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I am offering a fuller explanation here as to why I have reverted this edit by Diariser in response to the discussion at User_talk:SMcCandlish#Steve_Davis. I think it is probably better to continue a content discussion at the article talk page so the record is retained here, rather than in SMcCandlish's talk page archives [7].
I actually have a couple of problems with the edits. First of all Wikipedia is supposed to be a verifiable encyclopdia, not a snooker wiki. I am sure we all know interesting stuff that would enhance Wikipedia, but ultimately its credibility comes from having sufficient details to verify the information. I recommened that Diariser reads WP:Verifiability not truth. In fairness the result for this match is not difficult to source and that could indeed be included in the section (since it is already sourced in the results table), but the level of detail Diariser added is unwarranted IMO. This is a 200kb+ article that like so many snooker player articles (see Ronnie O'Sullivan) is in danger of turning into a giant match report. Do we really need to go into such specific detail about the matches themselves that have been non-defining in the context of somebody's career? When Davis put defending world champion and World number 1 John Higgins to bed in the 2011 world championship he pulled off one of the greatest finishes by any player of any era that I have ever seen, but we don't actually go into in the specifics. You can see the closing moments of the match here. The double on the brown to canon the blue into play is absolutely surreal, especially when you consider that if he misses he is most likely looking at a decider against Higgins. At the end of the day though while it is indisputably brilliant play it is not really defining in regards to his career so we don't go into specifics. Davis' maximum and his black ball defeat by Taylor in 1985 are the notable exceptions here because they have entered snooker folklore, but how many deciding frames has Davis won down the years, and how many times has he won frames needing snookers? It just seems a bit unbalanced to me that we devote more space to Davis beating Charlton needing a snooker early on in a tournament than what we do to what is possibly the only whitewash ever in a two-session final (mentioned in the preceding sentence). If that is indeed the case I would prefer to have more exposition about that.
Would this article be interesting for somebody who is only a casual viewer of snooker, or even someone who doesn't know about the game but is interested in learning more? I am not so sure. When we are documenting somebody's career we should let secondary sources determine what is important to cover and what is insignificant in regards to somebody's career. Betty Logan ( talk) 08:06, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
I've asked for advice at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard#Citation of TV broadcast; I haven't dealt with TV citations in years, and it's possible my understanding no longer matches current policy interpretation. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ< 23:11, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
There's a new short film about Davis's sideline as an electronica DJ, of all things. News/review from BilliardsMovies.com: [8]. He's also apparently been doing a radio show for some time now. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ< 06:09, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
I'm not at all clear why this is 'strange'- should his whole life be about snooker? . he's well-known amongst musicians & fans alike as a supporter of the french band 'magma' & arranged for them to play in london simply because he wanted to see them himself. people who only know him from snooker would be surprised to see him on stage with kavus- I get that. but to those of us who also have music as a second career, it's the most normal thing.
duncanrmi ( talk) 00:52, 30 March 2021 (UTC)
There seems to be a dispute over Davis's professional status. An IP claims that his pro status didn't end in 2014 when he dropped off the main tour (and received a wild card to compete in certain events) while Montgomery15 contends that pro status is defined by having a full tour card. During his wildcard period Davis still received ranking points for the events he entered and was still listed in the rankings. If Davis was not the 103rd ranked professional player at the end of 2015/2016, then who was? At this stage of his career he was still playing in tour events, he was still getting ranking points and he still had a world ranking, so I agree with the IP in this instance that he was still effectively a professional player at this time. Betty Logan ( talk) 01:54, 5 January 2018 (UTC)
In this episode, Steve did not recount his "cheese sandwich" story. Perhaps it has been cut out of the episode? What is the story? Honeybadger69 ( talk) 23:13, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
It's OK I answered my own question, looks like it was in the extra bits - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrH76aKA564 Honeybadger69 ( talk) 23:21, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Epicgenius ( talk · contribs) 20:07, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
Hi
Lee Vilenski, I will take up this review. I'll read through this and leave some in-depth comments later.
epicgenius (
talk)
20:07, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not) |
---|
|
Overall: |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Lead:
The BBC's Sports Personality of the Year in 1988, he is the only snooker player to win the award.- the award of "BBC's Sports Personality of the Year"? This should probably be rephrased to reflect that.
