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@ OyMosby: Would you care to explain and gather consensus for your last edit? I claim that Serbo-Croatian is indeed neutral (which has been noted and commented on page for canvassing only on hr.wikipedia). If you do not agree we could go with Shtokavian. Either Serbian or Croatian is not correct, in my book. cheers Sadkσ (talk is cheap) 21:48, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
Sources have already been presented by other fellow editors, if that is what you are looking for:
1) Nothing new was presented in the discussion. 2) Croatian language in the lead was not "stable" but pushed by 1 editor. Only that is disruptive, and calling the current version "stable" is incorrect and even manipulative. 3) There was 1 month without further comments and that is not "ongoing", by very definition. 3.1) IP comments should make sense and give arguments, while posting proper request, otherwise - they are irrelevant. 4) As for the last question posted on February 25, it makes very little sense as Serbs live and speak Serbian in tens of countries outside of Serbia. Another trivia is that the oldest astronomical society bears the name of RB, and it is based in Belgrade, of course. 5) I do not see any arguments why Serbo-Croatian is not a good fit for the lead. Sadkσ (talk is cheap) 20:28, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
A number of sources claim that Boscovich is a Serbian scientist and of Serbian paternal origin. I haven't checked all the sources but most of the sources talking about "Serbian scientist" not about "Serbian paternal origin". Sources which talk about "Serbian paternal origin" should be next to this claim. Mikola22 ( talk) 12:01, 11 April 2020 (UTC)
For about 200 years, Roger Boscovich's ancestry was not called into question - that's because there is no evidence his father was an ethnic Serb. The first time this claim was made was in 1910, by Branislav Petrinojevic. A likely reason this claim was made - that Roger was "as much Serb as he was Croat" - was that Croats claimed this about Nikola Tesla. In other words, it was just a reactionary claim and not based on any actual evidence. This claim was reprinted in English-language sources, who didn't confirm the validity of the claim, so it was repeated several times. The fact that something was falsely written and then repeated doesn't make it true, so it should be removed. There are no first-hand sources that suggest his father was an ethnic Serb. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2607:F2C0:E574:D34:399C:4E84:2DA7:E33C ( talk) 03:06, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
I‘ve said it in on the issue with Ivan Gundulić as well. How does someone with such a disruptive history towards a nation gets the ability to edit such articles? Croatian is the only right label, with mentioning his life in Italy. The history of Serbian claims on Dubrovnik is long and starts with the Serbo-Catholic movement in the 1830s and was extinguished quickly, due to the Serbian Orthodox church being against it with the inofficial rule „A Serb must be an Orthodox“.
Boskovich‘s paternal side comes from Orahov Do, a village in Bosnia and Hercegovina. Looking at the ethnical structure shows that only Croats live there and that even before the Yugoslav war. Logically speaking, Dubrovnik is today a city with the majority of the population being catholic Croats and proud of their cities contributions to the Croatian history.
The audacity of Serbian historians and some people here to claim him as a Serb or even Serbo-Croatian is promoting the idea of a Greater Serbia. Why isn‘t Tesla stated as a Serbo-Croatian then? The Serbian appreciation of Dubrovnik was showed in the massive bombardments in the 1990ties.
What would Boskovich, Gundulic and many other important figures say to the pictures of their destroyed and once proud city? That they are Serbs or Yugoslavs? It‘s more than double standards, that those people, who mercilessly attacked and completely destroyed over a third of the UNESCO protected old town, are claiming them to be proud Serbian or (the smarter ones say) Serbo-Croatian figures.
I as someone from Dubrovnik myself, demand justice to his Croatian nationality. If even Boskovic himself saying in a letter to his brother quote “Eviva Haddick e i nostri Croati!” isn’t evidence enough, well then I don’t even know what it should be!? We are tremendously proud of our Croatian son and want the truth to be shown. MarburgAnDerDrau ( talk) 12:14, 13 August 2020 (UTC)
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Why is there an entire section about nationality when a guy wrote himself what is his nationality?
Boscovich himself was proud of his Dalmatian identity. When d'Alembert in his Opuscule mathématiques... called him "an Italian mathematician", [1] he shoot back that he was "a Dalmatian from Dubrovnik, and not an Italian". [2]
Which would make him Croatian
Ayyven ( talk) 17:14, 22 July 2021 (UTC)
Remove nationality section and write it in the first paragraph: Roger Joseph Boscovich[a] SJ (18 May 1711 – 13 February 1787) was a Croatian physicist, astronomer, mathematician, philosopher, diplomat, poet, theologian, Jesuit priest, and a polymath from the Republic of Ragusa.
