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A news item involving Roberto Azevêdo was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the In the news section on 9 May 2013. |
Foo We Been Talking About You Sense Your Downfall And Sense Seeing Is Believing That Actualizes.
Texts following the names of RA and his wife were added with the explanation: Standard orthography name, according to the 1943 Orthographic Formulary; Brazilians often carry names as they were registered by their parents, either in obsolete or fancy alternative spellings, but they are tolerated errors, not standard forms. There is no article standard orthography, a brief mention in Portuguese names, but no information on this in Reforms of Portuguese orthography, Portuguese orthography or [1]. If there are indeed no Brazilian laws on names, it is difficult to characterise them as "errors" - perhaps "tolerated variants" would be better?
But in any case, unless reliable sources have written about RA and his wife in this respect, these additions look like WP:OR. These people seem to use only the names they were given. Of course many sources use "Azevedo", but I can find nothing to suggest that this is anything to do with changes in orthography - the non-use of diacriticals generally is commonplace in English-language writing. However, "Maria Nazaré Farani Azevedo" is hardly used at all (907 Google hits, compared with 218,000 for her actual name).
While writing this I see that the text has been changed to footnotes. This is still OR, I think. (And I am not sure in any case that the 1990 agreement is the relevant one, rather than the 1943 Brazilian reforms.) Davidships ( talk) 00:16, 10 May 2013 (UTC)
Thank you both for these explanations and observations. That's very helpful. I'm not sure that I really quite understand in what way the reforms were really expected to, and actually do, affect personal names. I can see that in the 1943 formulário [2] personal and geografical proper names are supposed to follow the new rules where they are "portuguese or adapted into portuguese" (and elsewhere I saw that the rules do not apply to personal names in other "languages"), except that individuals were permitted to retain their "customary signature". Obviously nobody born after 1943 could have a qualifying signature, so was the idea that all new birth registrations would have to be compliant? From the look of this [3] it may be so in Portugal, but clearly not in Brazil. Indeed, not much hope if my late father-in-law, a conservative Brazilian congressman, would include amongst his children "Luiz" and "Tereza" (though without the "h") - I'm not sure about "Vianney". But my question remains: since RA and his wife seem not to use the postulated standard spellings, is their inclusion without citations Original Research? Davidships ( talk) 20:17, 17 May 2013 (UTC)
This article must adhere to the biographies of living persons (BLP) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to this noticeboard.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see this help page. |
This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's
content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects: | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
A news item involving Roberto Azevêdo was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the In the news section on 9 May 2013. |
Foo We Been Talking About You Sense Your Downfall And Sense Seeing Is Believing That Actualizes.
Texts following the names of RA and his wife were added with the explanation: Standard orthography name, according to the 1943 Orthographic Formulary; Brazilians often carry names as they were registered by their parents, either in obsolete or fancy alternative spellings, but they are tolerated errors, not standard forms. There is no article standard orthography, a brief mention in Portuguese names, but no information on this in Reforms of Portuguese orthography, Portuguese orthography or [1]. If there are indeed no Brazilian laws on names, it is difficult to characterise them as "errors" - perhaps "tolerated variants" would be better?
But in any case, unless reliable sources have written about RA and his wife in this respect, these additions look like WP:OR. These people seem to use only the names they were given. Of course many sources use "Azevedo", but I can find nothing to suggest that this is anything to do with changes in orthography - the non-use of diacriticals generally is commonplace in English-language writing. However, "Maria Nazaré Farani Azevedo" is hardly used at all (907 Google hits, compared with 218,000 for her actual name).
While writing this I see that the text has been changed to footnotes. This is still OR, I think. (And I am not sure in any case that the 1990 agreement is the relevant one, rather than the 1943 Brazilian reforms.) Davidships ( talk) 00:16, 10 May 2013 (UTC)
Thank you both for these explanations and observations. That's very helpful. I'm not sure that I really quite understand in what way the reforms were really expected to, and actually do, affect personal names. I can see that in the 1943 formulário [2] personal and geografical proper names are supposed to follow the new rules where they are "portuguese or adapted into portuguese" (and elsewhere I saw that the rules do not apply to personal names in other "languages"), except that individuals were permitted to retain their "customary signature". Obviously nobody born after 1943 could have a qualifying signature, so was the idea that all new birth registrations would have to be compliant? From the look of this [3] it may be so in Portugal, but clearly not in Brazil. Indeed, not much hope if my late father-in-law, a conservative Brazilian congressman, would include amongst his children "Luiz" and "Tereza" (though without the "h") - I'm not sure about "Vianney". But my question remains: since RA and his wife seem not to use the postulated standard spellings, is their inclusion without citations Original Research? Davidships ( talk) 20:17, 17 May 2013 (UTC)