![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Taking a note from john Reid at WT:G, I'd like to expressly say that that the latest version of the article as of this posting, is by no means finished. This is a page created based on a recommendation found here. So, like John would say: edit this page. And no, I'm not askinmg others to do the work for me. This is my creation and I won't abandon it. I just want others to feel comfortable contributing. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 19:20, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Is it correct to list Stan Lee and Ditko as writers since they didn't write the films and this article refers only to the films?. Vicco Lizcano 18:27, 2 May 2007 (UTC) ( Hey! Listen!)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/6630521.stm Not solid enough on its' own, but for building the 'future' section... ThuranX 03:49, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
Will look for more. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 04:47, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
Proposed Merger of Spider-Man 4 to this article, until more definite information is released stating the film will come out. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 16:07, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
Above article is not appropriate to stand alone, being based on only one source and being underdeveloped due to its status. Proposed merger of this unfilmed version into the film series article. Information can be compressed and incorporated into Spider-Man film series#Development. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 17:38, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
No, I beleive that this should stay seperate, because they weren't involvedin making the 2002 movie.
The merge has been completed. I have compressed the content into a single full paragraph. If anyone feels that more from the original version needs to be included, feel free to visit the link, follow the redirect back, and look at the article history. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 12:46, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
broad comments:
-- Kalyan 08:13, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
I would like to propose a Cast and crew section that would talk about the involvement of the major cast and crew members. For example, Maguire and Dunst signed for three films, while Raimi signed on for one initially. I'm sure we can find other details of the consistency or change to the crew, such as the composer and the VFX supervisor. What do you think? It just seems that the article could use a little bit more prose. Additionally, the GA reviewer requested more images, but I'm not sure if that's possible for the film series -- maybe we can put a free image of Maguire or Raimi in this proposed section? It would show the face of Peter Parker for the article's purposes. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 10:51, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
I've removed /Film's mention of the Lizard being 95% likely to be in the film because this took place before Raimi expressed interest in what villain to be used. The measurement is null now, and the site's judgment does not seem any more dependable than FreezeDriedMovies.com's own speculation, or any other movie sites' future analysis, for that matter. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 10:52, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
The spiderman 4 villain will be carnage and this is proof
From the article: "Sony plans to release Spider-Man 4 in the summer of 2010." I think that's a little misleading considering the article that it's sourced from doesn't really say that. What do others think? - Joltman 11:18, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
“ | Should there be another Pirates, there is a natural place for it: 2010. Studios are starting to claim dates on that year as well, and as it stands it is beginning to look a lot like … well, 2007. Currently on the docket are Spider-Man 4 and Shrek 4, along with a Harry Potter 7. | ” |
How about actually getting the facts right? In reverting, you got every one of the facts wrong. Jesszuus. Point by point, guys:
In 1985, the bankrupt company Marvel Comics
Marvel wasn't anywhere NEAR bankruptcy in 1985. They'd just started an entire new animation division in LA and were doing as well as any comics company in the world.
auctioned rights to the comic book superhero Spider-Man to the independent film studio Cannon Films,
They didn't "auction" diddly squat. Cannon optioned the character(s) for five years. There was no "auction" because no one else was interested in doing comic book adaptations at that time, since Superman 3 had performed poorly. And Cannon was never a "studio," it was a company. The had offices, not a back lot and big barn-like soundstages. THAT's a studio. Your terminology is just wrong.
run by producer Menahem Golan and his cousin Yoram Globus, for $225,000
My goodness. You got something right. But this was an OPTION-- essentially a down-payment against a larger sum, should the movie be made.
The film rights would revert back to Marvel if a film was not made by April 1990.
Which could be put more simply by saying they bought a 5 year option.
Golan sought a script for the film adaptation, which was estimated to have a $15 million budget, and spent $2 million on ten different scripts.
The way this paragraph is written, half of this information is in the wrong place. Golan did not spend $2million on scripts; Cannon spent about $2million total on the project, including scripts, pre-production, the payment to Marvel, advertising, etc. There were not ten scripts, there were 8, plus a treatment by Leslie Stevens which never went to script. And every one of the scripts were, contractually, successive rewrites of the first screenplay. This includes the 3 "low-budget" versions written in 1989, as well as 2 drafts done via Golan at Columbia's request in 1989-90. The budget was estimated closer to $20million, with $15million for the below the line cost (a lot of money in 1985-88), five million ear-marked for above-the-line (cast, director, etc.)
The studio temporarily attached Poltergeist director Tobe Hooper to film Spider-Man, but Hooper was later replaced by director Joseph Zito. Leslie Stevens, the creator of The Outer Limits, was hired to write a script for the film under Hooper.
Bass-ackwards, and you just keep repeating this stuff. No offence, but you don't hire or attach a director before there's a story. Stevens was hired first. Hooper had a three picture deal with Cannon and was associated with the project for a couple of months (his name appeared on some trade ads). Stevens' story was shelved and never seen. John Brancato & Ted Newsom were hired at the suggestion of Stan Lee. Only after they (that is, us) submitted an original treatment & it was approved did Joe Zito come into the picture, just before we were asked to go to script.
Stevens created a different origin for Spider-Man than the comic book version, writing about a villain named Dr. Zork, a scientist who creates mutants and transforms his employee Peter Parker into a spider-man in an accident with an experiment.
What's funny is, you're using the name "Zork," which I made up in COMICS INTERVIEW years ago, because I couldn't remember the character's real name. I read Stevens' stuff years after we did our script, from a friend at Cannon, and it stunk. Only later after talking to Golan did I realize Stevens was just doing what he was told to do, since Golan never really understood the character.
Spider-Man creator Stan Lee originally provided his own treatment for Hooper, on which Zito hired writers Ted Newsom and John Brancato to adapt into a script.
No again. No one listened to Stan's suggestions, which rightly infuriated him, hence the stupid Stevens treatment, which had nothing to do with the comics. Zito didn't hire us; we had already written & submitted the approved story when Joe got the gig, fighting for it as hard as we did. (He had not realized Hooper had been slated to direct it.)
When Zito joined the project, the new director hired Barney Cohen to rewrite the script.
No again. We worked with Joe Zito. Barney was only hired after we turned in the first draft and it was approved. This was all reported in Variety & the Reporter, it's no secret.
The story, described to be 'pure, quintessential Spider-Man' had the superhero battle the villain Doctor Octopus.
That's a quote from Joe Zito in the CFQ article. I'd say he was right.
While no casting was done, Zito expressed interest in casting stunt man Scott Leva as Spider-Man and Bob Hoskins as Doc Ock, with Stan Lee appearing as Daily Bugle editor J. Jonah Jameson.
But it's all talk. Sure, Stan wanted to play Jameson (and always did); Joe wasn't keen on the idea. It's not as if this was some casting decision which'd been made. Tom Cruise was mooted for Peter/Spidey at one point, too (our suggestion). Scott Leva had done the ads for Cannon and appearances for Marvel, Zito liked him, and he would've been great. Adolph Caesar (as a cop) Peter Cushing (as a good-guy professor) and Katherine Hepburn (Aunt May) were discussed as well.
Due to a financial crisis with Cannon Films, the project shut down after $1.5 million had been spent on the pre-production process.
No again. The project was tabled because Cannon had acquired the rights to Superman from the Salkynds, and Masters of the Universe from Mattel. The money that would've gone into Spider-Man's budget drifted toward these two projects, both of which were considered (rightly or wrongly) more of a sure thing and more marketable. Cannon still had the rights to Spider-Man but now were looking at having to do it on a $7-8 million budget. THAT is when the series of rewrites occurred, severely limiting the action. Zito walked waway, knowing it wouldn't be much good at that budget. Albert Pyun stepped in (he had done such a wonderful job on Captain America...)
