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![]() | Text and/or other creative content from this version of Executive Order 11111 was copied or moved into Stand in the Schoolhouse Door with this edit. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
I thought I read somewhere that this was just a publicity exercise, and that the Feds and Wallace had agreed to have the students walk in the back door during his stand so that the media couldn't photograph them. Does anyone have a source for that? Heroeswithmetaphors ( talk) 07:48, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
Why did the general say "It's my sad duty..."? Was he a bigot too? 20.137.18.50 ( talk) 17:51, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
This is my pet peeve on Wikipedia - an otherwise historic article followed up by a list of random tidbits from frivolous media. Where do we draw the line? Obviously a documentary is notable and relevant, but a MadTV skit, or 2 minute scene in a movie? It just de-bases the entire article. Anthiety ( talk) 05:02, 17 May 2010 (UTC)
If I notice correctly, the two troopers on Wallace's left in the first photo have empty holsters. Were they expecting to be taken into custody by federal agents? knoodelhed ( talk) 16:53, 5 February 2013 (UTC)
Wallace has something hanging around his neck. What is it? Looks like some kind of electronic gadget, this might be relevant if it is some kind of recording device. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arjun53 ( talk • contribs) 10:45, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
This sentence: Katzenbach called President John F. Kennedy, who federalized the Alabama National Guard. confused me greatly. Eventually I decided that it must mean that Katzenbach telephoned JFK - is this correct? And federalized the Alabama National Guard - somehow JFK changed the status of the National Guard over the phone from state to federal? and this gave them greater authority? -- catslash ( talk) 19:30, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
Why leave out the Bob Dylan song?
Surely it was a significant needling at the time?
Anyone able to edit it into the article?
"Don’t stand in the doorway, don’t block up the hall"
Bob Dylan and George Wallace.
Bob Dylan is thought to have written The Times They Are A-Changin' some time in September / October 1963.
A few months earlier, on June 11, 1963, a national incident took place at the University of Alabama.
Two black students, Vivian Malone and James Hood, arrived at Foster Auditorium to register for classes. They were met by George Wallace, the Democratic Governor of Alabama, who blocked their entry by standing in the doorway in a symbolic attempt to keep his inaugural promise of "segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever" and stop the desegregation of schools.
This became known as the Stand in the Schoolhouse Door incident.
Bob Dylan was referencing Wallace's stand with the third stanza of his song:
Come senators, congressmen Please heed the call Don’t stand in the doorway Don’t block up the hall For he that gets hurt Will be he who has stalled There’s a battle outside and it is raging It’ll soon shake your windows and rattle your walls For the times they are a-changing
In 2011, George Wallace Jr. published book about his father, "The Man You Never Knew".
He explains in the book that his father first ran for governor in 1958 as a moderate, even getting support from the NAACP, and he lost. Four years later, he was the staunchest candidate on segregation because that's what brought out big crowds.
"To a large extent it's about the bargain he had to make — perhaps a faustian bargain — for the power that he wanted," wrote George Wallace Jr.
Excerpt from a review of the book:
"Wallace recalls that when he was 14 in 1965, his father stopped by one night and asked for a song. Wallace had just learned Bob Dylan's "The Times They Are A-Changin.'"
"The governor's face changed when his son got to the poignant lines, "Don't stand in the doorway. Don't block up the hall."
""I remember him turning to me with a startled look in his eyes. What was he thinking when he realized the lyric was about him?" Wallace asked."
— Preceding unsigned comment added by EdRicardo ( talk • contribs) 17:09, 14 January 2016 (UTC)
Done I found an article that detailed Wallace, Jr. talking about the incident and used that as a citation for a paragraph in the article. The book is a bit difficult to find.
Richard-of-Earth (
talk) 08:13, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
It's not quite true that no African-American was admitted before 1963. Although she didn't succeed in staying due to riots and administrative shenanigans leading to her expulsion, nevertheless some mention should be made of Autherine Lucy. Mathglot ( talk) 07:01, 14 April 2016 (UTC)
Executive Order 11111 has recently been created, covering much of the same ground as this article. I have prepared a merged version of the two articles at User:Bencherlite/sandbox1 and seek views on whether there is anything to be gained by keeping them apart. The full text of the order itself is on Wikisource already, so need not be included on Wikipedia as well. Bencherlite Talk 08:31, 12 May 2017 (UTC)
Only the first paragraph in EO, barring the final sentence, covers SITSD.So in other words, half of the article duplicates SITSD.
The rest covers the fallout of the Order and related executive orders. In other words, the rest of the article covers the fallout from the incident, and mentions one (not plural) related executive order.
