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When is Sarah Charles Lewis' Broadway debut date? March 31, 2016, the first day of Tuck Everlasting's previews? Or April 26, 2016, when Tuck Everlasting officially opened? Cunard ( talk) 06:58, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
The lead originally said that Sarah Charles' Broadway debut was on March 31, 2016. X4n6 ( talk · contribs) changed the lead to say April 26, 2016. I reverted, noting a source explicitly saying that Sarah Charles Lewis' Broadway debut was on March 31, 2016, and X4n6 reverted me. I reworded the lead to say she debuted in 2016 to avoid the dispute. However, X4n6 reverted again. Here are the two sources X4n6 is citing to support the April 26, 2016, debut date:
The source notes:
Tuck Everlasting, the new musical about a love that could live literally forever, opens on Broadway tonight at the Broadhurst Theatre. Previews began March 31.
The source notes:
I noted that the Tuck Everlasting musical page at https://www.ibdb.com/Production/View/501949 says "First Preview: Mar 31, 2016" and "Opening Date: Apr 26, 2016". It makes no ruling on which date is Lewis' Broadway debut.[Musical, Original]
Starring: Sarah Charles Lewis [Winnie Foster]
Date of Productions: Apr 26, 2016 - Present
The article notes:
Lewis will make her Broadway debut March 31 at the Broadhurst Theatre in New York City. For more details about the show and how to purchase tickets, visit the website.
That source is supported by a Broadway.com source saying:
Cunard ( talk) 08:13, 1 May 2016 (UTC)Sarah Charles Lewis is a 11-year-old performer who will make her Broadway debut this spring in Tuck Everlasting, and from the sound of it, she’s poised to remain a musical theater star forever and ever (and ever and ever and…).
...
Catch 'Tuck Everlasting' on Broadway beginning March 31.
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution article is not the only source that says her Broadway debut is March 31. So does TheaterMania, which notes: "Eleven-year-old Sarah Charles Lewis is getting ready to make her Broadway debut as Winnie Foster in the new musical Tuck Everlasting, beginning performances at the Broadhurst Theatre on March 31." Cunard ( talk) 17:35, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
When a reliable source explicitly says it is one date and you personally believe the reliable source is wrong and it should be another date, we should follow with the reliable source until and unless (1) that reliable source issues a correction or (2) another reliable source supports your position. How is it not original research to do otherwise? Cunard ( talk) 17:35, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
And how would it not be synthesis to take one source that says a preview isn't an "official" Broadway performance and take another source about when Tuck Everlasting's official opened. And then say Sarah Charles Lewis didn't debut until the "official" Broadway performance? From WP:SYNTH, "Do not combine material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources."
Cunard ( talk) 17:48, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
No sources have been presented here because it's a well known fact, but I'm happy to provide a litany of sources. [12] [13] [14] [15]. – if it is a well known that fact that "previews don't count as performances on Broadway", then why don't any of your sources explicitly say this? None of the sources mention previews. None of those sources explicitly support your assertion that "previews don't count as performances on Broadway". Please provide a source that explicitly says "previews don't count as performances on Broadway" rather than sources that discuss shows' opening nights.Do not combine material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources. Similarly, do not combine different parts of one source to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by the source. If one reliable source says A, and another reliable source says B, do not join A and B together to imply a conclusion C that is not mentioned by either of the sources. This would be improper editorial synthesis of published material to imply a new conclusion, which is original research performed by an editor here. "A and B, therefore C" is acceptable only if a reliable source has published the same argument in relation to the topic of the article. If a single source says "A" in one context, and "B" in another, without connecting them, and does not provide an argument of "therefore C", then "therefore C" cannot be used in any article.
As for sources about Lewis, I did some searching, and here you go. These all refer to opening night as the debut of Tuck Everlasting, most of them specifically referencing Lewis' debut as well: [16] [17] [18] [19] [20] [21] [22] – none of those sources explicitly say which date Lewis' debut was on.
I'd prefer to list Sarah Charles Lewis' Broadway debut as 2016 since which particular day she debuted on is unimportant in an encyclopedia article. I reworded the lead to say she debuted in 2016 to avoid the dispute, but X4n6 reverted me. Do you support or oppose the compromise position of changing the debut to 2016?
