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RE: Weller insisted that he was merely trying to irk "trendy left-wingers" and, still in 1977, bemoaned how the group had garnered the "Conservative" label and expressed disgust with Margaret Thatcher. Have we got a source for this, please? Conch Shell 13:32, 2 December 2005 (UTC)
i don't have a exact source for that, but the following quote is from the 84-page book 'The Jam - Direction, Reaction, Creation' that came with the cd boxset of the same name. in the essay for cd1 by pat gilbert [dated: jan 1997] [and copyrighted to him/her obviously]:
To promote the album, The Jam headed out to support The Clash's 'White Riot' tour in early May [1977 - r7], though friction between the group and Clash manager Bernie Rhodes caused them to pull out after just a handful of dates. When an interview appeared a few days later in which Weller said The Jam would be voting Conservative at the next election, Strummer and co vented their spleen by telegraphing the group's office with the infamous message: "Maggie wants you for target practice".
Though Weller's comments had been primarily designed to wind up "punk's trendy left-wingers", the notion that The Jam were cartoon Tories wasn't exactly challenged when, a month later, the group announced some celebratory gigs for the Queen's Silver Jubilee.
Weller was clearly showing a certain degree of political naivety here, but there was also a strong sense that he was desperately trying to distance himself from the 'anarchy crowd', while cocking a snook a the punk theatre of 'God Save the Queen'. To him, music wasn't about art-terrorism; it was about classic songwriting and brutally honest sentiments.
It was only when, in the following weeks, The Jam were accused of aligning themselves with the far-right National Front, that some of the Jubilee gigs were abandoned and the Union Flags that bedecked the group's amps were quietly folded away.
that cover it?
R7 21:53, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
Just thought it worth pointing out that Weller's (later) work with the Style Council is distinctly political, and distinctly anti-Thatcherite (e.g. "A Stone's Throw Away"). Obviously his approach to music and probably his political views had changed, but it seems unlikely that he was ever a confirmed Conservative.
Not wishing to take away anything from Bruce, but can anyone confirm his vocal and/ or creative input? Almost all Jam tracks are credited to Weller only, and the exceptions suggest the rest of the band's influence is unusual. Demo versions also seem to be Weller alone ("Thick as Thieves", for example). I'm also not sure on the vocal harmonies thing; many songs sound like Weller overdubbing. I don't know myself, just noting my suspicions for accuracy's sake.
I have a 7" single of "Funeral Pyre" that gives the songwriting credit only to Paul Weller. Yet this entry and the entry for Bruce Foxton says that "Funeral Pyre" is a Weller-Foxton-Buckler colloboration. I was going to edit the page to reflect this, but Allmusic also gives the song writing credit to Weller-Foxton-Buckler. Any know anything else about this [[[User:Tallbuildings|Tallbuildings]] 20:45, 15 May 2006 (UTC)]
I think the 'Greatest Hits' packaging, credits the lyrics to 'Weller' and the Music to 'The Jam' Bevo74 12:00, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
As far as I know Bruce Foxton wrote Lisa Radley. many years I had the physical CD and I think it is the only song he wrote on his own. I actually bought both his woeful solo releases but that is due to my addiction to all Jam items since BustOut
A2. How can you honestly 'bemoan' Foxton and Bucklers influence on the Jam's sound. Both had a massive part to play and the romoval of either would have made the Jam stagnant. Foxton has a number of credits on both album and singles - Smither Joness (on which he also had lead vocals as he did on David Watts)/ News of The World/ the Combine. I would also add there are joint band credits on Circus (The Gift) Funeral Pyre - You need to revisit the LP's and singles. In my opinion the musicianship of Foxton and Buckler complimented and formed the back bone of the Jam's sound. We often forget that there were three members of the Jam and two of them weren't Paul Weller! (wellerite) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.196.17.167 ( talk) 00:00, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
Naa, isn't the demo of Liza Radley Weller singing on his own?
He wrote The Circus, News of the World and Smithers-Jones. According to our story Bruce and Rick often wrote, bassline and drum patterns but were not credited except on Funeral Pyre. Ram4eva 20:28, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
"Liza Radley" was written by Weller. Foxton does play accordian on the song. "Smithers-Jones" is credited to Foxton but Weller wrote and sang the final verse. Foxton did provide harmony vocals throughout The Jam's career. -- J2 00:17, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
This needs a bit of work. At the moment it reads like it was written by fans. For example:
"Bassist Bruce Foxton made up for the group’s lack of a second guitarist by carrying much of the melody in his distinctive playing, a confluence of the power of John Entwistle with the speed and melodicism of Paul McCartney. His instantly memorable basslines were the foundation of many of the group’s songs..."