Career
Davis was introduced to snooker by his father Bill, a keen player who took him to play at his local working men's club at age 12 and gave him an instructional book: How I Play Snooker by Joe Davis.- First, is Joe Davis related to them? Second, could this be placed into active voice, like "Davis's father Bill, a keen player, introduced him to snooker at age 12". Currently, the phrase "age 12" is attached to Bill, not Steve, and Bill didn't introduce Steve to snooker when Bill was 12 years old.
before losing to Alex Higgins}- typo
at the Crucible Theatre- might it be worthwhile to mention that the Crucible Theatre hosts the World Snooker Championship?
After failing to qualify for the World Snooker Championship for the first time in his professional career in 2001, he felt that retiring would be the easy thing to do;- According to source 60, "the easy thing to do" is part of his direct quote.
Despite having his best run at the World Championship for five years and reaching the quarter-finals for only the second time since 1994, this was his last appearance at the Crucible; he failed to qualify for the World Championship again before his retirement.[citation needed]
After a defeat by Craig Steadman 8–10 in the second round of the 2014 World Snooker Championship qualification, Davis finished the season outside the top 64 on the money list and dropped off the main professional tour after 36 years.- this is also not marked as such, but it needs a citation, too
He announced his retirement from professional snooker during a live 17 April 2016 BBC broadcast, citing the recent death of his father as the main reason.- I think it would be better if the date were put first, since this is like "burying the lead" of the paragraph. I.e. "During a live 17 April 2016 BBC broadcast, he announced his retirement from professional snooker"
Other sports
At Event 22 of the 2011 Grand Poker Series, Davis finished eighth and won $2,049.- is "Event" supposed to be capitalized or lowercase?
In other media
Davis has become known for his coolness and conduct in high-pressure situations.[1] His initial lack of emotional expression and monotonous interview style earned him a reputation as boring, and the satirical television series Spitting Image nicknamed him "Interesting".[154] Davis now plays on this image, and says it helped him gain public acceptance- this goes back and forth from present to past and back to present tense. And I thought he retired.
Davis has published a number of other books.- How many exactly?
Top 10 hit in the United Kingdom- on the UK Singles Chart?
Legacy
Davis won a record 81 professional titles and was the runner-up in 37 events. Twenty-eight of these titles were in ranking events. His modern-era record of six world titles has been broken only by Hendry, and his six UK Championship titles has been bettered only by Ronnie O'Sullivan. Davis compiled over 300 competitive centuries during his career.- I think it could stand to be smoothed out by combining the first two sentences, if it's related to being inducted into the Snooker Hall of Fame.
In the book Masters of the Baize, a detailed comparison and ranking of snooker professionals, Luke Williams and Paul Gadsby rated Davis as the third greatest snooker player of all time (behind Joe Davis and Stephen Hendry).- should this go after the career stats?
Career finals
Winner 38. 1989 Hong Kong Gold Cup Northern Ireland Alex Higginsdoes not have a source.
References
"Steve Davis Retires From Snooker – World Snooker". 17 April 2016.needs to be formatted with publisher
"Board of Directors". Matchroom Sport. Archived from the original on 9 May 2011. Retrieved 10 May 2011.and ref 13
"Steve Davis profile". matchroomsport.com. Archived from the original on 18 February 2008. Retrieved 25 February 2008.
worldsnooker.com. World Professional Billiards and Snooker Association.
>Everton, Clive.
That's all. I'll put this page on hold. epicgenius ( talk) 18:01, 10 July 2020 (UTC)
Hi! I'd like to take this article to FA, but there's a few stumbling blocks, if someone wouldn't mind giving me a little hand:
Please add additional issues/solutions you may find with this one. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ( talk • contribs) 10:21, 29 April 2021 (UTC)
Hi. In the introduction, the title MBE is preceded by "a", whereas elsewhere it's "an". If somebody could re-read the entire article to ensure consistency, that would be great. Splićanin ( talk) 04:18, 19 February 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Steve Davis article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2 |
![]() | Steve Davis is a former featured article candidate. Please view the links under Article milestones below to see why the nomination failed. For older candidates, please check the archive. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
![]() | Steve Davis has been listed as one of the Sports and recreation good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
![]() | Steve Davis is part of the 1985 World Snooker Championship final series, a good topic. This is identified as among the best series of articles produced by the Wikipedia community. If you can update or improve it, please do so. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
![]() | This article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to multiple WikiProjects. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
"Find sources" tools:
|
---|
Find sources:
Google (
books ·
news ·
scholar ·
free images ·
WP refs) ·
FENS ·
JSTOR ·
TWL |
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified 140 external links on Steve Davis. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{
source check}}
(last update: 5 June 2024).