And the project hardly "shut down." The prep work was already done. In 1989, Golan and Globus split when Pathè bought out Cannon; as "21st Century," Golan hauled out the original screenplay (which was all ready to go) and pre-sold TV rights, then went to Columbia for the bulk of the budget in exchange for theatrical rights. The script-- all the scripts, actually, AND all the pre-production sketches, AND the budget work and everything else-- then went instead to Carolco (which released all its pictures through Columbia anyway.)
It isn't all that hard to understand. Continued revision to this screwed-up version of the facts doesn't help clear it up. Refer to Hiltzik's LA TIMES article (cited below), Sheldon Teitelbaum's CINEFANTASTIQUE article, and a COMICS INTERVIEW issue from 1990, where both Stan Lee and yours truly tell the story. And as for this exchange: No, I beleive that this should stay seperate, because they weren't involvedin making the 2002 movie. :But they didn't make any movie. This is about the development of a Spider-Man movie, not the development of Sam Raimi's movie.
There's a direct and publically documented line of descent from the Cannon era to Carolco & Cameron (links to the original script and the "Cameron rewrite" below), and from Carolco/Cameron to MGM/UA and then to Columbia, which acquired the "Cameron material"-- i.e., the screenplay (below) and his subsequent "Electro" treatment. So it's not like there were a bunch of separate Spider-Man" projects-- it's just that this had the gestation period of an old elephant.
http://www.dailyscript.com/scripts/SpiderMan_the_original.doc
http://www.dailyscript.com/scripts/spider_man_cohen_newson_cameron_8_4_93draft.html Ted Newsom 04:39, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
The Michael Hiltzik article in the LA TIMES SUNDAY MAGAZINE and the Sheldon Teitelbaum article in CFQ are quoted and sourced; they got it right. Guys, none of your arguments address my major complaint-- that the entry is factually inaccurate, even by wikipedia standards, and by standards of fact and grammarical clarity. The odd standards here use thrice-told on-line "reporting" as "verifiable" fact, as if something published on the net is accurate by virtue of computer accessibility. That's not true. As you all know, repetition does not make something correct. And if you do buy into this standard, then why would you not accept links to word-for-word online copies of the original manuscripts as legitimate references? (They are both, in fact, legitimate, as is the Cameron treatment, available on line as well. And, yes, I am who I say I am.) If you don't want to believe me or think there's some wacky conflict of interest, OK: but fannish devotion to an ill-written & erroneous entry is even worse, particularly when the correct facts are cited & linked within the overall article itself. The irony of the challenge to me-- i.e., a conflict of interest-- is that quite of few of the cited sources (like the TIMES & CFQ articles I mentioned) used me as a source in the first place, as well as documents I provided to the authors involved. Witness the reference to "Dr. Zork," which was not the character's name in the Leslie Stevens treatment. Actually, I think the first reference to the character was as "Dr. Zyrex," another made-up name, in the piece in David Kraft's COMICS INTERVIEW magazine, which also had interviews with Spidey guys Erik Larsen, Todd McFarland and Stan Lee, who discussed the then-current (1990) Columbia option on Spidey. (Do we discount the Spidey-movie references Stan made in his interview because he's got a potential conflict of interest, or doesn't this kick in unless he posts here himself?) Ted Newsom 20:29, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
How about we start with the first line and go sequentially through the thing? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvel_comics Please tell me where in this article it says Marvel was near bankruptcy in 1985. Cheers. Ted Newsom 09:47, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
I am trying to trace the course of Marvel Comics in the 1980s and 1990s. According to the article "Marvel Comics enters a whole New World" in the
Chicago Sun-Times on
November 21,
1986, "New World Pictures Ltd. yesterday bought Marvel Comics for $50 million and added the world's largest comic book publisher and its stable of fantastic characters to its line-up of teen-age entertainments. The purchase from Cadence Industries Corp. comes as America's $175 million-a-year comic-book industry is enjoying a boom after decades of fighting a losing battle against television... Marvel, whose action characters Spiderman [sic] and the X-Men help the firm lead the industry, last year had sales of $73 million. New World said it expects Marvel to post a substantial sales increase in 1986." I backtracked a little bit and found the following: "Starting in the latter part of the 1960s, Mr. Lee's coveted library of some 3,000 characters passed through the hands of a series of owners. Mr. Goodman sold out to a publicly held conglomerate called Cadence Industries. In the mid-1980s, when Cadence's assets were spun off, Marvel was acquired by Hollywood film studio New World Entertainment-the maker of such TV shows as The Wonder Years." From Phyllis Furman (
1997-04-28). "PERELMAN'S TANGLED WEB: FINANCIER'S HUBRIS PLUNGES MARVEL INTO BANKRUPTCY, RUINING A CULTURAL ICON". Crain's New York Business. {{
cite news}}
: Check date values in: |date=
(
help) Perhaps the spinning off of the assets was misinterpreted by Business Week, and I think that the Wasko book uses BW to mention that information, considering the similar recitation of facts in both sources. —
Erik (
talk •
contrib) -
15:46, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
I think you can pretty much throw the Janet Wasko thing out. It doesn't sound like SHE was using primary sources. Your other lengthy quote shows what I've said, which is that Marvel was financially sound up until Perlman bought out the company from Cadence... which was the point I was making, that the reference was faulty & untrue. The big comic book recession hadn't hit yet. Due respect to Ms. Wasko, covering this wacky business is not like just any old business. Maybe she's better at writing about leveraged buyouts or something. And remember-- this is just the first sentence of the entry in question... Ted Newsom 04:19, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Perhaps "bid" was misinterpreted to mean that an auction took place. What would be better terminology? Also, can a reliable source be found that describes the type of company that Cannon Films was? — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 16:01, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Regarding a desciption of what kind of company Cannon was-- there's a book that details the whole thing, incluing a description of thir various locations (i.e., offices). Can't recall the title; sorry.
As for how to phrase it? Simple. Just say what happened. "Independent film company Cannon Films, run by producer Menahem Golan and his cousin, Yoram Globus, optioned the Spider-Man movie rights from Marvel in 1985, for a total of $225,000, to be paid out over the length of the five-year option." [As widely reported, a late payment by Golan in 1989 had Marvel huffing that the contract was therefore null & void; they lost the argument, and Golan held the rights.] Ted Newsom 04:29, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
{{
cite book}}
: Unknown parameter |month=
ignored (
help)"According to Variety, in 1985, Menahem Golan and Yoram Globus's Cannon Films was the first to obtain the film rights to Spider-Man, to which they attached Invasion USA and Missing in Action director Joseph Zito and even placed ads in trade publications announcing the 'event' film..." (more here) — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 16:00, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Erik, wherever they're getting their information is clearly 2nd or 3rd hand (you see the problem?) The original Cannon trade announcements-- in Variety and the Hollywood Reporter-- came out in early 1985, with Tobe Hooper's name listed as director, Leslie Stevens as the writer. Subsequent to that, in autumn of 1985, John & I were hired at the suggestion of Stan Lee (ref: Comics Interview Magazine, 1989, interviews w/Lee, Newsom; reprinted in Comics Interview Super Special 1990). That winter, with much bigger, 2-page ads in the Weekly Variety & Reporter (I've got one framed on the wall in front of me, btw), Newsom & Brancato were listed as writers, with Joe Zito as director. And months after that, the name of Barney Cohen was added to "Written by." Now, even the quote you reproduce is dicey. Regarding the veracity of this quote you offer, I doubt that Variety EVER said "Cannon was the first to obtain film rights," because it isn't true. Because prior to Cannon, Roger Corman had an option on the property (hence the connection to the abortive Fantastic 4). That shows you how unpopular comic book properties were, because Corman never shelled out substantial dough for literary propeties in his life, so the dough must've been way less than even Cannon's price.