Now, I liked The Jam, so I would slightly tent to agree with that statement. But we aren't supposed to be stating our own opinions here. We would need a quote or a ref from a verifiable souce. That's just one example. I'll see what I can do myself too of course.-- Guinnog 22:21, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.103.144.18 ( talk • contribs)
Someone swiped (should I say 'nicked' for the Brits?) my copy of 'Dig the New Breed' 20 years ago, but I clearly remember Weller's rambling liner notes saying something like "Coming home pissed from the pub and writing 'That's Entertainment' in five minutes." The article says he came home from holiday and wrote it. Is there a source for that?
How can the writer(s) of this article possibly talk about a divergence from psychedelic influences when the B side of Funeral Pyre was a cover of about the Who's only serious attempt at psychedelia apart from Magic Bus - Disguises? Also - Funeral Pyre is about book burning, about fascism (the video at the time carried the famous footage of Brown-Shirts burning books), not about "Rick Buckler's drumming". What part of the line "their mad eyes bulged their flushed faces said 'the week get crushed as the strong grow stronger'" are we not understanding here? Eton Rifles isn't about one particular incident - "what chance have you got against a tie and a crest?" - goes a little deeper than that. The song Absolute Beginners is a reference and a salute to what the book said about youth and music - its not about the book at all.
Also "non-LP single" is a gross understatement. Record companies hated the fact that bands wanted to do that at the time, and bands had to insist on it. Weller was fuming that people were putting out exports of more than one single from an album (ie backdoor record company import singles), when the agreement was "one single per album".
I personally think this article doesn't begin to understand and articulate The Jam.
A user changed the members of the Jam to those of the "From the Jam featuring Rick Buckler and Bruce Foxton" touring group, left Paul Weller as a mere "former member," labeled that as a minor edit (!), and it stayed that way for over a month. This is an article about The Jam, not "From the Jam." The whole point of that name is to slyly get by the legal fact that it isn't the same band. The "2007 Revival" section of the article covers the "reunion" tour; if more information is desired, it should be in a new article about From the Jam. (It should be no different from the handling of The Cars versus The New Cars. -- emw 04:50, 11 April 2007 (UTC)
Image:NME TheJam.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
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BetacommandBot ( talk) 23:27, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
How can the writer(s) of this article possibly talk about a divergence from psychedelic influences when the B side of Funeral Pyre was a cover of about the Who's only serious attempt at psychedelia apart from Magic Bus - Disguises? Also - Funeral Pyre is about book burning, about fascism (the video at the time carried the famous footage of Brown-Shirts burning books http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFrrNhsGZp4), not about "Rick Buckler's drumming". What part of the line "their mad eyes bulged their flushed faces said 'the week get crushed as the strong grow stronger'" are we not understanding here? Eton Rifles isn't about one particular incident - "what chance have you got against a tie and a crest?" - goes a little deeper than that. The song Absolute Beginners is a reference and a salute to what the book said about youth and music - its not a direct reference to the book at all.
Also "non-LP single" is a gross understatement. Record companies hated the fact that bands wanted to do that at the time, and bands had to insist on it. Weller was fuming that people were putting out exports of more than one single from an album (ie backdoor record company import singles), when the agreement with the record company was "one single per album".
Let's think about being young, and working class in England, aspiring to a better 'lifestyle', a more sophisticated way of thinking, how much that left you on the outside amongst your own, the people you were brought up with, the people you loved. The Clash, The Sex Pistols, no-one articulated that in the way Saturdays Kids, When You're Young, Strange Town, Away from the Numbers, Running on the Spot, Town Called Malice and Going Underground did.
I personally think this article doesn't begin to understand and articulate The Jam.
Celeryness ( talk) 02:37, 4 May 2008 (UTC)
re the jam playing 2 songs on top of the pops, i don't believe they were the first band since the beatles to do this as i recall slade being at no.1 a few years before & after playing their latest chart-topper playing out the show with the b-side. however, i can't recall the songs in question for sure, although i have a feeling it may be the "cum on feel the noize" single. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.24.228.33 ( talk) 23:43, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Can someone clarify the bit in the first paragraph about "best-selling import singles of all time in the UK" ? Seeing as how this is a British band, I don't understand why their singles would be considered imports in the UK? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Frankenab ( talk • contribs) 22:29, 1 January 2010 (UTC)
This is a terrible opening sentence, which looks like it has been written by a committee. And, like most things down by committee, they've made a right horse's arse of it.
