![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
If you just put down the text or link that is in question. Rather than try to analyze the motives, could you (just) say what the change is, and the pro's and con's? And what is NCG? There is tons to read besides the above argument.
Martin |
tk
06:26, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
NCG=North Country Gazette. I see. Martin | tk 23:38, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
I changed this to "unable to feed herself". If I could revert this I would. You can if you want to. The changed text omits the meaning that she couldn't swallow. "Couldnt feed herself" I would take to mean more that her hand is paralyzed, and is silent on swallowing, leaving open the idea that others might feed her, which was not the case. Martin | tk 07:36, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
I cannot get this footnote to work. I want to read what Greer said - how he phrased his finding. It is note #9 I am assuming. The link to the 6th circuit court works, but the search there on Shiavo does not produce the document. The link to the pdf document hangs. ? Martin | tk 08:23, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
The footnote [5], "facts lies and videotape" contains the paragraph:
to support the statement:
The "no dissent" comment might easily be read to mean that the Schindlers did not at that point dissent from the diagnosis of PVS.
Changing statement. 09:42, 7 February 2007 (UTC) signing Martin | talk • contribs 01:39, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
Feb 9th
The footnotes, [5][6] are both copies of Dr Cranford's testimony titled 'facts,lies, videotape...'.
My clarification of "no dissent" to "by all treating neurologists", while accurate, may not be the best change to make. There were four treating neurologists mentioned by Dr Cranford, and all four are mentioned in the prior sentence. To say "all treating neurologists" at this point may lead one to believe that Dr Cranford is referring to more than the four cited about. His paper does contain another slightly broader statement somewnat farther down: From the initial hospitalization in February, 1990, until the present time, there have been no significant changes in Terri’s neurological findings, and nothing in the medical records to suggest any disagreement whatsoever among Terri’s attending and consulting physicians about the underlying diagnosis and prognosis for recovery.
In my opinion, it would be better to use this statement as the basis for the statement footnoted as [5][6].
Martin |
talk •
contribs
05:16, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
paragraph currently says: "She may have developed an eating disorder around this time.[4]"
"A Life That Matters", pg 27 says:
The above quote from "A Life That Matters" says that Terri went on Nutra System diet right after graduating, but the current text says that she went on Nutra System in 1980 then graduated in 1981. That looks like a mistake in the current text to me: I am sure her mom remembers that incident correctly, given how sensitive young women are to their weight, and their moms are to them. Martin | talk • contribs 07:43, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
It reads:
Despite intervention by the other branches, the courts continued to uphold the circuit court ruling that Schiavo was in a PVS, and that she would want life-prolonging procedures withdrawn. Her feeding tube was removed a third and final time on 18 March 2005. She died thirteen days later of dehydration at a Pinellas Park hospice on 31 March 2005, at the age of 41.
Most of this is contained in the prior two paragraphs.
Maybe just say Terri Schiavo died of dehydration at a Pinellas Park Hospice on 31 March 2005, at the age of 41.
current text is: and she was not menstruating (lack of menstruation, or amenorrhea is sometimes associated with excessive weight loss, as is thought to be the case with Schiavo). The statement as is thought to be the case with Schiavo is not attributed. The juxtapostion is enough to indicate that at least someone thinks that that fact is relevant and might be of note here. To note, in the passive voice, that some do think that, is not to add anything. It would be interesting to know "who" it is that thinks that that is the case, with a citation. Failing that, the phrase is redundant. Martin | talk • contribs 08:51, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
It would be nice if a doctor would comment on her low potassium. Do we know if her other electrolytes were looked at (magnesium?). And whether trauma also affects magnesium? [1]. The citation says that severe low potassium is below 3.0, other sites say under 2.5. Possibly 3.0 is severe (unusual?) as a result of trauma. No sense speculating... Martin | talk • contribs 08:39, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
On Larry King, Michael says that he and Terri were going to Dr Igel for fertility treatments. That assertion is included in the current article.
But Dr Stephen Igel, the one that settled for $200k, is an ob/gyn, not a 'fertility' doctor. The other doctor in the malpractice case, Dr Prawer, the million dollar award, is described as their family doctor. It makes sense that Terri, who was not menstruating, was going to an ob/gyn to find out what was wrong. What were these 'fertility treatments'?
[2]
Martin |
talk •
contribs
11:02, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
modified
Martin |
talk •
contribs
15:53, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
Input is sought here: Talk:Government_involvement_in_the_Terri_Schiavo_case#Edit_War_between_me_and_User:Calton; additionally, for all those who prefer active instead of passive voice, I seek said input.-- GordonWatts 14:26, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
I have observed massive deletions...