That said, the guy summarizes the saga pretty well, with a couple of exceptions. He makes the error in assuming the Carolco era was distinct from the Cannon/21st Century stuff, which is untrue. For one thing, the industry source Baseline Hollywood reported (in info also published weekly in both the trades) that "Spider-Man" was being made by Carolco, 21st Century and Lightstorm, all in conjunction; both Cameron and Neil Ruttenberg were listed as screenwriters. Neil Ruttenberg had rewritten the script for Golan/21st Century in Dec. 1989/Jan 1990, when the project was presented to Columbia; Neil has never worked for Carolco or met Cameron, ergo his script (and the others) were at Carolco, otherwise there is no explanation for his name to be listed on Baseline 5 years after his job. For another, Variety reported on September 1, 1993, that Cameron (then finishing True Lies) had recently delivered a completed screenplay to Carolco, which dovetails precisely to the date(s) on the alleged Cameron screenplay, "director's revision July 24, 1993," and "Third Draft, August 4, 1993." From reading Lichtenfield's summary, one would assume that Columbia and Marvel were the only players in the tail end of the story, but that's not the case, either. Columbia acquired a perpetual option on all previous scripts (ref: Carolco Bankrupcy Records, Federal Archives, Western Division) and excersized its option on the "Cameron material," hence Columbia's acquisition of the "Cameron" screenplay and the subsequent treatment. Those items were the property of MGM/UA (via acquisition), not Marvel. And as you know, it was the Cameron treatment which was the basis of Koepp's first draft script. Ted Newsom 04:11, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Hey, pace, BN. I read the stuff you recommended, and also the notes on "Citing oneself": Editing in an area in which you have professional or academic expertise is not, in itself, a conflict of interest. Using material you yourself have written or published is allowed within reason, but only if it is notable and conforms to the content policies. I think I can handle that. My name is on the linked copy of our first draft, and it's authentic; my name & 4 others are on the linked copy of the later draft, and it's authentic. I don't think I'm disqualified under "Financial" either (just in case), since nobody at Wiki is paying me and I don't stand to derive income or status by keeping things factually correct. Likewise, there is no ongoing court case regarding the subject. And I don't see a great deal of self-promotion in my stuff, since I'm also promoting the 11 other guys who were involved over 15 years. Yes, I understand about sourcing. The problem I have with the entry if exactly what the Wiki guidelines caution AGAINST-- citing A and B, and "therefore" C-- except that A & B are innaccurate and not primary sources. Erik's book quote, for example, has a writer misquoting Variety, which gives the sentence superficial credibility, but in fact the quote is quoting something ELSE quoting Variety. Ted Newsom 05:03, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for believing who I am, Erik; I was begining not to cast a shadow. But you see, it IS 20 years down the road, and the information is already grossly distorted-- hence my changes in the first place. And very few of the sources presently cited -- with that one neat exception you just posted which gets many of the business deals right-- seem to have even bothered to read the trades, look at the published ads, read interviews that directly quote those involved, or do anything but repeat twice-told tales. Hence you get the "telephone game" result of screwy history.
I'm not sure the complex facts would be that terribly interesting to more than three people. Maybe they would be. One of these daze. Ted Newsom 18:27, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
(Which, by the way, was not a line we gave Doc Ock. Our script had a jamoke in a junkyard saying it.) So... the history of the pre-Columbian artifacts is semi-straight, and, I think, done by the Wikipedia house rules. It's based on published information, verifiable by anyone with a library card and some time to spare. Unlike the previous entry, it's not based on news stories that are five or six steps removed from the source. Pullitzer-prize winning investigative reporter Mike Hiltzik, who wrote the LA TIMES piece (March 24, 2002, and his previous LA Times piece a year earlier) talked to the players in this drama first-hand, which means these are primary sources (Joe Zito, Barney Cohen, Ethan Wiley, Ted Newsom, Neil Ruttenberg, Frank La Loggia, Scott Rosenberg, and Rae Santini of Cameron's Lightstorm Company-- and Carolco before that). Ed Gross wrote an entire book on the comic character, Spider-Man Confidential (at my urging, to tell the truth) and talked directly with primary sources Zito, Newsom, Ruttenberg, Cohen, plus John Brancato, has interviewed Stan Lee numerous times, and had access to every version of the script from the first draft through the final shooting script. With, I think, one internet-link exception, all the facts are sourced from printed material, not ephemeral cyberspace sources. And, you know, I don't think it's boring. Ted Newsom 08:18, 1 November 2007 (UTC) Still having trouble formatting, particularly the link to the SEC document. Ted Newsom 22:16, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Doesn't anybody else think it's idiotic to list all three Spider-Man movies as if it's one film? I mean, a running time of 388 minutes... that helps absolutely no reader understand the subject. It's not as if you could list the comic Spider-Man and say it's 456,972,219 pages long. And totalling the grosses makes little sense either. Ted Newsom 05:13, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
I think the heading "Tangled Web of Litigation" sounds very unprofessional. Do puns like this really belong in an encyclopedia? Let's try to not make Wikipedia seem like a joke. – bse3 ( talk • contribs • count • logs) 01:16, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
I heard in an interview that Sam Raimi would help James Vanderbilt writing spider-man 4, so i changed the
"writers: David Koepp (spider-Man 1)
... Sam Raimi (spider-Man 3) ..."
to
"writers: David Koepp (spider-man 1)
... Sam Raimi (spider-man 3 & 4) ...
ok? 194.210.67.136 ( talk) 17:04, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
I'm not sure what interview you mean, because Raimi said it's up to Vanderbilt now where the franchise goes in a Comic Book Resources piece. Alientraveller ( talk) 17:17, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
Hey, when readin the "future of the franchise" part, I realised there's a huge mistake, for you are confusing Spider-Man 4 with the Venom spinoff. The following sentences should be referring to Venom and not spiderman 4: The studio commissioned Jacob Aaron Estes to write a script, but rejected it the following year. Sony announced that in addition to a new director and writer, they wanted to replace Topher Grace in the lead, as they felt he was unable to "carry" a blockbuster.[40] In September 2008, Paul Wernick and Rhett Reese (Sony's upcoming Zombieland) signed on to write.[32]. That's all (BTW, I´m Franshu, but I'm too lazy for loggin in right now, lol).
