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An unnamed editor has added the above category to the RNAS page. IMO this is inappropriate, since the RNAS was not disbanded but rather amalgamated with the then RFC to form the RAF. Since it has since been reincarnated as the Fleet Air Arm, this category is doubly inappropriate. I propose that this category be removed. Any objections? -- TraceyR ( talk) 14:52, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
The article does not mention the date of formation of the RNAS prior to WWI, nor is the role of Winston Churchill during his time as First Lord of the Admiralty mentioned. In Churchill's biography by his son Randolph (Vol. II, p. 687) it states "One of the [Churchill's] most enterprising and successful roles was as founder of the Royal Naval Air Service." Is this perhaps an over-enthusiatic interpretation by the son of his father's role, or was he personally responsible for the creation of the RNAS? Churchill was undoubtedly enthusiastic about aviation (he took lessons and was a keen student but never flew solo) and more aware than most politicians at the time of its military potential in areas other than reconnaisance. He was no doubt instrumental in supporting the RNAS and in pushing for advances in military aviation (e.g. the use of aircraft to launch torpedos) and involved himself with much detailed work on e.g. the development of maps for aircraft navigation, the provision of landing strips along well-marked flying routes etc. Perhaps Churchill's active involvement in the creation of and support for the RNAS deserves more mention here. -- TraceyR ( talk) 10:18, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
The author states: "Urgently required Sopwith 1½ Strutter two-seaters had to be transferred from the planned RNAS strategic bombing force (for which the type was in any case quite unsuitable) to RFC squadrons on the Western Front because the Navy had 'cornered' Sopwith production."
HOW did the Royal Navy get this favored treatment?
I don't dispute that the situation was scandalous, but even a valid accusation should be explained.
One of the few explanations I've read is in an appendix in Arthur Gould Lee's "No Parachute." According to him, the Royal Flying Corps decided before the war to rely on the Royal Aircraft Factory for aircraft. They left private firms sitting on the corner, so to speak, and that's where the navy found them.
If Lee's right, then an argument could be made there would have been no 1½ Strutters, Pups, Triplane, Camels, etc., etc. for anyone if it had not been for the RNAS.
After the war started, RFC policy still didn't change nearly fast enough, according to Lee. Contributions/12.9.217.229 ( talk) 20:52, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
That sounds reasonable. Thanks for the new information, Soundofmusicals.
I authored the part that was based on Lee and was deleted Feb. 4, and accept that there are better sources out there. However, the original question still hangs out there: HOW did the RNAS "corner" Sopwiths and so forth. It seems to a layman completely indisputable that the Army "cornered" Royal Aircraft Factory types -- which were scandalously inadequate. Blaming this shortage on another branch of the service -- one that apparently made a far better judgment of what was needed -- seems extremely biased. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.3.38.116 ( talk) 04:27, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
Thanks for the explanation. The wording in the article now is entirely satisfactory — and I learned a lot. I hope you make the revisions you suggested to the Royal Aircraft Establishment article. I'll also try and look up the reference you mentioned, particularly Paul Hare's "The Royal Aircraft Factory" 1990. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.172.7.178 ( talk) 17:13, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
There were only three types here, so I have bashed through Thetford's book, entering more. I've tried to decide which side of the RNAS/RAF watershed they fall, but quickly and without expertise so there may be aircraft missed out or wrongly included. Some redlinks may be because I've not got the Wikiname right, though there are not many. Still to do are the aircraft in Ap.A and the airships of Ap.B TSRL ( talk) 21:42, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
No mention of George Cyril Colmore the first RN aviator who payed for his own lessons at Eastchurch with the RAeC and probably encouraged the RAeC offer to train more naval officers. MilborneOne ( talk) 22:35, 18 May 2010 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure that the statement "Shot down the Red Baron" should be removed or altered to alleged as it's been near catergorically proved that it was nigh impossible for Brown to have fired the fatal round. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.86.71.241 ( talk) 08:45, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
This is the
