This article is within the scope of WikiProject Turkey, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Turkey and
related topics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.TurkeyWikipedia:WikiProject TurkeyTemplate:WikiProject TurkeyTurkey articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Weather, which collaborates on weather and related subjects on Wikipedia. To participate, help improve this article or visit the
project page for details.
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Greece, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Greece on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GreeceWikipedia:WikiProject GreeceTemplate:WikiProject GreeceGreek articles
Closing per a request at
WP:CR—there's consensus to merge
January 2022 Greek cold wave into
Storm Elpis, at least for now. Some editors feel that the cold wave may eventually merit some sort of stand-alone article, so feel free to split the cold-wave portion back out again if you think you can resolve the concerns expressed in this discussion.
Extraordinary Writ (
talk)
06:11, 11 September 2022 (UTC)reply
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
In its current state, the cold wave article gives
WP:UNDUE weight to Greece, (since the cold wave also impacted Turkey, Cyprus, Israel and other countries) and does not sufficiently describe the cold wave itself, rather talking more about the snowstorm, which is not directly caused by the cold wave, but by a mixture of frontal and convective precipitation collectively known as
Storm Elpis.
Uness232 (
talk)
15:12, 30 January 2022 (UTC)reply
15:23, 1 February 2022 (UTC) Hi there , the article above that i created belongs to Historical cold waves 2022 . I dont think is historical to see snow in a mountainious region like Turkey or in Jerusalem at 800 meters altitude..seems to be someting very common the winter months... but for Greece south is extraordinary. I dont want to open fight against Turkey but if you think storm Elpis had huge weather impact in terms of Historical why dont you write your own article ? I wouldn't aggree with the total merge of my article with storm Elpis article , this could have it removed from the Historical cold waves of January 2022 page ? — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Pun89 (
talk •
contribs)
15:21, 1 February 2022 (UTC)reply
Comment, while I'm having a bit of trouble understanding you, if I got it right, you're making a
WP:GNG argument. I am not arguing that the cold wave would never deserve its own article, but simply that in its current state, your article is not easily differentiated from this one in terms of content, scope or end-goal.
And also mind you, the cold was historic for certain regions of Turkey and the Levant as well, and while you'd be right that, for example, in Istanbul
-9.1C isn't unprecedented at all (even though it still breaks a daily record),
snow in Antalya (a city warmer than all of mainland Greece) definitely is.
Uness232 (
talk)
20:42, 1 February 2022 (UTC)reply
Strong Draftity and Scope Change - I believe the
January 2022 Greek cold wave should be draftified and have the overall scope changed. 12 Hypothermia deaths just occurred in Turkey, so the cold wave is still in effect, it just isn't only Greece. Maybe change the scope and title to be "Southeastern Europe cold wave" and I know that would be notable.
Storm Elpis and the new hypothermia deaths qualify for the
Weather of 2022 timeline, so notability (in general) is there. Would you be ok with that @
Pun89:?
Elijahandskip (
talk)
01:02, 3 February 2022 (UTC)reply
Yes , it's true for Antalya , southern Turkey ,right ?Ok ok you want to merge the "greek cold wave january 2022" to "South Eastern mediterranean cold wave January 2022" ? Permission granted and sorry for the trouble .
No, because they aren't from Storm Elpis. So here is the basic idea. Storm Eplis is a singular storm, nothing more, nothing less. During/after Storm Eplis, a cold wave continued to remain in the aftermath of Elpis. The hypothermia deaths aren't from Elpis, however, they are from the cold wave that followed after the storm. That is why I am arguing for a scope change, not for the merge, but on the cold wave article. As stated in the initial merge proposal, the cold wave affected more than Greece. So if the scope is changed to include all of the countries affected by the cold wave, then a merge is not needed. This is a similar situation to the
February 2021 North American cold wave. The cold wave is different from the two winter storms that occurred. Same situation here; the cold wave is different from Storm Elpis.
Elijahandskip (
talk)
17:32, 5 February 2022 (UTC)reply
If you merge the article to Storm Elpis , the original one will be disappeared ? if yes we have a tiny problem ... if not we are ok .
The article cold wave in the '21st century cold waves of 2022' section must include an article talking about the impact of the cold wave Elpis in January in Greece !!! This is very important for many greek amateur meteorologists who love study weather events !
Pun89 (
talk)
18:22, 3 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Also ,that event had a great impact in the country's capital because it was a very rare phenomenon and it cannot belong anywhere else but in the 21st century cold waves of 2022 section .
