Hey there! I'm going to be taking a look at this GAN. Any section marked with a Working tag means I haven't finished going through it, but feel free to start making changes as soon as they're listed here! Kncny11(shoot)20:55, 6 March 2021 (UTC)reply
Red Wings coach Scotty Bowman played the five together as a unit at times from October 1995 to June 1997, but also mixed and matched them with other teammates. This statement is not mentioned anywhere in the body.
Put NHL in parentheses after referencing the National Hockey League
All sites falling within the SB Nation domain are considered unreliable, based on
this discussion. Unfortunately, they're more of a fanblog than hard-hitting journalism.
This NYT article talks about Pryakhin, while
this NHL.com article talks about Nechayev.
Similarly, the Russia Beyond article is owned by
Russia Today, which is considered a depreciated source and should not be used.
The NYT source about Mogilny does not say that he was the 89th overall pick -- this needs a different citation.
"Gave spoke Russian, and had a media credential that would enable him to get into an exhibition game in Helsinki where the Soviet national team was scheduled to play a Finnish elite-level club." → "Not only did Gave speak Russian, but his media credentials would enable him to get into an
exhibition game in
Helsinki, where the
Soviet national team was scheduled to play a
Finnish club." with all the pipes
"Gave agreed to the mission, and in August 1989, he managed to meet with the players after their game and slip them each a Red Wings media guide with a letter hidden inside."
"We would have five (Russians) then, and if you ever want to, you could play them together." All direct quotes need a citation at the end of the sentence.
The Five on the Red Wings
"led the team with five assists."
1997 Stanley Cup Finals
"In the Finals, Detroit faced the Philadelphia Flyers." → "Detroit faced the Philadelphia Flyers in the 1997 Stanley Cup Finals."
Delink Steve Yzerman and Joe Louis Arena, which were linked earlier in the body
Comma after "skated over to Igor Larionov" and after "skated around the rink"
The entire second paragraph needs to be altered. Every sentence with a direct quote needs a citation at the end of the sentence, even if all of those quotes are from the same source.
I would like to see more citations for the last two paragraphs, which currently only cite the Gave.
After the Russian Five
Would prefer some more information on Kozlov's career post-Sabres.
Specify years that the three were inducted into the Hall of Fame
Legacy
This section needs more sources. The claims that the Russian Five had a serious impact on ice hockey should be addressed by more than one writer. Until then, it's hard to argue the neutrality of this section.
References
Make sure to archive all online references using
the tool
Make sure that you WL to all publications whenever possible
For [1], use The Hockey News as the work, and Sports Illustrated as the publisher
Include |url-access=limited for the Athletic citation (6)
For [15] and [24], MLive.com is the work, and MLive Media Group is the publisher
It's always The New York Times, not just "New York Times"
For [26], AP News is the work, and the Associated Press is the publisher
For [34], Grantland is the work, and ESPN is the publisher
For [35], Yahoo Sports is the work, and Yahoo is the publisher
The chapter titles for Keith Gave's book are inconsistent over whether there's a space between "Ch.#" and the chapter title. I prefer there to be a space there, but consistency is the most important.
Edit history looks stable. One problem editor blocked on February 8.
The image of the Soviet Union hockey jersey was mentioned in the last GAN. This is the Soviet national team jersey -- did any of them play for the national team? If not, it looks like all of them played for CSKA Moscow, so maybe there's a relevant photo from that club that can be used.
The other photos look fine!
Reasons for failure in the first GA:
11 of the sources are from the same source.
The same number of references are to the one Keith Gave book. However, it has gone from making up 38% of the total sources to 29%. I'd still like to see some more reduction, but this is an improvement.
Many statements are left uncited.
Most direct quotes now have citations attached.
Final comments and verdict
This is an improvement from the initial GA submission. However, there are still some issues with citations, specifically some unreliable sources in the beginning and a continued over-reliance on the Gave book. I'm willing to put this on hold while these issues are addressed, and would be happy to help find better sources for specific statements. Feel free to reach out if you need anything! Kncny11(shoot)22:02, 6 March 2021 (UTC)reply
@
JimKaatFan: Just checking in. Usually articles are left on hold for 7 days, but I'm willing to leave it open as long as there's communication or work being done. Just let me know. Kncny11(shoot)17:51, 13 March 2021 (UTC)reply
Hi there. I had pretty much quit editing Wikipedia after an incident (at a different article) that soured me on the entire process. I was completely demotivated and disgusted. But since you took the time to do such a thorough review, I will make the changes you recommend. Thanks.