190.226.89.19 (
talk)
03:29, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Found this... some more sm4 news, although not pretty much, maybe it should be added like: "in an interview to 'blog talk radio' James Vanderbilt has said that once the strike is over he will start working on the script"
http://www.comics2film.com/index.php?a=story&b=31006 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.155.221.213 ( talk • contribs)
Really we wont be alive by then, and im almost sure Sam Rammi will be dead..yeah —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.255.5.164 ( talk) 07:28, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
In the "development hell" part, there is written:
In 1996, Carolco, 21st Century, and Marvel went bankrupt.
what does that mean? I don't know much about history of Marvel Comics, but I didn't know they ever went bankrupt - but I may be easily wrong -- Have a nice day. Running 21:48, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
please someone add this...
http://www.cinematical.com/2008/05/16/scoop-spider-man-4-and-5-might-be-shot-at-the-same-time/
looks like james vanderbilt is writing both 4 & 5 and they will be shot at the same time!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.155.221.158 ( talk) 09:58, 17 May 2008 (UTC)
IDK if this is trustful source... but I added it here to see...
http://www.iesb.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4971&Itemid=99 82.155.223.118 ( talk) 10:25, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
In the first movie, Eddie Brock, was portrayed by, R.C. Everbeck. I would like for that to be added to the cast and characters section of the page. You can also add the fact that his scenes were deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jagfan71 ( talk • contribs)
This article is wholly unnecessary, as, unlike say Star Wars or Lord of the Rings, these films are not treated as a complete whole; rather, an initial film followed by sequels when popularity warrants it. The use of the term film serial in the lead is highly inaccurate as well. WesleyDodds 00:38, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
No, what is rumor is "Spider-Man 4 will happen", but what is verifiable fact is "Sony has expressed an interest in making more sequels". The former, again, is a rumor, it's unsubstantiated talk. The latter is verifiable, by reliable sources, that Sony does indeed want to make more films. Whether that happens or not, only time will tell. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 02:01, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
(Edit conflict) I think we have different definitions of rumors. Rumors, from my understanding, are completely unsubstantiated bits of information (such as Sarah Michelle Gellar being in The Dark Knight). The studio entered talks with Koepp to write a screenplay, and the studio folks themselves have repeatedly mentioned the projects being in production. It's not enough to start up these future film articles, but it's certainly adequate discussion for inclusion. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 02:02, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
I know what you were stating, but my point was that the quality of Spider-Man 3, and the amount of information that it already contains (and is only going to grow) means that information pertaining to the series as a whole would not be beneficial there. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 12:23, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
For the record, Star Wars was never meant to be a film serial. The first film was, initially, a "film followed by sequels when popularity warranted it." Only later did Lucas decide to go ahead with the idea of a serial. 205.250.102.212 ( talk) 00:18, 17 November 2008 (UTC)
As part of the WikiProject Good Articles, we're doing sweeps to go over all of the current GAs and see if they still meet the GA criteria. I went through the article and made various changes, please look them over. I believe the article currently meets the criteria and should remain listed as a Good article. Altogether the article is well-written and is still in great shape after its passing in 2007. Continue to improve the article making sure all new information is properly sourced and neutral. It would be beneficial to further expand the home media releases, and see if there are any more recent stories in the news. I would also recommend updating the access dates of the sources. I fixed several dead links, but was unable to fix one of them, so it would be beneficial if a new source could be found. If you have any questions, let me know on my talk page and I'll get back to you as soon as I can. I have updated the article history to reflect this review. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 ( talk • contrib) 19:04, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
I'm taking it down because: it must be from Spiderman 1 because you can clearly see the twin towers in the reflection on his mask. And besides, it's highly unlikely they'd release a teaser poster before they began filming. 96.25.80.203 ( talk) 17:18, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Spider-Man-4-Teaser-Poster-UPDATED-13408.html
Apparently the poster on display is completely fake and fan-made, and Sony had nothing to do with it? xD 68.179.133.176 ( talk) 04:15, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
Someone keeps creating Spiderman 4 page without any sources. Could someone watch that page. -- Gman124 talk 18:26, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
Why is there Box Office Revenue posted for Spiderman 4? The source says it was last retrieved on June 9, 2011, and the citation just links to the Box Office Mojo page for Spiderman 3. The Box Office Mojo page says nothing about Spiderman 4, or even any predicted revenue. Dano112358 ( talk) 04:08, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
Really, an article about a canon of films should have links to the films readily available - they are not in the side bar, nor the abstract - they should be put in one of these. Or at least a link to halfway down the page where they are first linked. Betaben ( talk) 18:45, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
Spider-Man 4 is coming soon to theatres and IMAX on May 6, 2011. AMC/IMAX Theatres is now offically open. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.255.83.27 ( talk) 01:44, 17 November 2009 (UTC)
Dagens nyheter (Means Daily News), one of Sweden's most respected newspapers published this today: http://www.dn.se/kultur-noje/film-tv/spindelmannen-byter-flickvan-1.1020070 In short, it says that Anne Hathaway will appear as M.J, or another girl friend of Spider-Man. I'm not sure about Star Magazines credability, which is cited as the source, but shouldn't it be mentioned?
-- 81.235.148.197 ( talk) 18:57, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
Anne's been dropped, so I would have that removed. 173.26.19.206 ( talk) 02:16, 10 January 2010 (UTC)
There is information on certain websites that claim they know the villain/villains for the upcoming film, Spider-Man 4. Yet the problem with these is that they say that they "know a source" on the inside, or that "a source very close to the film" told them the information which they claim is the real deal, yet not one of these sites have specifically cited a source. I know, I check for new info on this film and specifically attempt to locate cited sources, to which there is none. Therefore, the information is not a matter of fact, and only a matter of speculations. In these regards, the information on this page reflecting John Malkovich and Anne Hathaway somehow being "officially" attached to the film is not proven and is speculation only, and also the accounts of the villains being The Vulture and Vulturess or Black Cat are also untrue, as the script is currently being rewritten yet again. This info is misleading, it is simply not true. None of this info is official, and for these reasons, should be removed completely.
- Viperpulse ( talk) 22:41, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
I think that the Spider-man 4 section in this article should be split and givin its own article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.236.149.114 ( talk) 23:14, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
Can some help me with editing, news on no Maguire, Ramini-- Chard513 ( talk) 23:46, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
Some sites are now saying the film has been cancelled and there will be a reboot planned for 2012. I'm not sure how reputable the sources are.
http://www.superherohype.com/news/spider-mannews.php?id=8976 http://www.deadline.com/hollywood/urgent-spider-man-4-scrapped-as-is-raimi-and-cast-out-franchise-reboot-planned/ 86.43.176.37 ( talk) 23:10, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
Seems a bit off the beaten path for this page. If anything, it should go in the Bond series pages and not this. These sorts of toss-ups in the movie industry happen all of the time. I don't understand why this one's listed in here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.84.191.230 ( talk) 07:53, 25 December 2009 (UTC)
Without the rights-swap between the studios, the Columbia film never would have happened. It was the keystone of solving an intricate problem.
75.36.125.16 (
talk)
10:14, 26 January 2010 (UTC)Ted Newsom
here's the excerpt that's wrong: "Venom will run as its own movie and Disney Studios will produce the film.[60]" if you follow the link to the source, you'll find absolutely no mention of disney studios. infact, the article clearly states that sony/columbia will be still on the film, as they still have rights to it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.31.222.4 ( talk) 04:40, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
I'm wondering if it's premature to add the section to the table specifically for Spider Man 4; it's not due out until 2011 or 2012, depending on where you read. So there may not be any info in those fields for a very long time. Would it be better to wait until there's more concrete info available? Millahnna (mouse) talk 22:42, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Sony's official site says May 2011 will see the launch of the 4th movie, but the article only mentions 2012 at the moment.. - Philwiki ( talk) 11:42, 29 April 2010 (UTC)
There's been absolutely no news, except for news that they are still doing it ( here). Should that be noted in the article? ggctuk (2005) ( talk) 19:06, 4 July 2010 (UTC)
I have added to the sub-article about Spiderman 4 about Bruce Campbell's role in the film. Rio de Janiero God ( talk) 10:30, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
I have created a sandbox containing any information related to the Spider-Man reboot for future benefit of it becoming a article. Any updates of that particular topic and renovations of the userspace can be done here. Happy editing. Jhenderson 777 20:52, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
{{
cite news}}
: Check date values in: |date=
(
help)
![]() | This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page. |
Taking a note from john Reid at WT:G, I'd like to expressly say that that the latest version of the article as of this posting, is by no means finished. This is a page created based on a recommendation found here. So, like John would say: edit this page. And no, I'm not askinmg others to do the work for me. This is my creation and I won't abandon it. I just want others to feel comfortable contributing. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 19:20, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
Is it correct to list Stan Lee and Ditko as writers since they didn't write the films and this article refers only to the films?. Vicco Lizcano 18:27, 2 May 2007 (UTC) ( Hey! Listen!)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/6630521.stm Not solid enough on its' own, but for building the 'future' section... ThuranX 03:49, 7 May 2007 (UTC)
Will look for more. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 04:47, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
Proposed Merger of Spider-Man 4 to this article, until more definite information is released stating the film will come out. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 16:07, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
Above article is not appropriate to stand alone, being based on only one source and being underdeveloped due to its status. Proposed merger of this unfilmed version into the film series article. Information can be compressed and incorporated into Spider-Man film series#Development. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 17:38, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
No, I beleive that this should stay seperate, because they weren't involvedin making the 2002 movie.