Cheers.— InternetArchiveBot ( Report bug) 08:59, 10 May 2017 (UTC)
I am offering a fuller explanation here as to why I have reverted this edit by Diariser in response to the discussion at User_talk:SMcCandlish#Steve_Davis. I think it is probably better to continue a content discussion at the article talk page so the record is retained here, rather than in SMcCandlish's talk page archives [7].
I actually have a couple of problems with the edits. First of all Wikipedia is supposed to be a verifiable encyclopdia, not a snooker wiki. I am sure we all know interesting stuff that would enhance Wikipedia, but ultimately its credibility comes from having sufficient details to verify the information. I recommened that Diariser reads WP:Verifiability not truth. In fairness the result for this match is not difficult to source and that could indeed be included in the section (since it is already sourced in the results table), but the level of detail Diariser added is unwarranted IMO. This is a 200kb+ article that like so many snooker player articles (see Ronnie O'Sullivan) is in danger of turning into a giant match report. Do we really need to go into such specific detail about the matches themselves that have been non-defining in the context of somebody's career? When Davis put defending world champion and World number 1 John Higgins to bed in the 2011 world championship he pulled off one of the greatest finishes by any player of any era that I have ever seen, but we don't actually go into in the specifics. You can see the closing moments of the match here. The double on the brown to canon the blue into play is absolutely surreal, especially when you consider that if he misses he is most likely looking at a decider against Higgins. At the end of the day though while it is indisputably brilliant play it is not really defining in regards to his career so we don't go into specifics. Davis' maximum and his black ball defeat by Taylor in 1985 are the notable exceptions here because they have entered snooker folklore, but how many deciding frames has Davis won down the years, and how many times has he won frames needing snookers? It just seems a bit unbalanced to me that we devote more space to Davis beating Charlton needing a snooker early on in a tournament than what we do to what is possibly the only whitewash ever in a two-session final (mentioned in the preceding sentence). If that is indeed the case I would prefer to have more exposition about that.
Would this article be interesting for somebody who is only a casual viewer of snooker, or even someone who doesn't know about the game but is interested in learning more? I am not so sure. When we are documenting somebody's career we should let secondary sources determine what is important to cover and what is insignificant in regards to somebody's career. Betty Logan ( talk) 08:06, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
I've asked for advice at Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard#Citation of TV broadcast; I haven't dealt with TV citations in years, and it's possible my understanding no longer matches current policy interpretation. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ< 23:11, 30 October 2017 (UTC)
There's a new short film about Davis's sideline as an electronica DJ, of all things. News/review from BilliardsMovies.com: [8]. He's also apparently been doing a radio show for some time now. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ< 06:09, 23 November 2017 (UTC)
I'm not at all clear why this is 'strange'- should his whole life be about snooker? . he's well-known amongst musicians & fans alike as a supporter of the french band 'magma' & arranged for them to play in london simply because he wanted to see them himself. people who only know him from snooker would be surprised to see him on stage with kavus- I get that. but to those of us who also have music as a second career, it's the most normal thing.
duncanrmi ( talk) 00:52, 30 March 2021 (UTC)
There seems to be a dispute over Davis's professional status. An IP claims that his pro status didn't end in 2014 when he dropped off the main tour (and received a wild card to compete in certain events) while Montgomery15 contends that pro status is defined by having a full tour card. During his wildcard period Davis still received ranking points for the events he entered and was still listed in the rankings. If Davis was not the 103rd ranked professional player at the end of 2015/2016, then who was? At this stage of his career he was still playing in tour events, he was still getting ranking points and he still had a world ranking, so I agree with the IP in this instance that he was still effectively a professional player at this time. Betty Logan ( talk) 01:54, 5 January 2018 (UTC)
In this episode, Steve did not recount his "cheese sandwich" story. Perhaps it has been cut out of the episode? What is the story? Honeybadger69 ( talk) 23:13, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
It's OK I answered my own question, looks like it was in the extra bits - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrH76aKA564 Honeybadger69 ( talk) 23:21, 25 February 2020 (UTC)
GA toolbox |
---|
Reviewing |
Reviewer: Epicgenius ( talk · contribs) 20:07, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
Hi
Lee Vilenski, I will take up this review. I'll read through this and leave some in-depth comments later.
epicgenius (
talk)
20:07, 5 July 2020 (UTC)
GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not) |
---|
|
Overall: |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Lead:
The BBC's Sports Personality of the Year in 1988, he is the only snooker player to win the award.- the award of "BBC's Sports Personality of the Year"? This should probably be rephrased to reflect that.