File:Beating 2Da 2Ddead 2Dhorse.gif -- Fredrick day 13:02, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
Folks, we must cite our sources: This is not about "gordon's links," for if you note: MOST of the links are NOT mine, and they can't ALL be bad... And we wonder why Wikipedia is not considered a reliable source itself? Ironic isn't it that the very thing editors claim about other links not being reliable is what contributes to Wikipedia itself not being reliable:
"Thangs that make ya go 'Hmm...'."-- GordonWatts 09:27, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
Don't make it more complicated than necessary! Oh, the irony. Let me refresh your memory:
Per Wikipedia:Community noticeboard#Community ban request on User:GordonWatts:
It's over, Gordon. Done. They're never going in. -- Calton | Talk 14:46, 28 February 2007 (UTC) -- Calton | Talk 14:46, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
The recent change to the first paragraph needs some work. It is true that, after the court made the determination to pull the tube, the Schindler's were fighting the court rather than Michael.
Martin |
talk •
contribs
06:06, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
The new addition of "on the other hand" (which I have not read closely) I think is taking this in the wrong direction.
Martin |
talk •
contribs
20:52, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
Michael said something like this* on CNN/Larry King. However at the malpractice trial, he said that he never talked to Dr Igel. The discharge notes from Humana say that Terri was seeing a ob/gyn for a vaginal infection, and she had had no other notable treatments.
Martin |
talk •
contribs
06:54, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
At the July 27 92 deposition, Michael said that Dr Prawer, the family doctor, referred Terri to Dr Igel, the obgyn, because Terri missed her period.
Martin |
talk •
contribs
01:35, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
.*from CNN/Larry King SCHIAVO: No children. Terri and I were trying to have children. We were back and forth to a doctor for a year or so, trying to find out why we weren't getting pregnant. [11]. Martin | talk • contribs 04:47, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
Article says: Lack of menstruation, or amenorrhea is sometimes associated with excessive weight loss.
Dr Prawer's records indicate* that Terri was between 120 and 124 the four times he saw her in the year prior to her collapse. Michael does testify (jul 27 p 65)that she had weight swings, but later backs off (p 85) from that when presented with Prawer's records. But the comment, as written, is speculative.
.* Medical Malpractice Trial, July 27 1992 p85
Martin |
talk •
contribs
01:41, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
If you just put down the text or link that is in question. Rather than try to analyze the motives, could you (just) say what the change is, and the pro's and con's? And what is NCG? There is tons to read besides the above argument.
Martin |
tk
06:26, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
NCG=North Country Gazette. I see. Martin | tk 23:38, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
I changed this to "unable to feed herself". If I could revert this I would. You can if you want to. The changed text omits the meaning that she couldn't swallow. "Couldnt feed herself" I would take to mean more that her hand is paralyzed, and is silent on swallowing, leaving open the idea that others might feed her, which was not the case. Martin | tk 07:36, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
I cannot get this footnote to work. I want to read what Greer said - how he phrased his finding. It is note #9 I am assuming. The link to the 6th circuit court works, but the search there on Shiavo does not produce the document. The link to the pdf document hangs. ? Martin | tk 08:23, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
The footnote [5], "facts lies and videotape" contains the paragraph:
to support the statement:
The "no dissent" comment might easily be read to mean that the Schindlers did not at that point dissent from the diagnosis of PVS.
Changing statement. 09:42, 7 February 2007 (UTC) signing Martin | talk • contribs 01:39, 8 February 2007 (UTC)
Feb 9th
The footnotes, [5][6] are both copies of Dr Cranford's testimony titled 'facts,lies, videotape...'.
My clarification of "no dissent" to "by all treating neurologists", while accurate, may not be the best change to make. There were four treating neurologists mentioned by Dr Cranford, and all four are mentioned in the prior sentence. To say "all treating neurologists" at this point may lead one to believe that Dr Cranford is referring to more than the four cited about. His paper does contain another slightly broader statement somewnat farther down: From the initial hospitalization in February, 1990, until the present time, there have been no significant changes in Terri’s neurological findings, and nothing in the medical records to suggest any disagreement whatsoever among Terri’s attending and consulting physicians about the underlying diagnosis and prognosis for recovery.
In my opinion, it would be better to use this statement as the basis for the statement footnoted as [5][6].
Martin |
talk •
contribs
05:16, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
paragraph currently says: "She may have developed an eating disorder around this time.[4]"
"A Life That Matters", pg 27 says:
The above quote from "A Life That Matters" says that Terri went on Nutra System diet right after graduating, but the current text says that she went on Nutra System in 1980 then graduated in 1981. That looks like a mistake in the current text to me: I am sure her mom remembers that incident correctly, given how sensitive young women are to their weight, and their moms are to them. Martin | talk • contribs 07:43, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
It reads:
Despite intervention by the other branches, the courts continued to uphold the circuit court ruling that Schiavo was in a PVS, and that she would want life-prolonging procedures withdrawn. Her feeding tube was removed a third and final time on 18 March 2005. She died thirteen days later of dehydration at a Pinellas Park hospice on 31 March 2005, at the age of 41.