The merge has been completed. I have compressed the content into a single full paragraph. If anyone feels that more from the original version needs to be included, feel free to visit the link, follow the redirect back, and look at the article history. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 12:46, 8 June 2007 (UTC)
broad comments:
-- Kalyan 08:13, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
I would like to propose a Cast and crew section that would talk about the involvement of the major cast and crew members. For example, Maguire and Dunst signed for three films, while Raimi signed on for one initially. I'm sure we can find other details of the consistency or change to the crew, such as the composer and the VFX supervisor. What do you think? It just seems that the article could use a little bit more prose. Additionally, the GA reviewer requested more images, but I'm not sure if that's possible for the film series -- maybe we can put a free image of Maguire or Raimi in this proposed section? It would show the face of Peter Parker for the article's purposes. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 10:51, 29 June 2007 (UTC)
I've removed /Film's mention of the Lizard being 95% likely to be in the film because this took place before Raimi expressed interest in what villain to be used. The measurement is null now, and the site's judgment does not seem any more dependable than FreezeDriedMovies.com's own speculation, or any other movie sites' future analysis, for that matter. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 10:52, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
The spiderman 4 villain will be carnage and this is proof
From the article: "Sony plans to release Spider-Man 4 in the summer of 2010." I think that's a little misleading considering the article that it's sourced from doesn't really say that. What do others think? - Joltman 11:18, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
“ | Should there be another Pirates, there is a natural place for it: 2010. Studios are starting to claim dates on that year as well, and as it stands it is beginning to look a lot like … well, 2007. Currently on the docket are Spider-Man 4 and Shrek 4, along with a Harry Potter 7. | ” |
How about actually getting the facts right? In reverting, you got every one of the facts wrong. Jesszuus. Point by point, guys:
In 1985, the bankrupt company Marvel Comics
Marvel wasn't anywhere NEAR bankruptcy in 1985. They'd just started an entire new animation division in LA and were doing as well as any comics company in the world.
auctioned rights to the comic book superhero Spider-Man to the independent film studio Cannon Films,
They didn't "auction" diddly squat. Cannon optioned the character(s) for five years. There was no "auction" because no one else was interested in doing comic book adaptations at that time, since Superman 3 had performed poorly. And Cannon was never a "studio," it was a company. The had offices, not a back lot and big barn-like soundstages. THAT's a studio. Your terminology is just wrong.
run by producer Menahem Golan and his cousin Yoram Globus, for $225,000
My goodness. You got something right. But this was an OPTION-- essentially a down-payment against a larger sum, should the movie be made.
The film rights would revert back to Marvel if a film was not made by April 1990.
Which could be put more simply by saying they bought a 5 year option.
Golan sought a script for the film adaptation, which was estimated to have a $15 million budget, and spent $2 million on ten different scripts.
The way this paragraph is written, half of this information is in the wrong place. Golan did not spend $2million on scripts; Cannon spent about $2million total on the project, including scripts, pre-production, the payment to Marvel, advertising, etc. There were not ten scripts, there were 8, plus a treatment by Leslie Stevens which never went to script. And every one of the scripts were, contractually, successive rewrites of the first screenplay. This includes the 3 "low-budget" versions written in 1989, as well as 2 drafts done via Golan at Columbia's request in 1989-90. The budget was estimated closer to $20million, with $15million for the below the line cost (a lot of money in 1985-88), five million ear-marked for above-the-line (cast, director, etc.)
The studio temporarily attached Poltergeist director Tobe Hooper to film Spider-Man, but Hooper was later replaced by director Joseph Zito. Leslie Stevens, the creator of The Outer Limits, was hired to write a script for the film under Hooper.
Bass-ackwards, and you just keep repeating this stuff. No offence, but you don't hire or attach a director before there's a story. Stevens was hired first. Hooper had a three picture deal with Cannon and was associated with the project for a couple of months (his name appeared on some trade ads). Stevens' story was shelved and never seen. John Brancato & Ted Newsom were hired at the suggestion of Stan Lee. Only after they (that is, us) submitted an original treatment & it was approved did Joe Zito come into the picture, just before we were asked to go to script.
Stevens created a different origin for Spider-Man than the comic book version, writing about a villain named Dr. Zork, a scientist who creates mutants and transforms his employee Peter Parker into a spider-man in an accident with an experiment.
What's funny is, you're using the name "Zork," which I made up in COMICS INTERVIEW years ago, because I couldn't remember the character's real name. I read Stevens' stuff years after we did our script, from a friend at Cannon, and it stunk. Only later after talking to Golan did I realize Stevens was just doing what he was told to do, since Golan never really understood the character.
Spider-Man creator Stan Lee originally provided his own treatment for Hooper, on which Zito hired writers Ted Newsom and John Brancato to adapt into a script.
No again. No one listened to Stan's suggestions, which rightly infuriated him, hence the stupid Stevens treatment, which had nothing to do with the comics. Zito didn't hire us; we had already written & submitted the approved story when Joe got the gig, fighting for it as hard as we did. (He had not realized Hooper had been slated to direct it.)
When Zito joined the project, the new director hired Barney Cohen to rewrite the script.
No again. We worked with Joe Zito. Barney was only hired after we turned in the first draft and it was approved. This was all reported in Variety & the Reporter, it's no secret.
The story, described to be 'pure, quintessential Spider-Man' had the superhero battle the villain Doctor Octopus.
That's a quote from Joe Zito in the CFQ article. I'd say he was right.
While no casting was done, Zito expressed interest in casting stunt man Scott Leva as Spider-Man and Bob Hoskins as Doc Ock, with Stan Lee appearing as Daily Bugle editor J. Jonah Jameson.
But it's all talk. Sure, Stan wanted to play Jameson (and always did); Joe wasn't keen on the idea. It's not as if this was some casting decision which'd been made. Tom Cruise was mooted for Peter/Spidey at one point, too (our suggestion). Scott Leva had done the ads for Cannon and appearances for Marvel, Zito liked him, and he would've been great. Adolph Caesar (as a cop) Peter Cushing (as a good-guy professor) and Katherine Hepburn (Aunt May) were discussed as well.
Due to a financial crisis with Cannon Films, the project shut down after $1.5 million had been spent on the pre-production process.
No again. The project was tabled because Cannon had acquired the rights to Superman from the Salkynds, and Masters of the Universe from Mattel. The money that would've gone into Spider-Man's budget drifted toward these two projects, both of which were considered (rightly or wrongly) more of a sure thing and more marketable. Cannon still had the rights to Spider-Man but now were looking at having to do it on a $7-8 million budget. THAT is when the series of rewrites occurred, severely limiting the action. Zito walked waway, knowing it wouldn't be much good at that budget. Albert Pyun stepped in (he had done such a wonderful job on Captain America...)
