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WARNING regarding Wiki naming policy for ethnic groups and self-identification Just a reminder of Wiki naming policy for ethnic groups: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(ethnicities_and_tribes) "Self-identification-How the group self-identifies should be considered. If their autonym is commonly used in English, it would be the best article title. Any terms regarded as derogatory by members of the ethnic group in question should be avoided." As noted by Paul Robert Magosci, there is an ethnic group known in English as Ruthenians, but which self identifies as Carpatho-Rusyns, or simply Rusyns. They do not self-identify as Ukrainians. In fact, they find the Ukrainian label offensive. Anyone refering to Carpatho-Rusyns as Ukrainians may result in complaints being lodged in the appropriate Wiki forums. 37.200.224.205 ( talk) 01:58, 23 September 2014 (UTC)
The self-name "по нашому (po našomu)" means "our language" - I believe that it is unlikely that this could be the correct name of the language. ALEF7 ( talk) 22:25, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
Could anyone, who knows this language well, add some details concerning grammar? Like e.g. how many cases, how many times or time aspects does this language have, are there any special pecularities and stuff like that. Would be interesting to know! -- Edmund Sackbauer ( talk) 11:50, 9 May 2019 (UTC)
In sentence "Poland did the same, using internal exile to move all Ukrainians from the southern homelands to western areas conquered from Germany, and switch everyday language to Polish." word "conquered" is not a best choice imho. However different nations/ethnic groups involved may perceive post-WWII forced relocations of people, today's Poland westernmost parts weren't "conquered" by Poland, what may this way of putting it suggest. Poland forcefully relocated people - right. Germany lost areas which now belong to Poland - right. But Poland was practically non-existent at the time when borders were set. Stalin took this area from Germany and "granted" it to newly created puppet-state of "Poland".
In short: change "conquered" for "incorporated" :)
Queuedziej ( talk) 21:26, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
This article characterizes the Rusyn language as a " lect" despite the article title. Wikipedia naming conventions for language articles dictate that "The choice of "language" or "dialect" should follow the most common usage in relevant reliable sources." Therefore, either the article title is incorrect, or the usage of the term "lect" (which per the aforementioned convention should be changed to Variety_(linguistics)) is incorrect. The article title and text should be brought into harmony.
Modern sources should be gathered and evaluated to determine the contemporary consensus. However, considering that this "variety" of East Slavic was assigned an ISO language code, it seems that the international consensus leans toward Rusyn being a distinct language.
I will begin reviewing modern literature to determine this for certain.
KaerbaqianRen ( talk) 00:08, 10 November 2021 (UTC)
(Russian=) Ruski >> (German) Russen >> (phonetic reverse into Russian) Rusyn. Also see Teresin/Thalerhof concentration camps around WW1.
Same story as with "Ruthen" -> Voevodstvo Russkoe (Russian) under Poland converted into Woewodschaft Ruthenien under Austrohungary. "Ruthenia" literally means "Russia" in Latein (standard Catholic ABC; West Rome).
Thus west Russians (Ruski=Russian) were renamed into something else. Growing regional and cross country difference due to neighbours over time - yes. However, they are still all Russians. 78.34.195.69 ( talk) 08:19, 22 August 2023 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Rusyn language article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: 1, 2 |
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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A graph should have been displayed here but
graphs are temporarily disabled. Until they are enabled again, visit the interactive graph at
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WARNING regarding Wiki naming policy for ethnic groups and self-identification Just a reminder of Wiki naming policy for ethnic groups: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(ethnicities_and_tribes) "Self-identification-How the group self-identifies should be considered. If their autonym is commonly used in English, it would be the best article title. Any terms regarded as derogatory by members of the ethnic group in question should be avoided." As noted by Paul Robert Magosci, there is an ethnic group known in English as Ruthenians, but which self identifies as Carpatho-Rusyns, or simply Rusyns. They do not self-identify as Ukrainians. In fact, they find the Ukrainian label offensive. Anyone refering to Carpatho-Rusyns as Ukrainians may result in complaints being lodged in the appropriate Wiki forums. 37.200.224.205 ( talk) 01:58, 23 September 2014 (UTC)
The self-name "по нашому (po našomu)" means "our language" - I believe that it is unlikely that this could be the correct name of the language. ALEF7 ( talk) 22:25, 8 October 2018 (UTC)
Could anyone, who knows this language well, add some details concerning grammar? Like e.g. how many cases, how many times or time aspects does this language have, are there any special pecularities and stuff like that. Would be interesting to know! -- Edmund Sackbauer ( talk) 11:50, 9 May 2019 (UTC)
In sentence "Poland did the same, using internal exile to move all Ukrainians from the southern homelands to western areas conquered from Germany, and switch everyday language to Polish." word "conquered" is not a best choice imho. However different nations/ethnic groups involved may perceive post-WWII forced relocations of people, today's Poland westernmost parts weren't "conquered" by Poland, what may this way of putting it suggest. Poland forcefully relocated people - right. Germany lost areas which now belong to Poland - right. But Poland was practically non-existent at the time when borders were set. Stalin took this area from Germany and "granted" it to newly created puppet-state of "Poland".
In short: change "conquered" for "incorporated" :)
Queuedziej ( talk) 21:26, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
This article characterizes the Rusyn language as a " lect" despite the article title. Wikipedia naming conventions for language articles dictate that "The choice of "language" or "dialect" should follow the most common usage in relevant reliable sources." Therefore, either the article title is incorrect, or the usage of the term "lect" (which per the aforementioned convention should be changed to Variety_(linguistics)) is incorrect. The article title and text should be brought into harmony.
Modern sources should be gathered and evaluated to determine the contemporary consensus. However, considering that this "variety" of East Slavic was assigned an ISO language code, it seems that the international consensus leans toward Rusyn being a distinct language.
I will begin reviewing modern literature to determine this for certain.
KaerbaqianRen ( talk) 00:08, 10 November 2021 (UTC)
(Russian=) Ruski >> (German) Russen >> (phonetic reverse into Russian) Rusyn. Also see Teresin/Thalerhof concentration camps around WW1.
Same story as with "Ruthen" -> Voevodstvo Russkoe (Russian) under Poland converted into Woewodschaft Ruthenien under Austrohungary. "Ruthenia" literally means "Russia" in Latein (standard Catholic ABC; West Rome).
Thus west Russians (Ruski=Russian) were renamed into something else. Growing regional and cross country difference due to neighbours over time - yes. However, they are still all Russians. 78.34.195.69 ( talk) 08:19, 22 August 2023 (UTC)