Pun89 (
talk)
18:27, 3 April 2022 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
TropicalCyclone101's contribution to The 2022 C/B Class Drive
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Turkey, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Turkey and
related topics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.TurkeyWikipedia:WikiProject TurkeyTemplate:WikiProject TurkeyTurkey articles
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Weather, which collaborates on weather and related subjects on Wikipedia. To participate, help improve this article or visit the
project page for details.
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Greece, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
Greece on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GreeceWikipedia:WikiProject GreeceTemplate:WikiProject GreeceGreek articles
Closing per a request at
WP:CR—there's consensus to merge
January 2022 Greek cold wave into
Storm Elpis, at least for now. Some editors feel that the cold wave may eventually merit some sort of stand-alone article, so feel free to split the cold-wave portion back out again if you think you can resolve the concerns expressed in this discussion.
Extraordinary Writ (
talk)
06:11, 11 September 2022 (UTC)reply
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
In its current state, the cold wave article gives
WP:UNDUE weight to Greece, (since the cold wave also impacted Turkey, Cyprus, Israel and other countries) and does not sufficiently describe the cold wave itself, rather talking more about the snowstorm, which is not directly caused by the cold wave, but by a mixture of frontal and convective precipitation collectively known as
Storm Elpis.
Uness232 (
talk)
15:12, 30 January 2022 (UTC)reply
15:23, 1 February 2022 (UTC) Hi there , the article above that i created belongs to Historical cold waves 2022 . I dont think is historical to see snow in a mountainious region like Turkey or in Jerusalem at 800 meters altitude..seems to be someting very common the winter months... but for Greece south is extraordinary. I dont want to open fight against Turkey but if you think storm Elpis had huge weather impact in terms of Historical why dont you write your own article ? I wouldn't aggree with the total merge of my article with storm Elpis article , this could have it removed from the Historical cold waves of January 2022 page ? — Preceding
unsigned comment added by
Pun89 (
talk •
contribs)
15:21, 1 February 2022 (UTC)reply
Comment, while I'm having a bit of trouble understanding you, if I got it right, you're making a
WP:GNG argument. I am not arguing that the cold wave would never deserve its own article, but simply that in its current state, your article is not easily differentiated from this one in terms of content, scope or end-goal.
And also mind you, the cold was historic for certain regions of Turkey and the Levant as well, and while you'd be right that, for example, in Istanbul
-9.1C isn't unprecedented at all (even though it still breaks a daily record),
snow in Antalya (a city warmer than all of mainland Greece) definitely is.
Uness232 (
talk)
20:42, 1 February 2022 (UTC)reply
Strong Draftity and Scope Change - I believe the
January 2022 Greek cold wave should be draftified and have the overall scope changed. 12 Hypothermia deaths just occurred in Turkey, so the cold wave is still in effect, it just isn't only Greece. Maybe change the scope and title to be "Southeastern Europe cold wave" and I know that would be notable.
Storm Elpis and the new hypothermia deaths qualify for the
Weather of 2022 timeline, so notability (in general) is there. Would you be ok with that @
Pun89:?
Elijahandskip (
talk)
01:02, 3 February 2022 (UTC)reply
Yes , it's true for Antalya , southern Turkey ,right ?Ok ok you want to merge the "greek cold wave january 2022" to "South Eastern mediterranean cold wave January 2022" ? Permission granted and sorry for the trouble .
No, because they aren't from Storm Elpis. So here is the basic idea. Storm Eplis is a singular storm, nothing more, nothing less. During/after Storm Eplis, a cold wave continued to remain in the aftermath of Elpis. The hypothermia deaths aren't from Elpis, however, they are from the cold wave that followed after the storm. That is why I am arguing for a scope change, not for the merge, but on the cold wave article. As stated in the initial merge proposal, the cold wave affected more than Greece. So if the scope is changed to include all of the countries affected by the cold wave, then a merge is not needed. This is a similar situation to the
February 2021 North American cold wave. The cold wave is different from the two winter storms that occurred. Same situation here; the cold wave is different from Storm Elpis.
Elijahandskip (
talk)
17:32, 5 February 2022 (UTC)reply
If you merge the article to Storm Elpis , the original one will be disappeared ? if yes we have a tiny problem ... if not we are ok .
The article cold wave in the '21st century cold waves of 2022' section must include an article talking about the impact of the cold wave Elpis in January in Greece !!! This is very important for many greek amateur meteorologists who love study weather events !
Pun89 (
talk)
18:22, 3 April 2022 (UTC)reply
Also ,that event had a great impact in the country's capital because it was a very rare phenomenon and it cannot belong anywhere else but in the 21st century cold waves of 2022 section .
Pun89 (
talk)
18:27, 3 April 2022 (UTC)reply
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
TropicalCyclone101's contribution to The 2022 C/B Class Drive