And the project hardly "shut down." The prep work was already done. In 1989, Golan and Globus split when Pathè bought out Cannon; as "21st Century," Golan hauled out the original screenplay (which was all ready to go) and pre-sold TV rights, then went to Columbia for the bulk of the budget in exchange for theatrical rights. The script-- all the scripts, actually, AND all the pre-production sketches, AND the budget work and everything else-- then went instead to Carolco (which released all its pictures through Columbia anyway.)
It isn't all that hard to understand. Continued revision to this screwed-up version of the facts doesn't help clear it up. Refer to Hiltzik's LA TIMES article (cited below), Sheldon Teitelbaum's CINEFANTASTIQUE article, and a COMICS INTERVIEW issue from 1990, where both Stan Lee and yours truly tell the story. And as for this exchange: No, I beleive that this should stay seperate, because they weren't involvedin making the 2002 movie. :But they didn't make any movie. This is about the development of a Spider-Man movie, not the development of Sam Raimi's movie.
There's a direct and publically documented line of descent from the Cannon era to Carolco & Cameron (links to the original script and the "Cameron rewrite" below), and from Carolco/Cameron to MGM/UA and then to Columbia, which acquired the "Cameron material"-- i.e., the screenplay (below) and his subsequent "Electro" treatment. So it's not like there were a bunch of separate Spider-Man" projects-- it's just that this had the gestation period of an old elephant.
http://www.dailyscript.com/scripts/SpiderMan_the_original.doc
http://www.dailyscript.com/scripts/spider_man_cohen_newson_cameron_8_4_93draft.html Ted Newsom 04:39, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
The Michael Hiltzik article in the LA TIMES SUNDAY MAGAZINE and the Sheldon Teitelbaum article in CFQ are quoted and sourced; they got it right. Guys, none of your arguments address my major complaint-- that the entry is factually inaccurate, even by wikipedia standards, and by standards of fact and grammarical clarity. The odd standards here use thrice-told on-line "reporting" as "verifiable" fact, as if something published on the net is accurate by virtue of computer accessibility. That's not true. As you all know, repetition does not make something correct. And if you do buy into this standard, then why would you not accept links to word-for-word online copies of the original manuscripts as legitimate references? (They are both, in fact, legitimate, as is the Cameron treatment, available on line as well. And, yes, I am who I say I am.) If you don't want to believe me or think there's some wacky conflict of interest, OK: but fannish devotion to an ill-written & erroneous entry is even worse, particularly when the correct facts are cited & linked within the overall article itself. The irony of the challenge to me-- i.e., a conflict of interest-- is that quite of few of the cited sources (like the TIMES & CFQ articles I mentioned) used me as a source in the first place, as well as documents I provided to the authors involved. Witness the reference to "Dr. Zork," which was not the character's name in the Leslie Stevens treatment. Actually, I think the first reference to the character was as "Dr. Zyrex," another made-up name, in the piece in David Kraft's COMICS INTERVIEW magazine, which also had interviews with Spidey guys Erik Larsen, Todd McFarland and Stan Lee, who discussed the then-current (1990) Columbia option on Spidey. (Do we discount the Spidey-movie references Stan made in his interview because he's got a potential conflict of interest, or doesn't this kick in unless he posts here himself?) Ted Newsom 20:29, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
How about we start with the first line and go sequentially through the thing? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvel_comics Please tell me where in this article it says Marvel was near bankruptcy in 1985. Cheers. Ted Newsom 09:47, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
I am trying to trace the course of Marvel Comics in the 1980s and 1990s. According to the article "Marvel Comics enters a whole New World" in the
Chicago Sun-Times on
November 21,
1986, "New World Pictures Ltd. yesterday bought Marvel Comics for $50 million and added the world's largest comic book publisher and its stable of fantastic characters to its line-up of teen-age entertainments. The purchase from Cadence Industries Corp. comes as America's $175 million-a-year comic-book industry is enjoying a boom after decades of fighting a losing battle against television... Marvel, whose action characters Spiderman [sic] and the X-Men help the firm lead the industry, last year had sales of $73 million. New World said it expects Marvel to post a substantial sales increase in 1986." I backtracked a little bit and found the following: "Starting in the latter part of the 1960s, Mr. Lee's coveted library of some 3,000 characters passed through the hands of a series of owners. Mr. Goodman sold out to a publicly held conglomerate called Cadence Industries. In the mid-1980s, when Cadence's assets were spun off, Marvel was acquired by Hollywood film studio New World Entertainment-the maker of such TV shows as The Wonder Years." From Phyllis Furman (
1997-04-28). "PERELMAN'S TANGLED WEB: FINANCIER'S HUBRIS PLUNGES MARVEL INTO BANKRUPTCY, RUINING A CULTURAL ICON". Crain's New York Business. {{
cite news}}
: Check date values in: |date=
(
help) Perhaps the spinning off of the assets was misinterpreted by Business Week, and I think that the Wasko book uses BW to mention that information, considering the similar recitation of facts in both sources. —
Erik (
talk •
contrib) -
15:46, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
I think you can pretty much throw the Janet Wasko thing out. It doesn't sound like SHE was using primary sources. Your other lengthy quote shows what I've said, which is that Marvel was financially sound up until Perlman bought out the company from Cadence... which was the point I was making, that the reference was faulty & untrue. The big comic book recession hadn't hit yet. Due respect to Ms. Wasko, covering this wacky business is not like just any old business. Maybe she's better at writing about leveraged buyouts or something. And remember-- this is just the first sentence of the entry in question... Ted Newsom 04:19, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Perhaps "bid" was misinterpreted to mean that an auction took place. What would be better terminology? Also, can a reliable source be found that describes the type of company that Cannon Films was? — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 16:01, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Regarding a desciption of what kind of company Cannon was-- there's a book that details the whole thing, incluing a description of thir various locations (i.e., offices). Can't recall the title; sorry.
As for how to phrase it? Simple. Just say what happened. "Independent film company Cannon Films, run by producer Menahem Golan and his cousin, Yoram Globus, optioned the Spider-Man movie rights from Marvel in 1985, for a total of $225,000, to be paid out over the length of the five-year option." [As widely reported, a late payment by Golan in 1989 had Marvel huffing that the contract was therefore null & void; they lost the argument, and Golan held the rights.] Ted Newsom 04:29, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
{{
cite book}}
: Unknown parameter |month=
ignored (
help)"According to Variety, in 1985, Menahem Golan and Yoram Globus's Cannon Films was the first to obtain the film rights to Spider-Man, to which they attached Invasion USA and Missing in Action director Joseph Zito and even placed ads in trade publications announcing the 'event' film..." (more here) — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 16:00, 4 October 2007 (UTC)
Erik, wherever they're getting their information is clearly 2nd or 3rd hand (you see the problem?) The original Cannon trade announcements-- in Variety and the Hollywood Reporter-- came out in early 1985, with Tobe Hooper's name listed as director, Leslie Stevens as the writer. Subsequent to that, in autumn of 1985, John & I were hired at the suggestion of Stan Lee (ref: Comics Interview Magazine, 1989, interviews w/Lee, Newsom; reprinted in Comics Interview Super Special 1990). That winter, with much bigger, 2-page ads in the Weekly Variety & Reporter (I've got one framed on the wall in front of me, btw), Newsom & Brancato were listed as writers, with Joe Zito as director. And months after that, the name of Barney Cohen was added to "Written by." Now, even the quote you reproduce is dicey. Regarding the veracity of this quote you offer, I doubt that Variety EVER said "Cannon was the first to obtain film rights," because it isn't true. Because prior to Cannon, Roger Corman had an option on the property (hence the connection to the abortive Fantastic 4). That shows you how unpopular comic book properties were, because Corman never shelled out substantial dough for literary propeties in his life, so the dough must've been way less than even Cannon's price.