Firstly, The Jam were not a punk band, though they are often lumped in with them. Weller has on many occasions expressed his dislike for punk, and, even back in 1977, was reluctant to be grouped in with the punk groups. The Jam's musical and fashion sensibilities always had much more in common with the mod scene than their punk contemporaries.
Secondly, how can they be post-punk and punk at the same time? "Post-punk" is a meaningless term anyway. I have never heard any musician describe their band as a "post-punk" band. Even f@cking Green Day insist they are a "punk" band, rather than a "post-post-post-post-punk band" (though "corporate rock" would be a more accurate definition.)
Thirdly "mod-revival??" I just checked what that meant exactly, and it seems to be mainly about aging mods getting together at scooter meets. What's with the term "revival"? If you are a mod, you are a mod.
In my opinion, The Jam were mods. I'd accept New Wave, or even rock, but "The Jam were an English punk, post-punk, mod revival band" is terrible. You might as well just shove folk and glam in there too and be done with it.. Can we change this? -- Angstriddenyouth ( talk) 22:38, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
References
The Jam were British New Wave at its most quintessential and successful.
The article in general is reads like a cobbled together narrative constructed from old NME reports. Worse still it lacks any attempt to explain why Weller folded the group. It the section on the dissolution says they got a #1 record then that was it!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.150.226.95 ( talk) 10:35, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
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The first "Formation" paragraph has him playing guitar and then later switching from bass to guitar. Did he switch from guitar to bass and back again or is the first sentence in error? - Immigrant laborer ( talk) 23:21, 6 September 2017 (UTC)
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Someone has tagged a number of sentences with "Citation needed" on this article and on Paul Weller.
I've added the "Original research" banner on this article until that situation improves. When this article is more complete, I believe several sections of the Paul Weller article can have their own tags removed and can replicate the reliable information presented here.
I'm going to add "Original research" to that whole article too, as it's not just the Jam sections that need work. But people might want to work on those two (and maybe more) articles in tandem.
Thanks!
Allanaaaaaaa ( talk) 19:37, 22 February 2024 (UTC)
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RE: Weller insisted that he was merely trying to irk "trendy left-wingers" and, still in 1977, bemoaned how the group had garnered the "Conservative" label and expressed disgust with Margaret Thatcher. Have we got a source for this, please? Conch Shell 13:32, 2 December 2005 (UTC)
i don't have a exact source for that, but the following quote is from the 84-page book 'The Jam - Direction, Reaction, Creation' that came with the cd boxset of the same name. in the essay for cd1 by pat gilbert [dated: jan 1997] [and copyrighted to him/her obviously]:
To promote the album, The Jam headed out to support The Clash's 'White Riot' tour in early May [1977 - r7], though friction between the group and Clash manager Bernie Rhodes caused them to pull out after just a handful of dates. When an interview appeared a few days later in which Weller said The Jam would be voting Conservative at the next election, Strummer and co vented their spleen by telegraphing the group's office with the infamous message: "Maggie wants you for target practice".
Though Weller's comments had been primarily designed to wind up "punk's trendy left-wingers", the notion that The Jam were cartoon Tories wasn't exactly challenged when, a month later, the group announced some celebratory gigs for the Queen's Silver Jubilee.
Weller was clearly showing a certain degree of political naivety here, but there was also a strong sense that he was desperately trying to distance himself from the 'anarchy crowd', while cocking a snook a the punk theatre of 'God Save the Queen'. To him, music wasn't about art-terrorism; it was about classic songwriting and brutally honest sentiments.
It was only when, in the following weeks, The Jam were accused of aligning themselves with the far-right National Front, that some of the Jubilee gigs were abandoned and the Union Flags that bedecked the group's amps were quietly folded away.
that cover it?
R7 21:53, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
Just thought it worth pointing out that Weller's (later) work with the Style Council is distinctly political, and distinctly anti-Thatcherite (e.g. "A Stone's Throw Away"). Obviously his approach to music and probably his political views had changed, but it seems unlikely that he was ever a confirmed Conservative.
Not wishing to take away anything from Bruce, but can anyone confirm his vocal and/ or creative input? Almost all Jam tracks are credited to Weller only, and the exceptions suggest the rest of the band's influence is unusual. Demo versions also seem to be Weller alone ("Thick as Thieves", for example). I'm also not sure on the vocal harmonies thing; many songs sound like Weller overdubbing. I don't know myself, just noting my suspicions for accuracy's sake.