As was said earlierYou mean, "as I said earlier".
It fulfils GNGbut that doesn't mean that it must be in a separate article - our readers are better served by learning about the incident and the aftermath in one article, rather than artificially splitting off part of the episode.
the proposed STATUTE also stated that pieces of legislation are notableWP:Notability (law) is a failed proposal and so is worthless for your arguments.
While STATUTE may not be a policy, it is a helpful guideline.No, it is a failed proposal and not even a guideline, let along a helpful one.
bit of overlapis in fact half of your new, short article - not so little as to warrant two treatments of the topic. I agree that the order is not mentioned in the current version of the article - it is in my merged version, which is what I'm inviting discussion about - but actually you should have put a link in SITSD to your article when creating it, otherwise how would people find out about it? It would be an orphan and no use to anyone. You have still failed to say what is wrong with the merged version, I see. And finally, are you saying that you will not be claiming WikiCup points for this DYK nomination? Bencherlite Talk 09:45, 12 May 2017 (UTC)
I have merged the articles. Bencherlite Talk 11:13, 24 May 2017 (UTC)
Hello! This is a note to let the editors of this article know that File:Vivian Malone registering.jpg will be appearing as picture of the day on June 11, 2017. You can view and edit the POTD blurb at Template:POTD/2017-06-11. If this article needs any attention or maintenance, it would be preferable if that could be done before its appearance on the Main Page. — Chris Woodrich ( talk) 03:21, 27 May 2017 (UTC)
SnowFire Please clearly explain to me why it is inappropriate for this specific article to use the parameter "side" from Template:Infobox civil conflict. According to the "Usage" section from that template, "side1/side2/side3 – optional – the parties participating in the conflict."
What is it about this conflict that makes it an exception? Is it the presence of military personnel and commanding officers? Your explanations on 11 June 2019 and 13 June 2019 do not clearly state why you think this article is an exception. Mitchumch ( talk) 09:18, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
The currently-employed {{ infobox civil conflict}} is inappropriate for this article; it should be changed (possibly to {{ infobox event}}) or removed. — Fourthords | =Λ= | 19:17, 21 October 2019 (UTC)
![]() | A fact from Stand in the Schoolhouse Door appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 2 March 2009, and was viewed approximately 6,542 times (
disclaimer) (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
| ![]() |
![]() | A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on June 11, 2011, June 11, 2013, June 11, 2016, June 11, 2019, and June 11, 2024. |
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
![]() | Text and/or other creative content from this version of Executive Order 11111 was copied or moved into Stand in the Schoolhouse Door with this edit. The former page's history now serves to provide attribution for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists. |
I thought I read somewhere that this was just a publicity exercise, and that the Feds and Wallace had agreed to have the students walk in the back door during his stand so that the media couldn't photograph them. Does anyone have a source for that? Heroeswithmetaphors ( talk) 07:48, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
Why did the general say "It's my sad duty..."? Was he a bigot too? 20.137.18.50 ( talk) 17:51, 11 June 2009 (UTC)
This is my pet peeve on Wikipedia - an otherwise historic article followed up by a list of random tidbits from frivolous media. Where do we draw the line? Obviously a documentary is notable and relevant, but a MadTV skit, or 2 minute scene in a movie? It just de-bases the entire article. Anthiety ( talk) 05:02, 17 May 2010 (UTC)
If I notice correctly, the two troopers on Wallace's left in the first photo have empty holsters. Were they expecting to be taken into custody by federal agents? knoodelhed ( talk) 16:53, 5 February 2013 (UTC)
Wallace has something hanging around his neck. What is it? Looks like some kind of electronic gadget, this might be relevant if it is some kind of recording device. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arjun53 ( talk • contribs) 10:45, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
This sentence: Katzenbach called President John F. Kennedy, who federalized the Alabama National Guard. confused me greatly. Eventually I decided that it must mean that Katzenbach telephoned JFK - is this correct? And federalized the Alabama National Guard - somehow JFK changed the status of the National Guard over the phone from state to federal? and this gave them greater authority? -- catslash ( talk) 19:30, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
Why leave out the Bob Dylan song?
Surely it was a significant needling at the time?
Anyone able to edit it into the article?
"Don’t stand in the doorway, don’t block up the hall"
Bob Dylan and George Wallace.
Bob Dylan is thought to have written The Times They Are A-Changin' some time in September / October 1963.
A few months earlier, on June 11, 1963, a national incident took place at the University of Alabama.
Two black students, Vivian Malone and James Hood, arrived at Foster Auditorium to register for classes. They were met by George Wallace, the Democratic Governor of Alabama, who blocked their entry by standing in the doorway in a symbolic attempt to keep his inaugural promise of "segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever" and stop the desegregation of schools.
