whether the article as it stands is of GA quality. I have no doubt at all that it is, and therefore:
GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria
A fine piece of work: permit me to congratulate you. I'll return to the prose and possible refinements when time allows. Tim riley talk 20:05, 28 July 2015 (UTC)
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@ Silence of Järvenpää: I appreciate your preference to add Dahlström's value, but being reliably sourced is not the only consideration - that value contradicts the rest of the article, including your own discography table. It appears to be a case of false precision. Nikkimaria ( talk) 03:58, 4 February 2024 (UTC)
The Oceanides is a featured article; it (or a previous version of it) has been identified as one of the best articles produced by the Wikipedia community. Even so, if you can update or improve it, please do so. | |||||||||||||
This article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page as Today's featured article on June 4, 2017. | |||||||||||||
| |||||||||||||
A
fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the "
Did you know?" column on
July 14, 2015. The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that in his
tone poem
The Oceanides, Finnish composer
Jean Sibelius "applied the
impressionist method of scoring to the bass instruments, thereby achieving effects of sonority hitherto unknown"? | |||||||||||||
Current status: Featured article |
This article is rated FA-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||
|
Hello, fellow Sibelian and welcome to the wonderful world of the Sibelius tone poems! I am sure we are of one mind: the 13 Sibelius examples in this form represent, along with his seven symphonies and the violin concerto, the height of his orchestral powers. As such, I have taken the liberty over the last year of giving some of these tone poems (namely, The Wood Nymph and The Oceanides) the expanded treatment I think they deserve.
As part of this expansion project, I have added infoboxes onto each of the tone poem pages (save for Finlandia and Luonnotar and two that don't yet exist, The Dryad and Pan and Echo) to assist our readers in having the most important information about each piece at their fingertips. I feel that standardization of infobox information and form is something we should strive to maintain among these pieces, and as such, I suggest that any changes be agreed to by the community. If you're interested, I have the following opinions:
Okay, thanks for reading! If you are so inclined to add the infobox to the seven symphonies (or the four tone poems mentioned above) or some of his incidental music, please be my guest. My focus, for now, is on the tone poems.
Sgvrfjs ( talk) 18:22, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
Note: I have included this message on the talk pages of each of the existing tone poems that have infoboxes.
One of the most notable recodings of The Oceanides (all three versions of the work) is included in the 2003 album BIS-CD-1445 Rondo of the Waves [1] with Osmo Vänskä conducting the Lahti Symphony Orchestra. See, for example, the review by Andrew Clements of the Guardian who calls it the best album of the year as well as the very positive Gramophone magazine review. See also the Google translation of [2] which also mentions acclaim by Matthew Rye of the Daily Telegraph. I think it should be included in the table, perhaps with appropriate comments in the text.-- Ipigott ( talk) 09:13, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
Hi, Ipigott. In my haste, I think my writing has perhaps been less than clear, and if so, I apologize. Please allow me a second chance to explain the decisions I made when constructing the discography table. 1) In the table, all recording are of the final version of The Oceanides. So as to avoid confusion, the intermediate versions recorded by Vanska in 2003 are left out. The list is, to my knowledge (after extensive online research), more or less, complete. 2) The dates that appear in the third column are to the best of my knowledge all dates of first recording rather than dates of CD release. Why my preference for the former over the latter? In my mind, date of recording is more important because it shows when the recording first appeared, and thus, when this particular interpretation of The Oceanides first became a part of the 'discussion' (by which I mean was available for listeners and even subsequent conductors to hear). Even more importantly, consider the example of Sir Adrian Boult. The recording date is 1936 (first recording ever, and on a LP), whereas the CD that we can today purchase the recording on was released in 2007. To my mind, the more essential date is clearly 1936 rather than 2007. 3) Following this logic, then, and for consistency purposes in a table, I listed the dates of first recording for all conductors. 4) Vanska first recorded the final version of The Oceanides in 2000, and the CD was released that year. Later, in 2003, this recording was re-released on the Rondo of the Waves CD we have been focused on, as an accompaniment to the interminate version recordings from 2003. 5) You might disagree and think the release date is still more important, to which I would only counter with one other point that I'm sure you're obviously well aware of: release dates in classical music are in my mind pretty meaningless because a single recording might be reissued and reissued and reissued a handful of times. Thus, any release date listed in the table would be arbitrary. 6) Which leads me to my final point: perhaps you are on board with using the date of first recording in the table, but don't like how the links I provided to the CD sometimes doesn't contain this recording date. To this point I concede that I just sought to find a CD a given recording was on, rather than its first issue. I didn't have the time or the resources to dig that deep. 7) The AVAILABLE ON column, then, merely is designed to give the reader a CD upon which to find the recording, not necessarily its first. 8) Perhaps you'd rather me provide a link for the Vanska final version to the CD from 2000 rather than the 2003 release. If this would solve the problem, I am happy to do so. 9) For clarity purposes, I have altered the title of column three in the table from YEAR to RECORDED, so that it is obvious to readers that the years listed are not for the CD release. Again, I apologize if I still have not addressed your concerns; the weaknesses of comprehension are entirely my own fault, but please know that I have tried to be accommodating and a team-player. Happy editing! :) Sgvrfjs ( talk) 07:14, 16 July 2015 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Tim riley ( talk · contribs) 20:44, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
Starting first read-through. More in the next day or so.
Tim riley
talk
20:44, 25 July 2015 (UTC)
This is an impressive piece of work, resourcefully written to be useful to the lay person and the trained musician alike. A few suggestions that you might like to ponder:
Please consider these points, and we can then take the review forward. At your service if you have any questions. – Tim riley talk 17:24, 26 July 2015 (UTC)
We progress admirably. Everything above is now entirely satisfactory for GA. The resurrected (renewed apoologies!) discography table needs attention. You could either stop it being sortable, or you could make the conductors sortable by surname (rather than, as at present, by given name, which really won't do.) For GA an unsortable table will be perfectly adequate. If you want to go further then you'll need to add the necessary coding to sort by surname. I'm not the one to help you with this, being chronically inept with tables, but Gerda may be able to help, and if she can't I know a very friendly editor who is a whizz in this department. And that, I think, will do for GA. I look forward to cutting the ribbon very soon. Tim riley talk 20:46, 26 July 2015 (UTC)
As above, I'll offer further suggestions on the drafting on the talk page. For now it's my task to pronounce on whether the article as it stands is of GA quality. I have no doubt at all that it is, and therefore:
GA review – see WP:WIAGA for criteria
A fine piece of work: permit me to congratulate you. I'll return to the prose and possible refinements when time allows. Tim riley talk 20:05, 28 July 2015 (UTC)
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Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 07:31, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
@ Silence of Järvenpää: I appreciate your preference to add Dahlström's value, but being reliably sourced is not the only consideration - that value contradicts the rest of the article, including your own discography table. It appears to be a case of false precision. Nikkimaria ( talk) 03:58, 4 February 2024 (UTC)