JimKaatFan (
talk)
22:31, 18 March 2021 (UTC)reply
Hey there! I'm going to be taking a look at this GAN. Any section marked with a Working tag means I haven't finished going through it, but feel free to start making changes as soon as they're listed here! Kncny11(shoot)20:55, 6 March 2021 (UTC)reply
Red Wings coach Scotty Bowman played the five together as a unit at times from October 1995 to June 1997, but also mixed and matched them with other teammates. This statement is not mentioned anywhere in the body.
Put NHL in parentheses after referencing the National Hockey League
All sites falling within the SB Nation domain are considered unreliable, based on
this discussion. Unfortunately, they're more of a fanblog than hard-hitting journalism.
This NYT article talks about Pryakhin, while
this NHL.com article talks about Nechayev.
Similarly, the Russia Beyond article is owned by
Russia Today, which is considered a depreciated source and should not be used.
The NYT source about Mogilny does not say that he was the 89th overall pick -- this needs a different citation.
"Gave spoke Russian, and had a media credential that would enable him to get into an exhibition game in Helsinki where the Soviet national team was scheduled to play a Finnish elite-level club." → "Not only did Gave speak Russian, but his media credentials would enable him to get into an
exhibition game in
Helsinki, where the
Soviet national team was scheduled to play a
Finnish club." with all the pipes
"Gave agreed to the mission, and in August 1989, he managed to meet with the players after their game and slip them each a Red Wings media guide with a letter hidden inside."
"We would have five (Russians) then, and if you ever want to, you could play them together." All direct quotes need a citation at the end of the sentence.
The Five on the Red Wings
"led the team with five assists."
1997 Stanley Cup Finals
"In the Finals, Detroit faced the Philadelphia Flyers." → "Detroit faced the Philadelphia Flyers in the 1997 Stanley Cup Finals."
Delink Steve Yzerman and Joe Louis Arena, which were linked earlier in the body
Comma after "skated over to Igor Larionov" and after "skated around the rink"
The entire second paragraph needs to be altered. Every sentence with a direct quote needs a citation at the end of the sentence, even if all of those quotes are from the same source.
I would like to see more citations for the last two paragraphs, which currently only cite the Gave.
After the Russian Five
Would prefer some more information on Kozlov's career post-Sabres.
Specify years that the three were inducted into the Hall of Fame
Legacy
This section needs more sources. The claims that the Russian Five had a serious impact on ice hockey should be addressed by more than one writer. Until then, it's hard to argue the neutrality of this section.
References
Make sure to archive all online references using
the tool
Make sure that you WL to all publications whenever possible
For [1], use The Hockey News as the work, and Sports Illustrated as the publisher
Include |url-access=limited for the Athletic citation (6)
For [15] and [24], MLive.com is the work, and MLive Media Group is the publisher
It's always The New York Times, not just "New York Times"
For [26], AP News is the work, and the Associated Press is the publisher
For [34], Grantland is the work, and ESPN is the publisher
For [35], Yahoo Sports is the work, and Yahoo is the publisher
The chapter titles for Keith Gave's book are inconsistent over whether there's a space between "Ch.#" and the chapter title. I prefer there to be a space there, but consistency is the most important.
Edit history looks stable. One problem editor blocked on February 8.
The image of the Soviet Union hockey jersey was mentioned in the last GAN. This is the Soviet national team jersey -- did any of them play for the national team? If not, it looks like all of them played for CSKA Moscow, so maybe there's a relevant photo from that club that can be used.
The other photos look fine!
Reasons for failure in the first GA:
11 of the sources are from the same source.
The same number of references are to the one Keith Gave book. However, it has gone from making up 38% of the total sources to 29%. I'd still like to see some more reduction, but this is an improvement.
Many statements are left uncited.
Most direct quotes now have citations attached.
Final comments and verdict
This is an improvement from the initial GA submission. However, there are still some issues with citations, specifically some unreliable sources in the beginning and a continued over-reliance on the Gave book. I'm willing to put this on hold while these issues are addressed, and would be happy to help find better sources for specific statements. Feel free to reach out if you need anything! Kncny11(shoot)22:02, 6 March 2021 (UTC)reply
@
JimKaatFan: Just checking in. Usually articles are left on hold for 7 days, but I'm willing to leave it open as long as there's communication or work being done. Just let me know. Kncny11(shoot)17:51, 13 March 2021 (UTC)reply
Hi there. I had pretty much quit editing Wikipedia after an incident (at a different article) that soured me on the entire process. I was completely demotivated and disgusted. But since you took the time to do such a thorough review, I will make the changes you recommend. Thanks.
JimKaatFan (
talk)
22:31, 18 March 2021 (UTC)reply