I have a 7" single of "Funeral Pyre" that gives the songwriting credit only to Paul Weller. Yet this entry and the entry for Bruce Foxton says that "Funeral Pyre" is a Weller-Foxton-Buckler colloboration. I was going to edit the page to reflect this, but Allmusic also gives the song writing credit to Weller-Foxton-Buckler. Any know anything else about this [[[User:Tallbuildings|Tallbuildings]] 20:45, 15 May 2006 (UTC)]
I think the 'Greatest Hits' packaging, credits the lyrics to 'Weller' and the Music to 'The Jam' Bevo74 12:00, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
As far as I know Bruce Foxton wrote Lisa Radley. many years I had the physical CD and I think it is the only song he wrote on his own. I actually bought both his woeful solo releases but that is due to my addiction to all Jam items since BustOut
A2. How can you honestly 'bemoan' Foxton and Bucklers influence on the Jam's sound. Both had a massive part to play and the romoval of either would have made the Jam stagnant. Foxton has a number of credits on both album and singles - Smither Joness (on which he also had lead vocals as he did on David Watts)/ News of The World/ the Combine. I would also add there are joint band credits on Circus (The Gift) Funeral Pyre - You need to revisit the LP's and singles. In my opinion the musicianship of Foxton and Buckler complimented and formed the back bone of the Jam's sound. We often forget that there were three members of the Jam and two of them weren't Paul Weller! (wellerite) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.196.17.167 ( talk) 00:00, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
Naa, isn't the demo of Liza Radley Weller singing on his own?
He wrote The Circus, News of the World and Smithers-Jones. According to our story Bruce and Rick often wrote, bassline and drum patterns but were not credited except on Funeral Pyre. Ram4eva 20:28, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
"Liza Radley" was written by Weller. Foxton does play accordian on the song. "Smithers-Jones" is credited to Foxton but Weller wrote and sang the final verse. Foxton did provide harmony vocals throughout The Jam's career. -- J2 00:17, 4 March 2007 (UTC)
This needs a bit of work. At the moment it reads like it was written by fans. For example:
"Bassist Bruce Foxton made up for the group’s lack of a second guitarist by carrying much of the melody in his distinctive playing, a confluence of the power of John Entwistle with the speed and melodicism of Paul McCartney. His instantly memorable basslines were the foundation of many of the group’s songs..."
Now, I liked The Jam, so I would slightly tent to agree with that statement. But we aren't supposed to be stating our own opinions here. We would need a quote or a ref from a verifiable souce. That's just one example. I'll see what I can do myself too of course.-- Guinnog 22:21, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.103.144.18 ( talk • contribs)
Someone swiped (should I say 'nicked' for the Brits?) my copy of 'Dig the New Breed' 20 years ago, but I clearly remember Weller's rambling liner notes saying something like "Coming home pissed from the pub and writing 'That's Entertainment' in five minutes." The article says he came home from holiday and wrote it. Is there a source for that?
How can the writer(s) of this article possibly talk about a divergence from psychedelic influences when the B side of Funeral Pyre was a cover of about the Who's only serious attempt at psychedelia apart from Magic Bus - Disguises? Also - Funeral Pyre is about book burning, about fascism (the video at the time carried the famous footage of Brown-Shirts burning books), not about "Rick Buckler's drumming". What part of the line "their mad eyes bulged their flushed faces said 'the week get crushed as the strong grow stronger'" are we not understanding here? Eton Rifles isn't about one particular incident - "what chance have you got against a tie and a crest?" - goes a little deeper than that. The song Absolute Beginners is a reference and a salute to what the book said about youth and music - its not about the book at all.
Also "non-LP single" is a gross understatement. Record companies hated the fact that bands wanted to do that at the time, and bands had to insist on it. Weller was fuming that people were putting out exports of more than one single from an album (ie backdoor record company import singles), when the agreement was "one single per album".
I personally think this article doesn't begin to understand and articulate The Jam.