That said, the guy summarizes the saga pretty well, with a couple of exceptions. He makes the error in assuming the Carolco era was distinct from the Cannon/21st Century stuff, which is untrue. For one thing, the industry source Baseline Hollywood reported (in info also published weekly in both the trades) that "Spider-Man" was being made by Carolco, 21st Century and Lightstorm, all in conjunction; both Cameron and Neil Ruttenberg were listed as screenwriters. Neil Ruttenberg had rewritten the script for Golan/21st Century in Dec. 1989/Jan 1990, when the project was presented to Columbia; Neil has never worked for Carolco or met Cameron, ergo his script (and the others) were at Carolco, otherwise there is no explanation for his name to be listed on Baseline 5 years after his job. For another, Variety reported on September 1, 1993, that Cameron (then finishing True Lies) had recently delivered a completed screenplay to Carolco, which dovetails precisely to the date(s) on the alleged Cameron screenplay, "director's revision July 24, 1993," and "Third Draft, August 4, 1993." From reading Lichtenfield's summary, one would assume that Columbia and Marvel were the only players in the tail end of the story, but that's not the case, either. Columbia acquired a perpetual option on all previous scripts (ref: Carolco Bankrupcy Records, Federal Archives, Western Division) and excersized its option on the "Cameron material," hence Columbia's acquisition of the "Cameron" screenplay and the subsequent treatment. Those items were the property of MGM/UA (via acquisition), not Marvel. And as you know, it was the Cameron treatment which was the basis of Koepp's first draft script. Ted Newsom 04:11, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Hey, pace, BN. I read the stuff you recommended, and also the notes on "Citing oneself": Editing in an area in which you have professional or academic expertise is not, in itself, a conflict of interest. Using material you yourself have written or published is allowed within reason, but only if it is notable and conforms to the content policies. I think I can handle that. My name is on the linked copy of our first draft, and it's authentic; my name & 4 others are on the linked copy of the later draft, and it's authentic. I don't think I'm disqualified under "Financial" either (just in case), since nobody at Wiki is paying me and I don't stand to derive income or status by keeping things factually correct. Likewise, there is no ongoing court case regarding the subject. And I don't see a great deal of self-promotion in my stuff, since I'm also promoting the 11 other guys who were involved over 15 years. Yes, I understand about sourcing. The problem I have with the entry if exactly what the Wiki guidelines caution AGAINST-- citing A and B, and "therefore" C-- except that A & B are innaccurate and not primary sources. Erik's book quote, for example, has a writer misquoting Variety, which gives the sentence superficial credibility, but in fact the quote is quoting something ELSE quoting Variety. Ted Newsom 05:03, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for believing who I am, Erik; I was begining not to cast a shadow. But you see, it IS 20 years down the road, and the information is already grossly distorted-- hence my changes in the first place. And very few of the sources presently cited -- with that one neat exception you just posted which gets many of the business deals right-- seem to have even bothered to read the trades, look at the published ads, read interviews that directly quote those involved, or do anything but repeat twice-told tales. Hence you get the "telephone game" result of screwy history.
I'm not sure the complex facts would be that terribly interesting to more than three people. Maybe they would be. One of these daze. Ted Newsom 18:27, 5 October 2007 (UTC)
(Which, by the way, was not a line we gave Doc Ock. Our script had a jamoke in a junkyard saying it.) So... the history of the pre-Columbian artifacts is semi-straight, and, I think, done by the Wikipedia house rules. It's based on published information, verifiable by anyone with a library card and some time to spare. Unlike the previous entry, it's not based on news stories that are five or six steps removed from the source. Pullitzer-prize winning investigative reporter Mike Hiltzik, who wrote the LA TIMES piece (March 24, 2002, and his previous LA Times piece a year earlier) talked to the players in this drama first-hand, which means these are primary sources (Joe Zito, Barney Cohen, Ethan Wiley, Ted Newsom, Neil Ruttenberg, Frank La Loggia, Scott Rosenberg, and Rae Santini of Cameron's Lightstorm Company-- and Carolco before that). Ed Gross wrote an entire book on the comic character, Spider-Man Confidential (at my urging, to tell the truth) and talked directly with primary sources Zito, Newsom, Ruttenberg, Cohen, plus John Brancato, has interviewed Stan Lee numerous times, and had access to every version of the script from the first draft through the final shooting script. With, I think, one internet-link exception, all the facts are sourced from printed material, not ephemeral cyberspace sources. And, you know, I don't think it's boring. Ted Newsom 08:18, 1 November 2007 (UTC) Still having trouble formatting, particularly the link to the SEC document. Ted Newsom 22:16, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
Doesn't anybody else think it's idiotic to list all three Spider-Man movies as if it's one film? I mean, a running time of 388 minutes... that helps absolutely no reader understand the subject. It's not as if you could list the comic Spider-Man and say it's 456,972,219 pages long. And totalling the grosses makes little sense either. Ted Newsom 05:13, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
I think the heading "Tangled Web of Litigation" sounds very unprofessional. Do puns like this really belong in an encyclopedia? Let's try to not make Wikipedia seem like a joke. – bse3 ( talk • contribs • count • logs) 01:16, 30 November 2007 (UTC)
I heard in an interview that Sam Raimi would help James Vanderbilt writing spider-man 4, so i changed the
"writers: David Koepp (spider-Man 1)
... Sam Raimi (spider-Man 3) ..."
to
"writers: David Koepp (spider-man 1)
... Sam Raimi (spider-man 3 & 4) ...
ok? 194.210.67.136 ( talk) 17:04, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
I'm not sure what interview you mean, because Raimi said it's up to Vanderbilt now where the franchise goes in a Comic Book Resources piece. Alientraveller ( talk) 17:17, 10 December 2007 (UTC)
Hey, when readin the "future of the franchise" part, I realised there's a huge mistake, for you are confusing Spider-Man 4 with the Venom spinoff. The following sentences should be referring to Venom and not spiderman 4: The studio commissioned Jacob Aaron Estes to write a script, but rejected it the following year. Sony announced that in addition to a new director and writer, they wanted to replace Topher Grace in the lead, as they felt he was unable to "carry" a blockbuster.[40] In September 2008, Paul Wernick and Rhett Reese (Sony's upcoming Zombieland) signed on to write.[32]. That's all (BTW, I´m Franshu, but I'm too lazy for loggin in right now, lol).
190.226.89.19 (
talk)
03:29, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Found this... some more sm4 news, although not pretty much, maybe it should be added like: "in an interview to 'blog talk radio' James Vanderbilt has said that once the strike is over he will start working on the script"
http://www.comics2film.com/index.php?a=story&b=31006 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.155.221.213 ( talk • contribs)
Really we wont be alive by then, and im almost sure Sam Rammi will be dead..yeah —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.255.5.164 ( talk) 07:28, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
In the "development hell" part, there is written:
In 1996, Carolco, 21st Century, and Marvel went bankrupt.
what does that mean? I don't know much about history of Marvel Comics, but I didn't know they ever went bankrupt - but I may be easily wrong -- Have a nice day. Running 21:48, 10 May 2008 (UTC)
please someone add this...
http://www.cinematical.com/2008/05/16/scoop-spider-man-4-and-5-might-be-shot-at-the-same-time/
looks like james vanderbilt is writing both 4 & 5 and they will be shot at the same time!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.155.221.158 ( talk) 09:58, 17 May 2008 (UTC)
IDK if this is trustful source... but I added it here to see...