source: http://www.faculty.fairfield.edu/jmac/sj/scientists/boscovich.htm
ScottishFinnishRadish ( talk) 17:24, 22 July 2021 (UTC)
{{
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ScottishFinnishRadish (
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09:14, 23 July 2021 (UTC)References
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In the section "Boscovich's Demon" a reference is missing or has been removed. Please add the following reference to the scholarly article demonstrating the claims in this section:
Kožnjak Boris, "Who let the demon out? Laplace and Boscovich on determinism", Studies in History and Philosophy of Science, 51 (2015) 42–52. doi:10.1016/j.shpsa.2015.03.002 31.217.6.187 ( talk) 10:02, 29 September 2021 (UTC)
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{{subst:trim|1=
Change everything it is all bad
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Roger Joseph Boscovich article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives:
1,
2,
3,
4,
5Auto-archiving period: 365 days
![]() |
![]() | The subject of this article is controversial and content may be in dispute. When updating the article, be bold, but not reckless. Feel free to try to improve the article, but don't take it personally if your changes are reversed; instead, come here to the talk page to discuss them. Content must be written from a neutral point of view. Include citations when adding content and consider tagging or removing unsourced information. |
![]() | Discussions on this page often lead to previous arguments being restated. Please read recent comments and look in the archives before commenting. |
![]() | This ![]() It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
@ OyMosby: Would you care to explain and gather consensus for your last edit? I claim that Serbo-Croatian is indeed neutral (which has been noted and commented on page for canvassing only on hr.wikipedia). If you do not agree we could go with Shtokavian. Either Serbian or Croatian is not correct, in my book. cheers Sadkσ (talk is cheap) 21:48, 23 February 2020 (UTC)
Sources have already been presented by other fellow editors, if that is what you are looking for:
1) Nothing new was presented in the discussion. 2) Croatian language in the lead was not "stable" but pushed by 1 editor. Only that is disruptive, and calling the current version "stable" is incorrect and even manipulative. 3) There was 1 month without further comments and that is not "ongoing", by very definition. 3.1) IP comments should make sense and give arguments, while posting proper request, otherwise - they are irrelevant. 4) As for the last question posted on February 25, it makes very little sense as Serbs live and speak Serbian in tens of countries outside of Serbia. Another trivia is that the oldest astronomical society bears the name of RB, and it is based in Belgrade, of course. 5) I do not see any arguments why Serbo-Croatian is not a good fit for the lead. Sadkσ (talk is cheap) 20:28, 23 March 2020 (UTC)
A number of sources claim that Boscovich is a Serbian scientist and of Serbian paternal origin. I haven't checked all the sources but most of the sources talking about "Serbian scientist" not about "Serbian paternal origin". Sources which talk about "Serbian paternal origin" should be next to this claim. Mikola22 ( talk) 12:01, 11 April 2020 (UTC)
For about 200 years, Roger Boscovich's ancestry was not called into question - that's because there is no evidence his father was an ethnic Serb. The first time this claim was made was in 1910, by Branislav Petrinojevic. A likely reason this claim was made - that Roger was "as much Serb as he was Croat" - was that Croats claimed this about Nikola Tesla. In other words, it was just a reactionary claim and not based on any actual evidence. This claim was reprinted in English-language sources, who didn't confirm the validity of the claim, so it was repeated several times. The fact that something was falsely written and then repeated doesn't make it true, so it should be removed. There are no first-hand sources that suggest his father was an ethnic Serb. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2607:F2C0:E574:D34:399C:4E84:2DA7:E33C ( talk) 03:06, 28 April 2020 (UTC)
I‘ve said it in on the issue with Ivan Gundulić as well. How does someone with such a disruptive history towards a nation gets the ability to edit such articles? Croatian is the only right label, with mentioning his life in Italy. The history of Serbian claims on Dubrovnik is long and starts with the Serbo-Catholic movement in the 1830s and was extinguished quickly, due to the Serbian Orthodox church being against it with the inofficial rule „A Serb must be an Orthodox“.
Boskovich‘s paternal side comes from Orahov Do, a village in Bosnia and Hercegovina. Looking at the ethnical structure shows that only Croats live there and that even before the Yugoslav war. Logically speaking, Dubrovnik is today a city with the majority of the population being catholic Croats and proud of their cities contributions to the Croatian history.
The audacity of Serbian historians and some people here to claim him as a Serb or even Serbo-Croatian is promoting the idea of a Greater Serbia. Why isn‘t Tesla stated as a Serbo-Croatian then? The Serbian appreciation of Dubrovnik was showed in the massive bombardments in the 1990ties.
What would Boskovich, Gundulic and many other important figures say to the pictures of their destroyed and once proud city? That they are Serbs or Yugoslavs? It‘s more than double standards, that those people, who mercilessly attacked and completely destroyed over a third of the UNESCO protected old town, are claiming them to be proud Serbian or (the smarter ones say) Serbo-Croatian figures.
I as someone from Dubrovnik myself, demand justice to his Croatian nationality. If even Boskovic himself saying in a letter to his brother quote “Eviva Haddick e i nostri Croati!” isn’t evidence enough, well then I don’t even know what it should be!? We are tremendously proud of our Croatian son and want the truth to be shown. MarburgAnDerDrau ( talk) 12:14, 13 August 2020 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Why is there an entire section about nationality when a guy wrote himself what is his nationality?
Boscovich himself was proud of his Dalmatian identity. When d'Alembert in his Opuscule mathématiques... called him "an Italian mathematician", [1] he shoot back that he was "a Dalmatian from Dubrovnik, and not an Italian". [2]
Which would make him Croatian
Ayyven ( talk) 17:14, 22 July 2021 (UTC)
Remove nationality section and write it in the first paragraph: Roger Joseph Boscovich[a] SJ (18 May 1711 – 13 February 1787) was a Croatian physicist, astronomer, mathematician, philosopher, diplomat, poet, theologian, Jesuit priest, and a polymath from the Republic of Ragusa.
source: http://www.faculty.fairfield.edu/jmac/sj/scientists/boscovich.htm
ScottishFinnishRadish ( talk) 17:24, 22 July 2021 (UTC)
{{
edit semi-protected}}
template. See discussion above
ScottishFinnishRadish (
talk)
09:14, 23 July 2021 (UTC)References
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
In the section "Boscovich's Demon" a reference is missing or has been removed. Please add the following reference to the scholarly article demonstrating the claims in this section:
Kožnjak Boris, "Who let the demon out? Laplace and Boscovich on determinism", Studies in History and Philosophy of Science, 51 (2015) 42–52. doi:10.1016/j.shpsa.2015.03.002 31.217.6.187 ( talk) 10:02, 29 September 2021 (UTC)
![]() | This
edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
{{subst:trim|1=
Change everything it is all bad