talk page for discussing improvements to the
Royal Naval Air Service article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
Article policies
|
Find sources: Google ( books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
An unnamed editor has added the above category to the RNAS page. IMO this is inappropriate, since the RNAS was not disbanded but rather amalgamated with the then RFC to form the RAF. Since it has since been reincarnated as the Fleet Air Arm, this category is doubly inappropriate. I propose that this category be removed. Any objections? -- TraceyR ( talk) 14:52, 18 December 2007 (UTC)
The article does not mention the date of formation of the RNAS prior to WWI, nor is the role of Winston Churchill during his time as First Lord of the Admiralty mentioned. In Churchill's biography by his son Randolph (Vol. II, p. 687) it states "One of the [Churchill's] most enterprising and successful roles was as founder of the Royal Naval Air Service." Is this perhaps an over-enthusiatic interpretation by the son of his father's role, or was he personally responsible for the creation of the RNAS? Churchill was undoubtedly enthusiastic about aviation (he took lessons and was a keen student but never flew solo) and more aware than most politicians at the time of its military potential in areas other than reconnaisance. He was no doubt instrumental in supporting the RNAS and in pushing for advances in military aviation (e.g. the use of aircraft to launch torpedos) and involved himself with much detailed work on e.g. the development of maps for aircraft navigation, the provision of landing strips along well-marked flying routes etc. Perhaps Churchill's active involvement in the creation of and support for the RNAS deserves more mention here. -- TraceyR ( talk) 10:18, 7 June 2009 (UTC)
The author states: "Urgently required Sopwith 1½ Strutter two-seaters had to be transferred from the planned RNAS strategic bombing force (for which the type was in any case quite unsuitable) to RFC squadrons on the Western Front because the Navy had 'cornered' Sopwith production."
HOW did the Royal Navy get this favored treatment?
I don't dispute that the situation was scandalous, but even a valid accusation should be explained.
One of the few explanations I've read is in an appendix in Arthur Gould Lee's "No Parachute." According to him, the Royal Flying Corps decided before the war to rely on the Royal Aircraft Factory for aircraft. They left private firms sitting on the corner, so to speak, and that's where the navy found them.
If Lee's right, then an argument could be made there would have been no 1½ Strutters, Pups, Triplane, Camels, etc., etc. for anyone if it had not been for the RNAS.
After the war started, RFC policy still didn't change nearly fast enough, according to Lee. Contributions/12.9.217.229 ( talk) 20:52, 15 June 2009 (UTC)
That sounds reasonable. Thanks for the new information, Soundofmusicals.
I authored the part that was based on Lee and was deleted Feb. 4, and accept that there are better sources out there. However, the original question still hangs out there: HOW did the RNAS "corner" Sopwiths and so forth. It seems to a layman completely indisputable that the Army "cornered" Royal Aircraft Factory types -- which were scandalously inadequate. Blaming this shortage on another branch of the service -- one that apparently made a far better judgment of what was needed -- seems extremely biased. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.3.38.116 ( talk) 04:27, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
Thanks for the explanation. The wording in the article now is entirely satisfactory — and I learned a lot. I hope you make the revisions you suggested to the Royal Aircraft Establishment article. I'll also try and look up the reference you mentioned, particularly Paul Hare's "The Royal Aircraft Factory" 1990. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.172.7.178 ( talk) 17:13, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
There were only three types here, so I have bashed through Thetford's book, entering more. I've tried to decide which side of the RNAS/RAF watershed they fall, but quickly and without expertise so there may be aircraft missed out or wrongly included. Some redlinks may be because I've not got the Wikiname right, though there are not many. Still to do are the aircraft in Ap.A and the airships of Ap.B TSRL ( talk) 21:42, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
No mention of George Cyril Colmore the first RN aviator who payed for his own lessons at Eastchurch with the RAeC and probably encouraged the RAeC offer to train more naval officers. MilborneOne ( talk) 22:35, 18 May 2010 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure that the statement "Shot down the Red Baron" should be removed or altered to alleged as it's been near catergorically proved that it was nigh impossible for Brown to have fired the fatal round. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.86.71.241 ( talk) 08:45, 5 January 2011 (UTC)