This became known as the Stand in the Schoolhouse Door incident.
Bob Dylan was referencing Wallace's stand with the third stanza of his song:
Come senators, congressmen Please heed the call Don’t stand in the doorway Don’t block up the hall For he that gets hurt Will be he who has stalled There’s a battle outside and it is raging It’ll soon shake your windows and rattle your walls For the times they are a-changing
In 2011, George Wallace Jr. published book about his father, "The Man You Never Knew".
He explains in the book that his father first ran for governor in 1958 as a moderate, even getting support from the NAACP, and he lost. Four years later, he was the staunchest candidate on segregation because that's what brought out big crowds.
"To a large extent it's about the bargain he had to make — perhaps a faustian bargain — for the power that he wanted," wrote George Wallace Jr.
Excerpt from a review of the book:
"Wallace recalls that when he was 14 in 1965, his father stopped by one night and asked for a song. Wallace had just learned Bob Dylan's "The Times They Are A-Changin.'"
"The governor's face changed when his son got to the poignant lines, "Don't stand in the doorway. Don't block up the hall."
""I remember him turning to me with a startled look in his eyes. What was he thinking when he realized the lyric was about him?" Wallace asked."
— Preceding unsigned comment added by EdRicardo ( talk • contribs) 17:09, 14 January 2016 (UTC)
Done I found an article that detailed Wallace, Jr. talking about the incident and used that as a citation for a paragraph in the article. The book is a bit difficult to find.
Richard-of-Earth (
talk) 08:13, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
It's not quite true that no African-American was admitted before 1963. Although she didn't succeed in staying due to riots and administrative shenanigans leading to her expulsion, nevertheless some mention should be made of Autherine Lucy. Mathglot ( talk) 07:01, 14 April 2016 (UTC)
Executive Order 11111 has recently been created, covering much of the same ground as this article. I have prepared a merged version of the two articles at User:Bencherlite/sandbox1 and seek views on whether there is anything to be gained by keeping them apart. The full text of the order itself is on Wikisource already, so need not be included on Wikipedia as well. Bencherlite Talk 08:31, 12 May 2017 (UTC)
Only the first paragraph in EO, barring the final sentence, covers SITSD.So in other words, half of the article duplicates SITSD.
The rest covers the fallout of the Order and related executive orders. In other words, the rest of the article covers the fallout from the incident, and mentions one (not plural) related executive order.
As was said earlierYou mean, "as I said earlier".
It fulfils GNGbut that doesn't mean that it must be in a separate article - our readers are better served by learning about the incident and the aftermath in one article, rather than artificially splitting off part of the episode.
the proposed STATUTE also stated that pieces of legislation are notableWP:Notability (law) is a failed proposal and so is worthless for your arguments.
While STATUTE may not be a policy, it is a helpful guideline.No, it is a failed proposal and not even a guideline, let along a helpful one.
bit of overlapis in fact half of your new, short article - not so little as to warrant two treatments of the topic. I agree that the order is not mentioned in the current version of the article - it is in my merged version, which is what I'm inviting discussion about - but actually you should have put a link in SITSD to your article when creating it, otherwise how would people find out about it? It would be an orphan and no use to anyone. You have still failed to say what is wrong with the merged version, I see. And finally, are you saying that you will not be claiming WikiCup points for this DYK nomination? Bencherlite Talk 09:45, 12 May 2017 (UTC)
I have merged the articles. Bencherlite Talk 11:13, 24 May 2017 (UTC)
Hello! This is a note to let the editors of this article know that File:Vivian Malone registering.jpg will be appearing as picture of the day on June 11, 2017. You can view and edit the POTD blurb at Template:POTD/2017-06-11. If this article needs any attention or maintenance, it would be preferable if that could be done before its appearance on the Main Page. — Chris Woodrich ( talk) 03:21, 27 May 2017 (UTC)
SnowFire Please clearly explain to me why it is inappropriate for this specific article to use the parameter "side" from Template:Infobox civil conflict. According to the "Usage" section from that template, "side1/side2/side3 – optional – the parties participating in the conflict."
What is it about this conflict that makes it an exception? Is it the presence of military personnel and commanding officers? Your explanations on 11 June 2019 and 13 June 2019 do not clearly state why you think this article is an exception. Mitchumch ( talk) 09:18, 15 June 2019 (UTC)
The currently-employed {{ infobox civil conflict}} is inappropriate for this article; it should be changed (possibly to {{ infobox event}}) or removed. — Fourthords | =Λ= | 19:17, 21 October 2019 (UTC)