http://www.iesb.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4971&Itemid=99 82.155.223.118 ( talk) 10:25, 31 May 2008 (UTC)
In the first movie, Eddie Brock, was portrayed by, R.C. Everbeck. I would like for that to be added to the cast and characters section of the page. You can also add the fact that his scenes were deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jagfan71 ( talk • contribs)
This article is wholly unnecessary, as, unlike say Star Wars or Lord of the Rings, these films are not treated as a complete whole; rather, an initial film followed by sequels when popularity warrants it. The use of the term film serial in the lead is highly inaccurate as well. WesleyDodds 00:38, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
No, what is rumor is "Spider-Man 4 will happen", but what is verifiable fact is "Sony has expressed an interest in making more sequels". The former, again, is a rumor, it's unsubstantiated talk. The latter is verifiable, by reliable sources, that Sony does indeed want to make more films. Whether that happens or not, only time will tell. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 02:01, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
(Edit conflict) I think we have different definitions of rumors. Rumors, from my understanding, are completely unsubstantiated bits of information (such as Sarah Michelle Gellar being in The Dark Knight). The studio entered talks with Koepp to write a screenplay, and the studio folks themselves have repeatedly mentioned the projects being in production. It's not enough to start up these future film articles, but it's certainly adequate discussion for inclusion. — Erik ( talk • contrib) - 02:02, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
I know what you were stating, but my point was that the quality of Spider-Man 3, and the amount of information that it already contains (and is only going to grow) means that information pertaining to the series as a whole would not be beneficial there. BIGNOLE (Contact me) 12:23, 11 May 2007 (UTC)
For the record, Star Wars was never meant to be a film serial. The first film was, initially, a "film followed by sequels when popularity warranted it." Only later did Lucas decide to go ahead with the idea of a serial. 205.250.102.212 ( talk) 00:18, 17 November 2008 (UTC)
As part of the WikiProject Good Articles, we're doing sweeps to go over all of the current GAs and see if they still meet the GA criteria. I went through the article and made various changes, please look them over. I believe the article currently meets the criteria and should remain listed as a Good article. Altogether the article is well-written and is still in great shape after its passing in 2007. Continue to improve the article making sure all new information is properly sourced and neutral. It would be beneficial to further expand the home media releases, and see if there are any more recent stories in the news. I would also recommend updating the access dates of the sources. I fixed several dead links, but was unable to fix one of them, so it would be beneficial if a new source could be found. If you have any questions, let me know on my talk page and I'll get back to you as soon as I can. I have updated the article history to reflect this review. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 ( talk • contrib) 19:04, 20 May 2009 (UTC)
I'm taking it down because: it must be from Spiderman 1 because you can clearly see the twin towers in the reflection on his mask. And besides, it's highly unlikely they'd release a teaser poster before they began filming. 96.25.80.203 ( talk) 17:18, 26 May 2009 (UTC)
http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Spider-Man-4-Teaser-Poster-UPDATED-13408.html
Apparently the poster on display is completely fake and fan-made, and Sony had nothing to do with it? xD 68.179.133.176 ( talk) 04:15, 5 June 2009 (UTC)
Someone keeps creating Spiderman 4 page without any sources. Could someone watch that page. -- Gman124 talk 18:26, 14 June 2009 (UTC)
Why is there Box Office Revenue posted for Spiderman 4? The source says it was last retrieved on June 9, 2011, and the citation just links to the Box Office Mojo page for Spiderman 3. The Box Office Mojo page says nothing about Spiderman 4, or even any predicted revenue. Dano112358 ( talk) 04:08, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
Really, an article about a canon of films should have links to the films readily available - they are not in the side bar, nor the abstract - they should be put in one of these. Or at least a link to halfway down the page where they are first linked. Betaben ( talk) 18:45, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
Spider-Man 4 is coming soon to theatres and IMAX on May 6, 2011. AMC/IMAX Theatres is now offically open. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.255.83.27 ( talk) 01:44, 17 November 2009 (UTC)
Dagens nyheter (Means Daily News), one of Sweden's most respected newspapers published this today: http://www.dn.se/kultur-noje/film-tv/spindelmannen-byter-flickvan-1.1020070 In short, it says that Anne Hathaway will appear as M.J, or another girl friend of Spider-Man. I'm not sure about Star Magazines credability, which is cited as the source, but shouldn't it be mentioned?
-- 81.235.148.197 ( talk) 18:57, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
Anne's been dropped, so I would have that removed. 173.26.19.206 ( talk) 02:16, 10 January 2010 (UTC)
There is information on certain websites that claim they know the villain/villains for the upcoming film, Spider-Man 4. Yet the problem with these is that they say that they "know a source" on the inside, or that "a source very close to the film" told them the information which they claim is the real deal, yet not one of these sites have specifically cited a source. I know, I check for new info on this film and specifically attempt to locate cited sources, to which there is none. Therefore, the information is not a matter of fact, and only a matter of speculations. In these regards, the information on this page reflecting John Malkovich and Anne Hathaway somehow being "officially" attached to the film is not proven and is speculation only, and also the accounts of the villains being The Vulture and Vulturess or Black Cat are also untrue, as the script is currently being rewritten yet again. This info is misleading, it is simply not true. None of this info is official, and for these reasons, should be removed completely.
- Viperpulse ( talk) 22:41, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
I think that the Spider-man 4 section in this article should be split and givin its own article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.236.149.114 ( talk) 23:14, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
Can some help me with editing, news on no Maguire, Ramini-- Chard513 ( talk) 23:46, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
Some sites are now saying the film has been cancelled and there will be a reboot planned for 2012. I'm not sure how reputable the sources are.
http://www.superherohype.com/news/spider-mannews.php?id=8976 http://www.deadline.com/hollywood/urgent-spider-man-4-scrapped-as-is-raimi-and-cast-out-franchise-reboot-planned/ 86.43.176.37 ( talk) 23:10, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
Seems a bit off the beaten path for this page. If anything, it should go in the Bond series pages and not this. These sorts of toss-ups in the movie industry happen all of the time. I don't understand why this one's listed in here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.84.191.230 ( talk) 07:53, 25 December 2009 (UTC)
Without the rights-swap between the studios, the Columbia film never would have happened. It was the keystone of solving an intricate problem.
75.36.125.16 (
talk)
10:14, 26 January 2010 (UTC)Ted Newsom
here's the excerpt that's wrong: "Venom will run as its own movie and Disney Studios will produce the film.[60]" if you follow the link to the source, you'll find absolutely no mention of disney studios. infact, the article clearly states that sony/columbia will be still on the film, as they still have rights to it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.31.222.4 ( talk) 04:40, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
I'm wondering if it's premature to add the section to the table specifically for Spider Man 4; it's not due out until 2011 or 2012, depending on where you read. So there may not be any info in those fields for a very long time. Would it be better to wait until there's more concrete info available? Millahnna (mouse) talk 22:42, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
Sony's official site says May 2011 will see the launch of the 4th movie, but the article only mentions 2012 at the moment.. - Philwiki ( talk) 11:42, 29 April 2010 (UTC)
There's been absolutely no news, except for news that they are still doing it ( here). Should that be noted in the article? ggctuk (2005) ( talk) 19:06, 4 July 2010 (UTC)
I have added to the sub-article about Spiderman 4 about Bruce Campbell's role in the film. Rio de Janiero God ( talk) 10:30, 7 September 2010 (UTC)
I have created a sandbox containing any information related to the Spider-Man reboot for future benefit of it becoming a article. Any updates of that particular topic and renovations of the userspace can be done here. Happy editing. Jhenderson 777 20:52, 13 September 2010 (UTC)
{{
cite news}}
: Check date values in: |date=
(
help)