I'd oppose that because we have more specific information available. In order of the sources:
None of those represent any sort of synthesis, nor do the other sources represent synthesis when answering the question "Does an actor/actress debut on Broadway on the first previous or opening night?" ~ Rob Talk 21:27, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
I'm also curious about the article's YouTube link to the subject's channel in the External links section. Per WP:ELNEVER in External links, I believe it may be a copyvio concern. Thoughts? X4n6 ( talk) 00:04, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Sarah Charles Lewis article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
![]() | A fact from Sarah Charles Lewis appeared on Wikipedia's
Main Page in the
Did you know column on 6 May 2016 (
check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
| ![]() |
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
![]() | This article is rated C-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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When is Sarah Charles Lewis' Broadway debut date? March 31, 2016, the first day of Tuck Everlasting's previews? Or April 26, 2016, when Tuck Everlasting officially opened? Cunard ( talk) 06:58, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
The lead originally said that Sarah Charles' Broadway debut was on March 31, 2016. X4n6 ( talk · contribs) changed the lead to say April 26, 2016. I reverted, noting a source explicitly saying that Sarah Charles Lewis' Broadway debut was on March 31, 2016, and X4n6 reverted me. I reworded the lead to say she debuted in 2016 to avoid the dispute. However, X4n6 reverted again. Here are the two sources X4n6 is citing to support the April 26, 2016, debut date:
The source notes:
Tuck Everlasting, the new musical about a love that could live literally forever, opens on Broadway tonight at the Broadhurst Theatre. Previews began March 31.
The source notes:
I noted that the Tuck Everlasting musical page at https://www.ibdb.com/Production/View/501949 says "First Preview: Mar 31, 2016" and "Opening Date: Apr 26, 2016". It makes no ruling on which date is Lewis' Broadway debut.[Musical, Original]
Starring: Sarah Charles Lewis [Winnie Foster]
Date of Productions: Apr 26, 2016 - Present
The article notes:
Lewis will make her Broadway debut March 31 at the Broadhurst Theatre in New York City. For more details about the show and how to purchase tickets, visit the website.
That source is supported by a Broadway.com source saying:
Cunard ( talk) 08:13, 1 May 2016 (UTC)Sarah Charles Lewis is a 11-year-old performer who will make her Broadway debut this spring in Tuck Everlasting, and from the sound of it, she’s poised to remain a musical theater star forever and ever (and ever and ever and…).
...
Catch 'Tuck Everlasting' on Broadway beginning March 31.
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution article is not the only source that says her Broadway debut is March 31. So does TheaterMania, which notes: "Eleven-year-old Sarah Charles Lewis is getting ready to make her Broadway debut as Winnie Foster in the new musical Tuck Everlasting, beginning performances at the Broadhurst Theatre on March 31." Cunard ( talk) 17:35, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
When a reliable source explicitly says it is one date and you personally believe the reliable source is wrong and it should be another date, we should follow with the reliable source until and unless (1) that reliable source issues a correction or (2) another reliable source supports your position. How is it not original research to do otherwise? Cunard ( talk) 17:35, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
And how would it not be synthesis to take one source that says a preview isn't an "official" Broadway performance and take another source about when Tuck Everlasting's official opened. And then say Sarah Charles Lewis didn't debut until the "official" Broadway performance? From WP:SYNTH, "Do not combine material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources."
Cunard ( talk) 17:48, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
No sources have been presented here because it's a well known fact, but I'm happy to provide a litany of sources. [12] [13] [14] [15]. – if it is a well known that fact that "previews don't count as performances on Broadway", then why don't any of your sources explicitly say this? None of the sources mention previews. None of those sources explicitly support your assertion that "previews don't count as performances on Broadway". Please provide a source that explicitly says "previews don't count as performances on Broadway" rather than sources that discuss shows' opening nights.Do not combine material from multiple sources to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources. Similarly, do not combine different parts of one source to reach or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by the source. If one reliable source says A, and another reliable source says B, do not join A and B together to imply a conclusion C that is not mentioned by either of the sources. This would be improper editorial synthesis of published material to imply a new conclusion, which is original research performed by an editor here. "A and B, therefore C" is acceptable only if a reliable source has published the same argument in relation to the topic of the article. If a single source says "A" in one context, and "B" in another, without connecting them, and does not provide an argument of "therefore C", then "therefore C" cannot be used in any article.
As for sources about Lewis, I did some searching, and here you go. These all refer to opening night as the debut of Tuck Everlasting, most of them specifically referencing Lewis' debut as well: [16] [17] [18] [19] [20] [21] [22] – none of those sources explicitly say which date Lewis' debut was on.
I'd prefer to list Sarah Charles Lewis' Broadway debut as 2016 since which particular day she debuted on is unimportant in an encyclopedia article. I reworded the lead to say she debuted in 2016 to avoid the dispute, but X4n6 reverted me. Do you support or oppose the compromise position of changing the debut to 2016?
I'd oppose that because we have more specific information available. In order of the sources:
None of those represent any sort of synthesis, nor do the other sources represent synthesis when answering the question "Does an actor/actress debut on Broadway on the first previous or opening night?" ~ Rob Talk 21:27, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
I'm also curious about the article's YouTube link to the subject's channel in the External links section. Per WP:ELNEVER in External links, I believe it may be a copyvio concern. Thoughts? X4n6 ( talk) 00:04, 2 May 2016 (UTC)