Most of this is contained in the prior two paragraphs.
Maybe just say Terri Schiavo died of dehydration at a Pinellas Park Hospice on 31 March 2005, at the age of 41.
current text is: and she was not menstruating (lack of menstruation, or amenorrhea is sometimes associated with excessive weight loss, as is thought to be the case with Schiavo). The statement as is thought to be the case with Schiavo is not attributed. The juxtapostion is enough to indicate that at least someone thinks that that fact is relevant and might be of note here. To note, in the passive voice, that some do think that, is not to add anything. It would be interesting to know "who" it is that thinks that that is the case, with a citation. Failing that, the phrase is redundant. Martin | talk • contribs 08:51, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
It would be nice if a doctor would comment on her low potassium. Do we know if her other electrolytes were looked at (magnesium?). And whether trauma also affects magnesium? [1]. The citation says that severe low potassium is below 3.0, other sites say under 2.5. Possibly 3.0 is severe (unusual?) as a result of trauma. No sense speculating... Martin | talk • contribs 08:39, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
On Larry King, Michael says that he and Terri were going to Dr Igel for fertility treatments. That assertion is included in the current article.
But Dr Stephen Igel, the one that settled for $200k, is an ob/gyn, not a 'fertility' doctor. The other doctor in the malpractice case, Dr Prawer, the million dollar award, is described as their family doctor. It makes sense that Terri, who was not menstruating, was going to an ob/gyn to find out what was wrong. What were these 'fertility treatments'?
[2]
Martin |
talk •
contribs
11:02, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
modified
Martin |
talk •
contribs
15:53, 18 February 2007 (UTC)
Input is sought here: Talk:Government_involvement_in_the_Terri_Schiavo_case#Edit_War_between_me_and_User:Calton; additionally, for all those who prefer active instead of passive voice, I seek said input.-- GordonWatts 14:26, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
I have observed massive deletions...
File:Beating 2Da 2Ddead 2Dhorse.gif -- Fredrick day 13:02, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
Folks, we must cite our sources: This is not about "gordon's links," for if you note: MOST of the links are NOT mine, and they can't ALL be bad... And we wonder why Wikipedia is not considered a reliable source itself? Ironic isn't it that the very thing editors claim about other links not being reliable is what contributes to Wikipedia itself not being reliable:
"Thangs that make ya go 'Hmm...'."-- GordonWatts 09:27, 15 February 2007 (UTC)
Don't make it more complicated than necessary! Oh, the irony. Let me refresh your memory:
Per Wikipedia:Community noticeboard#Community ban request on User:GordonWatts:
It's over, Gordon. Done. They're never going in. -- Calton | Talk 14:46, 28 February 2007 (UTC) -- Calton | Talk 14:46, 28 February 2007 (UTC)
The recent change to the first paragraph needs some work. It is true that, after the court made the determination to pull the tube, the Schindler's were fighting the court rather than Michael.
Martin |
talk •
contribs
06:06, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
The new addition of "on the other hand" (which I have not read closely) I think is taking this in the wrong direction.
Martin |
talk •
contribs
20:52, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
Michael said something like this* on CNN/Larry King. However at the malpractice trial, he said that he never talked to Dr Igel. The discharge notes from Humana say that Terri was seeing a ob/gyn for a vaginal infection, and she had had no other notable treatments.
Martin |
talk •
contribs
06:54, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
At the July 27 92 deposition, Michael said that Dr Prawer, the family doctor, referred Terri to Dr Igel, the obgyn, because Terri missed her period.
Martin |
talk •
contribs
01:35, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
.*from CNN/Larry King SCHIAVO: No children. Terri and I were trying to have children. We were back and forth to a doctor for a year or so, trying to find out why we weren't getting pregnant. [11]. Martin | talk • contribs 04:47, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
Article says: Lack of menstruation, or amenorrhea is sometimes associated with excessive weight loss.
Dr Prawer's records indicate* that Terri was between 120 and 124 the four times he saw her in the year prior to her collapse. Michael does testify (jul 27 p 65)that she had weight swings, but later backs off (p 85) from that when presented with Prawer's records. But the comment, as written, is speculative.
.* Medical Malpractice Trial, July 27 1992 p85
Martin |
talk •
contribs
01:41, 20 February 2007 (UTC)