Career
Davis was introduced to snooker by his father Bill, a keen player who took him to play at his local working men's club at age 12 and gave him an instructional book: How I Play Snooker by Joe Davis.- First, is Joe Davis related to them? Second, could this be placed into active voice, like "Davis's father Bill, a keen player, introduced him to snooker at age 12". Currently, the phrase "age 12" is attached to Bill, not Steve, and Bill didn't introduce Steve to snooker when Bill was 12 years old.
before losing to Alex Higgins}- typo
at the Crucible Theatre- might it be worthwhile to mention that the Crucible Theatre hosts the World Snooker Championship?
After failing to qualify for the World Snooker Championship for the first time in his professional career in 2001, he felt that retiring would be the easy thing to do;- According to source 60, "the easy thing to do" is part of his direct quote.
Despite having his best run at the World Championship for five years and reaching the quarter-finals for only the second time since 1994, this was his last appearance at the Crucible; he failed to qualify for the World Championship again before his retirement.[citation needed]
After a defeat by Craig Steadman 8–10 in the second round of the 2014 World Snooker Championship qualification, Davis finished the season outside the top 64 on the money list and dropped off the main professional tour after 36 years.- this is also not marked as such, but it needs a citation, too
He announced his retirement from professional snooker during a live 17 April 2016 BBC broadcast, citing the recent death of his father as the main reason.- I think it would be better if the date were put first, since this is like "burying the lead" of the paragraph. I.e. "During a live 17 April 2016 BBC broadcast, he announced his retirement from professional snooker"
Other sports
At Event 22 of the 2011 Grand Poker Series, Davis finished eighth and won $2,049.- is "Event" supposed to be capitalized or lowercase?
In other media
Davis has become known for his coolness and conduct in high-pressure situations.[1] His initial lack of emotional expression and monotonous interview style earned him a reputation as boring, and the satirical television series Spitting Image nicknamed him "Interesting".[154] Davis now plays on this image, and says it helped him gain public acceptance- this goes back and forth from present to past and back to present tense. And I thought he retired.
Davis has published a number of other books.- How many exactly?
Top 10 hit in the United Kingdom- on the UK Singles Chart?
Legacy
Davis won a record 81 professional titles and was the runner-up in 37 events. Twenty-eight of these titles were in ranking events. His modern-era record of six world titles has been broken only by Hendry, and his six UK Championship titles has been bettered only by Ronnie O'Sullivan. Davis compiled over 300 competitive centuries during his career.- I think it could stand to be smoothed out by combining the first two sentences, if it's related to being inducted into the Snooker Hall of Fame.
In the book Masters of the Baize, a detailed comparison and ranking of snooker professionals, Luke Williams and Paul Gadsby rated Davis as the third greatest snooker player of all time (behind Joe Davis and Stephen Hendry).- should this go after the career stats?
Career finals
Winner 38. 1989 Hong Kong Gold Cup Northern Ireland Alex Higginsdoes not have a source.
References
"Steve Davis Retires From Snooker – World Snooker". 17 April 2016.needs to be formatted with publisher
"Board of Directors". Matchroom Sport. Archived from the original on 9 May 2011. Retrieved 10 May 2011.and ref 13
"Steve Davis profile". matchroomsport.com. Archived from the original on 18 February 2008. Retrieved 25 February 2008.
worldsnooker.com. World Professional Billiards and Snooker Association.
>Everton, Clive.
That's all. I'll put this page on hold. epicgenius ( talk) 18:01, 10 July 2020 (UTC)
Hi! I'd like to take this article to FA, but there's a few stumbling blocks, if someone wouldn't mind giving me a little hand:
Please add additional issues/solutions you may find with this one. Best Wishes, Lee Vilenski ( talk • contribs) 10:21, 29 April 2021 (UTC)
Hi. In the introduction, the title MBE is preceded by "a", whereas elsewhere it's "an". If somebody could re-read the entire article to ensure consistency, that would be great. Splićanin ( talk) 04:18, 19 February 2023 (UTC)