A user changed the members of the Jam to those of the "From the Jam featuring Rick Buckler and Bruce Foxton" touring group, left Paul Weller as a mere "former member," labeled that as a minor edit (!), and it stayed that way for over a month. This is an article about The Jam, not "From the Jam." The whole point of that name is to slyly get by the legal fact that it isn't the same band. The "2007 Revival" section of the article covers the "reunion" tour; if more information is desired, it should be in a new article about From the Jam. (It should be no different from the handling of The Cars versus The New Cars. -- emw 04:50, 11 April 2007 (UTC)
Image:NME TheJam.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot ( talk) 23:27, 2 January 2008 (UTC)
How can the writer(s) of this article possibly talk about a divergence from psychedelic influences when the B side of Funeral Pyre was a cover of about the Who's only serious attempt at psychedelia apart from Magic Bus - Disguises? Also - Funeral Pyre is about book burning, about fascism (the video at the time carried the famous footage of Brown-Shirts burning books http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFrrNhsGZp4), not about "Rick Buckler's drumming". What part of the line "their mad eyes bulged their flushed faces said 'the week get crushed as the strong grow stronger'" are we not understanding here? Eton Rifles isn't about one particular incident - "what chance have you got against a tie and a crest?" - goes a little deeper than that. The song Absolute Beginners is a reference and a salute to what the book said about youth and music - its not a direct reference to the book at all.
Also "non-LP single" is a gross understatement. Record companies hated the fact that bands wanted to do that at the time, and bands had to insist on it. Weller was fuming that people were putting out exports of more than one single from an album (ie backdoor record company import singles), when the agreement with the record company was "one single per album".
Let's think about being young, and working class in England, aspiring to a better 'lifestyle', a more sophisticated way of thinking, how much that left you on the outside amongst your own, the people you were brought up with, the people you loved. The Clash, The Sex Pistols, no-one articulated that in the way Saturdays Kids, When You're Young, Strange Town, Away from the Numbers, Running on the Spot, Town Called Malice and Going Underground did.
I personally think this article doesn't begin to understand and articulate The Jam.
Celeryness ( talk) 02:37, 4 May 2008 (UTC)
re the jam playing 2 songs on top of the pops, i don't believe they were the first band since the beatles to do this as i recall slade being at no.1 a few years before & after playing their latest chart-topper playing out the show with the b-side. however, i can't recall the songs in question for sure, although i have a feeling it may be the "cum on feel the noize" single. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.24.228.33 ( talk) 23:43, 2 January 2009 (UTC)
Can someone clarify the bit in the first paragraph about "best-selling import singles of all time in the UK" ? Seeing as how this is a British band, I don't understand why their singles would be considered imports in the UK? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Frankenab ( talk • contribs) 22:29, 1 January 2010 (UTC)
This is a terrible opening sentence, which looks like it has been written by a committee. And, like most things down by committee, they've made a right horse's arse of it.
Firstly, The Jam were not a punk band, though they are often lumped in with them. Weller has on many occasions expressed his dislike for punk, and, even back in 1977, was reluctant to be grouped in with the punk groups. The Jam's musical and fashion sensibilities always had much more in common with the mod scene than their punk contemporaries.
Secondly, how can they be post-punk and punk at the same time? "Post-punk" is a meaningless term anyway. I have never heard any musician describe their band as a "post-punk" band. Even f@cking Green Day insist they are a "punk" band, rather than a "post-post-post-post-punk band" (though "corporate rock" would be a more accurate definition.)
Thirdly "mod-revival??" I just checked what that meant exactly, and it seems to be mainly about aging mods getting together at scooter meets. What's with the term "revival"? If you are a mod, you are a mod.
In my opinion, The Jam were mods. I'd accept New Wave, or even rock, but "The Jam were an English punk, post-punk, mod revival band" is terrible. You might as well just shove folk and glam in there too and be done with it.. Can we change this? -- Angstriddenyouth ( talk) 22:38, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
References
The Jam were British New Wave at its most quintessential and successful.
The article in general is reads like a cobbled together narrative constructed from old NME reports. Worse still it lacks any attempt to explain why Weller folded the group. It the section on the dissolution says they got a #1 record then that was it!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.150.226.95 ( talk) 10:35, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
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The first "Formation" paragraph has him playing guitar and then later switching from bass to guitar. Did he switch from guitar to bass and back again or is the first sentence in error? - Immigrant laborer ( talk) 23:21, 6 September 2017 (UTC)
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Someone has tagged a number of sentences with "Citation needed" on this article and on Paul Weller.
I've added the "Original research" banner on this article until that situation improves. When this article is more complete, I believe several sections of the Paul Weller article can have their own tags removed and can replicate the reliable information presented here.
I'm going to add "Original research" to that whole article too, as it's not just the Jam sections that need work. But people might want to work on those two (and maybe more) articles in tandem.
Thanks!
Allanaaaaaaa ( talk) 19:37, 22 February 2024 (UTC)